Are emergency med doctors and emergency medicine looked down upon

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Samiamm

Samiamm

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Ive been seeing a lot of negative posts about them and emergency medicine. Why would emergency med be looked down upon?
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What are you talking about.... Looked down by whom? Can you link to the post/thread/article you're referring to?
 
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I personally work with ER physicians and many of them have told me that they feel looked down upon by other specialties. This is due to the fact that they are not experts in any one field and have to consult other specialties all the time. What they do provide is good knowledge in ALL fields of medicine, this is something that other physicians cannot say and I don't believe that the other physicians always think about it that way.
 
will831 said:
I personally work with ER physicians and many of them have told me that they feel looked down upon by other specialties. This is due to the fact that they are not experts in any one field and have to consult other specialties all the time. What they do provide is good knowledge in ALL fields of medicine, this is something that other physicians cannot say and I don't believe that the other physicians always think about it that way.
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Ahh, ok I see
 
I work with a lot of emergency physicians also, and I have never heard the same feelings you do.

From my experience, other specialties tend to get short of patience with the emergency physicians at times because whenever the emergency physician calls to transfer a patient to another service, it always means more work for that service. Emergency physicians can not always be mindful of the day time hours that endocrine or ENT keeps (just examples, nothing personal) and in the middle of the night, it may be easy for a physician of another specialty to get snippy and ask in a less than polite way why on earth the ER doc is bothering them about something, that is in their opinion, trivial.

I do know this though...when things do not go as planned, and a patient crashes on the floor or outside of a controlled environment, most other specialties are the first to step aside and let the ER doc take the lead.

Doctors are people too. In some cases they may be having a bad day and that comes out in the way they speak to colleagues. In some cases they may just be, in general, a jerk...has nothing to do with specialty though...has everything to do with them as a person.
 
It was one of the most popular fields to match into this year at my school. Definitely not looked down upon here.
 
EM gets a lot of flack in major academic hospitals. There are a bunch of reasons for this. For one, EM serves as a major gateway to admission into hospitals. More admissions means more work for the residents and attendings. This becomes especially aggravating if the residents/attendings don't agree with the admission. EM docs are also often in a damned if you do and damned if you don't situation. If they do too much they step on the toes of the specialists. If they do too little they are called glorified triage nurses. I have found that EM tends to be much more respected in rural areas and the Midwest than on the East Coast.
 
From what I've heard, like others have said, the stigma may because the ER doc can be looked at as someone who does what they can for the patient and then hands them off to the REAL experts when they can't do anymore.

Again, only bias and stigma, I don't actually think this is true, just what I've heard from doctors about why they mayyy be looked down on sometimes.
 
mmmcdowe said:
EM gets a lot of flack in major academic hospitals. There are a bunch of reasons for this. For one, EM serves as a major gateway to admission into hospitals. More admissions means more work for the residents and attendings. This becomes especially aggravating if the residents/attendings don't agree with the admission. EM docs are also often in a damned if you do and damned if you don't situation. If they do too much they step on the toes of the specialists. If they do too little they are called glorified triage nurses.
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i was going to use this term as well
 
Don't know about the academic hospital thing, but at the large local hospital they seem to be really popular with everyone. The admissions thing probably ruffles feathers, but I don't think other doctors look down on them intellectually.
 
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I feel EM is a specialty where if you're in a public place and someone shouts, "we need a doctor!!" they can probably be helpful in most situations as they work with all ages, see a big variety of cases, etc.
 
I work in the ER and as one of the physicians puts it "jack of all trades, master of none".

They know a little of everything but don't specialize in any one thing. I guess other specialities get ticked off when we call to admit a patient or ask for consult at strange hours.

Whatev's, I love EM and I plan on doing just that.
 
I work in the ER as well, seeing how the ER docs work is really impressive to me. I'll never forget my first day ever in the ER we had a 31 year old women code out of no where, it was a real shock to everyone. While panic and chaos was breaking out, and the family members screaming I saw the ER doc take the control of the situation so clam and cool and because of him the women survived.

Now I can understand that other doctors might look down upon them because they are not true "experts" in one field, but i'll also never forget the time the chief OB/GYN resident came down and asked one of the ER doctors to look at his throat because he had a swollen throat, when this happened i'll never forget what he said "Why do my lymph nodes swell? I just don't get it?" Then he defended himself saying that he doesn't know anything else about the body outside the realm of female genitalia. Needless to say I was pretty shocked by the simplicity of the question he was asking.
 
just another case of superiority complexes
 
Samiamm said:
Ive been seeing a lot of negative posts about them and emergency medicine. Why would emergency med be looked down upon?
Click to expand...
,

1) Because they have negative relationship with other services: almost every service in the hospital has a give and take relationship with almost all other services. You consult and turf to them, they consult and turf to you. EM only takes. Every time they call you its work for you. Maybe an admit, maybe a consult, maybe a question, but always work. There's a baseline negative reaction to EM that's basically Pavlovian. Also because their workflow is a hospital wide priority, they often tell you what to do rather than ask (i.e. 'I'm calling you to come down and admit this patient') which pisses off people on other services.

2) They often look dumb, and never have the chance to look smart: Because EM is responsible for managing what is arguable the widest range of pathology in the hospital, and they need to do it with no known history in an incredibly limited amount of time, they often have differential diagnoses and work ups that are incomplete or just bizzare. Every pediatrician has gotten a call for someone who didn't know the difference between adult and pediatric SIRS criteria, every surgeon has gotten a call for an 'acute abdomen' that is soft and passing gas, etc. When you see them missing what are, to you, basic diagnoses you tend to think of them as dumb. You don't get the perspective that the doctor took the history in bits and pieces while dashing to two Traumas and a combative patient in withdrawel, that the volume in triage means that the doc has less than 10 minutes a patient, or whatever. Also, again, there's no give and take with EM: since you never consult the emergency room, they never have the opprotunity to be the voice of wisdom to your stupidity, so there's nothing to balance out your poor impression.

3) Because they look mercenary: EM works shifts. Short shifts, for a lot of money, and when they're done they normally leave regardless of how their current patients are doing or how many more are screaming for attention in triage.. It seems mercenary to hospitalists who are used to staying until the job is done, and its the moral high ground they take when they want to look down on EM. Honestly there's a grain of truth here: not all EM docs are cynical, but I feel like a disproportionate number of the most cynical doctors I've met have been attracted to Emergency medicine.

4) In some academic hospitals, they can be the only non-academic service. At several of the hospitals I worked at EM was the only service not to have its own residency. They were shift workers in a hospital full of academic doctors. It takes an already contentious relationship and makes it worse.

5) Because they're undertrained: This is the other moral high ground point. EM has declared themselves the patient's first point of contact in the hospital, they are supposed to be capable of providing care that includes Obstetrics, Pediatrics, toxicology, Internal medicine, cardiology, and even basic radiology. Yet they have concieved a residency program that is arguably the easiest in modern medicine. The majority of EM docs graduate from a 3 year program where they average something like 60 hours/week, sometimes dropping down to 40 when they're seniors. 4 year programs are the exception rather than the rule, and there's a feeling that EM people just aren't trying very hard, especially by residents who are doing harder residencies at the same hospital. It creates a poor opinion that's hard to get rid of down the line.

It's mostly not fair, and it shouldn't influence your career decision, but I think that's why. Just my thoughts.
 
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I would specialize in everything so I wouldn't have to rely on other people since other people are so unreliable.
 
TopTomato said:
I work in the ER as well, seeing how the ER docs work is really impressive to me. I'll never forget my first day ever in the ER we had a 31 year old women code out of no where, it was a real shock to everyone. While panic and chaos was breaking out, and the family members screaming I saw the ER doc take the control of the situation so clam and cool and because of him the women survived.

Now I can understand that other doctors might look down upon them because they are not true "experts" in one field, but i'll also never forget the time the chief OB/GYN resident came down and asked one of the ER doctors to look at his throat because he had a swollen throat, when this happened i'll never forget what he said "Why do my lymph nodes swell? I just don't get it?" Then he defended himself saying that he doesn't know anything else about the body outside the realm of female genitalia. Needless to say I was pretty shocked by the simplicity of the question he was asking.
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I hate to burst your bubble, but no one knows less about medicine than an OBGyn.
 
diagonal said:
I hate to burst your bubble, but no one knows less about medicine than an OBGyn.
Click to expand...

Yeah but even so, I think any doctor should know the question to why a sore throat happens, or why lymph nodes swell
 
will831 said:
I personally work with ER physicians and many of them have told me that they feel looked down upon by other specialties. This is due to the fact that they are not experts in any one field and have to consult other specialties all the time. What they do provide is good knowledge in ALL fields of medicine, this is something that other physicians cannot say and I don't believe that the other physicians always think about it that way.
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Completely agree. I work in the ER and they are def not repsected by other Docs (cards, rads, surg). I see it firsthand but most of them don't care. One Dr. told me last night on my shift he doesnt care if he gets respect or not because he loves saving lives and he loves his paycheck ($245 per hr/32 week). Not too shabby for someone on the bottom of the totem pole.)
 
They generally are not looked down upon, except in some instances.

080509-Hospital.jpg
 
Every specialty talks **** about every other specialty.

Psych: "pffft neuro consults us for so much stupid crap."

Surg: "does the medicine team actually DO anything or just talk about it?!"

And on and on. Do what you enjoy.
 
This is news to me.

I'm very interested in EM.
 
I've heard that EM is a good field if you're young. When you don't have any real commitments in your life, four 12-hour shifts sound pretty good for the amount of free time that you have.
 
Perrotfish said:
,

1) Because they have negative relationship with other services: almost every service in the hospital has a give and take relationship with almost all other services. You consult and turf to them, they consult and turf to you. EM only takes. Every time they call you its work for you. Maybe an admit, maybe a consult, maybe a question, but always work. There's a baseline negative reaction to EM that's basically Pavlovian. Also because their workflow is a hospital wide priority, they often tell you what to do rather than ask (i.e. 'I'm calling you to come down and admit this patient') which pisses off people on other services.

2) They often look dumb, and never have the chance to look smart: Because EM is responsible for managing what is arguable the widest range of pathology in the hospital, and they need to do it with no known history in an incredibly limited amount of time, they often have differential diagnoses and work ups that are incomplete or just bizzare. Every pediatrician has gotten a call for someone who didn't know the difference between adult and pediatric SIRS criteria, every surgeon has gotten a call for an 'acute abdomen' that is soft and passing gas, etc. When you see them missing what are, to you, basic diagnoses you tend to think of them as dumb. You don't get the perspective that the doctor took the history in bits and pieces while dashing to two Traumas and a combative patient in withdrawel, that the volume in triage means that the doc has less than 10 minutes a patient, or whatever. Also, again, there's no give and take with EM: since you never consult the emergency room, they never have the opprotunity to be the voice of wisdom to your stupidity, so there's nothing to balance out your poor impression.

3) Because they look mercenary: EM works shifts. Short shifts, for a lot of money, and when they're done they normally leave regardless of how their current patients are doing or how many more are screaming for attention in triage.. It seems mercenary to hospitalists who are used to staying until the job is done, and its the moral high ground they take when they want to look down on EM. Honestly there's a grain of truth here: not all EM docs are cynical, but I feel like a disproportionate number of the most cynical doctors I've met have been attracted to Emergency medicine.

4) In some academic hospitals, they can be the only non-academic service. At several of the hospitals I worked at EM was the only service not to have its own residency. They were shift workers in a hospital full of academic doctors. It takes an already contentious relationship and makes it worse.

5) Because they're undertrained: This is the other moral high ground point. EM has declared themselves the patient's first point of contact in the hospital, they are supposed to be capable of providing care that includes Obstetrics, Pediatrics, toxicology, Internal medicine, cardiology, and even basic radiology. Yet they have concieved a residency program that is arguably the easiest in modern medicine. The majority of EM docs graduate from a 3 year program where they average something like 60 hours/week, sometimes dropping down to 40 when they're seniors. 4 year programs are the exception rather than the rule, and there's a feeling that EM people just aren't trying very hard, especially by residents who are doing harder residencies at the same hospital. It creates a poor opinion that's hard to get rid of down the line.

It's mostly not fair, and it shouldn't influence your career decision, but I think that's why. Just my thoughts.
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This covers everything and is quoted for emphasis.
 
Perrotfish said:
,

1) Because they have negative relationship with other services: almost every service in the hospital has a give and take relationship with almost all other services. You consult and turf to them, they consult and turf to you. EM only takes. Every time they call you its work for you. Maybe an admit, maybe a consult, maybe a question, but always work. There's a baseline negative reaction to EM that's basically Pavlovian. Also because their workflow is a hospital wide priority, they often tell you what to do rather than ask (i.e. 'I'm calling you to come down and admit this patient') which pisses off people on other services.

2) They often look dumb, and never have the chance to look smart: Because EM is responsible for managing what is arguable the widest range of pathology in the hospital, and they need to do it with no known history in an incredibly limited amount of time, they often have differential diagnoses and work ups that are incomplete or just bizzare. Every pediatrician has gotten a call for someone who didn't know the difference between adult and pediatric SIRS criteria, every surgeon has gotten a call for an 'acute abdomen' that is soft and passing gas, etc. When you see them missing what are, to you, basic diagnoses you tend to think of them as dumb. You don't get the perspective that the doctor took the history in bits and pieces while dashing to two Traumas and a combative patient in withdrawel, that the volume in triage means that the doc has less than 10 minutes a patient, or whatever. Also, again, there's no give and take with EM: since you never consult the emergency room, they never have the opprotunity to be the voice of wisdom to your stupidity, so there's nothing to balance out your poor impression.

3) Because they look mercenary: EM works shifts. Short shifts, for a lot of money, and when they're done they normally leave regardless of how their current patients are doing or how many more are screaming for attention in triage.. It seems mercenary to hospitalists who are used to staying until the job is done, and its the moral high ground they take when they want to look down on EM. Honestly there's a grain of truth here: not all EM docs are cynical, but I feel like a disproportionate number of the most cynical doctors I've met have been attracted to Emergency medicine.

4) In some academic hospitals, they can be the only non-academic service. At several of the hospitals I worked at EM was the only service not to have its own residency. They were shift workers in a hospital full of academic doctors. It takes an already contentious relationship and makes it worse.

5) Because they're undertrained: This is the other moral high ground point. EM has declared themselves the patient's first point of contact in the hospital, they are supposed to be capable of providing care that includes Obstetrics, Pediatrics, toxicology, Internal medicine, cardiology, and even basic radiology. Yet they have concieved a residency program that is arguably the easiest in modern medicine. The majority of EM docs graduate from a 3 year program where they average something like 60 hours/week, sometimes dropping down to 40 when they're seniors. 4 year programs are the exception rather than the rule, and there's a feeling that EM people just aren't trying very hard, especially by residents who are doing harder residencies at the same hospital. It creates a poor opinion that's hard to get rid of down the line.

It's mostly not fair, and it shouldn't influence your career decision, but I think that's why. Just my thoughts.
Click to expand...


This is a good synopsis. Maybe a bit one sided, but honest. If someone is interested in EM, theres a lot of things you can do to mitigate many of these. And I'll just add my thoughts as well:

1- I'd say try to train in the midwest or west if you're going into EM. For whatever reason, lots of these issues tend to be amped on the east coast where there is less cordial of a relationship.

2- Its often different in the community. In many hospitals, every admission or consult means money for that service, so of course they're happy to help with a patient. Its not like the academic world where you're giving an admission to a tired and overworked resident. And in rural and small town settings, none of these issues apply.

3- If you train at a hospital where the ED has admitting privileges, pushback from the admitting services isn't an issue. You put the order in for the bed, and the rest is history. You simply call the accepting team to give report, and tell them about the patient. No arguing for a needed admission. If they don't want to hear about an admission, its their loss because the patient going upstairs regardless. I'm sure it doesn't help with whatever gets said up on the wards, but at least it keeps you sheltered from it down in the ED. I also try to talk to the admitting team a day or two later for feedback on our ED management. Its useful and they seem to appreciate it. You always learn a thing or two.

4- As far as the mercenary part, there is a grain of truth in it. EM docs do shift work and are in the hospital for fewer hours. But when you're working in the ED, you typically only stop to drink, shove a cliff bar in your mouth, or pee. Thats should be about it. So from the outside it looks pretty good...and for the most part it is. But 8 hours in the ED is not the same as 8 hours on the wards (well...ok, you got me again. Wards feel longer). I've seen a quite a few IM residents who just don't understand the work pace and flow in the ED. On the flipside, they've seen me with my eyes glazed over during rounds. So its all even.

And finally, just my little plug, but like Perrotfish said, don't pick a specialty because you're looking for validation from others in the hospital. Pick a specialty that has the elements and people you enjoy working with. As much grief as EM gets in the hospital, I couldn't imagine a specialty with more utility and intense human interaction. It is challenging, and I learn new things every day. It really is a great field.
 
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Perrotfish said:
1) Because they have negative relationship with other services: almost every service in the hospital has a give and take relationship with almost all other services. You consult and turf to them, they consult and turf to you. EM only takes. Every time they call you its work for you. Maybe an admit, maybe a consult, maybe a question, but always work. There's a baseline negative reaction to EM that's basically Pavlovian. Also because their workflow is a hospital wide priority, they often tell you what to do rather than ask (i.e. 'I'm calling you to come down and admit this patient') which pisses off people on other services.

2) They often look dumb, and never have the chance to look smart: Because EM is responsible for managing what is arguable the widest range of pathology in the hospital, and they need to do it with no known history in an incredibly limited amount of time, they often have differential diagnoses and work ups that are incomplete or just bizzare. Every pediatrician has gotten a call for someone who didn't know the difference between adult and pediatric SIRS criteria, every surgeon has gotten a call for an 'acute abdomen' that is soft and passing gas, etc. When you see them missing what are, to you, basic diagnoses you tend to think of them as dumb. You don't get the perspective that the doctor took the history in bits and pieces while dashing to two Traumas and a combative patient in withdrawel, that the volume in triage means that the doc has less than 10 minutes a patient, or whatever. Also, again, there's no give and take with EM: since you never consult the emergency room, they never have the opprotunity to be the voice of wisdom to your stupidity, so there's nothing to balance out your poor impression.

3) Because they look mercenary: EM works shifts. Short shifts, for a lot of money, and when they're done they normally leave regardless of how their current patients are doing or how many more are screaming for attention in triage.. It seems mercenary to hospitalists who are used to staying until the job is done, and its the moral high ground they take when they want to look down on EM. Honestly there's a grain of truth here: not all EM docs are cynical, but I feel like a disproportionate number of the most cynical doctors I've met have been attracted to Emergency medicine.

4) In some academic hospitals, they can be the only non-academic service. At several of the hospitals I worked at EM was the only service not to have its own residency. They were shift workers in a hospital full of academic doctors. It takes an already contentious relationship and makes it worse.

5) Because they're undertrained: This is the other moral high ground point. EM has declared themselves the patient's first point of contact in the hospital, they are supposed to be capable of providing care that includes Obstetrics, Pediatrics, toxicology, Internal medicine, cardiology, and even basic radiology. Yet they have concieved a residency program that is arguably the easiest in modern medicine. The majority of EM docs graduate from a 3 year program where they average something like 60 hours/week, sometimes dropping down to 40 when they're seniors. 4 year programs are the exception rather than the rule, and there's a feeling that EM people just aren't trying very hard, especially by residents who are doing harder residencies at the same hospital. It creates a poor opinion that's hard to get rid of down the line.

It's mostly not fair, and it shouldn't influence your career decision, but I think that's why. Just my thoughts.
Click to expand...

The first thought that popped into my mind was essentially your first point in that when the ED calls, it's ALWAYS for an admission and, thus, more work, especially when it comes at the end of the day team's shift, but they have to take the admission anyway. Your other points hit the nail on the head; well done.
 
If you aren't a neuroplastic dermasurgeon, then you might as well quit.
 
Perrotfish said:
,

1) Because they have negative relationship with other services: almost every service in the hospital has a give and take relationship with almost all other services. You consult and turf to them, they consult and turf to you. EM only takes. Every time they call you its work for you. Maybe an admit, maybe a consult, maybe a question, but always work. There's a baseline negative reaction to EM that's basically Pavlovian. Also because their workflow is a hospital wide priority, they often tell you what to do rather than ask (i.e. 'I'm calling you to come down and admit this patient') which pisses off people on other services.

2) They often look dumb, and never have the chance to look smart: Because EM is responsible for managing what is arguable the widest range of pathology in the hospital, and they need to do it with no known history in an incredibly limited amount of time, they often have differential diagnoses and work ups that are incomplete or just bizzare. Every pediatrician has gotten a call for someone who didn't know the difference between adult and pediatric SIRS criteria, every surgeon has gotten a call for an 'acute abdomen' that is soft and passing gas, etc. When you see them missing what are, to you, basic diagnoses you tend to think of them as dumb. You don't get the perspective that the doctor took the history in bits and pieces while dashing to two Traumas and a combative patient in withdrawel, that the volume in triage means that the doc has less than 10 minutes a patient, or whatever. Also, again, there's no give and take with EM: since you never consult the emergency room, they never have the opprotunity to be the voice of wisdom to your stupidity, so there's nothing to balance out your poor impression.

3) Because they look mercenary: EM works shifts. Short shifts, for a lot of money, and when they're done they normally leave regardless of how their current patients are doing or how many more are screaming for attention in triage.. It seems mercenary to hospitalists who are used to staying until the job is done, and its the moral high ground they take when they want to look down on EM. Honestly there's a grain of truth here: not all EM docs are cynical, but I feel like a disproportionate number of the most cynical doctors I've met have been attracted to Emergency medicine.

4) In some academic hospitals, they can be the only non-academic service. At several of the hospitals I worked at EM was the only service not to have its own residency. They were shift workers in a hospital full of academic doctors. It takes an already contentious relationship and makes it worse.

5) Because they're undertrained: This is the other moral high ground point. EM has declared themselves the patient's first point of contact in the hospital, they are supposed to be capable of providing care that includes Obstetrics, Pediatrics, toxicology, Internal medicine, cardiology, and even basic radiology. Yet they have concieved a residency program that is arguably the easiest in modern medicine. The majority of EM docs graduate from a 3 year program where they average something like 60 hours/week, sometimes dropping down to 40 when they're seniors. 4 year programs are the exception rather than the rule, and there's a feeling that EM people just aren't trying very hard, especially by residents who are doing harder residencies at the same hospital. It creates a poor opinion that's hard to get rid of down the line.

It's mostly not fair, and it shouldn't influence your career decision, but I think that's why. Just my thoughts.
Click to expand...

I can't believe people think that Emergency medicine residents are under trained. I do find that many residents say that it is way easier that what they are doing though.
 
Brigade4Radiant said:
I can't believe people think that Emergency medicine residents are under trained. I do find that many residents say that it is way easier that what they are doing though.
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People think that we're undertrained because the residency is only 3 years. Maybe we're just more efficient at learning. I completed a surgical internship prior to my EM residency, so I'll make a few comparisons here:

1. We start seeing patients and working as an EP on the first day of residency. When I was a surgical intern, we rarely went to the OR. Most of our time was spent on the floor writing notes and orders and keeping track of consultants. Even the PGY-2's in surgery might spend only 6 months or so in the OR. The rest was spent in the ICU. If surgical residents spent everyday all day in the OR starting on day 1 of residency, their training could be cut by a year and the knowledge would be the same.

2. Many EM programs have a reading plan from the textbooks with weekly or monthly quizzes. In surgery (and I think medicine), reading is largely dependent on you.

3. Things seem easier when you aren't a part of it. Derm, preventive medicine, and rehab medicine all seem easier since the residencies generally span 40 hours a week. They have lots of reading and expertise, but if you're counting the number of hours spent in residency, you're missing much of the picture.
 
Didn't you know? EM actually stands for "exasperated *****s" or "expect malpractice." ;)

In all seriousness though, EM and Ortho are the most frequently shat-upon services in the hospital. Hands down. It's amazing (and sad) how often attendings & residents will openly malign these specialties. Both have very difficult jobs and will inevitably piss people off on a regular basis, so they're facing a losing battle in most hospitals.

But, as others have said, don't let this sway you from pursing EM (or ortho). No matter what field you choose, you'll be on the receiving end of criticism from other services. Find what you like, and pursue it with passion. And don't let the snarkiness get to you.
 
Sparda29 said:
The ER docs at my hospital still don't understand the concept of no chart/order = no meds dispensed. Yet they always send nurses running over asking for things without giving us any patient info.
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Then you must not understand the concept of a true medical emergency.

Lets not forget that most EM docs are also capable of performing basic nursing skills, making drips, pulling up meds, starting IVs, ect.

At our hospital I feel we are the most respected residents. Some of the smartest attendings in the hospital are in the ED, hands down.

ED's are an essential part of our healthcare system. Does OB/Gyn want to come down and see every vag bleeder that night? Does surgery want to come see every abdominal pain?

We are re-reimbursed well because there is a hugh demand for what we do
 
Sparda29 said:
The ER docs at my hospital still don't understand the concept of no chart/order = no meds dispensed. Yet they always send nurses running over asking for things without giving us any patient info.
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I'll bet the ER docs aren't sending nurses to ask any of their questions...EM doctors do their own dirty work and don't like word-of-mouth answers...probably just nurses jumping the gun and asking for meds before the doc puts in the orders and then blaming the doctors. Not trying to talk **** about nurses, but I know many nurses that do this.
 
KinasePro said:
Didn't you know? EM actually stands for "exasperated *****s" or "expect malpractice." ;)

In all seriousness though, EM and Ortho are the most frequently shat-upon services in the hospital. Hands down. It's amazing (and sad) how often attendings & residents will openly malign these specialties. Both have very difficult jobs and will inevitably piss people off on a regular basis, so they're facing a losing battle in most hospitals.

But, as others have said, don't let this sway you from pursing EM (or ortho). No matter what field you choose, you'll be on the receiving end of criticism from other services. Find what you like, and pursue it with passion. And don't let the snarkiness get to you.
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LOL EM and Ortho are the two fields I would like to go into most at this point. Wonder what that says about me. :whistle:
 
Cliffs: they jelly of $150/hour shift work.
 
KinasePro said:
EM and Ortho are the most frequently shat-upon services in the hospital.
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Why ortho??? Just because they fix bones, so they seem primitive? I thought that it's fairly prestigious and hard to get into.
 
nychila said:
Why ortho??? Just because they fix bones, so they seem primitive? I thought that it's fairly prestigious and hard to get into.
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I think that Ortho is the most joked about. They have a reputation for being jock-ish, and though everyone knows their average step score is in the 240s their reputation for being meatheads somehow gets transmuted into dumb guy jokes like this:

[YOUTUBE]3rTsvb2ef5k[/YOUTUBE]


I don't think anyone actually complains about them in a serious way. I've never heard an attending complain that Ortho was obstructive, or lazy, or whatever. It's like the Navy making jokes about the Marine Corps, all in good fun. In fact its mostly the same jokes.
 
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