Advice on which school (DO or MD) to apply with my specific situation

Aug 3, 2015
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Pre-Medical
Hi, I'm new to this forum so I'm still learning my way around. Any help/advice would be greatly appreciated. I'm not a stranger to tough love and honesty so please tell me what you would do in my shoes:)

Undergrad was academically terrible, made the common mistakes that any 17-20 year old would make: sports, partying, relationship drama, ect and ended with my overall GPA of 2.9 and my science is lower than that. (not sure but maybe around 2.6)
I did a semester of post-grad at a fairly large school and made C's in all 3 classes.
On a good note: I started a masters program for a master's in medical science and so far I have a 4.0. I'm confident that I will do well on my MCAT in 2 weeks and plan to keep my 4.0 through this program.
I have great letters of rec, and a LOT of outside experiences/background in medicine.

I am applying to three DO schools, one of which I think I have a fairly good chance of getting into.
I am also applying to LSU-S and LSU-NO.

MY QUESTION: I would LOVE to go to the DO school, I think that it has a great program, HOWEVER, the allopathic schools have been what I set my goals on since I was very young and if I did get into the DO school this year and not the MD schools, should I consider putting school off a year for a better chance at getting into one of the MD schools?

There are pros and cons to each situation, the MD schools are cheaper and one is closer to home. The DO school is also close to home and I love the 'small school' feel of the community. I have a better chance of getting into the DO but is my 'dream' school worth waiting another year?

Thanks in advance, sorry for such a long explanation.
 

Dr. Death

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What is your gpa now? How patient are you? What are you going to score on the MCAT? Can you get your GPA up to the 3.4-3.5 range in a year or are you there now? What specialty do you think you are interested in?
 

slopes23

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This is not the correct du forum for this question. Much better suited for Pre-Allopathic.
 
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avgn

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Lol lmao "I am too good for DO, MD is my dream."

You are not in a position to be picky. Your application is bottom of the barrel. 4.0 in a master's are often seen, it doesn't mean much. Come back with your MCAT and let's see what you're made of. Right now, it looks something like tofu...
 
Dec 16, 2013
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You should probably take some undergrad courses and do well in them before applying DO or MD... My understanding is that undergrad courses show preparedness for med school, not Master's programs that tend to inflate grades.
 
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xerei

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It's commonly said that MD schools are less forgiving when it comes to poor undergrad performance, just putting that out there.
 
OP
AA831261414
Aug 3, 2015
7
1
Status
Pre-Medical
What is your gpa now? How patient are you? What are you going to score on the MCAT? Can you get your GPA up to the 3.4-3.5 range in a year or are you there now? What specialty do you think you are interested in?
My GPA now is a 4.0 for my master's degree. If you mean calculating my undergrad, postgrad, and graduate together I'm really not certain, probably close to 3.1-ish. I will have to sit down and calculate them together. The application services should tell me the overall calculated GPA but I just submitted my AMCAS 2 days ago and have not had it verified yet.

What am I going to score? I hope a 508 or better, the practice test i took from AMCAS did not give me a score but comparing my percentages to the old MCAT I was around 26. By the end of my masters program I plan to still have my 4.0 but as an overall GPA, It should bring me close to a 3.5.

I am open to almost any specialty, my passion is in emergency medicine and pediatrics as of now.

LSU-No also has a program for students in my position: if you take at least 32 hours at a post graduate institution, then your undergraduate GPA will be replaced by your new GPA. That would significantly help my application, however, I wont be done with my hours until May.

I'm pretty patient. I will be 24 this october so it's getting a little frustrating because people get in at 22 now days but in the long run I know im still young. On the other hand I dont want to put it off too long bc I want to start a family. BUT I know thats not a huge deciding factor.
 
OP
AA831261414
Aug 3, 2015
7
1
Status
Pre-Medical
You should probably take some undergrad courses and do well in them before applying DO or MD... My understanding is that undergrad courses show preparedness for med school, not Master's programs that tend to inflate grades.

Thank you! the master's program I am in is actually very medically based and has strong ties to the DO school and LSU-S because it is known to really prepare students for medical level classes. My problem is, is that Im just starting this program and the hardest classes (Medical Phys 1 and 2, and Gross Anatomy) I wont be taking til this fall and spring. So that's why I think i wont have a good chance until next summer's applications.
 

md-2020

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I'd just apply DO if you can score decently on the MCAT (505+)

MD is very difficult, as masters GPAs a rarely ever weighted heavily; in fact, I've heard than anything under a 3.7 is considered below average!

You won't get into MD even if you wait another year, unless you rock a 95%ile+ MCAT (which is very unlikely, unfortunately).
 
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OP
AA831261414
Aug 3, 2015
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Lol lmao "I am too good for DO, MD is my dream."

You are not in a position to be picky. Your application is bottom of the barrel. 4.0 in a master's are often seen, it doesn't mean much. Come back with your MCAT and let's see what you're made of. Right now, it looks something like tofu...
Thank you, I said honesty and tough love, not dingus. Also don't put quotes around something that wasn't said, that is tacky.
 
OP
AA831261414
Aug 3, 2015
7
1
Status
Pre-Medical
I'd just apply DO if you can score decently on the MCAT (505+)

MD is very difficult, as masters GPAs a rarely ever weighted heavily; in fact, I've heard than anything under a 3.7 is considered below average!
Yes that is what I have been told too, in order to be considered at the DO or LSU-S you need atleast a 3.6+ so that is what I am preparing for.
 
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Sep 13, 2014
55
26
Under the Sea
Hi, I'm new to this forum so I'm still learning my way around. Any help/advice would be greatly appreciated. I'm not a stranger to tough love and honesty so please tell me what you would do in my shoes:)

Undergrad was academically terrible, made the common mistakes that any 17-20 year old would make: sports, partying, relationship drama, ect and ended with my overall GPA of 2.9 and my science is lower than that. (not sure but maybe around 2.6)
I did a semester of post-grad at a fairly large school and made C's in all 3 classes.
On a good note: I started a masters program for a master's in medical science and so far I have a 4.0. I'm confident that I will do well on my MCAT in 2 weeks and plan to keep my 4.0 through this program.
I have great letters of rec, and a LOT of outside experiences/background in medicine.

I am applying to three DO schools, one of which I think I have a fairly good chance of getting into.
I am also applying to LSU-S and LSU-NO.

MY QUESTION: I would LOVE to go to the DO school, I think that it has a great program, HOWEVER, the allopathic schools have been what I set my goals on since I was very young and if I did get into the DO school this year and not the MD schools, should I consider putting school off a year for a better chance at getting into one of the MD schools?

There are pros and cons to each situation, the MD schools are cheaper and one is closer to home. The DO school is also close to home and I love the 'small school' feel of the community. I have a better chance of getting into the DO but is my 'dream' school worth waiting another year?

Thanks in advance, sorry for such a long explanation.
Dude take a DO acceptance. Their is a 99.9% chance you WILL NOT GET into an MD program. Get accepted and never look back. You'll be a doctor before you know it. At the end of the day a doctor is a doctor. Also please post in pre osteopathic or allopathic
 
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OP
AA831261414
Aug 3, 2015
7
1
Status
Pre-Medical
Dude take a DO acceptance. Their is a 99.9% chance you WILL NOT GET into an MD program. Get accepted and never look back. You'll be a doctor before you know it. At the end of the day a doctor is a doctor. Also please post in pre osteopathic or allopathic
Thanks! I highly doubt I would ever turn down an acceptance when it came down to it, I just wanted to get some other opinions. I agree with you tho.

Ok I got a notification that my post had been moved to another forum but Ill make sure to do that next time! thanks!
 

Goro

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Give up the DO school and keep trying for MD. I'd much rather see your seat go to someone who actually wants to go to med school immediately, not forego a year of clinician salary, and who isn't afraid of working a little harder to land a competitive residency.



Hi, I'm new to this forum so I'm still learning my way around. Any help/advice would be greatly appreciated. I'm not a stranger to tough love and honesty so please tell me what you would do in my shoes:)

Undergrad was academically terrible, made the common mistakes that any 17-20 year old would make: sports, partying, relationship drama, ect and ended with my overall GPA of 2.9 and my science is lower than that. (not sure but maybe around 2.6)
I did a semester of post-grad at a fairly large school and made C's in all 3 classes.
On a good note: I started a masters program for a master's in medical science and so far I have a 4.0. I'm confident that I will do well on my MCAT in 2 weeks and plan to keep my 4.0 through this program.
I have great letters of rec, and a LOT of outside experiences/background in medicine.

I am applying to three DO schools, one of which I think I have a fairly good chance of getting into.
I am also applying to LSU-S and LSU-NO.

MY QUESTION: I would LOVE to go to the DO school, I think that it has a great program, HOWEVER, the allopathic schools have been what I set my goals on since I was very young and if I did get into the DO school this year and not the MD schools, should I consider putting school off a year for a better chance at getting into one of the MD schools?

There are pros and cons to each situation, the MD schools are cheaper and one is closer to home. The DO school is also close to home and I love the 'small school' feel of the community. I have a better chance of getting into the DO but is my 'dream' school worth waiting another year?

Thanks in advance, sorry for such a long explanation.
 
Sep 13, 2014
55
26
Under the Sea
Thanks! I highly doubt I would ever turn down an acceptance when it came down to it, I just wanted to get some other opinions. I agree with you tho.

Ok I got a notification that my post had been moved to another forum but Ill make sure to do that next time! thanks!
Awesome I don't think anyone here is knocking you. Everyone is showing you tough love. DO = MD honestly and in the future when there is only one match the difference will be minimum.
 
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md-2020

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Awesome I don't think anyone here is knocking you. Everyone is showing you tough love. DO = MD honestly and in the future when there is only one match the difference will be minimum.
I've been hearing at UMD-SOM that they're anticipating as early as 2018.
 
Jun 1, 2015
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Give up the DO school and keep trying for MD. I'd much rather see your seat go to someone who actually wants to go to med school immediately, not forego a year of clinician salary, and who isn't afraid of working a little harder to land a competitive residency.


SAVAGE!
 
OP
AA831261414
Aug 3, 2015
7
1
Status
Pre-Medical
Give up the DO school and keep trying for MD. I'd much rather see your seat go to someone who actually wants to go to med school immediately, not forego a year of clinician salary, and who isn't afraid of working a little harder to land a competitive residency.
I understand the first part of your response and yes, it makes sense, however, i dont see how my question says that I am afraid to work harder for a competitive residency....? Actually, quite the opposite: I'm willing to work harder to get into a more difficult school. If I didn't want to work hard I would settle for waiting tables.
 

Goro

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Yet you value the MD degree more than the DO....that was the whole point of your post.
 

GrapesofRath

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I don't want to needlessly add on but to put some perspective into place OP put yourself in an ADCOMs shoes. How do you think they would look at someone who went through 4 years of college to graduate with a 2.9/2.6 THEN in a post-bacc got straight C's? You screwed up your first chance. You bombed your second chance. Now you are asking for a third? Where in your transcript have you demonstrated an ability to handle medical school? Note: a heavily graded inflated masters degree is not the answer to this question.

The fact that there is even a discussion of a third chance in itself should show you how fortunate you are. Yet, you are acting as if you have already capitalized on your chance and are now complaining about a DO vs MD. Hell, many people who capitalize on their first chance and do well in undergrad and study hard for the MCAT don't get to the MD route Hopefully, me and the others who have posted on here aren't the only ones who see the flaw here.
 
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Apr 18, 2015
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Here's another case of an OP getting slammed unnecessarily and repeatedly.

The OP was extremely up front about his shortcomings, and then posed this -- "I would LOVE to go to the DO school, I think that it has a great program, HOWEVER, the allopathic schools have been what I set my goals on since I was very young and if I did get into the DO school this year and not the MD schools, should I consider putting school off a year for a better chance at getting into one of the MD schools?"

There are pros and cons to each situation, the MD schools are cheaper and one is closer to home. The DO school is also close to home and I love the 'small school' feel of the community. I have a better chance of getting into the DO but is my 'dream' school worth waiting another year?"

The respondents simply could have said something like, "Listen, congrats for your perseverance, but you've likely got too much to overcome to go for MD, and you may even be a longshot for DO, so concentrate your efforts on DO and accept a DO seat if you are fortunate enough to get one."

It's more than a little disingenuous, though, to slam the OP for wanting or "dreaming" of MD, since virtually every poster here prefers MD. Even Goro recommends that those with appropriate stats and ECs go for MD (and perhaps protect themselves with DO apps). Those applicants don't get quizzed on their value judgments about DO. And I would bet the house that there are posters here going MD who might well choose another direction other than DO if they were unable to snag a MD seat. Portraying the OP as some kind of entitled narcissist and slamming him for it doesn't match up with what the OP presented.
 
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FutureOncologist

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I'll keep it short. You are showing love for DO and if you get in, you should take it. MD = DO unless you're trying to get to Harvard for a residency spot. However, @Goro has seen some of his students get placed at competitive residencies, such as Mayo. Hell,more and more "ivy league" institutions are taking 1-2 DOs each year.

It'll be a little harder to get a nicer residency spot, but if you show this much determination at a Master's Program with a 4.0, you'll have no problem with getting one. All the luck OP.
 

NewHorizons

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Here's another case of an OP getting slammed unnecessarily and repeatedly.

The OP was extremely up front about his shortcomings, and then posed this -- "I would LOVE to go to the DO school, I think that it has a great program, HOWEVER, the allopathic schools have been what I set my goals on since I was very young and if I did get into the DO school this year and not the MD schools, should I consider putting school off a year for a better chance at getting into one of the MD schools?"

There are pros and cons to each situation, the MD schools are cheaper and one is closer to home. The DO school is also close to home and I love the 'small school' feel of the community. I have a better chance of getting into the DO but is my 'dream' school worth waiting another year?"

The respondents simply could have said something like, "Listen, congrats for your perseverance, but you've likely got too much to overcome to go for MD, and you may even be a longshot for DO, so concentrate your efforts on DO and accept a DO seat if you are fortunate enough to get one."

It's more than a little disingenuous, though, to slam the OP for wanting or "dreaming" of MD, since virtually every poster here prefers MD. Even Goro recommends that those with appropriate stats and ECs go for MD (and perhaps protect themselves with DO apps). Those applicants don't get quizzed on their value judgments about DO. And I would bet the house that there are posters here going MD who might well choose another direction other than DO if they were unable to snag a MD seat. Portraying the OP as some kind of entitled narcissist and slamming him for it doesn't match up with what the OP presented.
OP asked for tough love and honesty... everyone isn't holding back.... don't get the big deal. I do appreciate you defending many of the applicants since I noticed a trend some of your posts are on the more forgiving side. I personally would like to as well... but here's where I had some problems

Lets start from the beginning...

"i, I'm new to this forum so I'm still learning my way around. Any help/advice would be greatly appreciated. I'm not a stranger to tough love and honesty so please tell me what you would do in my shoes:)"

Fair enough... you're gonna get it but you are prepared.

"Undergrad was academically terrible, made the common mistakes that any 17-20 year old would make: sports, partying, relationship drama, ect and ended with my overall GPA of 2.9 and my science is lower than that. (not sure but maybe around 2.6). I did a semester of post-grad at a fairly large school and made C's in all 3 classes."

Wholeheartedly disagree.... people think that just because you are young it's natural to do stupid things. That couldn't be further from the truth. I'd argue these issues aren't common amongst those who earnestly want to get into medicine. They buckle down and focus... even for those who do end up faltering, most don't tank their overall undergrad GPA of at least 4 years by that much. Even with some post-grad classes, which I assume is when you tried to smarten up your act, you still couldn't do well.

"On a good note: I started a masters program for a master's in medical science and so far I have a 4.0. I'm confident that I will do well on my MCAT in 2 weeks and plan to keep my 4.0 through this program. "

Unknown right now if masters degrees inflate marks. Is it a course-based masters? If not you may not even have enough courses to offset your terrible undergraduate GPA. It's really school dependent when considering graduate degrees and how they weigh in the GPA calculations.

"I have great letters of rec, and a LOT of outside experiences/background in medicine."

We'd all like to hear it, particularly what you even define as great.

"I am applying to three DO schools, one of which I think I have a fairly good chance of getting into. I am also applying to LSU-S and LSU-NO."

Some semblance of planning is nice, though I wouldn't be that optimistic to say your chances are good. Your MCAT score is unknown too.

"MY QUESTION: I would LOVE to go to the DO school, I think that it has a great program, HOWEVER, the allopathic schools have been what I set my goals on since I was very young and if I did get into the DO school this year and not the MD schools, should I consider putting school off a year for a better chance at getting into one of the MD schools?"

Fair question... do you really think putting off school for a year will change your disastrous GPA around? You need at least a post-bacc or SMP to lift the grades as there's no grade replacement opportunity for MD. This is all assuming you even get into a DO school, which in itself is unclear.

"There are pros and cons to each situation, the MD schools are cheaper and one is closer to home. The DO school is also close to home and I love the 'small school' feel of the community. I have a better chance of getting into the DO but is my 'dream' school worth waiting another year?"

If your dream is to be stubborn trying to get ,MD behind your name, then by all means.... You have no choice, nor the right given your stats, to be picky. There is only one viable option, to apply broad and run with the opportunity at an NA school.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"What am I going to score? I hope a 508 or better, the practice test i took from AMCAS did not give me a score but comparing my percentages to the old MCAT I was around 26. By the end of my masters program I plan to still have my 4.0 but as an overall GPA, It should bring me close to a 3.5."

How did you arrive at this calculation? Assuming you're in a 2 yr program... even a full course load every semester at 4.0 cannot offset your entire 4+ yr undergrad GPA of <3.0, it's just mathematically impossible, particularly if those post-grad C's are included. I want to give you the benefit of the doubt, but without some actual supporting evidence I have to say that you won't be able to, assuming things even continue to go well.

In addition, hope and speculation is about as good as your current status in med school, empty. I don't believe in unreached potential or speculations. Until you get the grades, the objective numbers in front of me right now don't suggest you get that ... at best I'd think you get around <=26... which is lethal for MD anyways. A 508 is around 30-31....... how do you think with your practice at ~26 that you can get a 31? Be realistic.

"I am open to almost any specialty, my passion is in emergency medicine and pediatrics as of now."

I wouldn't get carried away.... you still have a long way to go.

LSU-No also has a program for students in my position: if you take at least 32 hours at a post graduate institution, then your undergraduate GPA will be replaced by your new GPA. That would significantly help my application, however, I wont be done with my hours until May.

Eh don't know much about this so I'll refrain from commenting....

I'm pretty patient. I will be 24 this october so it's getting a little frustrating because people get in at 22 now days but in the long run I know im still young. On the other hand I dont want to put it off too long bc I want to start a family. BUT I know that's not a huge deciding factor.

I'm 24 and just gotten in after my masters. Even if you get in 4 years later that's nothing, nor does that hold you back from starting a life.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Overall the OP doesn't seem completely terrible... that said the perceived potential and speculation are not nearly realistic. The OP still has a long way to go.
 

candbgirl

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My GPA now is a 4.0 for my master's degree. If you mean calculating my undergrad, postgrad, and graduate together I'm really not certain, probably close to 3.1-ish. I will have to sit down and calculate them together. The application services should tell me the overall calculated GPA but I just submitted my AMCAS 2 days ago and have not had it verified .
Why on earth did you apply this cycle? You won't be verified until sometime in September, secondaries won't be submitted until later, no MCAT and just awful
GPAs. This shows very poor judgement on your part. Even if LSU has a program for people like you it won't help you one bit this cycle. By the time you get 32 hours interviewing will be over. And then when you aren't accepted you'll be a reapplicant. If you somehow manage to get into a DO school and that's questionable take the acceptance and don't look back.
 
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"Undergrad was academically terrible, made the common mistakes that any 17-20 year old would make: sports, partying, relationship drama, ect and ended with my overall GPA of 2.9 and my science is lower than that. (not sure but maybe around 2.6). I did a semester of post-grad at a fairly large school and made C's in all 3 classes."

Wholeheartedly disagree.... people think that just because you are young it's natural to do stupid things. That couldn't be further from the truth. I'd argue these issues aren't common amongst those who earnestly want to get into medicine. They buckle down and focus... even for those who do end up faltering, most don't tank their overall undergrad GPA of at least 4 years by that much. Even with some post-grad classes, which I assume is when you tried to smarten up your act, you still couldn't do well.
Appreciate your effort in this post, but the above shows how we just read things very differently. You apparently viewed the OP in the above as making excuses. I read that as the OP being pretty forthcoming and transparent about bombing undergrad as far as pre-med goes. What did you expect the OP to say? Something like "I did not make common mistakes of 17-20 year olds and in fact I was very idiosyncratically a disaster and failure"?

Here's a related question. What % of MD matriculants would not have considered DO if they had no MD options, and instead would have chosen an alternative career path, or waited another cycle to again apply to MD programs exclusively? Please don't say zero.
 

PREDOCSIMP

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Give up the DO school and keep trying for MD. I'd much rather see your seat go to someone who actually wants to go to med school immediately, not forego a year of clinician salary, and who isn't afraid of working a little harder to land a competitive residency.
I thought you were being serious. I understand your post now.
 

NewHorizons

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Appreciate your effort in this post, but the above shows how we just read things very differently. You apparently viewed the OP in the above as making excuses. I read that as the OP being pretty forthcoming and transparent about bombing undergrad as far as pre-med goes. What did you expect the OP to say? Something like "I did not make common mistakes of 17-20 year olds and in fact I was very idiosyncratically a disaster and failure"?

Here's a related question. What % of MD matriculants would not have considered DO if they had no MD options, and instead would have chosen an alternative career path, or waited another cycle to again apply to MD programs exclusively? Please don't say zero.
Ok that's another fair way to look at the post and I definitely acknowledge that possibility... the reason I went for the more negative thought was that throughout the text the OP demonstrated what I felt was very unrealistic speculation, which makes me doubt their ability to judge certain situations currently. Honestly... I think saying you're a "disaster" is honestly ... well more honest. If it were me I actually would acknowledge it like that... though to be fair I'm the type that wants to hear only negatives and use that as motivation to be better.

Still wondering what the OP is thinking now. I'm also interested in whether anyone does have an answer to your question.

Take care man =D
 
Apr 18, 2015
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Ok that's another fair way to look at the post and I definitely acknowledge that possibility... the reason I went for the more negative thought was that throughout the text the OP demonstrated what I felt was very unrealistic speculation, which makes me doubt their ability to judge certain situations currently. Honestly... I think saying you're a "disaster" is honestly ... well more honest. If it were me I actually would acknowledge it like that... though to be fair I'm the type that wants to hear only negatives and use that as motivation to be better.

Still wondering what the OP is thinking now. I'm also interested in whether anyone does have an answer to your question.

Take care man =D
Yep, read the OP's very first sentence..."Undergrad was academically terrible." Seems to me the OP hammered himself so he wouldn't have to be hammered and could just focus on what to do. He (or she) got hammered.

And I doubt anyone will answer the question.
 
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Thank you! the master's program I am in is actually very medically based and has strong ties to the DO school and LSU-S because it is known to really prepare students for medical level classes. My problem is, is that Im just starting this program and the hardest classes (Medical Phys 1 and 2, and Gross Anatomy) I wont be taking til this fall and spring. So that's why I think i wont have a good chance until next summer's applications.
Ahh! I see, but you mentioned averaging your GPAs, which won't happen. They'll see your 4.0 and your 2.6 separately.
 

Stagg737

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As someone that got a degree in NOLA and have experience with the programs you're talking about, here's my best advice:

Forget about applying this cycle. It doesn't matter if you're 24, if you don't put out the best application possible, you may never get in. Finish your master's and get your 32 credits. Getting a 3.8+ will vastly improve your chances at LSU, and you don't want them to have any doubts that your crappy undergrad GPA is in the past. Besides, from the sounds of it you need as much focus as possible to maintain that 4.0. You're also going to need to have a strong MCAT, I think a 508 is a good target (converts to a 31 old score), but getting much lower than that could hurt your chances a lot. I know my school (DO) is wants a minimum 506 next year so things are getting more competitive.

Once you've got your new GPA and MCAT, apply as early as possible next year. You should have all primaries submitted by mid-June, and secondaries done by August for MD schools and September for DO. I say this because you're going to need all the help you can get. If you're applying MD, stick to LSU. You won't get much love, if any at all, from any other schools. You should also expand the number of DO schools you're applying to. For someone with your stats, applying to less than 10 will likely be a waste of time.

Not trying to be negative, just being realistic. Good luck OP.