All of you thinking about going into nursing please read!

Discussion in 'Clinicians [ RN / NP / PA ]' started by guylon07, Jun 24, 2000.

  1. guylon07

    guylon07 Member
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    I wrote this response to another topic (I have added a little to it), and I feel that it is important that people should read this!

    Ok, now a topic that has struck a nerve. As the person stated before, I am also going to go to medical school. I have been a nurse for 4 years in hospitals here in Little Rock Arkansas. However, I have become sooooo frustrated with the nursing profession. We are sooo overworked and underpaid for the responsibilities that we take on every time we go to work.

    I was a charge nurse in a critical care unit. The thing of it is, is that I was working so hard under mental and physical stress becuase we were so short staffed at work (and the problem was not because of some so called nursing shortage, it was because 3 of our hospitals had hiring freezes within 6 mo. of each other becuase they were all going bankrupt trying to outdo one another), and I was also under stress at home becuase I could not pay my bills with what I was getting paid at the hospital. Here I am with a B.S.N and a B.S. in physiology, and I could make just as much money waiting tables as I could working as a nurse.

    I was in charge of the unit and took patients of my own most of the time, and after 3 years of working here I was making 13.50 an hour. THAT IS REDICULOUS. And what really makes me mad is that all of the hospitals around here pay anywhere from 11.80-15.00 hr. depending upon experience. I am sorry but that is slave wages for the work we do.

    The ANA should do something about this, but they are to busy making sure that nursing is considered a "Profession" than taking the time to actually do something useful for us nurses out there in the field. I wrote several letters to the ANA and our state nursing association about my concern. However, I never received any response. I even went to the hospitals nursing administrationa and had a meeting with them discussing my concerns for the patients and staff, but all I received were empty promises to make me happy so that I might leave the office.

    I also considered going into a NP program, but I feel that this is also a JOKE. My fiance just finished a masters porgram here at UAMS, and it was useless. They are more concerned about teaching you the history of nursing, theory, and research so that they can be considered a profession, than they are about teaching you how to care for a patient. I do not feel that an NP needs to know about this CRAP unless they are going into teaching. However, I love medicine and I love the idea of what nursing once was. Nursing was built on the idea of taking care of people but, I feel that this idea has long been forgotten. I could not take the way that nurses are treated any longer, and the way that my hands were tied in trying to care for patients so I opted for Medical school. I will be starting in the fall, and I am really looking forward to it.

    All I have to say is "All of you people thinking about becoming nurses be forwarned." "It is not the glorious save the world scenario that they discuss in class. You can make a difference in some peoples lives and that is the only reason I have stayed in it this long. However you go to work, you are over worked, underpaid, unapreciated by administration, and in most places stressed to the hilt." I feel that if something is not done soon to adjust this problem there are going to be major deficiencies in the nursing population as far as experienced staff goes.

    However I don't feel that there will be a shortage of nurses because of the nursing industries marketing of the shortage, job availability, the great pay, and excellent benefits. I feel that there will always be new nurses coming on (inexperienced)and the hospitals will keep using them and spitting them out. This is why the propblem will never be solved, becuase there will always be new nurses coming on.

    This is why I am writing this so that all of you thinking about becoming nurses will think about it hard and heavy. It is sad that the paitients are going to be the ones who suffer the greatest becuase of it. This thought has kept me going in nursing but I have done all that I can do, and I am moving on. There was a 2 page spread written a couple of weeks ago in the Arkanas Times by a nurse with 20 or so years of experience who had left nursing becuase of the working conditions. I thoght that this was wonderful. We need to let the public know how the people who are taking care of their loved ones are being treated. The general population has no idea. When I tell people how much money I make, and the hours that I work they can not believe it. Also, when I tell them that an R.N. with a diploma who has only had 1 1/2 yrs of training could be taking care of their critically ill loved they are amazed. I am going to make it a point when I become a doctor to bring this to peoples attention. I have vowed to do something about this one day when I do have some power to do so. All of you that feel this way should also begin to start ways to bring this to peoples attention (call your paper, news, etc.. anonamously if you are worried about your job, these media people eat this up), becuase until the public starts putting pressure on hospitals and the ANA, nothing will be done about it. Good luck to all of you.
    J.K.
     
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  3. Future DOc

    Future DOc Senior Member
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    My fiance' has been an BSN-RN for 2 years now & she got hired as a new grad at $25/hr. She works 3-11 schedule as a Post Cardiac Care nurse & normally gets out on time. We reside in SO Cal.

    I have a lot of firends who are BSN-RNs working on Guam who are living the exact experiences you have just described. Maybe it might be location....Have you looked elsewhere?

    Final note: Working to become a physician is actually a lot more horrendous that what you have described for nurses, so be ready for more HELL on top of your current expereinces as you pursure medicine. Trust me!!! Good luck to you!!! [​IMG]

    Rob
    MS III
     
  4. guylon07

    guylon07 Member
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    Well FutureDoc,
    Your wife may be in a good area and, and thank goodness that she does, you don't have to be in some other country like guam to experience this. I live in Arkansas, and this is a problem throughout the southern states, and with my educational background you would not think that I or any of the other nurses around here would have to move around the country to try and find a job that pays decient wages. Myself, my wife, and every other nurse that I know in this state are going through the same problems. If you do not believe that this could be possible read look at this site http://www.arktimes.com/000526coverstoryd.html. As for the med school thing, DON"T ENVEN BEGIN TO TELL ME ABOUT THE TERRIBLE HELLS YOU GO THROUGH!! One of the hospitals I worked in was a teaching hospital, and we had residents coming through our unit. I know what med students and residents go through, and they all said the same thing "I would not have your job for anything." Yes you may have hour upon hour of grueling studying without sleep, but you try for one day, being bit, hit, kicked, spit on, cussed by patients and family members, **** on (literally), vommitted on, saving someones life, keeping the residents from doing more damage than good, and standing there holding someones hand as they look at you scared to death taking their last breath. On top of this standing there with the family after the doctor has walked in and said there was nothing more we could do and walks out. Then realizing that you made about 125.00 bucks for a twelve hr shift that usually runs into about 13-14 hrs that probably took a year or two off of your lifespan because of the stress you just experienced. These are all things the doctors rarely see, but we have such an easy job don't we. Like I said your wife is very lucky if she has a cush job like that becuase there aren't many. And don't get me wrong I am not going into medicine because I think that it is easier, I don't guess you read me post very well (just like a doc to skim the surface) I am going into medicine becuase I am so tired of seeing what patients need, and having no one there to agree with me and help me treat them. Many doctors have a thing about someone suggesting a treatment. It hurts their ego or something. So many times I would watch a patient going down hill fast, because I am there with that patient day after day hour after hour, I knew what was going on with that patient, and there was not a thing I could do about it. So I got tired of this. This is the main reson I went into medicine, not that I thought it was easy. If I wanted easy I would have left the medical field all together. I am here to help people that is what keeps me going here.
    Please think before you speak it will help you in the future.
    JK
     
  5. Julie

    Julie Member
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    I agree with guylon07, nursing is a difficult career. I worked in a hospital for a year and my aunt has been a nurse at that hospital for 8 years. The things I saw and the things she has gone through are horrible.
    She also works on a critical care unit and so did I. They are always understaffed and under paid. (She does make a little more ~$20 an hour) I have the up most respect for nurses but there is no way I would be a nurse. They get treated horrible by some of the doctors. At her hospital and some of the other area hospitals they are trying to join the union so they will have some control over their working conditions.
     
  6. Future DOc

    Future DOc Senior Member
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    Whoever said that nursing isn't a tough job....I have always known that!!! I have numerous friends & family members who are BSN-RNs as well. I have always respected nurses & I will always do so.

    Please don't lecture me on what are the ins & outs of the hospital as a nurse b/c I worked as a medical technologist for many years & we get our share of the blows as well. You don't know how many times I have had to deal with unreasonable nurses too. You make it sound like ONLY nurses get the short end of the stick in the medical field & docs just coast in & out and make the big bucks! Lab techs, Resp techs, PTs, etc...& believe it or not, docs as well have their share too!!! Do you see me or others complaining?

    My point is: I don't think its very fair of you to speak about the ENTIRE nursing profession as a whole based on just YOUR experiences. So, please quit trying to discourage future applicants from pursuing a potential dream b/c YOU are not the MAJORITY...just one voice!!!

    Its obvious you have heavy BEEF with what you are doing as a nurse. What makes you think that pursuing medicine will make things better? I would like to see you live your life like an Intern!! You try making a life or death decision on someone's grandmother with just 2hrs sleep the past 2 days!! You need to step back & reassess YOUR line of thinking here...

    Let me ask you a question: WHY did you continue to pursue nursing in the 1st place if you are so disgruntled about it? You must have known what you were getting yourself into when you did your clinicals? OR were you just not paying attention?

    Good luck in your endeavors anyhow & learn not to take things so personally or to get so defensive when you don't like how someone else responds to your posts!! That is KEY when you pursue medicine b/c you will get bashed down the road!! I was ONLY giving you MY thoughts....plain & simple!!!

    Rob
    MS III

    [This message has been edited by Future DOc (edited 06-26-2000).]
     
  7. guylon07

    guylon07 Member
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    OK, OK, lets not fight. I might have come across harsh, becuase this is a touchy subject to me. I listed all of the reasons why I stayed in medicine, to help people ect.... If you don't mind pleas go back and read the orignial post above again. I love medicine and nursing, and I am not trying to talk people out of their dreams, I would just like to let people know what they are getting into, and in the original post I suggessted the idea of letting the public know what is going on. I feel that this is the only thing that is going to change the road that nursing is heading down. I don't have a beef with medicine. I love medicine and the idea of nursing, but I don't like what nursing has become. Man you could take a sentence like "the sky is blue", and turn it around to make it sound like the sky is falling! Lets not turn this into an argument. I am trying to do something productive here and your making me sound like a disgruntled employee. Like I said I am not the only one check out the link above if you think that it is just me. Once again I have vowed to help nurses in the future when I have some authority to do so. Nursing was once a wonderful profession, it has just been taken advantage of. So thats that. Good luck to you, and sorry if I came across harsh.
    JK
     
  8. zazu

    zazu Junior Member

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    ***IN REPONSE TO CONCERNED NURSES AND DOCTORS

    I've been a nurse practitioner for years, and my spouse is a nurse working in a rehab hospital. I've been a waitress, a nurse, a psychologist and almost became an architect. I am an ex-southern wife. Yikes!

    My new husband is a RN who used to own a great landscape company. He is one of those really great nurses.
    My husband and I are amoungst the thirty something generation who finally know what they want to do.

    Dear frustrated nurses and future doctors,

    I laughed and shook my head while saying "YES!!!" many times while reading the words of both individuals which I will call "the future doctor" and the "frustrated nurse".
    A word to the future doctor: I've jumped into that gray area where most people I know are very happy that I am going to medical school, but many others are not. Many nurses and a few NPs and PAs I know think I'm crazy and are shocked by my decision.

    After all, I've been saying for years: "I love my job as a nurse practitioner. Why the heck whould I go to medical school now?"

    I no longer feel this way. I am so frustrated with the nursing profession that I said the hell with it! Going to medical school will change my life in multiple ways.
    My husband hopes to keep our $300,000 home. My father is a doctor who told me NOT TO GO TO MEDICAL school and encouraged me to go to nurse practitioner school.
    My husband and I make a good living and are both good at what we do. We used to work together. We saved many lives. I live for that and so does he. We have property ready in Colorado. It's not about the money and it really shouldn't be anyway.

    The truth is simply this: Whether you are a nurse or a doctor you must rise above the administrative bull and doctor nurse rivalry nonsense and get back to taking care of your patients! I feel that I can take better care of my patients as a doctor. Whoever is interested, please send me your opinions.

    To the frustrated nurse:

    I don't blame you for feeling the way that you do. You should talk to my husband. Many of the nurse practitioner programs do really miss the point, and some down right suck.

    ****You need to ask yourself the most important question of your entire career.***

    Maybe I've been in denial for years, but now I've asked myself this question.
    Are you ready to ask yourself the following question? Can you live with the answer? If so, read on.

    ***In your current capacity as a nurse, nurse practitioner or physician asisstant, can you provide the best quality care with the very best of your ability to your patients?***
    Will you exibit the necessary zest and vigor you used to have or strive to have while taking care of your patients? That's a loaded question-and-a-half!!! It's really many questions rolled together.

    To put it more simply: Do you love your job, or are you burnt out; are you bored, or have you grown out of your job; can you manage to deal with the nursing or mid level bull, or do you need to increase your knowledge base and further your career?

    Do you thirst for knowledge? Do you seek out new knowledge and treatments for your patients sake? Will your patients miss you?

    Pretend that age is irrelevant. Think about the patients. How can you help them the best? Do you still want to help patients, or do you think somebody else can do it?

    YOU HAVE THREE CHOICES

    1. Quit medicine and find something else to do.
    2. Stay in your current profession and stop complaining about the woes of nurses or NPs or PAs.
    3. Go to medicial school.

    These are really your only choices. Quit, deal with it, or move on and forward.

    I now consider myself to be very lucky. I finally know what I want. Medical school is my only option. I have a supportive husband and the money to do it. I love taking care of patients. My only regret is that I didn't listen to the comments of other nurses and many doctors years ago. They all said: "You should be a doctor!"

    It was finally the patients, the crappy insurance companies, an occational really bad nurse or doctor, and my conscience that got to me. I love nothing better than my husband and medicine. I can make more of a difference for my patients if I am a medical doctor.
    I still believe medicine to be amoung the most noble of professions. I cannot quit. I have been cheated, harassed and taken advantage of. But that doesn't matter to the patients. They still need help and I have a job to do. It is what I do best.

    My husband is a great nurse. I want to be a great doctor. If you have the same love and respect for patients that my husband I do, stay in the profession or go to medical school. Otherwise, get out of medicine. I don't mean this in a nasty way at all. Just decide and commit to one road or the other. If you read this entire posting, please encourage those who have what it takes to further their careers and never forget about the patients. Good luck to all from NP gone MD.

    The patients are waiting.

    [This message has been edited by zazu (edited 07-06-2000).]

    [This message has been edited by zazu (edited 07-06-2000).]

    [This message has been edited by zazu (edited 07-06-2000).]

    [This message has been edited by zazu (edited 07-06-2000).]
     
  9. Matt Norman

    Matt Norman Member
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    Well, say what you will about nursing. I think it is a wonderful thing. You must be in an area with saleries on the low side. I just graduated from nursing school and I started at $14.13 an hour plus $2.50 for night shift. Plus I know some nurses making as much a $65,000 a year. not bad for a two year degree. Any way just my two cents worth. I do agree that it is highly stressful and that our very career is on the line every day we go to work. However, one thing to keep in mind. My mother has been an RN for 15 years and never ben sued. Not bad. All things concidered I think nursing isn't such a bad thing. Just my two cents.

    Matt

    ------------------
    Love God, Hate Sin
     
  10. guylon07

    guylon07 Member
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    Very well said Zazu, you don't realize how much I agree with you. I have become so frustrated with people that I work with, and nurses on the aol nursing bulliten board who look at me going into medicine as turning my back on the nursing profession. Well the so called nursing ?PROFESSION? has turned its back on all of us. All I have heard are negative responses from nurses and doctors. Especially like the ones above. All I hear is "Oh the money is terrible, you have so many student loans to pay back, I make more money as a nurse." Or the doctors say "Its terrible the long hours, and all of the studying." Well no matter how many times I explain it nobody listens. However, you hit it on the nose. I am doing it to better myself and the patients. I am in a stagnant rut in nursing, and its only getting deeper. My hospital salary is terrible, they never offer any education, staffing is terrible, managment is going to watch out for no one but themselves and, I watch patients suffer everyday with my hands tied behind my back. However, according to everone else I'm only wanting to go to med school for the money, it's always the money this and the money that, when you are talking to others about this subject. The fact that you might be trying to provide the patients with something more never comes up in these conversations. I love the way you stated the above post, and I thank you for writing it.
    Jodie
     
  11. ewagner

    ewagner Senior Member
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    Zazu,

    I have an idea of why your father may say not to go into medicine, as many other physicians say to the "up and comers". As I sometimes think myself coming from a professional life to the student life.

    Medical school isn't fun. And, you enter into a lot of debt. You also enter into a more hostile and competative workplace than any other physicians before us have. And, quite often , you find yourself at odds with the approaches that instructors teach in school.
    I remember a pharmacist in school just shaking her head in pharmacology class because we had to memorize the MOA's of drugs that were no longer used clinically!
    It is a very frustrating affair. You may also find yourself struggling academically like you never have before because all of the young guns have just come out of school. A former Vet. almost failed her first year at our school!

    But, when you have a calling you have a calling. I really cannot picture myself being a PT anymore. I see myself only as a doctor and that gives me the strength to continue pushing on.
    So, if you are ready for a rough road...good luck, and I am sure in the not so distant future, you will be very happy.

    good luck
     
  12. NurseAmy

    NurseAmy New Member

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    Hi!!
    I am currently a 33-yr old student nurse and already looking into either going on for NP or MD. I've been told many times also that I should be a doctor but never thought I would be able to handle all the stress, hours, etc. since I already have a 4.5 yr old and might have another on the way. My question is....with a nursing degree behind me will I have any shorter route to becoming an MD or will I have to retake all the classes that I have been through, like the sciences, etc. I am really interested in pursuing this further but need some advice. Also, about how long would it take for me to get my MD? I'm thinking maybe by the time I'm 40? Is that way too old? What do you all think?
    Thanks,
    Amy!!
     
  13. Krazed_Medic

    Krazed_Medic Registered Banned User
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    In my own little not so important opinion, that's why everyone who wants to further their education should "Just do it". whether it be to NP, PA, MD, DO, OD...etc...etc. It should definately be to better yourself for the good of the people you treat.
     
  14. BADunning

    BADunning Member
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    Hi NurseAmy,

    Well, here the opinion of an LPN. Go for it. I certainly don't think that your age is a problem. I'll be 39 next month and starting med school in August. Obviously I don't think I'm too old.

    As far as the shorter route is concerned, you need four basic courses to qualify for most med schools: Biology, Chemistry, Organic Chem, and Physics; one year each all with labs. If these are part of your nursing degree, that's okay. You shouldn't have to retake any classes, especially those that were pre-reqs for nursing (English, math, etc . . .). In addition to MD programs, look into DO programs. They tend to look more favorably on older students and give more consideration to life experiences.

    Opinions are like . . . well, just my opinions.
    :)
     
  15. NurseyK

    NurseyK Bunny-Slave
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    Ouch...a hot topic...welp, they say opinions are like a$$holes....here comes mine: :p

    Future DOc: I believe, even though you state you "know" many nurses, you need to do a bit more research into what exactly is going on in nursing today. California is a hot-bed of nursing issues of late, so you should be able to find up-to-date info quite easily. I would suggest you do this before telling us all in the trenches what essentially amounts to "suck-it-up". You are correct when you say that any Tech (ER, XR, Phleb, Resp, etc) runs ragged also. I know my ER Techs and Secretary work like dogs right next to me on a bad nite. And always remember, the nurses are your last check-stop before your orders are executed. Giving orders on a pt while working on only 2 hrs of sleep? Well, the nurse standing next to you (depending on the hospital) has been on shift for 20 hrs without the benefit of a nap (and probably not a decent meal or potty break). When you think of it like that it's truly a wonder how more pt's don't die...maybe because of something called TEAM effort and knowlege sharing/good rapport (?) Just a few things to think about...

    Guy: I'm with you 300% (if that's even possible). You are relating most everything that happens on a daily basis. I, too, posted some of my frustrations on a web-BB (a thread on SDN and also one that was even specific to Nursing - Emergency Nursing - to be exact) and was shot down in flames. Called all sorts of names. Told to "suck it up" and be "greatful for my job" and that I "couldn't take the stress" or some such nonsense (I've been a Charge RN in a Trauma center now for 5-6 yrs with more certifications than you can shake a stick at..hell, I've probably forgotten more than a few of 'em young'uns 'ave learned ;) LOL!). I was made to feel like *I* was the crazy one (Psych consult anyone?). You are not crazy. You are not alone. Even though I make quite a bit more money than you, I'm also in NY, which means my cost of living is higher. Is money an issue? Sure. But, I think the foremost issue for all of us in the trenches is working conditions. Nursing working conditions are deplorable. Overworked somehow doesn't seem to describe it well enough. Mandation is killing us (we're mandated for 20's here - you work you're reg 12 then stay another 8...ouch). Understaffing is cutting us down even more. 3 inept, poorly skilled and - I'm coming to believe - untrainable - new-to-ER (about 10 mos old and 3 unit specific orientations later) nurses in the Dept (that the Mger won't fire despite the fact we have written enough paper to cover her office walls). In my State, they screw up, I get to take the heat (as their Charge RN) -- and BOYOBOY do they screw up (just for a flavor: MD orders KCl, "suzie" goes in and **PUSHES** the KCL like water...."oops" she says. Never mind the pt aftermath). This is not a *doctor* problem. This is a *nursing* problem. (Get it Future? Each of us on the team have our own unique headaches/reportable issues/legal responsibilities/etc.) And lastly Guy, don't expect the majority of your nursing colleagues to congratulate you on your accomplishment of gaining entrance to medschool. They didn't hold any parades for me when I let it be known, they didn't for the many before me, and they won't after me (and you). I don't know what the reason is, and neither do the Docs (read: former nurses) either. Words of wisdom I've received...never forget where you came from.

    Each healthcare specialty has its own unique problems. To berate or belittle another's is foolish and exhibits an overwhelming lack of knowlege.


    Kat [pulling up her pants so you don't need to hear her "opinion" anymore ;) ]
     
  16. groundhog

    groundhog 1K Member
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    Well Guylon07,

    Ever consider the reason that RN's make peanuts in Arkansas might be due to the fact that it is a "right to work" state. So, you have to work along side those RN's who have spouses that make good bucks and will never support your efforts to organize an effective union that could negotiate a contract with the hospital administration.
     
  17. wsu

    wsu Senior Member
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    Gay, i agree with you 100%

    Where is the ANA saying nursing should be a profession and its a wonderful career chocie when in fact, 1 in 3 nurses under 30 leave the profession and more older nurses are simply becoming burnout. We work nights, midnigts, weekends, get paid crap compared to othe entry level careers and do more...

    Gay, your anger should be directed towards the ANA not the hospitals. The ANA has let us down in a huge way..
     
  18. tedsadoc2002

    tedsadoc2002 Senior Member
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    To Future Doc,
    If he indeed has time to read this anymore (he's probably graduated looking at the original date on the post), it's really nice that your fiance (or wife) has a job that pays that well and gets out on time every night. This is THE EXCEPTION rather than the rule. I have been a registered nurse in NY (so yes my salary was way up there, but have you ever lived on Long Island, do you have any idea what the property taxes and the utility rates are, my salary might as well be the same as Guylon's!!!!!)for 12 years. Things had gone from fair to flat out horrible. And though the ANA should share some blame for not helping us to resolve some of the nonsense, the hospitals definitely are the culprits in the mess out there. One particular teaching institution on the "Island" has been buying up all the smaller community hospitals, pushed out the bargaining unit (union) then promptly decreased salaries and decreased nursing staff. Their hospital made front page news when they "fired" their entire nursing staff then made them reapply for their jobs. When they reapplied, I believe (don't quote me on exact figures as this occurred shortly before I left to go to med school)they only rehired 30%-50% and replaced the rest with brand new (not experienced because they might have to pay them) techs. This has been the way they have cut costs and have lined their pockets. They are the only hospital out there that I know that has refurbished and added on to their main hospital continuously since I was a nursing student (and that was eons ago.) This leaves the nurses liable for any mistakes that the tech makes (they aren't licensed so who did you think they were going to sue or fire for that matter!)that are made. Guam and Arkansas are not the only places that the nurses are overworked and underpaid. Dissatisfaction was very high in many of the places that I worked in (to supplement that "high" salary so that I could afford a place to live, I taught at 2 different institutions and worked for 2 registries, does that tell you something?, Yes, I was crazy but I'd like to pay bills and not have a stress attack cause I'm fighting for meagre overtime that they only wanted to dole out to their favorite nurses). Okay, so I've spouted enough venom for today, felt good. To those of you who want to get into the nursing profession, good luck to you. I suggest though that if there are issues you feel strongly about at your work place and you wish to effect change, look around at the people you work with carefully. Will they support you (1000% like McGovern said to Eagleton back in the '72 presidential campaign, that might as well be a knife in the back), brand you a "troublemaker" and give you grief or simply leave you out there to fend for yourself. If you don't like what you see, get out while you still can. If you can weather the storms, I say go for it. Nothing worth fighting for is ever easy. Best wishes (you can tell I'm on a break from school these posts are so long) Ted.
     
  19. Nurse2Doc

    Nurse2Doc Senior Member
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    Nursing is what you make of it. One of the many wonderful things about nursing is its flexibility. If you are making 11.50/hr as a nurse, then it is b/c of your own lack of business savvy. Sure there are those who are content to go to work at the same job, day after day, year after year~I call it the comfort zone. If you are not happy, change it. Move out of your comfort zone. Be proactive. There are so many things you can do in nursing if you are not happy in your current position. To those of you considering nursing~~don't let the discouraged discourage you. While I am applying to med school (I got my BS specifically to apply to med school, & nursing seemed like a logical major) I have discovered nursing to be a wonderful profession, and you will always find those who try to throw up road blocks, whatever path you choose.
     
  20. JAMMAN

    JAMMAN Chief Exceutive Officer
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    I think nursing is an excellent career and I encourage alot of people to go into it.
     
  21. Jambi

    Jambi Caldari
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    Talk about resurrecting and old thread :eek:
     
  22. Sinnman

    Sinnman Senior Member
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    I have a simple question:

    Why doesn't the ANA focus on producing more nurses and stop trying to produce NPs that want to play doctor?

    I know that sounds harsh but think about it. There are nursing programs all over the country with 2 year waiting lists for admission and hospitals begging for some RNs. Open any newspaper and you will see a ton of ads trying to recruit nurses.

    Why? The claim is that there are not enough nursing instructors. The irony is that the NP programs are opening as fast as the local mini-marts. They are actively recruiting students! I still get flyers from Vanderbilt trying to get me to go to their MSN NP program.

    I wish the nursing "theorists" and leaders would stop trying to be something you are not and start producing a much needed member of the healthcare system, plain 'ol nurses.
     
  23. zenman

    zenman Senior Member
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    Doctors aren't happy these days either because big insurance makes the rules. If you want a good paying job with benefits where you can really make a difference become a politician! :D
     
  24. OrthoFixation

    OrthoFixation 1K Member
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    OP: Your compensation in AR is low. Here in DFW metroplex (Texas), new nursing grad's start out about $20-$22/hr and are usually hired before they graduate (committed to hiring). The competition is stiff, with multiple offers. My friend's wife was in this situation. Prior to her first anniversary, she received a $4/hr raise. She is also paid 40 hrs/wk but only works 36 (Thurs, Sat, Sun on days). She has considered taking a hiring bonus of $15K with another employer for a two year committment. This was unusual, since most hiring bonuses in the Dallas Morning News are $4K - $6K.

    Good luck.
     
  25. zenman

    zenman Senior Member
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    My ex-wife, who is a nurse midwife and FNP, is leaving Ark after a short stay because of the quality of care there and the compensation. I suspect Ark is a third world country...as is Hawaii...but at least the pay is a lot better here...but costs are high also.
     
  26. diabeticfootdr

    Podiatrist 10+ Year Member

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    Guylon07: We are sooo overworked and underpaid for the responsibilities that we take on every time we go to work.
    *** nurses are neither. Are you forced to work more than 40 hours a week (without agreeing to take extra shifts)???? Nursing is one of the best fields, it's growing, and the pay is excellent. Where else can you have a 2 year degree and make so much money?? Wound care nurses in my wound center make $70 - 85,000 a year!!!

    Guylon07: (and the problem was not because of some so called nursing shortage, it was because 3 of our hospitals had hiring freezes within 6 mo. of each other becuase they were all going bankrupt trying to outdo one another),
    *** the problem is because nursing unions have so many rediculous requirements on hospital, they are going bankrupt!

    Guylon07: and I was also under stress at home becuase I could not pay my bills with what I was getting paid at the hospital. Here I am with a B.S.N and a B.S. in physiology, and I could make just as much money waiting tables as I could working as a nurse.
    ***A nurse, in the traditional sense, does not need a bachelor's degree - that's your fault for getting one and going into nursing. Perhaps if you wanted to be a nurse administrator or a nursing instructor you need a BS.
    Guylon07: However, I love medicine and I love the idea of what nursing once was. Nursing was built on the idea of taking care of people but, I feel that this idea has long been forgotten. I could not take the way that nurses are treated any longer, and the way that my hands were tied in trying to care for patients so I opted for Medical school. I will be starting in the fall, and I am really looking forward to it.
    *** WHAT NURSING ONCE WAS!?!?!? So you would like to return to the time of Florence Nightengale? What rubbish are you talking about.
    *** Maybe you should reconsider medical school, you obviously don't understand the life of a physician. You think that a doctors lifestyle is less stressful than a nurses?? So all of a sudden with a doctorate degree you don't have any more responsibility? And let me tell you about the life of a resident --- because you obviously don't know ---- I'm a 1st year in limb salvage, I work 6 A.M. to 9 P.M. everyday (saturdays included) and when I'm on-call I can count on about 2 hrs of sleep after admitting patients and booking amputations all night from the ER. And I actually work less than the internal medicine residents!!!! So if that's your plan, you're in for a rude awakening. Oh, and there's NO overtime, NO unions, MUCH responsibility, and you DON'T go home until the work is DONE.



    Guylon07: Also, when I tell them that an R.N. with a diploma who has only had 1 1/2 yrs of training could be taking care of their critically ill loved they are amazed.
    *** so do you suggest all nurses require a doctorate??? what do you mean taking care of their critically ill loved ones? --- isn't there a doctor at the head of the team? or perhaps the doctor should take orders from the nurse? how much training do you need to read and follow orders, mix drips, do ACLS, and identify problems which require the doctors attention?

    You're such a complainer now, you can't even see the benefits of nursing. I'd hate to see how much you'll complain as a doctor.

    Nursing is a great field - I've recommended it to many friends and 2 sisters.

    LCR
     
  27. NPtobe

    NPtobe Junior Member

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    Yeah $13.50 is pretty crappy pay, I must say. As a new grad I started out making $24 after my differentials . I know some new grads that were lucky to find a weekend program and get to work 2 nights a week for $32/hour. I can see why you want to go into medicine because MDs get more respect than nurses do. I originally wanted to be a MD after graduating from nursing school for that same reason. However, I did some thinking and realized that somebody had to stay around and fight for the rights of NPs. So I'm sticking around. Some days I feel good about the decision and others I think, man what am I thinking. Nursing is like any other group that has been opressed, it just takes time and a lot of effort before arriving at equality. I wish that you would work as a nurse for awhile so you would understand what we do, but, if you don't I hope you learn to respect all nurses whether they be NPs or RNs or at least treat them as an individuals. Meaning some may be smart and others dumb... Just like in any profession, I know some MDs are idiots and others really shine. I respect your decision and understand your frustrations with nursing because I have felt the same way many times. I hope you can respect mine and are willing to work with NPs rather than against them. After all, we all chose these professions to help people and last time I checked patients get the best care when the healthcare team works together.
     
  28. muttmommy

    muttmommy Member
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    Ok, at the risk of sounding a little ignorant, let me just put in my two cents worth.

    I am not a doctor or a nurse. However, I did want to become a veterinarian (or a nurse, I wasn't really sure which at the time) and I have heard a similar argument over on the veterinary board. From my point of view, I think it boils down to this: we all went into whatever health profession we chose for a reason, right? To help in any way that we can. Yes, I know the lines are blurred now, and it is difficult at times to remember why we became doctors or nurses, or even veterinariians when we have to deal with difficult situations. But I guess I look at (however naively it may be) the health profession like one SHOULD look at marriage: to have and to hold, FOR BETTER OR FOR WORSE....through good times and bad. My father was a doctor too, and I have heard just about every horror story there is, but I also remember all the grateful patients that showered him with gifts and cards and whatnot out of sheer gratitude that he saved their sight (he's a retinal detachment specialist - ret.) That's what I remember and that's one of the reasons why I wanted to go into nursing - or veterinary school. To me, it's not what you do, but how you do it.

    Now, pardon me while I run for the door to get a head start on all of you who are about to pound me over the head for being so pollyanna-ish!! :laugh: Cheers everyone!!

    Life is short - so grab it by the horns while you can!! (ok, so I paraphrased it a little - you get my drift)
     
  29. TucsonDDS

    TucsonDDS Senior Member
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    The only problems that I have had with nursing over the past 10 years is all of the stupid bullsh*t paperwork, mandatory meetings, stupid anuall competencies on what, the same **** that you have been working with for 10 years. If nursing wants to grow as a profession they need to create an image by stopping all of this meeningless busywork. I have had a good ten years in nursing. I have worked per diem in the resource pool here in Arizona for the past seven and I haven't made less than 75K in those seven years. Last year I made 97K working a little over 2000 total hours. I always get out on time, I never have had mandatory overtime. I make my own schedule and have for the past 7 years. I never get refused vacation requests. Nursing has been a dream job for me these past years but it has gotten pretty boring also. I have seen some of the negatives that the OP has pointed out but I would recommend nursing to anybody that could get through the day without killing a patient. So what have I learned in my carreer, medicine in general sucks, insurance rules the roost and I need a career change. I am starting dental school in august and I won't look back.

    If you are happy with a limitting job with great benefits go and become a nurse. If you want to be the boss it won't be for you.
     
  30. rn29306

    rn29306 Drugs are bad, m'kay?
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    Excellent post.
     

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