At 400 hours each for nonclinical and clinical volunteering. Low GPA applicant. Do I try to hit the 1000-hour mark?

[Python Forever]

Strangely worded title, but I didn't really know how else to word it.

Long story short, I graduated a few years ago from a UC, screwed around too much and graduated with less than stellar grades; 2.67 to be exact (similar cu and sci GPAs). Fortunately, I have no bio/chem/physics courses (i.e. prereqs) in undergrad. Since then, I've completed the med school prerequisites, 4ish upper division bio courses, some community college Anatomy/Physiology/Intro Chem/Microbio classes and have maintained a 4.0 (totaling around 70 units I think?). Brought me up to a 3.2 cum, 3.3 sci. Currently prepping for MCAT.

I've also accumulated 400 hours of nonclinical and clinical volunteering, respectively (so 800 total). Nonclinical at various organizations geared toward the homeless, and clinical at a couple of hospices.

It is unrealistic for me to take any more classes (highly unlikely a spot will open up for other classes for a visiting student at schools in my area), so the only thing I can work on is my MCAT and my EC's. I've had no luck finding a research position as a postbacc with 0 research experience in undergrad, so I've pretty much gave up on trying to find research. MCAT is coming along, and I've been scoring 520+ on FL's, if that means anything. Only thing I can really work on additionally now is my volunteering.

Should I pretty much volunteer full time in the upcoming year to try to hit the 1000-hour mark for both nonclinical and clinical volunteering? If so, I'd continue working with the homeless and do some more volunteering at additional hospices. In the context of my application, will having 1000+ hours in both categories (nonclinical and clinical) make a significant enough impact for me next year? Or should I just dedicate 4 hours a week to them, and try to save some money before the app season by working? Making a few extra 10-20k will definitely help with CoL and app fees for this and next year, but I'd be willing to go into some debt if the volunteering significantly helps me out.

Sorry if this sounds too much like a WAMC post. Just wanted to provide some context to my background. Thank you for reading.

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[PA_dud3]

You'd be solid for a good bit of DO schools with your current volunteering hours, depending on MCAT. My vote is to keep up the volunteering, make some dough to support yourself, do well on that MCAT, polish off your app and apply to DO schools (semi-broadly, I will defer to Goro for specifics). I can't comment as to your allopathic competitiveness. Good luck to you!

 

[CyrilFiggis]

Do well on the MCAT. You can't compensate for your past grades with volunteer hours. That said, I agree with Dr. Dud - find a job to put cash in your pocket (doesn't matter if it's medical related), put in 4+ hours a week of meaningful volunteering and work on crushing the MCAT.

I was in your shoes. You have a story to tell. Your recent grades show you can work hard. Any volunteering you do should be meaningful because it helps paint the picture of who you are as an applicant. What you do is more important than how much you do. good luck

 

[Moko]

My thoughts:
- There are diminishing returns with any activity. More clinical and non-clinical volunteering obviously won't hurt, but won't make up for bad grades.
- If you have a major deficiency in your application such as a lack of research, it may make more sense to do research with volunteering on the side. An afternoon per week for volunteering is sufficient in my opinion.
- Have you looked for volunteer research positions? PIs are usually more receptive to free labor. Just make sure that you're part of the experimental process and not just cleaning beakers.
- Alternatively, taking a job while doing volunteering on the side would also be a good alternative. The goal is to have an application with a diversity of experiences, in addition to a few experiences that stand out.
- You would likely be considered competitive for MD schools as well if you knock the MCAT out of the park. Even more so if your undergrad GPA showed an upward trend as well. For example, a 1.6 / 2.0 / 3.3 / 3.6 / 4.0 / 4.0 looks very different than a 2.6 / 2.6 / 2.6 / 2.6 / 4.0 / 4.0.

 

[Python Forever]

My thoughts:
- There are diminishing returns with any activity. More clinical and non-clinical volunteering obviously won't hurt, but won't make up for bad grades.
- If you have a major deficiency in your application such as a lack of research, it may make more sense to do research with volunteering on the side. An afternoon per week for volunteering is sufficient in my opinion.
- Have you looked for volunteer research positions? PIs are usually more receptive to free labor. Just make sure that you're part of the experimental process and not just cleaning beakers.
- Alternatively, taking a job while doing volunteering on the side would also be a good alternative. The goal is to have an application with a diversity of experiences, in addition to a few experiences that stand out.
- You would likely be considered competitive for MD schools as well if you knock the MCAT out of the park. Even more so if your undergrad GPA showed an upward trend as well. For example, a 1.6 / 2.0 / 3.3 / 3.6 / 4.0 / 4.0 looks very different than a 2.6 / 2.6 / 2.6 / 2.6 / 4.0 / 4.0.

Thanks for the reply. Unfortunately, I'd say my undergrad trend is almost downward, since I was one of those "C's get degrees, just graduate and work in software engineering" type of people, relying too much on school pedigree. It took 6 months of growing up post-graduation for me to get my ass kicked by life and learn it doesn't work that way.

I guess the trend is something like 2.x -> 2.x -> 2.x -> 2.x -> 4.0 -> 4.0 -> 4.0 (FR -> SP -> JR -> SR -> PB1 -> PB2 -> PB3), where x is slightly decreasing.

Do you think that downward trend will be a negative, or a neutral since my UG performance was so s**t in the first place?

 

[Python Forever]

Do well on the MCAT. You can't compensate for your past grades with volunteer hours. That said, I agree with Dr. Dud - find a job to put cash in your pocket (doesn't matter if it's medical related), put in 4+ hours a week of meaningful volunteering and work on crushing the MCAT.

I was in your shoes. You have a story to tell. Your recent grades show you can work hard. Any volunteering you do should be meaningful because it helps paint the picture of who you are as an applicant. What you do is more important than how much you do. good luck

It was definitely wishful thinking, trying to brute force a way to "clean up" my undergrad with volunteer hours. I'll just dedicate that time to MCAT/tutoring for cash, and try to work a couple of months with Habitat for Humanity. Thank you.

 

[chemdoctor]

I think the downward trend is whatever since you didn’t have too many prereqs and completed a post bacc with a 4.0

How many credits in the post bacc? Just focus on the MCAT. How long would it take to get your hours to 1000?

If you could get 1000 hours and a good MCAT, I think you’d be solid

 

[CyrilFiggis]

It was definitely wishful thinking, trying to brute force a way to "clean up" my undergrad with volunteer hours. I'll just dedicate that time to MCAT/tutoring for cash, and try to work a couple of months with Habitat for Humanity. Thank you.

Don't be discouraged, not everyone did well in undergrad. If you have a reasonable employer who knows of your journey, ask them for an LOR. Med schools also want to know you're mature and professional. Having this as an extra letter helps to show your growth. I literally said in an interview when asked about my UG grades that I was young, short-sighted and never expected my life to go in a direction that would require anything more than having a degree, rather than the grades i took to get it. Humility helps.

 

[Python Forever]

I think the downward trend is whatever since you didn’t have too many prereqs and completed a post bacc with a 4.0

How many credits in the post bacc? Just focus on the MCAT. How long would it take to get your hours to 1000?

If you could get 1000 hours and a good MCAT, I think you’d be solid

70 unit postbacc, with some CC science classes mixed in there.

It was between dedicating 20+ hours a week to volunteering to hit 1000, or spend that time working part-time as a tutor, but it seems like it's wiser to work and continue my volunteering steadily than try to double the amount in a year.

 

[Moko]

Thanks for the reply. Unfortunately, I'd say my undergrad trend is almost downward, since I was one of those "C's get degrees, just graduate and work in software engineering" type of people, relying too much on school pedigree. It took 6 months of growing up post-graduation for me to get my ass kicked by life and learn it doesn't work that way.

I guess the trend is something like 2.x -> 2.x -> 2.x -> 2.x -> 4.0 -> 4.0 -> 4.0 (FR -> SP -> JR -> SR -> PB1 -> PB2 -> PB3), where x is slightly decreasing.

Do you think that downward trend will be a negative, or a neutral since my UG performance was so s**t in the first place?

A downward trend doesn't help, BUT you have also already proven that you are no longer a 2.x student. With a good MCAT, I do think that you will stand a good shot at both MD and DO schools provided that the rest of your application is competitive. And as @CyrilFiggis said, remain humble. It's a highly desired trait in applicants and physicians .

 

[Skeletorr]

My thoughts:
- There are diminishing returns with any activity. More clinical and non-clinical volunteering obviously won't hurt, but won't make up for bad grades.
- If you have a major deficiency in your application such as a lack of research, it may make more sense to do research with volunteering on the side. An afternoon per week for volunteering is sufficient in my opinion.
- Have you looked for volunteer research positions? PIs are usually more receptive to free labor. Just make sure that you're part of the experimental process and not just cleaning beakers.

Sorry to hijack your thread OP. What if one lives in a very rural area where the nearest research positions are 1.5hrs away? Would adcoms understand less research hours because an applicants location?

 

[Moko]

Sorry to hijack your thread OP. What if one lives in a very rural area where the nearest research positions are 1.5hrs away? Would adcoms understand less research hours because an applicants location?

Yes and no. This is likely going to be very school- and mission-dependent. It also depends on how many fewer hours you're talking about, and also whether you've done enough research to be able to talk meaningfully about it.

Generally speaking though, at least at my school, we do understand that those in very rural areas will have more difficulty getting certain things done especially after graduation, and/or if they are a non-trad applicant. This isn't to say that being from a rural area can be used as a crutch, but usually the experiences that they bring being from a rural region help balance out some of the deficiencies in the application.