Anyone substitute biochem for a term of organic chem?

[sandflea]

hey everyone. here's the story: my college was on a quarter system, and thus 3 quarters of organic chem constituted a full school year. i only took the first two quarters, as the third quarter was deemed optional for pre-meds and i was told that biochemistry could substitute, as the third quarter of orgo was essentially biochemistry anyway. i did take an upper-level biochem course, and i just recently also took a heavy-duty graduate biochem course as well, so i've taken plenty of that.

so i applied to a few med schools a few years ago and no one seemed to care about the lack of a full-year of orgo, since i did take biochem. but i'm applying to way more schools this time around and some secondaries (ex. dartmouth, MCW) explicitly state that they will not take biochem credit in place of orgo. my questions are:

A) how many of the rest of you also didn't take a full year of orgo? taking two quarters-worth (~20 weeks) still provides me with more material than taking only a single *semester* (~14 weeks), and maybe preventing students from applying with only a single semester of organic chem was the reason why they required a full year, a situation that i'm not in.

B) anyone else know of any other schools that flat-out state that biochem credit doesn't count?

thanks everyone!

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[Peregrin]

Really your best bet is to look it up in the MSAR. You don't need to buy it, it should be in your school's library.

It has been my experience that it doesn't matter whether or not it fulfills the reqirement for admissions. You can be accepted without all the pre-reqs, but you may not matriculate until then. It should not impact your chances for acceptance at all. If you need to take another term, they'll let you know then.

 

[sandflea]

ugh. yes, i know that i do not need to take all of the required courses before i apply. but i'm several years out of college and thus many years removed from organic chemistry. i *purposely* did not take the third quarter of orgo, not only because it was hell but also because my school considered biochemistry to be a suitable replacement and only considered the third quarter to be optional. i haven't looked back since, and i really have no intention of going back to take this third course!!

what i was wondering then, i guess, is if anyone else is aware of any other schools besides dartmouth that explicitly do not accept biochem credit. i've looked into a number of schools and no one really cares that i took biochem instead of the third quarter of organic, i.e. they did not consider me to have any prereqs missing. i know of other students who also didn't take the third quarter and were never questioned about it. this is why i was so surprised that dartmouth took such a hardline stance on it. dartmouth isn't high on my list anyway; i was simply curious if others in the same situation as me have met resistance and at which schools.

 

[IlliniEMT1]

Many ppl at my school (U of IL) take biochem instead of a 2nd sem of OChem, so our advisor contacted the schools to see who would accept this substitute. I dont know if whether this applies to your school's biochem, but here are the schools that she gave me that for sure WILL NOT take our biochem in substitute

UCLA; George Washington; U of Fla;
U of Chicago ;Uniformed Svcs; Tufts;
U Minn- Duluth; U MO/ Columbia;
U Nevada; Dartmouth;
U New Mex; SUNY- Stony Brook;
NE Ohio; U Okla; Hahnemann; UT Houston;
U Utah; U Wisc; Oklahoma St.-osteo

This is not a comprehensive list- some schools didnt reply, but most others did and will take the sub.

 

[Gotrob]

I have a one semester course of organic and also a one semester course of Biochem. I have talked to a few schools who said theat it is not a problem as long as I write a letter asking to have the biochem fill the organic requirement. Also a lot of the schools say in their literature (you have to read every line) that biochem can be substituted for organic. Not very specific, but call the schools you are interested in.

good luck

 

[sandflea]

thanks for the feedback!

 

[sandflea]

just moving this up!

 

[Jacky]

I have difficulty understanding why anyone would possibly choose Biochem over Orgo II? Biochem is 100 times more rigorous, in my opinion. (depending on how it's structured at your school, of course) For instance, my Orgo II class consisted of about 8 to 10 chapters of the second half of the text. My Biochem class was 32 chapters and involved much more difficult text!!

 

[IlliniEMT1]

I agree that biochem may be 100 times harder than Orgo 2, and im not sure why I took it, but I can say that im glad I did because I also learned 100 times more than i did in orgo. maybe im just crazy, but to me it was actually interesting when the normally boring chemistry concepts had actual application- i didnt really realize it until i went on to immunology and learned how important biochem was to medicine- how the smallest nuts and bolts of the body work and how medications tinker with them.
...or maybe i just liked it cuz i got an A .

 

[Dylann FMD]

Originally posted by Jacky:
•I have difficulty understanding why anyone would possibly choose Biochem over Orgo II? Biochem is 100 times more rigorous, in my opinion. (depending on how it's structured at your school, of course) For instance, my Orgo II class consisted of about 8 to 10 chapters of the second half of the text. My Biochem class was 32 chapters and involved much more difficult text!!•

Biochemistry made be a lot harder, but it is much more applicable to what we are going into. Period. If you are looking for easy classes, go take psychology courses. And if you are a dedicated premed-er, take biochem.

 

[sandflea]

yes, biochem was hard, but as others have noted, it was much more directly applicable to medicine and was thus, in that way, a lot more interesting than organic ever was. for example, in organic everyone had to memorize a bunch of carbohydrate structures; in biochem, not only did one have to memorize them, but we had to learn what they did. maybe that's not a good example, but you get my point. i *hated* organic and even if biochem was harder it was still a welcome change. my school was on a quarter system and the final quarter of organic was essentially a biochem course anyway.

anyway, i've emailed a few schools on the list someone posted above to see what adcoms think.

 

[different strokes]

Biochem at our school was so much easier than orgo. It was like weight being lifted off my chest.

peace

 

[trying2becomeMD]

Well, I don't understand how ANY UCLA students can get accepted at the schools that are listed above. I mean, at UCLA, there are NO options to take 3 quarters of organic chem!!!!! It is 2 quarter of G chem, 2 quarters of organic chem. I took the 11 series, so I took 11A, 11B, 11BL, 11CL, 132A, 132B, 132BL. This series was for Chem major, but I know that for 10 series, it is much the same. Please correct me if I am wrong though, I am putting these courses as I remember...

I also have same dilemma as OP...

 

[sandflea]

an update:

i contacted a few schools on the list someone provided above. what i was universally told was that while adcoms have their preferences that we complete a full-year of orgo, they will accept our coursework if we have completed the pre-med requirements as determined by our undergraduate schools. so if you officially completed all the pre-med courses at your college, then don't worry about it. what more can you do, anyway? my pre-med advisor said that if anyone hassled me about the coursework requirement, then he'd send them a letter stating that i did indeed finish up all of the pre-med work as set by my college.

no worries.