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Discussion in 'Pre-Medical - MD' started by Ron Mexico, Dec 18, 2005.
Cause thats whats mine is gonna look like...
people on this forum have gotten in with or even less than 3.2. I forgot who they were.
friend of mine got into his state school (tennessee) with a 3.2
Im a chump.
Here is the story:
In 2000, I was accepted into osteopathic medical school. I had taken the MCAT a year ago without having taken most of the typical prerequisites, and scored a 21. I remember thinking to myself, "what am I doing taking this test, i have never seen most of the material here!" I have an aunt and two uncles who are MD doctors, but the DO title did not (and mostly still does not) matter to me.
The thing that kept playing on my mind was I had just gotten a C in organic chemistry, and online no less. I invested a total of approximately 14 hours into the entire class, that is, 2 hours enrolling and getting ready for the class, and 12 hours studying and taking tests. The entire 12 hours was an all night, no sleep marathon, on a cold Monday in December. I had no organic chemistry knowledge previously, but the design of the class, and fast research allowed me to pass an entire semester of organic chemistry in one night. Having taken 3 tests and a final, I was finished by 6am that next morning, and ready to go to my electrical engineering job in two hours.
This was really only the beginning to an amazingly easy ride into the osteopathic world of medicine. I found that without trying, I could slip in under their radar, and additionally get a full ride in achieving something that I thought I had wanted to do since I was five. I thought it was all a part of the life of that allowed me to be accepted into the high IQ society, Mensa, where if you could think pretty fast then people thought you were something special even if you were a lazy bum doing nothing to better society, much like myself.
So the school year started as I had expected, lectures all the time, and a test in a few weeks. Well as was my typical routine, I would not study. In fact I would wait until the night before the exam to do any studying at all. I manage to pass my tests with a typical score of 75-80%, getting near perfect scores in the subject of pathology that was considered to be so hard for everyone, so I was not too worried about trying any harder. It was bothering me somewhat, that I am in this to handle the life or death health choices for many people, and I was taking this all so lightly. However, my first final exam I did not even bother to study for and I failed. It was a complete surprise to me as were the next few months where this exact process repeated.
I left feeling surprised and hurt, partly feeling mad at the school, but really I knew it was my own fault. In some way, I was happy to leave, there were a number of small things that happened that encouraged me to not try, and I wasn't learning like I should. I liked the people, the material was very interesting, I got along with everyone very well. I was even the President two clubs.
In the following weeks I realized I had to wake up and take notice of what had occurred, or even if I never fulfill my dream, I will go through life not doing my best, not enjoying life.
So, I set up a plan, in painful consideration of my faults but also my strengths, with goals I decided I must achieve if I were to even consider going back to school. First, I decided I needed to find my driving force in pursuing this pathway. This is the reason why I wanted to do this at all, I knew I had felt it a number of times, but this had to be concrete to me, and make me want to try hard, and do very, very well. Second was to take a complete set of prerequisites this time, and do not slouch on this as my previous school actually allowed, by getting straight A's in all new courses. Medical school requires extreme dedication and if I could not get A's in these simple classes then how could I reasonably expect to do well in life or death situations that require fast and most importantly accurate thinking? Third was to study for and retake the MCAT. I decided I must far surpass the average for acceptance to satisfy my personal resolve. Only meeting averages or just passing is how I used to operate, and this is how I run my life no longer.
Now, 4 years after I started, I have achieved a straight A record on my new classes, and a 33 on the MCAT. I became certified as a paramedic and have logged several thousand hours rushing to literally save people's lives. This was most important to me, because I feel I have gained a truly invaluable experience in this time as a paramedic, giving me the spirit and motivation I had only previously seen on occasion. In addition, I continued my work as an Electrical Engineer and received my PE license, however, this only managed to further my realization that work as an engineer is not what I have enjoyed, it is not what I felt a strong calling to do in life.
My past experiences have been that of someone who had life very easy and was never pushed. I felt like getting into osteopathic medical school was something that was simply handed to me, and I never felt encouraged to try. I have been handed scholarship after scholarship, opportunity after opportunity, all just simply handed to me, and that part of my life has been nearly meaningless in helping me or helping others in this amazing journey we call life. I have learned a great deal in the past four years, and can honestly assure you, but most importantly know in myself, that I will no longer be lackadaisical in what I do. Life is something you get to play with for only a few fleeting moments, and then it is gone. I have chosen my present path because I know it to be something dear to my heart, and I feel very challenged and motivated from within to pursue this further.
So I guess what I am asking, is this dream even possible after all of this time, am I just kidding myself even now?? Will any MD school let me in its doors with my history??
I know folks who have gotten in with those kinds of numbers. But knowing that others got in with low GPA doesn't help you much in terms of evaluating your own position, because you can bet they stood out in some other aspect, or had some other "in". This isn't a purely numbers driven process. That's why I'm not sure things like MDApplicants are all that useful in estimating your own status. Comparing yourself to average matriculants is slightly better, but still doesn't tell you the whole story either.
Ok, you're also a troll, champ.
OP, check MDapplicants. People get in with 3.2s, it's not the ideal situation but hey, those are your grades.
wait what does this have to do with the OP's question?
in any case im not sure if you even have a chance at MD due to the fact that you have been in DO. Although I have no experience in cases like these I am speculating that there may be some sort of rule against it. Just like if your in highschool and you try out for the NBA draft. You cant play college basketball anymore. Sorry bro
I have a 3.29, I should be able to tell you sometime next week if I got in to one of my schools...
my history is even worse, so his 3.2 could be worse..
its not as bad as other ppl's stories, so maybe makes him feel better
heh. kinda a stretch. i would recommend you start a new thread
i got in with a 3.2
my md apps profile is in my signature if you want more info.
if he's really motivated he can still go to the caribbean for med. school. Granted it's going to be a lot tougher to choose a specialty of choice, but you'll still get the M.D.
would they even accept me?? i dont care about specialty. when i was in DO school before, i thought either EM or FP, but now after being a para for a few yrs, i think i want to do FP. i loved my job, and the things i did. I have a lot of respect for EMs but, i think FP is for me.
You have your own thread; let the OP have his.
He/she has this same thing posted on a thread over in the pre-osteo forum... that is if it hasnt been locked already
I got in with a 3.26 gpa but have straight A's on recent work (last ~100 hours) and a 36 on the MCAT. Here is my profile if you are interested.
There isn't much you can do about your gpa when you are at the end of your coursework, so you need to make everything else as close to optimal as possible. Make sure you crush the MCAT, and have great clinical experience, great LOR's, etc. It's an uphill battle, but yes you've a shot. Also try to find schools that are interested in you as a person, not just your intellect. Definitely consider osteopathic medicine. That's my 2 cents. Good luck!
I got in with a 3.2 something.
That guy ExtraAverage got into Loyola with a 3.0 and 29.
Yeah, but even he'll concede he's the exception rather than the rule - I think. And maybe his PS kicked some serious ass, and so did his LORs, etc.
There are a lot of known unknowns in his situation, but it's certainly inspirational.
Hey OP... I have a 3.19, 3.02 BCPM, and I got into Buffalo
It's possible! Just kick ass on MCAT, PS, and LORs. Good luck
schools might take into consideration your GPA and your major because i think you would be expected to do better if you're in certain majors as opposed to say something like engineering.
i got into 2 schools with a 3.2somethin science gpa
I see this a lot on SDN... "just kill the MCAT".... as if it were something you could just decide to do, like "Oh, just microwave for 3 minutes on high" I'm really not trying to sound pissy or anything, but having not taken the MCAT, can I really expect to kill it as long as I study like crazy? I hope so
It all depends on the person. However, I think that the frequency that the phrase is used on this site is very misleading. No, it is not easy to simply "Kill the MCAT". Especially if it is your first time.
me. good luck!
I think everyone has a range of scores they could possibly get on the MCAT. I think that range is predictable from experiences prior to the MCAT. Hard studying is meant to boost you towards the top of your potential range.
Does that make sense? It's controversial to actually say out loud that I don't think everyone could get a 43 on the MCAT no matter how hard they studied, but I'll be honest and say I'm not even sure the top of my range reaches that high. If I was an MCAT instructor for one of the major test prep companies for 3 years, taught all the subjects, and I spent the last 6 months of that studying my butt off, I might be able to hit that, but I don't know.
Actually that is EXACTLY what you need to decide to do. Then of course you need to follow it up with studying your butt off. The MCAT is just a test. It's a big icky test, but it's still just a test. I don't think I can recall any test I've ever taken where my score was not highly correlated to my level of preparedness.
There are plenty of study materials and courses available to help with your preparation and measure your progress. AMCAS publishes previous MCAT exams with keys so that you can score your practice tests. (Put yourself in the actual test environment when you take these.) Using these practice exams, you should have a very good idea of what score you will receive on your actual test. If it's not high enough, you'll need to hit the books some more. If you are coming from behind like the OP, a classroom review course might give you a leg up.
My best advice. Your personal statement needs to address your grades. Trends are a major thing. If you are doing better in the last years of college than the first, thats good. I have heard applicants regret screwing up in the early years. A B+ in biochem looks good when you had a C in 101... if you had an A in 101, that means that you have slipped a little. Every other opportunity you have can make up for the GPA.
Your MCAT must be good. If GPA is not good, you have to reach a 9 on the verbal section with a P or better on the writing.
Experience needs to include clinical or research work.
Write a very interesting personal statement. Show it to friends, family, or even strangers. Dont ask "is this good?", ask "would you want to meet me after reading this". For instance, I wrote how my inspiration to become a physcian involved a sporting accident resulting in a broken femur, but I never said what happened. EVERY interviewer I have had asked the same first question... "so what happened to your leg?"
Thats all I have for now, perhaps once I get in I'll devulge all my secrets best of luck.
Dont be afraid of rejection, if you are borderline, odds are you will be rejected. Make an appointment with the chair of admissions and ask what was your weakest point and how to fix it. Odds are by reapplying, that will be enough to put you over the line.
I got in to a coupla schools so far with a 3.00! One of my interviewers actually told me, though, that my MCAT score was the only reason I got an interview. They accepted me. My other ups are:
Red Cross Volunteer
Very good in personal interviews
Haha, yeah I have taken it twice and I always heard that phrase, "Kill it, just kill it." Then I get my scores back and think, "Grrr, why didn't I think of that!??"
If only it were that easy for me!
If you have a GPA around 3.2 you are not getting in unless:
1. You are from a state with a lot of public schools and/or
why do my posts keep getting messed up...i didn't edit that!
I really don't think it's fair to make such a blanket statement like that - there are many other aspects that are considered besides GPA that you didn't add to your list
3. You work for someone with some clout at a med school who is willing to stick their neck out, make the endless phone calls, write the letters, etc. to show that your abilities far exceed those of your numbers... happened to a friend of mine.
I mean, sure, why not? Take a course if you're really worried. I find that I do better when I study on my own, so that's what I did. I was kinda worried too, since I hadn't taken physics or chemistry in 5 years, and I got Cs in orgo. But I studied diligently every night with a friend for the whole summer, then took it in August. Oh, and studying with a friend helps too But no, don't expect to just wake up, decide to kill it, and then go in with no preparation and do really well. Again, best of luck to everyone
i got into 2 schools (1 out of state) without either of those factors...and no i'm not a URM.
OH yeah, and to reiterate what someone else said: if the OP has not finished school yet, try to work really hard for an upward trend because that's what really helped me sell myself to my interviewers. I had something like a 2.6 my first two years and then brought it up, so I point out that upward trend and say, look, if this linear line continued upward I'd be predicted to get a 4.3 GPA next year! Ok I don't really say that, but you get the point. You just have to show them that you are more than your numbers, whatever way you do that is fine. LORs, PS, or upward trend work, I think.
Congrats, but you are the exception, not the rule. It's unrealistic for everyone who fits that criteria to think they have a realistic chance without improving one or both of those numbers given the competativeness of this process.
Yay! I'm the exception!
Count the number of people who got into an allopathic medical school (URM excluded) who do not meet the two stated criteria, I bet you won't have to go to your toes.
I have a 3.2 right now since I transferred my freshman year to a new school and my old GPA didn't count - I had to start over again so my GPA is lower. Not to mention my school is ridiculous as far as grade deflation goes - they full on hate giving A's in my science classes. But I have 5 interview invitations (turned one down) and 1 acceptance already so I think if you show improvement and dedication and have lots of extracurriculars, you'll be ok. Every committee I've met so far has been great about my life experience (paying my own way through undergrad, working since I was 15, divorced parents and no dad in the picture) and willing to hear my side of the story as far as my GPA is concerned. Don't give up!
i think it also depends on what schools we're talking about. i mean, there are quite a few schools with average mcat scores of like 27-29 or something - and i think even if you get like a 33 you can pull your weight a little.
also, some schools with low-ish mcat averages, like gw for example, will flat out reject people with 35+ mcats regardless of gpa because they know those people are most likely going somewhere else.
in theory though, i think it's correct to say your mcat really needs to show that you know your sh!t. so if you have a low gpa and low mcat, then you'll be in trouble. i just don't think a 35 is a low mcat score...
Is this for real? Because GW is my top my choice and I'd be really sad if they rejected me for that. (See, I wasn't a smart ass this time.)
I would have a hard time believing that- It isn't like GW doesn't have alot to offer an applicant.
Count me as 1. 3.1 Cum (2.8 undergrad as an English major), around a 3.5 BCPM (4.0 in the "prereq" courses as a post-bac). 30R MCAT (way lower, for some reason, than I had been scoring on practice tests). Not a URM or Disadvantaged. Interesting work experience, though, in a career totally outside of medicine, but quite respected.
Accepted at 3 schools: 2 state schools, and 1 "top tier" (top 40ish) school.
Keep at it, folks. Persistance works.
Me. Wake Forest w/ 3.03 overall.
i never said gw doesn't have alot to offer. i'm just saying that people with insanely high scores can get rejected from schools that have much lower mcat averages. an M1 at gw told me the exact same thing - that gw puts people on hold and rejects people with mcat scores that are "too high" because they are less likely to attend.
if everyone with a 36 mcat went to gw would there average still be a 28? i'm pretty sure a lot of the 36 mcat peeps are getting into better schools.
obviously there are exceptions...so don't start freaking out people with the "my friend" and "this kid i know" stories.
WOW that's amazing, congrats. They rejected me right off the bat with my 3.2 overall!
umdnj-njms likes people with high MCAT and will take you if your MCAT is good. so it can help you offset your GPA.