• Livestream AMA: Join SDN as we welcome Dr. John Ligon, a Pediatric Oncologist with the National Cancer Institute on May 11th at 8:00 PM Eastern. Register now!

azmd22

2+ Year Member
Nov 9, 2017
162
186
Status (Visible)
  1. Medical Student
Hi friends! I have been planning to apply to gen surg but just shadowed urology and absolutely loved it. I feel like I am very late to the game though, so I was wondering if y'all thought I had a shot without a research year. I wouldn't be opposed to doing a research year if I need to, but obviously I would prefer not to. I've heard the match is more favorable for women as well but obviously don't want to bank on this. Thanks in advance for your help!

Step 1: 255
Grades: 3 honors, 1 high pass so far
Research: 2 pubs, 2 abstracts in general surgery
 

frenchyn

7+ Year Member
Dec 10, 2012
636
769
Status (Visible)
Hi friends! I have been planning to apply to gen surg but just shadowed urology and absolutely loved it. I feel like I am very late to the game though, so I was wondering if y'all thought I had a shot without a research year. I wouldn't be opposed to doing a research year if I need to, but obviously I would prefer not to. I've heard the match is more favorable for women as well but obviously don't want to bank on this. Thanks in advance for your help!

Step 1: 255
Grades: 3 honors, 1 high pass so far
Research: 2 pubs, 2 abstracts in general surgery
Agree, I think you should be ok. You probably won’t end up at top programs tho. But ace subI, get great LoR and step 2, you should match.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
About the Ads

Redpancreas

SDN Gold Donor
10+ Year Member
Dec 28, 2010
3,928
4,288
Status (Visible)
  1. Resident [Any Field]
Hi friends! I have been planning to apply to gen surg but just shadowed urology and absolutely loved it. I feel like I am very late to the game though, so I was wondering if y'all thought I had a shot without a research year. I wouldn't be opposed to doing a research year if I need to, but obviously I would prefer not to. I've heard the match is more favorable for women as well but obviously don't want to bank on this. Thanks in advance for your help!

Step 1: 255
Grades: 3 honors, 1 high pass so far
Research: 2 pubs, 2 abstracts in general surgery
Grades/Steps are good. Research is fair. The match is always in favor of the minority which in this case is female.

1. I would do talk to a resident and ask for some case reports. See if you can get an abstract/presentation as well and you can alway start projects and mention them during interviews.
2. Prioritize a urology audition over Step 2 to get letters/exposure to home department. Yeah Step 2's the new thing but from what I've been seeing, people are still willing to bank on Step 1 especially when your grades correlate with it and PDs still have data. Definitely have it done by end of Jan (committees sit down to meet in Feb).
3. One new thing I have learnt is that many places have filters for people who applied to their program before. Ask your Urology PD how frequently this filter is used in Urology or maybe NRMP has data.

Definitely think it's doable based on stats/demographics. Definitely write a good PS and have a story in there too. With all these fields, the first step's to find someone influential who can guide you through this.
 

Redpancreas

SDN Gold Donor
10+ Year Member
Dec 28, 2010
3,928
4,288
Status (Visible)
  1. Resident [Any Field]

Not sure what you're trying to call out here as my statement's pretty clear. If a field has 80% male and 20% female applicants, a PD will try to balance that out or at minimum ensure the class isn't all male (and rightfully so to ensure we're not susceptible to gender biases, mistreatment etc.). What I'm not saying is female applicants with a 220 Step 1, middle of the road grades, etc. are waltzing into Urology. OP specifically said that the match favors her gender and I confirmed that that's likely the case just from a number's standpoint.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user

Frogger27

2+ Year Member
Aug 2, 2016
2,123
4,344
Status (Visible)
  1. Medical Student
You're good. Just start getting involved with some research in the Urology department at your school and get advice on where to do your away rotation. Urology is notorious for being a field that people find late so they will not hold that against you, particularly with your strong background
 

MICKY MANTLE

Membership Revoked
Removed
Feb 14, 2021
46
52
Status (Visible)
  1. Non-Student
Not sure what you're trying to call out here as my statement's pretty clear. If a field has 80% male and 20% female applicants, a PD will try to balance that out or at minimum ensure the class isn't all male (and rightfully so to ensure we're not susceptible to gender biases, mistreatment etc.). What I'm not saying is female applicants with a 220 Step 1, middle of the road grades, etc. are waltzing into Urology. OP specifically said that the match favors her gender and I confirmed that that's likely the case just from a number's standpoint.
I'm calling out exactly what I quoted from your post. Please tell me where you got this information from, your in-depth qualifications, case studies,etc?... otherwise, you are providing information that may or may not be valid.

BTW, she said " I've heard the match is more favorable for women", she did not say "specifically" that the match "favors her gender." I copied her exact wording---- "I've heard the match is more favorable for women as well but obviously don't want to bank on this."

Evaluating Urology Residency Applications: What Matters Most and What Comes Next? published August 2020​

"Although recruitment of female applicants has increased at a favorable rate, the overall representation of women and underrepresented racial minorities among urology residents compares poorly to other surgical fields."

This certainly suggests that things are improving, but as noted, females are significantly unrepresented in Urology.

To the OP, I think you are well on you way of becoming a strong candidate for Uro...I would speak to a mentor for further advice regarding research/pubs, etc. Best of luck.
 
Last edited:

Redpancreas

SDN Gold Donor
10+ Year Member
Dec 28, 2010
3,928
4,288
Status (Visible)
  1. Resident [Any Field]
I'm calling out exactly what I quoted from your post. Please tell me where you got this information from, your in-dept qualifications, otherwise, you are providing information that may or may not be valid.

BTW, she said " I've heard the match is more favorable for women", she did not say "specifically" thatnthe match favors her gender.

Are you a pre-med student?

I don't have the qualifications as I make no decision when it comes to ranking candidates nor do I have specific data in front of me. A PD may be able to provide a better assessment. That said, I do have close friends involved in selection of residents and demographics are a factor they heavily rely on to rank candidates. Say we disregard that completely though, I consider it common sense that if there is a qualified minority (racial, gender, etc.) in a process, they would fare better during the ranking process. Not going to argue this further and it doesn't benefit OP.
 

MICKY MANTLE

Membership Revoked
Removed
Feb 14, 2021
46
52
Status (Visible)
  1. Non-Student
I don't have that qualification/data in front of me and frankly don't think even one individual PD would. That said, I do have close friends involved in selection of residents and demographics is a factor they heavily rely on to rank candidates. Say we disregard that completely though, I consider it common sense that if there is a qualified minority (racial, gender, etc.) in a process, they would fare better during the ranking process. Not going to argue this further and hope OP is successful.
I wasn't trying to argue tbh, but we can agree to disagree and yes, best of luck to the OP.
 

machete fred

5+ Year Member
2+ Year Member
Apr 21, 2016
372
802
Status (Visible)
  1. Medical Student
A couple of thoughts from someone who just matched into urology. Standard preface that this is all based on my own experience and your mileage may vary:

1. Try to meet with your home PD/APD/any urology advisor ASAP. They will be able to gauge your competitiveness way better than anyone on SDN/reddit can. They will also be able to guide you towards research projects in the department if they think that aspect of your app is lacking. Finally, they can point you towards good programs to do aways at (provided those are happening this year).

2. Research is important. It didn't use to be as much, but from my experience in the match this year the people with the most research got the most interviews at the top programs. I think part of this relates to more research = more mentors in the field and more connections, but PD's and chairs like residents who will contribute to their department's productivity.

3. Going off of the point above, numbers seem less important than they used to. I had a 260+ on both steps, AOA, honors on most of my rotations, great letters, but a lot of programs didn't really care about these that much. I was similar to you in that I decided on urology late and didn't have much urology research, and this probably hurt me in terms of getting interviews at top programs. At a certain point numbers are meaningless, and programs that can be choosy want residents with diverse backgrounds, whether this is via research, work before med school, etc. In this sense, being a female will help you because of the lack of women in the field.

4. It goes without saying, but work hard on your Sub-I's and really try to spend the next 6 months or so to build relationships within your home department. Almost every interviewer commented on the strength of my letters. These will probably be the most important aspect of your application. Because of how small academic urology is (everybody knows everybody), it's probably better off to get an average letter from a top dog in the field than it is to get a stellar letter from an unknown community urologist (though this is controversial).

5. Networking is important. I was, and am still a #MedTwitter hater, but it might not be the worst thing to make a professional urology twitter account and follow/retweet people who are doing stuff that interests you. I personally did not do this because I despise twitter and I think it is a detriment to medicine and society as a whole, but I heard some stories of co-applicants having success networking this way.

In short, hop on some urology research projects ASAP, make connections within your home program, and work hard on your Sub-I's. Given your stats and background, you should be successful. One of the great parts about urology is that there are pretty much no bad programs given how small and well regulated the field is. Pretty much anywhere you go will train you to be a great urologist.

Congrats on picking urology! Apologies for the wall of text, I am a bored post-match 4th year on a virtual rotation. I'm happy to answer any other questions you may have.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: 4 users

azmd22

2+ Year Member
Nov 9, 2017
162
186
Status (Visible)
  1. Medical Student
A couple of thoughts from someone who just matched into urology. Standard preface that this is all based on my own experience and your mileage may vary:

1. Try to meet with your home PD/APD/any urology advisor ASAP. They will be able to gauge your competitiveness way better than anyone on SDN/reddit can. They will also be able to guide you towards research projects in the department if they think that aspect of your app is lacking. Finally, they can point you towards good programs to do aways at (provided those are happening this year).

2. Research is important. It didn't use to be as much, but from my experience in the match this year the people with the most research got the most interviews at the top programs. I think part of this relates to more research = more mentors in the field and more connections, but PD's and chairs like residents who will contribute to their department's productivity.

3. Going off of the point above, numbers seem less important than they used to. I had a 260+ on both steps, AOA, honors on most of my rotations, great letters, but a lot of programs didn't really care about these that much. I was similar to you in that I decided on urology late and didn't have much urology research, and this probably hurt me in terms of getting interviews at top programs. At a certain point numbers are meaningless, and programs that can be choosy want residents with diverse backgrounds, whether this is via research, work before med school, etc. In this sense, being a female will help you because of the lack of women in the field.

4. It goes without saying, but work hard on your Sub-I's and really try to spend the next 6 months or so to build relationships within your home department. Almost every interviewer commented on the strength of my letters. These will probably be the most important aspect of your application. Because of how small academic urology is (everybody knows everybody), it's probably better off to get an average letter from a top dog in the field than it is to get a stellar letter from an unknown community urologist (though this is controversial).

5. Networking is important. I was, and am still a #MedTwitter hater, but it might not be the worst thing to make a professional urology twitter account and follow/retweet people who are doing stuff that interests you. I personally did not do this because I despise twitter and I think it is a detriment to medicine and society as a whole, but I heard some stories of co-applicants having success networking this way.

In short, hop on some urology research projects ASAP, make connections within your home program, and work hard on your Sub-I's. Given your stats and background, you should be successful. One of the great parts about urology is that there are pretty much no bad programs given how small and well regulated the field is. Pretty much everywhere you go will train you to be a great urologist.

Congrats on picking urology! Apologies for the wall of text, I am a bored post-match 4th year on a virtual rotation. I'm happy to answer any other questions you may have questions.
Congrats on matching!! I really appreciate the advice. I have an appointment with an advisor this Friday! I really appreciate your response and I will let you know if I have any questions!
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
About the Ads

Your message may be considered spam for the following reasons:

  1. Your new thread title is very short, and likely is unhelpful.
  2. Your reply is very short and likely does not add anything to the thread.
  3. Your reply is very long and likely does not add anything to the thread.
  4. It is very likely that it does not need any further discussion and thus bumping it serves no purpose.
  5. Your message is mostly quotes or spoilers.
  6. Your reply has occurred very quickly after a previous reply and likely does not add anything to the thread.
  7. This thread is locked.