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another double standard?!

Discussion in 'Clinical Rotations' started by sanfilippo, Jul 21, 2002.

  1. sanfilippo

    sanfilippo El Gaucho Misterioso 10+ Year Member

    Jun 4, 2002
    North Country
    is there a double standard regarding male vs female dress code on rotations?

    so far, there have been days where i wear a dress shirt and tie with dockers or corduroys. other times, i wear a polo with no phrases or designs on it underneath my white coat when the heat is bad. i have not gotten any flack for it yet, but we were joking with some residents that the AM clinic should have a shirt-and-tie dress code (very few actually wear ties), so we started doing it.

    however, some female compadres have worn tank tops and similar flimsy or lacey blouses under their white coats and often wear open-toe shoes and sandals. all guys so far have worn dress shoes or surgical clogs. i was talking to a NP about this, and she said she never thought about it before but agrees that there is one among students. she says she always wear nylons even when they're not really appropriate just because there is a certain "standard" that must be adhered to.

    is there a double standard? aren't open-toe shoes just an accident waiting to happen like if a guy with a variceal bleed just starts oozing all over those freshly painted toes?

    you decide...
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  3. Mindy

    Mindy Senior Member 10+ Year Member

    Jun 10, 2001
    I definitely agree. The problem is that there are no standards of dress for women (at least none I'm aware of after my 27 yrs of being a woman!) There are days where I would *love* to be able to throw on a men's button down shirt (easy to buy since they are all the same size), a tie (all the same with different designs), one of my 3 pairs of men's all-purpose dress pants (blue, black, and gray) and 1 pair of dress shoes (recycled when they smell too badly), and be done with it. (Almost like fancy scrubs!) There is simply no uniform like this for women---for better or worse.

    Open toed shoes are a no-no, though.


    IBDCURE Junior Member 7+ Year Member

    Jul 21, 2002
    Double standard? Do you think that women are getting off the hook easy? It sounds that the males at your clinic imposed guidelines on themselves. If there was a set code for females, I think that most would be happy to abide, because we are often left wondering what IS appropriate.
    There is no "official" code for males or females at the hospital here and because of it, many people have to put up with catty criticism. I was told AFTER an 8 week rotation on Pediatrics that I wore a skirt that was "inappropriate," which left me trying to remember which of the several skirts that I own (which are all nearly ankle length and in dark colors) was being referred to, later to find out that someone thought that one with a slit that came beneath the knee was offensive. Give me a break; I see people walking around all the time with dirty-looking clothes- how are these people less offensive than a slit that revealed my calves?
    While there are some professional-looking open-toed shoes, I do agree that closed-toe shoes are best in a medical setting for safety reasons alone. However, can someone fill me in on why some people think women need to wear hose all of the time, even under long skirts or pants? They're incredibly uncomfortable, and I've always wanted to know who is offended by a small area of exposed bare skin?
  5. sanfilippo

    sanfilippo El Gaucho Misterioso 10+ Year Member

    Jun 4, 2002
    North Country
    i think my whole point was that there are no absolute standards for guys or gals. i think if a rotation requires a certain dress code and actually wants people to conform to it, then the people in charge should be more forthcoming about it and make sure it is discussed from the get-go.

    for me, i don't care if a woman wears a decent-looking skirt provided it doesn't reveal all the kibbles and bits. open-toe shoes, though, drive me bananas, esp. during inpatient or surgery when bodily fluid may be coming at you all of a sudden.

    flimsy or summer tank tops with spaghetti straps, although comfortable for the gals, are just not the best way to go when seeing patients, IMHO.

    the dress code story for that clinic was a joke among the attendings and residents since, as i pointed out, no one abides by the shirt-and-tie rule. the only female there is the NP who's rotating there from another dept. i had assumed it was a reference to those of us not wearing ties that day, but the following week, the attending wasn't wearing one.

    i will continue to wear polo's on some days; i pray, too, that i won't be chastised about it UNTIL IT'S TOO LATE. so far, no one has made any comments about the way students dress, esp. when there are attendings who wear more casual things.

    i agree, though, if an attending has a problem with dress, the student should be made aware of it as a being a problem when or shortly after the "infraction" happens...not until the final evaluation!

  6. lrg

    lrg Junior Member 7+ Year Member

    Apr 16, 2002
    I don't know a durn thing about women's clothes, so I can't comment on that but what the hell are you doing wearing a polo shirt to work? You're in a hospital, not a country club. Where I go, every male, from medical student to attending, wears a long sleeve shirt and tie every day regardless of how hot it is (and it can get over 100F with high humidity). Even during surgery we were expected to change out of scrubs for clinic. And everyone wore a shirt and tie to M&M and grand rounds regardless of if you were post call or where you were coming from or going to afterwards. It may not always be comfortable or convenient but it is much more professional.
  7. Ludy

    Ludy Senior Member 7+ Year Member

    Jun 29, 2001
    Our hospital actually does have a dress code for females, including no open-toed shoes and no sleeveless shirts, as well as requiring that either socks or hose be worn at all times. I had to go out and buy some new shoes for my skirts, but I still think girls have it better than the guys; they're always complaining about how uncomfortable their ties are by the end of the day. On the other hand, guys' shoes look much more comfortable, so maybe it all evens out in the end :) Although there's no formal code for males that I know of, I have NEVER seen a male med student/doctor/resident in the hospital in anything other than a dress shirt and tie.
  8. kristing

    kristing Senior Member 10+ Year Member

    Jun 12, 2002
    I bet you ANYTHING in all of these situations, there is a dress requirement for closed toed shoes. In my past life in a university occupational health clinic, it seemed that people wearing open toed shoes chose not to follow the dress code, do not know of the dress code, or their supervisors do not enforce the dress code.

    As far as long sleeved men's shirt vs. polo shirt. or long skirt vs. short skirt, etc., I think it really depends on the region you are in. Here in AZ, dress is VERY casual most everywhere, especially in Tucson. But I assume on the east coast, dress is much more formal.

    So for the guy who got upset about the guy in the Polo shirt, chill out, man!

    PS as a woman, I WILL not wear pantyhose everyday. I just refuse. I may every now and again, but those things are torcherous. Nor will I wear anysort of uncomfortable dress shoe. I don't care what the standards are.

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