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AOA plan to increase perceived quality

Discussion in 'Medical Students - DO' started by MSU-DO 2005, Sep 3, 2002.

  1. MSU-DO 2005

    MSU-DO 2005 New Member

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    Hello,
    I just heard today through a student government meeting that the AOA is planning on trying to recruit the ACGME to accredit already existing AOA residencies, therefore making some AOA programs dualy accredited. The reason: To try to keep DO students in AOA residencies by increasing the perceived quality by making them ACGME accredited as well.

    To me, this seems like the exact opposite of what the AOA should actually do. They should be working on creating more AOA spots by creating new programs or offering accrediation to existing ACGME programs. Instead they are actually taking away positions from DO grads by opening them up to ACGME students when there already are not enough to go around.

    Any thoughts??

    MSU-DO 2005
     
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  3. DOnut

    DOnut Senior Member
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    I agree 100%

    Why on earth would the AOA open up spots to allopathic students taking positions away from osteopathic graduates. This will do nothing but force MORE osteopathic physicians to seek ACGME residencies.
    Do you think that we as students should collectively write the AOA, or have our student governments write on the behalf of our institutions??

    Tell me what you think!
     
  4. drusso

    Physician Moderator Emeritus Lifetime Donor Classifieds Approved 10+ Year Member

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    I disagree. I think that dual accreditation is the way to go. It's really a David vs Golliath situation. The ACGME is so huge that it has become in many ways *THE* benchmark for quality. The AOA needs to work cooperatively with allopathic institutions to further the interest of osteopathic students. There are simply not enough quallity internship slots to go around and with 5 states requiring AOA-approved internships for licensure, it puts DO's at a relative disadvantage in the marketplace. Also, it's my understanding that the AOA is interest mostly in dual-accrediting internships (which 5 states require for licensure), the residencies themselves will still remain solely AOA-accredited. So, those highly sought after ENT, ortho, radiology, plastic surgery, and derm slots will still exist for DO's only, but the internship slots will be available to both MDs and DOs.
     
  5. GoForIt

    GoForIt Senior Member
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    Would the dual accreditation be retroactive? Would anyone know?
     
  6. DOnut

    DOnut Senior Member
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    If it helps physicians Osteopathic physicians work in the "big 5" then I'm for it. I guess I misunderstood the situation. As long as the AOA is not opening up the residencies, then it's ok.

    I still think, however that the AOA should also look into accrediting the ACGME transitional year. There are just more of them!!! Especially in the big 5 states.
     
  7. DocWagner

    DocWagner Senior Member
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    Ending the "big 5" rule and attempting dual accreditation are the only things that keep DO graduate medical education afloat in the years to come.
     
  8. droliver

    Moderator Emeritus 10+ Year Member

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    Just curious, why would you go the DO route for any of those specialties assuming you had an option to go to an allopathic medical school?
     
  9. Dr JPH

    Dr JPH Membership Revoked
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    Is this a reality in the coming years? Any talk of it happening? ("big 5" rule)
     
  10. drusso

    Physician Moderator Emeritus Lifetime Donor Classifieds Approved 10+ Year Member

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    Well, I think that people discover as they progress through their education that they enjoy different things. A good friend of mine went to D.O. school because he really wanted to "be a doctor" in every sense of the world---the old Marcus Welby, rural, general practitioner type. He subsuquently fell in love with surgery on his surgery rotation, and then became very interested in plastic reconstructive surgery during an elective rotation at Ben Taub in Houston. He is now doing an osteopathic ENT residency in Philadelphia and wants to head toward plastics. He's been very active as a resident in a committee to get fellowship status granted by the American Academy of Facial Plastic and Reconstructive Surgery to residency-trained osteopathic facial and plastic surgeons.


    Some pertinent links to check out:

    American Osteopathic Colleges of Ophthalmology and Otolaryngology-Head and Neck Surgery

    PCOM's ENT Residency Program
     
  11. DocWagner

    DocWagner Senior Member
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    What I should have said is:
    2 things you will see in 10 years...
    Widely expanded dual accreditation
    The end of the "big 5".
     
  12. muonwhiz

    muonwhiz Senior Member
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    Okay, what is the meaning of the Big 5 terminology? Please clarify.
     
  13. drusso

    Physician Moderator Emeritus Lifetime Donor Classifieds Approved 10+ Year Member

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    The five states that require osteopathic physicians to complete an AOA-approved PGY-I rotating internship:

    Michigan
    Pennsylvania
    Florida
    Oklahoma
    West Virginia

    I've also heard that the New York Osteopathic Association was lobbying the New York legislature to require an AOA-approved internship for DO's, but this has not come to be...
     
  14. MSU-DO 2005

    MSU-DO 2005 New Member

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    Thanks for all of your replies. I talked to our student council pres yesterday and he was left with the impression that the AOA wants ACGME accreditation for both internships and residencies. This was from the meeting in June, the disscussion will continue at the AOA convention next month. If the AOA is only interested in the dual accreditation for internships, it seems that that would only make it easier for DO's to do the required year and then jump into a PGY-2 position outside of the AOA. Which opens up our options, but does not accomplish their goal of keeping DO's in AOA programs.
    I agree that dual accredation is the way to go, but I think it should be the AOA going in and accrediting ACGME programs. But, we all know that is not going to happen on a very large scale. As for those 5 states, I dont see that requirement ending anytime soon. Living in Michigan, I have mixed feelings about this. The internship year requirement has changed quite a bit, it now only has 5-6 months of required rotations. Anyway, if I hear more I will let you know.

    MSU-DO 2005
     
  15. I agree dual accredation is the way to go, but I think it should be the AOA going in and accrediting ACGME programs. This is unlikely to happen first.

    I feel this is of benefit for those wishing to pursue sunspecialties.
    If Dual accredation a surgery candidate can jump from a DO MD Surgery into a MD subspecialty with greater ease, a definite plus.

    Thank you for the update
     
  16. drusso

    Physician Moderator Emeritus Lifetime Donor Classifieds Approved 10+ Year Member

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    There are situations where ACGME programs want AOA accreditation. Large programs with prelim spots and transitional years would like AOA accreditation so that they can have larger internship classes!

    --Dave
     

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