Are others disappointed in ABIM?

[BelaMedicine]

I am surprised there isn’t more flexibility this year and more testing dates being offered given the fact that Pearson’s is operating at limited capacity. Have others faced any issues?

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[DrMetal]

I'm very disappointed, in that they exist at all.

 

[obiwan]

LOL, is this a rhetorical question ?

 

[DrMetal]

It's a useless organization that does nothing for physician or patient advocacy, who's only function is to police and maintain a meaningless credential.

 

[BelaMedicine]

And they have done a God awful job of giving any flexibility during this time. Exams were cancelled last minute. Not enough testing slots to take exams- people left without the ability to take exams because they refuse to open up more slots.

 

[ewax]

It's a useless organization that does nothing for physician or patient advocacy, who's only function is to police and maintain a meaningless credential.

That and taking money from residents who are already hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt. #medicineisascam

 

[DrMetal]

That and taking money from residents who are already hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt. #medicineisascam

Much of its our own fault. We (as a community of physicians) decided that it wasn't enough to complete a pre-med curriculum (yes, I count college, b/c you and I did not have a normal college experience), to complete medical school, to complete 3-7 years of training....on top of this, we have to obtain a maintain a 'board certification', a credential that really has no bearing on performance or outcomes.

So congrats to us, BC/MOC are now the norm. Enjoy the suck.

 

[jurassicpark]

Much of its our own fault. We (as a community of physicians) decided that it wasn't enough to complete a pre-med curriculum (yes, I count college, b/c you and I did not have a normal college experience), to complete medical school, to complete 3-7 years of training....on top of this, we have to obtain a maintain a 'board certification', a credential that really has no bearing on performance or outcomes.

So congrats to us, BC/MOC are now the norm. Enjoy the suck.

it'll never go away not because of any political or educational reasons. But it's a nice chunk of change. Seems like every year they're changing the criteria for BC/MOC from 10 year to 2 year to a question a week or so to placate the angry mom. Heck, it may even change to, "Just give us the money and pretend this is a robbery and watch a video of mediciny stuff" one day. But pay we will. That'll never go away.

 

[DrMetal]

it'll never go away not because of any political or educational reasons. But it's a nice chunk of change. Seems like every year they're changing the criteria for BC/MOC from 10 year to 2 year to a question a week or so to placate the angry mom. Heck, it may even change to, "Just give us the money and pretend this is a robbery and watch a video of mediciny stuff" one day. But pay we will. That'll never go away.

Yeah, you're certainly right. I recall a 'Gomber Blog' article where the ABIM announced daily re-certifications. Many a truth are presented in jest!

But our psyche is to blame as well. We love to one-up each other, to come up with credentials that attempt to distinguish some physicians from others (as if such distinction is necessary). BC used to be an optional goal, usually held by academics, but the rural FP who sees 25 patients a day/5 days a week wasn't expected to necessarily get it.

Now it's essentially a requirement. And in due time, b/c of our psyche, we'll come up with a new credential and pester ourselves with it. It'll be called "extra special super mojo board certification".

Of course, we could stop the crazy train and just collectively refuse to do BC/MOC, but I don't think we have the gall to do that.

 

[jurassicpark]

Now it's essentially a requirement. And in due time, b/c of our psyche, we'll come up with a new credential and pester ourselves with it. It'll be called "extra special super mojo board certification".

Of course, we could stop the crazy train and just collectively refuse to do BC/MOC, but I don't think we have the gall to do that.

Not when most hospitals and places now may BE/BC a requirement, no one wants to lose privileges. I still get recruitment email, they all want BE/BC. I think the only place that doesn't are Federal I believe.. which makes you wonder about a great many things.

 

[zeloc]

How many hours is it and why aren't these being held virtually? I do not want to be in small room with other ppl for an extended period of time, even if everyone is wearing masks. Plus touching everything. I don't know how well they sanitized surfaces. They are even having high-stakes chess tournaments online with security measures (webcam on at all times, player cannot leave the computer while a game is ongoing, a 2nd camera behind the player, which includes the room and whole monitor is required to make sure the player is not receiving assistance, maybe an audio device as well); there's no reason why they can't do it with the boards.

It's a useless organization that does nothing for physician or patient advocacy, who's only function is to police and maintain a meaningless credential.

At least someone should come up with a low-cost alternative, because that is an easier pitch to hospitals than to remove the requirement altogether. The problem is that the 2 alternatives I have seen just want you to send them a check and they say you are board-certified. I'm not going to pitch one of them to any hospitals. But if there was something evidence-based and at a fraction of the cost, or even not evidence-based, but was a fraction of the cost and included a well-designed test, I'd go for it to get away from ABIM.

 

[DrMetal]

At least someone should come up with a low-cost alternative, because that is an easier pitch to hospitals than to remove the requirement altogether. The problem is that the 2 alternatives I have seen just want you to send them a check and they say you are board-certified. I'm not going to pitch one of them to any hospitals. But if there was something evidence-based and at a fraction of the cost, or even not evidence-based, but was a fraction of the cost and included a well-designed test, I'd go for it to get away from ABIM.

Here's a thought, how bout no test, no BC/MOC? Get rid of it alltogether.

You do a pre-med college curriculum (no small feat), you go to medical school, you complete a residency, +/- fellowship. We'll make a standardized exit exam for said residency, and that test will be governed by the ACGME (not by the ABMS). Upon completion of all of these things, you are now a fully-functional, independent physician. You're done. That's enough formal education and training, enough credentials.

You're then expected to do go good work, to take care of your patients well, and keep up with good CME. Every 2- or 5- or 10-years, the home institution you work for (or are credentialed by) reviews the body of your work. If you've been seeing patients, taking care of them well, no adverse outcomes, minimal complications rates with your procedures, doing high quality CME.....then you're good to go! Continue practicing. If not, further investigation and disciplinary measures may ensue.

In other words, the test is the body of your work!

 

[zeloc]

Sure, I don't disagree, but my point is that I don't see the likelihood of that occurring, and that's a hard sell to hospitals (which are the ones requiring board certification).
Whereas if I could pay $200 from a rival organization to take a test that is similar to what the ABIM makes for recertification, instead of $1000, and also be board certified, then I only need to say to the hospitals, I am board certified and my qualification is equally as good as ABIM.

 

[zeloc]

It looks like there are plenty of options for virtual assessments: Colleges Say They Don’t Need Exam Surveillance Tools to Stop Cheating

 

[wamcp]

Here's a thought, how bout no test, no BC/MOC? Get rid of it alltogether.

You do a pre-med college curriculum (no small feat), you go to medical school, you complete a residency, +/- fellowship. We'll make a standardized exit exam for said residency, and that test will be governed by the ACGME (not by the ABMS). Upon completion of all of these things, you are now a fully-functional, independent physician. You're done. That's enough formal education and training, enough credentials.

You're then expected to do go good work, to take care of your patients well, and keep up with good CME. Every 2- or 5- or 10-years, the home institution you work for (or are credentialed by) reviews the body of your work. If you've been seeing patients, taking care of them well, no adverse outcomes, minimal complications rates with your procedures, doing high quality CME.....then you're good to go! Continue practicing. If not, further investigation and disciplinary measures may ensue.

In other words, the test is the body of your work!

Yes. We should be doing CME and licensure like Japan.
No mandatory CME or recertification nonsense.

it’s a plain racket in the US

Current State and Future Opportunities for Continuing Medical Education in Japan

Globally, CPD systems vary widely. In Japan, the Japanese Medical Association (JMA) is responsible for identifying content and developing education for its speciality practice physicians. The JMA was concerned about persistent low levels of participation ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Unlike physicians practising in many other countries, Japanese physicians are not required to participate in CME to maintain licensure. Historically, the JMA has been opposed to linking CME to the medical licence renewal system as it believes CME should remain separate from governmental regulation.

 

[PikminOC]

Nbpas