Advice on when to tell my PI about medical school

[Postdoc2MD]

Hello everyone,

I am currently a postdoctoral fellow (PhD in a neuroscience-related field) and have decided to apply to medical school this cycle. I need to tell my PI about my decision at some point since a letter of recommendation from him would greatly help my application (and probably expected by most adcoms). I was planning on telling him after I take my MCAT in early May. I don't want to make it seem like I am neglecting my research duties for med school application prep (such as MCAT studying, volunteering, and shadowing), and I plan on working in the lab as a postdoc until I begin med school.

I also realize that I may be overthinking this; I know that some scientists frown upon people leaving academic research (and going into medicine/industry/etc.), and I am not sure how my boss will react. When I joined the lab (about a year ago) I intended to do a 4-5 year postdoc, and then go the whole tenure-track professor route. Over the last six months or so, I finally convinced myself that I don't have to be stuck on this route, just because I've started. I want to become a physician so that I can make a direct impact on people's lives in my day-to-day, rather than focus solely on esoteric questions far removed in my lab.

Any advice on how other non-trads told their bosses about their career change would be greatly appreciated!

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[Cheenghee Koh]

I am in the same boat with you, except that I am not going to ask for my PI's letter. I am from social science backgrounds and in the team I worked with before I was the lead statistician. My PI liked me a little too much, to a degree that she even sabotaged my applications to tenure-track positions so that she could keep me at her side working for her. So, I told her that I am going to medical school, and quitted the job. Luckily I got another post doc position, starting from this January. But the difference is: this 2nd PI has been my friend for past 12 years and we have published extensively together, and she knows my intention for med school from day 1. She is the very first person outside of my family to whom I disclosed my plans. So, yes, I will get a letter from her.

I think the lesson I learn is: be careful about the dynamics between your PI and you, as well as what types of people they are. I remembered I told both of my PIs that: I am not going to leave my field of origins. Rather, I am "expanding" my career (I try to develop integrated biopsychosocial care packages for the marginalized). I also promised them that I will keep publishing with them, but will bring biological health perspectives to future projects. But the results are: my first PI still tried to dissuade me from med school until the last day of my job. But the 2ns PI was more than happy to support me, hired me as her post-doc until I start med school in 2019, and we are planning what grants we are going to write together when I am in med school or after I get my MD.

I know that it may be too late to change PI if you think they may not be ideal person to disclose your plans to. But form my own experiences, try to frame your plans more strategically and let them see how your additional training may even help them on their career. Also, if possible, try to find other senior faculty members with whom you have worked closely with to write you letters if your PI is not supportive.

 

[DrMidlife]

I need to tell my PI about my decision at some point

I'll come back to that.

since a letter of recommendation from him would greatly help my application (and probably expected by most adcoms).

*A* letter is expected from your neurosci superiors, but a letter from your PhD adviser would be just as good or better than a letter from a PI for whom you've worked for less than a year.

Your job isn't to show med school admissions people that you can do PhD/postdoc work. Your job is to show that you can jump through hoops like a terrier to meet the requirements of medical training. Letters need to show that you do what needs to be done, academically and otherwise, to succeed, preferably with leadership and initiative and teamwork etc. Your undergrad chemistry teacher, whose office hours you went to, who called on you in class because you reliably raised your hand, who never had to feel like calling a lawyer to get you to stop jawboning about 2 missed points on an exam, can attest to your med school capabilities much better than pretty much anybody.

I was planning on telling him after I take my MCAT in early May.

Whoa nelly. The MCAT is one thing on a long list of things you need. Is your undergrad GPA competitive? Do you have O(100) hours of clinical exposure such as volunteering/EMT/CNA? Have you spent enough time with residents and/or practicing physicians to let them try to talk you out of being a doctor? Have you held up the enormous leg of a smelly drunk/IVDU obese vomiting wreck while an intern drained the pus from an abscess? If not, you'll convince nobody in a med school interview that your interest is legitimate. 60% of med school applicants get rejected every year, and your PhD doesn't spare you from those odds.

Point being, if you're not happy working in a lab after training for what, 4-6 years to get your PhD, holy **** don't go leap into another 7-10 years of training thinking you'll be happy on the other side without doing a crap load of first-hand investigation and soul-searching.

Which maybe you already did.

I want to become a physician so that I can make a direct impact on people's lives in my day-to-day, rather than focus solely on esoteric questions far removed in my lab.

In my 6th year of training I get to directly impact people's lives, beyond what a nurse or a good psychotherapist can do, maybe twice a week. To "earn" those couple moments, I slog through protocols written by committees and follow established guidelines and spend most of my time interacting with a computer for the other 79.5 hours of the week (that I report). As above, the job of doctoring is doing what needs to be done, regardless of what feels good or what feels worthwhile or whether I've been up 36 hours or whatever.

I work with a whole lot of people who are not at all happy with their jobs. Just like I did in my prior career. Just like you're probably doing in the lab.

Any advice on how other non-trads told their bosses about their career change would be greatly appreciated!

There are PIs that will be excited for you, will be delighted to support you, will ask you to keep working for the next year while you apply, will helpfully work with you to lay out your work responsibilities in a way that makes sense given your change in career plans. And if they're smart and truly kind, they'll also play devil's advocate as I've done above. They'll have dealt with post-docs who have depression and problematic work ethics and delusions of grandeur, and those experiences will be projected onto you. If you're smart you'll be grateful and thoughtful about any and all feedback you get on your career plans whether or not it is specific to your own personal self and situation. Say thank you and be gracious and ravenously plow through all feedback and advice for its truth.

There are also PIs who are immature and toxic and will make your change in career plans all about them and will want you to GTFO of their lab asap. Don't ask that type of boss for a letter.

Generally if you want to preserve a good relationship with a boss (such as one you want to recommend you for another job), you want to hold up your end of that relationship and be a good person and think of their situation in deciding when to drop the bomb. Your boss is spending resources on you with little return on investment so far. You most likely are not doing much to preserve his/her funding or to further his/her research yet. The average PI, upon learning that you'll be leaving, is done investing in you, necessarily. The average PI wants to get you replaced by somebody who will be more dedicated, as soon as possible. They may or may not be friendly about it.

Lastly, you need your letters of recommendation in hand at the beginning of June for best results. Right now you should be actively recruiting 5-6 recommenders in order to have 3-4 letters in time. As above, if you are not ready to produce a complete and compelling med school app, as compared to a capable and appropriately accomplished 20 year old college junior bio major, by June 1, you are not doing it right.

Best of luck to you.

 

[Postdoc2MD]

Thank you both for the input. I realized that I didn't put more of my stats in my initial post. I think my undergrad GPA is decent, but slightly below average for average MD matriculation at cGPA 3.65, sGPA 3.55. I did my undergrad in 3 years, with a Bio major with a chem minor, so all I've done all the prereqs needed. I have about 75 hours nonclinical volunteering (science education for kids), and will have 50 hours of clinical volunteering by the time I apply (ICU bedside at local children's hospital, with another ~100 projected hours by the time I matriculate). With my PhD and postdoc, I have plenty of research experience, publications, and posters/abstracts.

Shadowing is my major deficit (0 hours), but I am starting this weekend. Despite the lack of shadowing, I have many friends that are physicians and talked a lot with them about the profession, and they haven't talked me out of it yet. Talking with physicians is one of the reasons I've wanted to switch professions. Another reason is my wife is an inpatient social worker, and talking to her has peaked my interest about getting involved on a clinical level. I have been thinking about going to medical school since about halfway through my PhD (specifically me berating myself at not applying the Md/PhD route), but it has taken me a few years to accept the idea that I can go back to school. I have done plenty of soul-searching over this issue, but completely understand that you (and any adcom that reviews my application) will want to know that I have put the requisite amount of though into applying. Don't get me wrong, my PhD was full of long hours and stress, but I am aware that medical school is a whole other beast (and that doesn't hold a candle to the amount of work/stress I've heard about residencies).

Back to my initial question, I think that my current PI will be supportive, and I may be over analyzing the situation. He has been very supportive of others going to medical school (at least for undergrads, post-bac's, techs, etc.). Also, I currently have my own grant funding, so my salary is paid for and I don't need to worry about being replaced anytime soon.

And @Cheenghee Koh, I like the idea as portraying medical school as 'additional training'. I was already planning on about writing wanting to become a physician scientist in my apps, but telling this to my PI may make the transition easier for them to understand.