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Well wanted to get some advice from some of the people who are applying or are in a cardio fellowship about things to do in your first year other than trying to find research...thanks
Any advice for a PGY1...for a future cardio fellowship?
- Thread starter PayingMyDues
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Cardiology is a exciting and dynamic field. It can offer something to whatever personality you may have. The surgical types can pursue interventional or EP. The radiology types can go into noninvasive imaging. The PCP in us can go into general cards. You can attend in the CCU, etc, etc.
Thus, one can imagine that it is quite competitive to get into a cardiology fellowship these days. The NRMP listed 164 program last year with 699 spots. There are more programs enrolled in the match this year but that only increases the number of spots to about 700-750.
Only 63% of US graduats matched and only 26% on foreign medical graduatess matched. That adds up to about 1800-2000 applicants for 700-750 spots.
Your chances are best if you are an american graduate at a top tier university program. In general, the more academically prestigious the institution, the better you will be during your application process. that being, said, even those guys have a couple of people each year that don't match.
Thus, your best bet if you're dead set into going into cardiology is too find a cardiology mentor ASAP to begin a research project that hopefully you can publish. It doesn't have to be a big project, and you don't really have to have any good ideas to begin with. What this means however, is that you will need to be proactive about banging on cardiology attending doors and asking them if they have the time and resources to mentor a resident/intern. A lot of them will say no, but you need to be persistent and ask them if they no of anyone who does have the resources. Often times your best bet is to go directly to the chief of your cardiology department.
If you show interest ahead of time, and if you put in the work, you will be ahead of the game during the application process.
Finally, some people are concerned about applying during their 2nd or 3rd years. It is my experience that it makes no difference in your success in the match. At our institution, it is my personal experience that residents are more successful in the match if they apply during their 3rd year simply because it gives them more time to develop relations with attendings and to bring their projects to fruition. Other institutions may vary however.
Thus, one can imagine that it is quite competitive to get into a cardiology fellowship these days. The NRMP listed 164 program last year with 699 spots. There are more programs enrolled in the match this year but that only increases the number of spots to about 700-750.
Only 63% of US graduats matched and only 26% on foreign medical graduatess matched. That adds up to about 1800-2000 applicants for 700-750 spots.
Your chances are best if you are an american graduate at a top tier university program. In general, the more academically prestigious the institution, the better you will be during your application process. that being, said, even those guys have a couple of people each year that don't match.
Thus, your best bet if you're dead set into going into cardiology is too find a cardiology mentor ASAP to begin a research project that hopefully you can publish. It doesn't have to be a big project, and you don't really have to have any good ideas to begin with. What this means however, is that you will need to be proactive about banging on cardiology attending doors and asking them if they have the time and resources to mentor a resident/intern. A lot of them will say no, but you need to be persistent and ask them if they no of anyone who does have the resources. Often times your best bet is to go directly to the chief of your cardiology department.
If you show interest ahead of time, and if you put in the work, you will be ahead of the game during the application process.
Finally, some people are concerned about applying during their 2nd or 3rd years. It is my experience that it makes no difference in your success in the match. At our institution, it is my personal experience that residents are more successful in the match if they apply during their 3rd year simply because it gives them more time to develop relations with attendings and to bring their projects to fruition. Other institutions may vary however.
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Sorry I misread your question. "things to do other than research."
As an intern you should do your best to be a clinically outstanding intern. If you can try to do cardiology electives whenever you have the time. You can spend some spare time at the echo lab, going to cardiology conferences, etc.
However, it is difficult for an intern to truly make an impression as most interns just do not have the fund of knowledge yet to truly impress cardiology attendings, and so, the only way to set himself/herself apart is to work hard.
The other thing you may think about doing is trying to put yourself in line for a chief residency. You will also need to be proactive about this as well. You should make it known to the IM PD's that you are interested in this position, but you should not be annoying about it.
I'm afraid I'm going to have to stick with my original post and recommend that you seek a project as soon as possible. I have seen too many clinically average residents who have matched into top spots simply because they were proactive about finding a mentor.
Unless you are at a top 5-10 institution, have great connections, or the cardiology PD has already guaranteed you a spot at your home programs, research is ALMOST a must. I do see people without research match every year, but they do not match as well, and many more of them do not match as well.
Hope this helps
As an intern you should do your best to be a clinically outstanding intern. If you can try to do cardiology electives whenever you have the time. You can spend some spare time at the echo lab, going to cardiology conferences, etc.
However, it is difficult for an intern to truly make an impression as most interns just do not have the fund of knowledge yet to truly impress cardiology attendings, and so, the only way to set himself/herself apart is to work hard.
The other thing you may think about doing is trying to put yourself in line for a chief residency. You will also need to be proactive about this as well. You should make it known to the IM PD's that you are interested in this position, but you should not be annoying about it.
I'm afraid I'm going to have to stick with my original post and recommend that you seek a project as soon as possible. I have seen too many clinically average residents who have matched into top spots simply because they were proactive about finding a mentor.
Unless you are at a top 5-10 institution, have great connections, or the cardiology PD has already guaranteed you a spot at your home programs, research is ALMOST a must. I do see people without research match every year, but they do not match as well, and many more of them do not match as well.
Hope this helps
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Runningdoc,
In regards to selecting a program to do IM at, would you recommend selecting the best program one could get into to help with cards fellowships? For example I am having a tough time deciding b/w Duke or UTSW. One is a top 5, the other a top 10. In regards to programs and locations I really loved them both equally, but in different ways. All else being equal, does it really matter between upper top tier and top tier programs provided one does well at both? At the end of my residency I would like to have options at multiple cards programs throughout the country.
In regards to selecting a program to do IM at, would you recommend selecting the best program one could get into to help with cards fellowships? For example I am having a tough time deciding b/w Duke or UTSW. One is a top 5, the other a top 10. In regards to programs and locations I really loved them both equally, but in different ways. All else being equal, does it really matter between upper top tier and top tier programs provided one does well at both? At the end of my residency I would like to have options at multiple cards programs throughout the country.
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One basic rule of thumb, take everything people tell you with a grain of salt(me too). I can only give advice based on my personal experience, limited as that may be.
1st. Be sure you really want to do cardiology. If you're only a med student there are so many other exciting fields of medicine. I'm not trying to dissuade anyone, but be sure to keep an open mind.
That being said, it is true that the earlier you decide and begin acting on it the better chances you will have on achieving your career goal. This advice applies for any competitive specialty: derm, orthro, ent, ophtho, etc.
You're question: does it really matter? It all depends. I don't know the details, but I'm sure you will get equivalent clinical training at both institutions. I am also fairly positive that you will be in good position for the cardiology match at both institutions.
If all you are trying to achieve is simply match, then it probably does not make any difference. I would poll residents at UTSW and Duke to see how they match. I would imagine that UTSW residents match well, but I would guess they match at good institutions around the region. Duke residents, on the other hand, would match at top tier programs all over the country. I hope I'm wrong, but I bet that is the trend.
If you are a bright young doctor who wishes to become a leader in cardiology, pursue cutting edge research, try out new advanced devices, you'll do fine at both institutions, but I bet more doors open up at Duke than at UTSW.
HOWEVER, UTSW i'm sure has specific strengths that Duke does not have. Almost every major institution can lay claim to having world's expertise in one specific field. You if have a specific interest in that field that UTSW specializes in, then obviously you go to UTSW over Duke.
Again, you will hear the same thing over and over and over again.. If all you are interested is clinical cardiology private practice, then attending any community program is fine. You will graduate with excellent clinical training, and you can have a very very nice practice.
However, all of us want doors to be open. This means access to cutting edge research, first access to advanced devices, heading international committees, setting national policy, taking care of VIP's, consulting for industries, asking to help start up biotech companies, etc, etc, etc. All these opportunities come with a large upper echelon institution.
UTSW vs Duke is splitting hairs a little bit, so do a little bit of research before you jump on the prestige wagon, and most of the comments I made above are really just generalizations that may not apply specifically to Duke or UTSW. The city of Dallas itself may offer more to you than Raleigh-Durham may. Also, you may hate Duke basketball or you may find that you want to go to the west coast or east coast.
1st. Be sure you really want to do cardiology. If you're only a med student there are so many other exciting fields of medicine. I'm not trying to dissuade anyone, but be sure to keep an open mind.
That being said, it is true that the earlier you decide and begin acting on it the better chances you will have on achieving your career goal. This advice applies for any competitive specialty: derm, orthro, ent, ophtho, etc.
You're question: does it really matter? It all depends. I don't know the details, but I'm sure you will get equivalent clinical training at both institutions. I am also fairly positive that you will be in good position for the cardiology match at both institutions.
If all you are trying to achieve is simply match, then it probably does not make any difference. I would poll residents at UTSW and Duke to see how they match. I would imagine that UTSW residents match well, but I would guess they match at good institutions around the region. Duke residents, on the other hand, would match at top tier programs all over the country. I hope I'm wrong, but I bet that is the trend.
If you are a bright young doctor who wishes to become a leader in cardiology, pursue cutting edge research, try out new advanced devices, you'll do fine at both institutions, but I bet more doors open up at Duke than at UTSW.
HOWEVER, UTSW i'm sure has specific strengths that Duke does not have. Almost every major institution can lay claim to having world's expertise in one specific field. You if have a specific interest in that field that UTSW specializes in, then obviously you go to UTSW over Duke.
Again, you will hear the same thing over and over and over again.. If all you are interested is clinical cardiology private practice, then attending any community program is fine. You will graduate with excellent clinical training, and you can have a very very nice practice.
However, all of us want doors to be open. This means access to cutting edge research, first access to advanced devices, heading international committees, setting national policy, taking care of VIP's, consulting for industries, asking to help start up biotech companies, etc, etc, etc. All these opportunities come with a large upper echelon institution.
UTSW vs Duke is splitting hairs a little bit, so do a little bit of research before you jump on the prestige wagon, and most of the comments I made above are really just generalizations that may not apply specifically to Duke or UTSW. The city of Dallas itself may offer more to you than Raleigh-Durham may. Also, you may hate Duke basketball or you may find that you want to go to the west coast or east coast.
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Those are arguably the top two programs in the South . . . UTSW posts their fellowship matches on their website (very impressive) . . . I imagine Duke is the same way
I would make the selection based on factors other than the cardiology match . . .because you can't really go wrong with either program
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UTSW vs. Duke for IM to tee up for cardiology? I know both places well.
I'll take a different tack on this subject to expand on Runningdoc's excellent advice. Let's skip the geography 'cause I am sure you can figure out for yourself whether Dallas or Durham fits your personality.
Overall, selection for competitive cardiology programs across the country will first require you to be amongst the strongest residents in your IM program (reflected in your letter from your program director/chairman). After that hurdle, selection is primarily based upon your research (past achievements and future trajectory).
Regarding the first: You have to ask yourself which enviroment you think you will enjoy. Parkland (UTSW) is one of the best municipal hospitals in the country, and as such, directs care to a mostly indigent population. Housestaff are incredibly self-sufficient, autonomous, and cowboyish. Duke is a very high tech tertiary referral center for the entire Raleigh-Durham area. You have to ask yourself in what type of practicing environment you will excel.
As for research, it depends whether you are more directed towards basic or clinical investigation. For basic research, I would strongly lean towards UTSW. Few institutions (even compared to the Northeast or West) can compare with having people like Brown and Goldstein (Nobel prize winners), Helen Hobbs (HHMI & NAS), Eric Olson (NAS), Yanagisawa (HHMI), etc. Doing good work with any of these people will definitely open doors anywhere. Duke also has great basic scientists performing cardiovascular research (like Howard Rockman), but only one at this time who comes close to the UTSW folks in national or worldwide acclaim-- Robert Lefkowitz (HHMI). Therefore, I would say that the main attraction for Duke basic science is adrenergic receptor or G-coupled receptor biology. Now, for clinical research, Duke has a huge advantage in having the Duke Clinical Rsearch Istitute (DCRI) with Rob Califf and Robert Harrington. UTSW clinical cardiology services have a much lower volume cath lab, so device and translational studies again will be less active than Duke's.
Overall, both programs are successful in matching people to competitive cardiology programs. It is up to you to decide in which environment you will flourish and what the direction for your research is.
Good luck.
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Hi all,
I just wanted to thank you for your great responses to my questions!!! I appreciate your time
I just wanted to thank you for your great responses to my questions!!! I appreciate your time
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Same here...thanks for the input....
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Would definitely agree with grendelsdragon (u can see that guy/gal has been around the block based on his posts).
I would venture that both programs are pretty close in terms of reputation for hands on training. And even in research, while Duke has been the perennial clinical research powerhouse in cardiology (DCRI is pretty impressive), I feel UTSW has more of an up and coming attitude with the big projects derived from the Reynolds grant... and possibly more wiggle room to land a junior faculty spot...
BUT even more important than which has a better rep for IM, is how you do when you are actually a resident there... Chief-res from UTSW will do better at cards fellowship match than bottom of the barrel res at Duke... so think about where your personality fits better as described by prior posters...
I would venture that both programs are pretty close in terms of reputation for hands on training. And even in research, while Duke has been the perennial clinical research powerhouse in cardiology (DCRI is pretty impressive), I feel UTSW has more of an up and coming attitude with the big projects derived from the Reynolds grant... and possibly more wiggle room to land a junior faculty spot...
BUT even more important than which has a better rep for IM, is how you do when you are actually a resident there... Chief-res from UTSW will do better at cards fellowship match than bottom of the barrel res at Duke... so think about where your personality fits better as described by prior posters...
