Advice Needed: Do an SMP or increase volunteer hours for next cycle?

[deleted632307]

I had 1 waitlist, 3 rejections, and no word yet from 13 schools on Dec 1. Only had 1 pre-Dec interview (NYU); no other invites so far, including from my state schools (TX).

I have a high DAT score (25AA/23TS/20PAT/25RC) and okay overall GPA (3.5), but my science GPA is pretty low (3.2). 100 hours of shadowing (80 general), 100 hours of volunteering at a community dental clinic, and about 200 hours of non-dental related volunteering.

Submitted AADSAS second week of July because my last rec letter came in late.


My question is: Should I do an SMP to show dental schools that I can handle advanced science coursework? Or would it be better to increase my volunteer hours? What about working for a year as a dental assistant? I graduate this semester, so I won’t have anything to do starting from January.


I know there are still months left in the cycle and post-Dec interviews might come in, but I feel like I should at least get ready to reapply now because I’ve personally seen quite a few people with better stats not get any acceptances to dental school. And if I decide to do an SMP, applications are probably due soon, and I need to get rec letters for those…

In your guys’ opinion, what would my best course of action be at this point (other than just waiting)? My biggest fear is that I don't get in anywhere after waiting until April/May, but my application is the exact same when the next cycle opens up in June...

Thanks a lot in advance!

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[cacajuate]

Random thought cuz your stats are good. How old are you? Do you have anything to show on your application other than just school? Real job? Life experiences?

 

[deleted632307]

Random thought cuz your stats are good. How old are you? Do you have anything to show on your application other than just school? Real job? Life experiences?

23. I worked full time as an SAT tutor at a prep academy (during gap year between sophomore and junior year, which I had to take for financial reasons). Other than that, no real life experiences

 

[8_man]

Very odd, I thought you were safe for admission this cycle. Not sure what to say, besides considering a post-bacc. The only red flag in your application appears to be that sGPA.

 

[Toothout]

You'll probably get in later in the cycle, but why not both? The SMP and the volunteering..

 

[workofshart]

You should check the deadlines and everything for your school's SMP (or whichever you're interested in). I only mention this because my school's deadline isn't until June 1st and they don't even start looking at applications until March. They also take LoR used for other grad programs and DAT. Maybe they are unique in that idk but it's worth finding out what exactly you need and when. It's possible you will get more interviews or even an acceptance in the meantime. Good luck to you

 

[schmoob]

I had 1 waitlist, 3 rejections, and no word yet from 13 schools on Dec 1. Only had 1 pre-Dec interview (NYU); no other invites so far, including from my state schools (TX).

I have a high DAT score (25AA/23TS/20PAT/25RC) and okay overall GPA (3.5), but my science GPA is pretty low (3.2). 100 hours of shadowing (80 general), 100 hours of volunteering at a community dental clinic, and about 200 hours of non-dental related volunteering.

Submitted AADSAS second week of July because my last rec letter came in late.


My question is: Should I do an SMP to show dental schools that I can handle advanced science coursework? Or would it be better to increase my volunteer hours? What about working for a year as a dental assistant? I graduate this semester, so I won’t have anything to do starting from January.


I know there are still months left in the cycle and post-Dec interviews might come in, but I feel like I should at least get ready to reapply now because I’ve personally seen quite a few people with better stats not get any acceptances to dental school. And if I decide to do an SMP, applications are probably due soon, and I need to get rec letters for those…

In your guys’ opinion, what would my best course of action be at this point (other than just waiting)? My biggest fear is that I don't get in anywhere after waiting until April/May, but my application is the exact same when the next cycle opens up in June...

Thanks a lot in advance!

I would do dental assistant. 3.2 isn't terrible. Besides, it's still early.

 

[wengerout]

I would do an SMP and in your spare time branch out for some fun and interesting extracurriculars/experiences. You'll make yourself more competitive as an applicant, have more eye catching experiences, and have fun!


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[poanli2017]

Wow, your scores are great, I'm sorry you haven't heard back from the other schools. There is still hope though! I'd say do the SMP and bring the GPA up and on the side you can have a fun project, like an interesting community service.

 

[schmoob]

I would do an SMP and in your spare time branch out for some fun and interesting extracurriculars/experiences. You'll make yourself more competitive as an applicant, have more eye catching experiences, and have fun!

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I disagree (respectfully). I don't think that is a financially good move. Nor will it prepare him any better. I think a good idea would be to assist and that would help in dental school significantly. Also, taking an extra 1-2 science classes during the evening and weekends should boost sGPA enough. It would also boost OGPA.
An SMP is for those with at do not have an an academically competitive application, and their remaining holistic review is not enough to overcome that hurdle. An SMP doesn't prepare someone any better for dental school IMO, all it does is demonstrate the ability to succeed in a rigorous graduate level science curriculum, such as medical/Dental school. I got an A in biochem both in undergrad and in dental school, but if you ask me to break down the Pentose Phosphate Pathway to you right now, or ask me what monosaccharides form each individual disaccharide, I couldn't tell you.
OP has a 25AA which is very impressive. A little sGPA nudge and some dental experience should be enough to earn a number of offers, as well as be a better use of his time to prepare for dentistry.
Plus, if the dentist is cool, he could teach him some foundation skills like how to handle a handpiece, indirect vision, etc.

 

[wengerout]

I disagree (respectfully). I don't think that is a financially good move. Nor will it prepare him any better. I think a good idea would be to assist and that would help in dental school significantly. Also, taking an extra 1-2 science classes during the evening and weekends should boost sGPA enough. It would also boost OGPA.
An SMP is for those with at do not have an an academically competitive application, and their remaining holistic review is not enough to overcome that hurdle. An SMP doesn't prepare someone any better for dental school IMO, all it does is demonstrate the ability to succeed in a rigorous graduate level science curriculum, such as medical/Dental school. I got an A in biochem both in undergrad and in dental school, but if you ask me to break down the Pentose Phosphate Pathway to you right now, or ask me what monosaccharides form each individual disaccharide, I couldn't tell you.
OP has a 25AA which is very impressive. A little sGPA nudge and some dental experience should be enough to earn a number of offers, as well as be a better use of his time to prepare for dentistry.
Plus, if the dentist is cool, he could teach him some foundation skills like how to handle a handpiece, indirect vision, etc.

I see your points, sGPA is a little low which is why I said an SMP but you're right working with a dentist + some spare science classes could get the job done as well.


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[deleted632307]

Thanks so much for the feedback everyone, I really appreciate it.

Based on the poll, there seems to be an even split between doing an SMP and working as a dental assistant. These were probably the two options I was leaning towards in the beginning (since if I do an SMP, I'll probably do some volunteering as well).

A potential concern I have with an SMP (other than the financial aspect of taking out loans, potentially losing TX residency (?), etc.) is that I won't have any new SMP grades in by the time I apply on June 1. Do y'all think dental schools would want to hold off on giving me an interview until new grades come in (i.e. would I only get post-Dec interviews)? I'm worried that even if I do an SMP, I'll only be able to get post-Dec interviews at best, putting me at a disadvantage for the next cycle. In which case, it might be better to reapply AFTER the SMP (i.e. two cycles later)?

I read different threads on this topic but there doesn't seem to be a definite consensus on this point...

Also, if I decided to work as a dental assistant instead of doing an SMP, would the additional exposure to the dental field somewhat mitigate my low sGPA, given the rest of my app? I would probably work at the community health center I volunteered at, given my connections to the staff there.

Thanks again for taking the time to give me advice!

 

[workofshart]

Lets say you did reapply in June (I'm thinking I might do the same so I'm having similar thoughts as you). You would have Summer and Fall grades to add, you would hopefully by then have even more volunteering, EC, shadowing etc, and if you did either assisting or SMP you could add that as proof of dedication to the field. So its not like you wouldn't have new things to add and your DAT is great so you still have that plus.

So I think schmoob's idea isn't that bad either. What about taking higher level "recommended" science classes in the Spring? Could you delay graduation, do an extra minor/major or just simple post bac? Then you would have even more grades to add and if you are considering the $$$ on an SMP it's not like it's going to cost you THAT much extra in the long run. Also I know it's late but have you considered applying to some of the private schools that have like 2/1 deadlines? There's a non-zero chance with your DAT you could snag another interview or two that way. Just something to consider I guess

 

[Faefly]

I think you will get accepted later!
But meanwhile, don't stop enhancing your chances, maybe look for a research opportunity ! and why not. Take another science class! Register for next semester and try to choose a good professor!
And better yet! Look for an opportunity to go to another country and help!
I just looked in my university career search and saw a volunteer opportunity in Tanzania!
Why not travel to some poor country and do social work!
That will be an awesome experience!
Imagine if they didn't accept you this cycle and you applied again!
What new experience you have to offer?
Oh I went to x place and helped to build houses!
Awesome change!
And there are many places that right near USA that really need any help they can get!
Think out of the circle!

 

[deleted632307]

Lets say you did reapply in June (I'm thinking I might do the same so I'm having similar thoughts as you). You would have Summer and Fall grades to add, you would hopefully by then have even more volunteering, EC, shadowing etc, and if you did either assisting or SMP you could add that as proof of dedication to the field. So its not like you wouldn't have new things to add and your DAT is great so you still have that plus.

So I think schmoob's idea isn't that bad either. What about taking higher level "recommended" science classes in the Spring? Could you delay graduation, do an extra minor/major or just simple post bac? Then you would have even more grades to add and if you are considering the $$$ on an SMP it's not like it's going to cost you THAT much extra in the long run. Also I know it's late but have you considered applying to some of the private schools that have like 2/1 deadlines? There's a non-zero chance with your DAT you could snag another interview or two that way. Just something to consider I guess

Hey man, thanks for the detailed reply. It sucks that both of us are thinking about possibly reapplying, but I guess one can't be too careful... especially with how competitive it is to get into dental school these days! I hope things work out for us this cycle and we can go to dental school next year!

Yeah, I didn't think about the fact that I'd have more EC/volunteer/shadowing stuff (from this semester+next semester) to add to my app come June 1. I'm not exactly killing this Fall semester though, so not sure if that'll help my re-application lol.

Delaying graduation isn't really an option for me because of financial reasons. I could do a post bac, but only if I'm able to take out loans to cover the cost 100% (which I'd be able to do with an SMP). Not sure if this is possible with a post bac because post bac is technically undergrad (I'm not 100% sure about this though)? My family isn't really in a position to financially contribute to my education.

I didn't consider applying to more private schools with late deadlines, since I assumed every school's deadline has passed by now. Though at this point, what have I got to lose right? I don't know if my chances of getting in this way will be great (but who knows lol), but I'll definitely look into it!

As of now, I will probably at least APPLY to some SMPs and try to get a dental job for my Spring gap semester (and if I can't get a job, then increase volunteer hours next semester). Do you think this might be a decent plan? That way if I have to reapply, I can have the flexibility of either continuing to work as a dental assistant or attend an SMP in the fall.

 

[deleted632307]

I think you will get accepted later!
But meanwhile, don't stop enhancing your chances, maybe look for a research opportunity ! and why not. Take another science class! Register for next semester and try to choose a good professor!
And better yet! Look for an opportunity to go to another country and help!
I just looked in my university career search and saw a volunteer opportunity in Tanzania!
Why not travel to some poor country and do social work!
That will be an awesome experience!
Imagine if they didn't accept you this cycle and you applied again!
What new experience you have to offer?
Oh I went to x place and helped to build houses!
Awesome change!
And there are many places that right near USA that really need any help they can get!
Think out of the circle!

Thanks for your reply! I'm graduating this semester, so I don't know if taking more classes next semester/doing research right away will be possible. But I'll definitely take your advice on volunteering into consideration!

 

[Faefly]

Thanks for your reply! I'm graduating this semester, so I don't know if taking more classes next semester/doing research right away will be possible. But I'll definitely take your advice on volunteering into consideration!

oh, if you are graduating next semester, I think you need to focus on getting A's in your classes especially the science ones to improve them!
Best of luck
!

 

[workofshart]

@Keklel I'm sure things will work out in the end for both of us. Your plan sounds solid to me and I wouldn't be surprised if you end up getting in this cycle after all

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[schmoob]

You have a TX residency which is amazing. I think an acceptance to a TX school next year > private school this year.
Financially it might be tough, but even if you take out a private Sallie Mae loan for a class or 2 now, it's cheaper than an SMP.
Don't worry, it's early. Stay in contact with the TX schools. I highly recommend one of those schools over NYU.
Another consideration if this year doesn't work out is working on your PS and LoR's.
Don't worry, with your stats I'm surprised you haven't got anything yet. Keep your head up, you'll get it!

 

[periopocket]

You"ll deff get into NYU with those stats just send a letter of intent or two.

 

[super frank]

Don't panic, you will receive a bunch of interviews once the 30 days for deposits are up.

 

[htdt]

You have a more than excellent DAT score, a decent amount shadowing and volunteer hours and you apply early too so I'm very surprised. Again, it's still early in the game so it is very possible that you will get more interviews/acceptances. But can you think of any possible red flags in your PS or LoRs? Might be a good idea to double check on that. Best of luck to you!

 

[deleted632307]

What other schools did you apply to? I'm surprised NYU waitlisted you. You said you thought your interview with them went well right? For my own sake, I'd like to believe they thought you'd go elsewhere.

I'm a similar applicant to you. My DAT scores are above average for every school I applied to, but I have a weaker sGPA. My last letter came in late as well (even later than yours), so I'm also starting to think about backup plans.

PM'd you.

 

[Scumbag_Steve]

.

 

[deleted632307]

Well what I would do in your situation depends on a number of factors.

Hey Scumbag Steve,

Thank you so, so much for your detailed advice. You weren't obligated to do so, but you went out of your way to help out a random stranger on the Internet whom you don't even know. I really, really appreciate that. From your Dental School application guide, to your insightful posts on other advice threads start by pre-dents, I can tell that you are truly a good person who looks out for the well-being of others.

I just wanted to let you know that your hard work and generosity for pre-dents like myself have not gone unnoticed!

And I will definitely let y'all know how my dental school cycle turns out in the end, for better or worse, in the hopes of being a helpful reference for applicants in the future!

Best of luck with your studies at UConn!!!

 

[RS2224]

Hey Scumbag Steve,

Thank you so, so much for your detailed advice. You weren't obligated to do so, but you went out of your way to help out a random stranger on the Internet whom you don't even know. I really, really appreciate that. From your Dental School application guide, to your insightful posts on other advice threads start by pre-dents, I can tell that you are truly a good person who looks out for the well-being of others.

I just wanted to let you know that your hard work and generosity for pre-dents like myself have not gone unnoticed!

And I will definitely let y'all know how my dental school cycle turns out in the end, for better or worse, in the hopes of being a helpful reference for applicants in the future!

Best of luck with your studies at UConn!!!

Keklel I KNOW you'll be closing this thread soon! Keep your head up, you are on a school's waitlist that loves students contacting them a lot and has the most movement. Since NYU likes monthly updates, try picking up one event each month and update them on it?

 

[Ollivander]

You can look through my post history if you want, but your bat**** crazy if you do a SMP. There's way more risk given your stats than there is to gain. If I were you I'd just apply more broadly, do lots of research using the past two ADEA Guides to form a list of schools, volunteer a little bit, and see if you can get a job as a dental assistant or as a dental lab tech. Honestly just getting a job in healthcare in general will help your application. Again, if I were you I would not mess with a 3.5/3.2 given your killer DAT score. You will definitely get in next cycle if you apply smart, get a little more volunteering under your belt, and get some healthcare job experience even if it's just a little bit.

With that said, a post-bacc is superior to a SMP unless an individual's undergrad GPA is borderline not salvageable or you're gunning for allopathic med schools.

 

[deleted632307]

Keklel I KNOW you'll be closing this thread soon! Keep your head up, you are on a school's waitlist that loves students contacting them a lot and has the most movement. Since NYU likes monthly updates, try picking up one event each month and update them on it?

Thanks a lot! I've been updating NYU regularly so hopefully it pays off when they start pulling people off the waitlist!

In the meantime, I'm trying to remain positive and focus on my upcoming interview!

 

[deleted632307]

You can look through my post history if you want, but your bat**** crazy if you do a SMP. There's way more risk given your stats than there is to gain. If I were you I'd just apply more broadly, do lots of research using the past two ADEA Guides to form a list of schools, volunteer a little bit, and see if you can get a job as a dental assistant or as a dental lab tech. Honestly just getting a job in healthcare in general will help your application. Again, if I were you I would not mess with a 3.5/3.2 given your killer DAT score. You will definitely get in next cycle if you apply smart, get a little more volunteering under your belt, and get some healthcare job experience even if it's just a little bit.

With that said, a post-bacc is superior to a SMP unless an individual's undergrad GPA is borderline not salvageable or you're gunning for allopathic med schools.

Hey man, I appreciate your added perspective!

I really hope I don't have to do an SMP OR dental job next year, if at all possible!

 

[Ollivander]

Hey man, I appreciate your added perspective!

I really hope I don't have to do an SMP OR dental job next year, if at all possible!

Honestly you just got unlucky this time around. If you were/are even contemplating spending money towards a SMP with your stats, you'd do yourself more of a service to just apply to 25 schools instead of 13 with a portion of the money you were going to use towards the SMP. SMP's are overpriced risks for the type of student that normally needs one, much less you who I think should have been accepted this time around. My advice is to apply to at least 20 schools next cycle and you will most assuredly get accepted.

I look forward to your acceptance thread this time next year! Good luck man!

 

[LuckyOne5]

Hey man, thanks for the detailed reply. It sucks that both of us are thinking about possibly reapplying, but I guess one can't be too careful... especially with how competitive it is to get into dental school these days! I hope things work out for us this cycle and we can go to dental school next year!

Yeah, I didn't think about the fact that I'd have more EC/volunteer/shadowing stuff (from this semester+next semester) to add to my app come June 1. I'm not exactly killing this Fall semester though, so not sure if that'll help my re-application lol.

Delaying graduation isn't really an option for me because of financial reasons. I could do a post bac, but only if I'm able to take out loans to cover the cost 100% (which I'd be able to do with an SMP). Not sure if this is possible with a post bac because post bac is technically undergrad (I'm not 100% sure about this though)? My family isn't really in a position to financially contribute to my education.

I didn't consider applying to more private schools with late deadlines, since I assumed every school's deadline has passed by now. Though at this point, what have I got to lose right? I don't know if my chances of getting in this way will be great (but who knows lol), but I'll definitely look into it!

As of now, I will probably at least APPLY to some SMPs and try to get a dental job for my Spring gap semester (and if I can't get a job, then increase volunteer hours next semester). Do you think this might be a decent plan? That way if I have to reapply, I can have the flexibility of either continuing to work as a dental assistant or attend an SMP in the fall.

Hey I'm a TX resident myself and doing postbacc at UTD while working at a dental real estate company (help dentists find space for their new practices). As long as you go full-time and declare another major you're good to go. I am doing Neuroscience but also taking Oral Histology...I obviously don't plan on graduating with the degree it's just for financial aid purposes. Hope this helps.

 

[Faefly]

I hope you get in NYU or whatever school you want!
Keep us updated, but it never hurts to work as a dental assistant in your gap year

I have a theory maybe your LOR or your personal statement weren't great!

 

[schmoob]

Hey man, I appreciate your added perspective!

I really hope I don't have to do an SMP OR dental job next year, if at all possible!

I hope not either.
Have you provided an academic update to TMDSAS? Hopefully your grades were good, and will garner enough attention to offer an interview invite.
Call the TX schools and see how many interviews are left for each.
Also, your numbers seem fine to have more than 1-2 interviews. It makes me wonder about your LoRs. I'm guessing you didn't get a chance to read them all. Did you get a committee letter? I really hope no one put anything negative in there about you that would result in costing you hundreds of thousands of dollars, or lost time.