Balancing Family Life and Medicine

[cntran]

Hello everyone,

This is a bit of a long dilemma, (thank you so much for reading) but I've been agonizing over it for a very long while now and would really appreciate any advice or insight anyone has to offer.

I'm a female in my mid-20s, and I find that it's as important for me to be an active mom as it is a physician. My dilemma is that I currently have an opportunity to go to a post-baccalaureate program for medical school, but I'm not sure if I want to take it just yet or put off medical school for later on in the future. I want to have start having kids before I'm 30-years-old, aim for a decent-sized family with around 3-4 kids, and I also think one of the most important times to be most present in their lives is when they're young before grade-school age.

A possibility my fiance and I considered was, I could go into nursing first so that I can allocate more time on being present during the earlier years' of our kids lives (nurses can work 3 12-hour shifts a week and their schedule is super flexible), and around when I'm in my mid-30s, they'll be in grade school, my then-husband will be settled in his job as PA, and he would be willing to move, work, and take care of our kids and finances while I'm in medical school. I guess I'm just concerned that if I have kids DURING medical school (which would ideally be between MS3MS4), it can largely affect my performance and I'll miss out on a good portion of the earlier years of my kids. Not just that, but my then-husband will barely be a PA when Im in MS3/MS4, and me dumping a newborn/toddler on him while I go off into residency and am essentially barely home sounds rather intimidating. A few of my physician-mentors warned me about how difficult it was to balance time for a baby during medical school and residency, but I'm hoping that maybe it can still be done or if I would have a lot of regrets.

Is this a viable idea? To sum up: I'd reject my post-bacc offer, become a nurse first, have my kids and be more present in the earlier years of their lives, wait until they're in grade school and my husband to be settled as PA, and THEN pursue medical school when I'm like 32 or 33.

OR,

1) Is there something I'm missing where I can actually be both a good mom and a good student during medical school?
2) Are medical schools really supportive of maternity leave? If so, what kind of programs did they offer?
3) If you took a year off during medical school to have a child, how was your experience with that and would you recommend it?
4) Do you know a lot of women who were able to balance a good amount of time left with their families while performing well in medical school?

I also considered working part-time once I finally finish medical school and residency, but I'm not sure how common that is or what the pros/cons are other than the obvious.

Thank you so much, I know I just threw out a bunch of concerns all at once, but I'm just stressed beyond believe. Please let me know your insight.

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[kimjongillest]

As a parent in medical school (male), and having seen multiple dads and moms (both single moms and those with partners) go through this process, it is easy to say it absolutely not conducive to doing well as either a student and/or parent. It can be done, but not well (but perhaps there are superhuman exceptions out there). There are many many days I regret it, and get incredibly sad at how much I miss out in my kid's lives. You will have your foot half in both doors. I go to a school that is pretty supportive, and even with that, given that much of the system is external to the school (ie board exams, away electives, research work, residency apps), it is what it is. Many of our parents chose to go into fields that put less an emphasis on high standardized scores/research, but still struggle to do well, a couple have had to repeat years. Pursuing medical school at 32-33 is absolutely not a bad idea as you will still be young, but who knows, the best-laid plans of mice and men often go awry

 

[CleverAdvisor]

Why would you go through the process of applying for medical school if you didn't plan on attending?
There is a limited amount of time where your MCAT is valid for schools, while you'll stay in touch with your references, while your EC's are "recent." It is also getting more difficult each year to get into medical school.
You're making this exceedingly complicated just because you want to have kids a few years earlier. Not to mention 3-4 kids will be quite expensive and more time consuming than you seem to think.

 

[trs88]

I'm just not fond if the idea of practicing as nurse just to use it as a stepping stone to attempt to get into medical school. The profession deserves more than that.

 

[GoSpursGo]

Moving to pre-allo.

 

[cntran]

I'm just not fond if the idea of practicing as nurse just to use it as a stepping stone to attempt to get into medical school. The profession deserves more than that.

Hello trs88,

I would first like to apologize - I do not mean to demean nurses in any way. I actually have a lot of respect for them - there are things that nurses can do better than many doctors can, and they have a very important role to play in a patient's wellbeing. I just like the idea that their schedule has more flexibility, and it's still a way for me to be in the healthcare field. I am simply looking at schedule flexibility without any implication of seeing is as "stepping stone."

 

[cntran]

Why would you go through the process of applying for medical school if you didn't plan on attending?
There is a limited amount of time where your MCAT is valid for schools, while you'll stay in touch with your references, while your EC's are "recent." It is also getting more difficult each year to get into medical school.
You're making this exceedingly complicated just because you want to have kids a few years earlier. Not to mention 3-4 kids will be quite expensive and more time consuming than you seem to think.

Hello,

Actually, I haven't taken the MCAT yet because the postbacc program has an integrated MCAT course prep, so I held off until I received an acceptance. Second, I'm taking a postbacc program because a lot of life-stuff got in the way that prevented me from doing well in school. Sp either way, I would have to take additional courses before actually going into medical school. Third, I hope your tone isn't belittling, because I am coming at this open-minded with the understanding that I lack experience. I am well aware that having 3-4 kids is very time consuming - hence, I am seeking advice from people who are more experienced and can provide me with mature and well-thought out advice. Third, I am making this "exceedingly complicated" because I value family just as much as I value my place in healthcare. Your values may be different, and that's fine, but this is what is important to me and I want to make the best educated decision I can.

 

[cntran]

Moving to pre-allo.

Hello,

I am not sure what this comment means. Can you please expand?

 

[cntran]

As a parent in medical school (male), and having seen multiple dads and moms (both single moms and those with partners) go through this process, it is easy to say it absolutely not conducive to doing well as either a student and/or parent. It can be done, but not well (but perhaps there are superhuman exceptions out there). There are many many days I regret it, and get incredibly sad at how much I miss out in my kid's lives. You will have your foot half in both doors. I go to a school that is pretty supportive, and even with that, given that much of the system is external to the school (ie board exams, away electives, research work, residency apps), it is what it is. Many of our parents chose to go into fields that put less an emphasis on high standardized scores, but still struggle to do well, a couple have had to repeat years. Pursuing medical school at 32-33 is absolutely not a bad idea as you will still be young, but who knows, the best-laid plans of mice and men often go awry

Hello,

Thank you so much for being honest with your experience. My female physician-mentors told me about the troubles they faced finding a good work-life balance. If I may ask, do you have any regrets about your profession? If so, what keeps you moving forward in being a doctor (essentially I'm asking - what do you do to still make it "worth it?)" and if you could go back in time, would you have done things differently?

 

[LizzyM]

Hello,

I am not sure what this comment means. Can you please expand?

It means that you are in preparation for medical school and therefore questions you pose should be in the Pre-allo forum. A forum moderator moved it for you.

 

[cntran]

It means that you are in preparation for medical school and therefore questions you pose should be in the Pre-allo forum. A forum moderator moved it for you.

Oh, thank you for the heads up!

 

[GoSpursGo]

Hello,

I am not sure what this comment means. Can you please expand?

The "Medical Students-MD" forum is intended for current medical students to discuss issues that are relevant for their level of training. We move questions from users who are not yet in medical school to the "Pre-Medical-MD" forum. Med students frequently still respond to questions in this forum.

"Pre-allo" is an old term from when the forum used to be called "Pre-allopathic."

To answer your question, your reasoning for questioning going into the post-bacc now is sound, but if being a doctor is a passion that you will be truly disappointed if you don't attain, then I think you need to do the post-bacc now. It's not impossible for you to do it later, but the further out you get from undergrad the more you will need to re-learn, and it will be significantly harder to do that when you have school-aged kids than now. And on top of that, you will have certainly burned a bridge at your current post-bacc where they won't accept you a second time. Succeeding in your post-bacc now is probably the most likely path you have to eventually going to med school.

There are lots of women who take time off in med school. The saying goes that there is "never a good time," but people make it work. The trade off, of course, is that you won't be present for all of the early years of their lives, and there really isn't a way around that. Only you can decide for yourself if that is a sacrifice that you and your family are willing to make.

 

[cntran]

The "Medical Students-MD" forum is intended for current medical students to discuss issues that are relevant for their level of training. We move questions from users who are not yet in medical school to the "Pre-Medical-MD" forum. Med students frequently still respond to questions in this forum.

"Pre-allo" is an old term from when the forum used to be called "Pre-allopathic."

To answer your question, your reasoning for questioning going into the post-bacc now is sound, but if being a doctor is a passion that you will be truly disappointed if you don't attain, then I think you need to do the post-bacc now. It's not impossible for you to do it later, but the further out you get from undergrad the more you will need to re-learn, and it will be significantly harder to do that when you have school-aged kids than now. And on top of that, you will have certainly burned a bridge at your current post-bacc where they won't accept you a second time. Succeeding in your post-bacc now is probably the most likely path you have to eventually going to med school.

There are lots of women who take time off in med school. The saying goes that there is "never a good time," but people make it work. The trade off, of course, is that you won't be present for all of the early years of their lives, and there really isn't a way around that. Only you can decide for yourself if that is a sacrifice that you and your family are willing to make.

Hello,

You have a very valid point. The school I got accepted would definitely be a privilege, and I would hate to burn a bridge with them. Do you personally know these women who took off time for medical school? If so, can you tell me anything about the pros/cons of taking a year off for child-rearing? I heard some moms did that and used that as their research year before going into residency and it worked out for a few of them, but I'm not sure what the other downsides of that may be (like if it looks bad to residency programs, increases finances, etc)

 

[Mt Kilimanjaro]

It sounds like you don’t have kids now. You could obviously wait and have them later like many female physicians do. Medical school with children is extremely difficult to balance even under the best circumstances. It sounds like you want to be more involved than even a very good, involved working parent so I think the emotional toll may be even harder for you. I’m generally not supportive of medical school applicants who plan to work part time after residency although many do. Seems like a huge waste of time and resources for society, the school, and the student but others may disagree. If this is your plan, I think nursing or PA makes more sense.

Mothersinmedicine is a good site.

 

[theKingLT]

Can't speak from personal experience, but I've heard residency or post-residency is much more conducive to having kids than medical school (probably depending on the specialty/specific program though). Have you considered waiting an extra few years to have kids? I know you said you would like them before 30 but that might be a better option, especially if your post bacc means you would matriculate 2019, that really wouldn't be too late for kids during residency

 

[cntran]

It sounds like you don’t have kids now. You could obviously wait and have them later like many female physicians do. Medical school with children is extremely difficult to balance even under the best circumstances. It sounds like you want to be more involved than even a very good, involved working parent so I think the emotional toll may be even harder for you. I’m generally not supportive of medical school applicants who plan to work part time after residency although many do. Seems like a huge waste of time and resources for society, the school, and the student but others may disagree. If this is your plan, I think nursing or PA makes more sense.

Hello,

Thank you so much for your honest insight and input on things. I would like to hear more about your opinion of those who choose to work part time. Can you elaborate more? I heard about part-time physicians before, but it almost sounds too good to be true and I feel that it's more complex than it seems.

 

[Mt Kilimanjaro]

There’s a fairly famous NYT piece — Karen Siebert, “Don’t quit this day job”

Lots of specialties offer part time options that are often somewhat demeaningly referred to as “mommy track.”

Anesthesia, Emergency Medicine, radiology, family medicine, and internal medicine probably offer the best options for part-time shift work. There’s so much required more-than-full-time work x 7-8 years in order to get to those jobs though it never makes sense to me if that is your long-term goal from the start. You could be a teacher or a nurse and work 40 to 50 hours per week and the first case or 36 hours per week in the second case and still make a difference and a decent income.

 

[GoSpursGo]

Hello,

You have a very valid point. The school I got accepted would definitely be a privilege, and I would hate to burn a bridge with them. Do you personally know these women who took off time for medical school? If so, can you tell me anything about the pros/cons of taking a year off for child-rearing? I heard some moms did that and used that as their research year before going into residency and it worked out for a few of them, but I'm not sure what the other downsides of that may be (like if it looks bad to residency programs, increases finances, etc)

Yes, I personally know plenty of women--you make it sound like they are extremely rare, but it really is not uncommon.

It is certainly easier to have kids during a research year where you aren't being pressured to study constantly, but research isn't some magical land where you can just be home all the time--you will have pressure to do work to justify your time in the lab, and while in and of itself doing a research year doesn't look bad to residency programs, you'll want something to show for your time spent doing research. And importantly, sometimes the best laid plans are all for naught if the baby doesn't come at the exact time that you hoped.

I'm not trying to discourage you, and it's certainly not fair that finding time to have kids is a question that is much harder for women in medicine. But it would be disingenuous to say that it's super easy and you can have it all no problem--you CAN have it all, but if you do there is still some level of sacrifice that is being made at home, or at school, or probably both.

 

[cntran]

Yes, I personally know plenty of women--you make it sound like they are extremely rare, but it really is not uncommon.

It is certainly easier to have kids during a research year where you aren't being pressured to study constantly, but research isn't some magical land where you can just be home all the time--you will have pressure to do work to justify your time in the lab, and while in and of itself doing a research year doesn't look bad to residency programs, you'll want something to show for your time spent doing research. And importantly, sometimes the best laid plans are all for naught if the baby doesn't come at the exact time that you hoped.

I'm not trying to discourage you, and it's certainly not fair that finding time to have kids is a question that is much harder for women in medicine. But it would be disingenuous to say that it's super easy and you can have it all no problem--you CAN have it all, but if you do there is still some level of sacrifice that is being made at home, or at school, or probably both.

Thank you, I really do appreciate your honesty and going into more detail about this. I will definitely give it more thought!

 

[cntran]

Can't speak from personal experience, but I've heard residency or post-residency is much more conducive to having kids than medical school (probably depending on the specialty/specific program though). Have you considered waiting an extra few years to have kids? I know you said you would like them before 30 but that might be a better option, especially if your post bacc means you would matriculate 2019, that really wouldn't be too late for kids during residency

Yeah, that is a very good point. I'm sure if I waited just another year or two, it may be more doable. I will give this more thought, thank you so much!

 

[getdown]

Can't speak from personal experience, but I've heard residency or post-residency is much more conducive to having kids than medical school (probably depending on the specialty/specific program though). Have you considered waiting an extra few years to have kids? I know you said you would like them before 30 but that might be a better option, especially if your post bacc means you would matriculate 2019, that really wouldn't be too late for kids during residency

yeah ... no. Residency would NOT be a good time to have kids or get pregnant. I know plenty of female residents who've had kids during residency. I wouldn't go so far as to say they regretted it but they found it to be harder than they thought. Not only are you going to have to make up the time you're off for maternity leave but the work doesn't magically disappear just because you're pregnant or have a baby at home. Someone's gonna have to pick up the slack for your time off and you're still responsible for all the work, training and responsibilities once you're back even if your kid is sick or you didn't get a wink of sleep last night because the baby's crying.

 

[theKingLT]

yeah ... no. Residency would NOT be a good time to have kids or get pregnant. I know plenty of female residents who've had kids during residency. I wouldn't go so far as to say they regretted it but they found it to be harder than they thought. Not only are you going to have to make up the time you're off for maternity leave but the work doesn't magically disappear just because you're pregnant or have a baby at home. Someone's gonna have to pick up the slack for your time off and you're still responsible for all the work, training and responsibilities once you're back even if your kid is sick or you didn't get a wink of sleep last night because the baby's crying.

All very good points. When would you recommend as the best time to get pregnant then?

 

[getdown]

All very good points. When would you recommend as the best time to get pregnant then?

Unfortunately, there is no "best" time. At every point of this journey (medical school, residency, fellowship, etc) will have it's own unique set of challenges and obstacles. Med school has rotations and board exams, residency is your on the job training with its own rules, fellowship the same, as an attending it's your age. It's probably the "easiest" to have kids as an attending when your time is your time and you can determine your own hours (depending on your job and group). 2nd easiest would likely be in medical school (probably during the first 2 years) since you're technically still in "school" with no real responsibilities and outside of the required activities you can technically stay home and just study and listen to lectures then. Probably a little harder during clinicals since there are expectations you have to meet in terms of pre-rounding, and being present, etc.

 

[LizzyM]

Unfortunately, there is no "best" time. At every point of this journey (medical school, residency, fellowship, etc) will have it's own unique set of challenges and obstacles. Med school has rotations and board exams, residency is your on the job training with its own rules, fellowship the same, as an attending it's your age. It's probably the "easiest" to have kids as an attending when your time is your time and you can determine your own hours (depending on your job and group). 2nd easiest would likely be in medical school (probably during the first 2 years) since you're technically still in "school" with no real responsibilities and outside of the required activities you can technically stay home and just study and listen to lectures then. Probably a little harder during clinicals since there are expectations you have to meet in terms of pre-rounding, and being present, etc.

Some schools have mandatory attendance for some learning experiences during first and second year. Active learning is a buzz word right now in curriculum design and just sitting home listening to lectures is not going to be a viable alternative. And the kid is too young for boarding school when you hit M3 so you have your clinical rotations including overnights and a toddler/pre-school child at home.... what then?

Residents and fellows seem to be timing their pregnancies to coincide with the end of training... take a couple months off before the first job and voila! At that point you have an attending salary so you can more easily afford child care. Some families find an au pair (a live in caregiver) to be a good option, particularly if work hours don't mesh well with traditional child care options.

 

[deleted804295]

Becoming a doctor is a journey just as becoming a nurse is a journey.

If you will end up going into medicine either way I recommend just going in now unless you have other strenuous circumstances.

If you want kids really badly just switch off on shifts with your husband so that he is at home when you are at work and vice versa.

 

[Goro]

All very good points. When would you recommend as the best time to get pregnant then?

When you are professor emeritus. Absent that, whenever.

 

[curbsideconsult]

When you are professor emeritus. Absent that, whenever.

Seems just about anything is possible: Woman in her 70s may be oldest ever to give birth

 

[halamadrid17]

You could either have kids now, be present for a few years, and then miss out on a good 7+ years of your kids’ lives, or you could start your training now, wait to have kids until you’re an attending and have more control over your schedule than an MS or resident would. My two cents is that medicine is a fantastic calling, though it may not provide the level of flexibility you’re looking for regarding child rearing. If you want to be a physician absolutely go for it and don’t look back, but I would at least explore the option of having kids in your 30s after your training for their sake and yours

 

[getdown]

Some schools have mandatory attendance for some learning experiences during first and second year. Active learning is a buzz word right now in curriculum design and just sitting home listening to lectures is not going to be a viable alternative. And the kid is too young for boarding school when you hit M3 so you have your clinical rotations including overnights and a toddler/pre-school child at home.... what then?

Residents and fellows seem to be timing their pregnancies to coincide with the end of training... take a couple months off before the first job and voila! At that point you have an attending salary so you can more easily afford child care. Some families find an au pair (a live in caregiver) to be a good option, particularly if work hours don't mesh well with traditional child care options.

It does seem like medical education has changed since I was last there not too long ago. Never really understood the active learning paradigm. If you're sitting at home and learning by yourself aren't you "actively learning" still vs having to be forced into a mandatory group setting to learn and teach each other. People learn differently, forcing someone who learns better at home seems counterproductive but hey, I'm not in charge of this stuff so .

Timing pregnancies at end of training is ideal and that's how we did it, but as I'm sure you're aware sometimes it doesn't always work like you want it. Plus most specialties have their boards at the end of training so that also presents a challenge if you're having morning sickness or are heavily pregnant. I had to ignore my heavily pregnant wife for nearly a whole month to study for my boards. Overall, there's never really a right time. You just gotta bite the bullet and figure out what you're willing to sacrifice.

 

[RangerBob]

My priorities really changed after the birth of our son. My wife's priorities certainly did as well (and even more).

There is a best time to get pregnant (biologically speaking)--now! As more time goes on, it does get harder to get pregnant--it took my wife and I over a year (we're in our early 30's). But otherwise I agree with others that getting pregnant in medical school would be difficult on you/your family (and probably delay graduation). Getting pregnant in residency is much more doable if you have supportive coworkers-it helps to go into a family-friendly specialty like psych or PM&R (both have better hours than most others), or go into one where they're very supportive of families like family medicine/peds (they love babies!).

You should think about what your priority is--having a big family or going into medicine. It is certainly not impossible to do both, but it may be extremely difficult to do both well if your husband works full-time or you don't have a ton of family support (think "Full/Fuller House" help). If you go into medicine before having kids, you may end up regretting not having kids sooner (my wife isn't in medicine, and is now a stay at home mom, and we wish we had started sooner). You may also end up deciding you can only support (emotionally) a smaller family, and only have 1-2 kids.

If you have kids first (especially if you have 4), I think the odds of going into medicine later in life are very low unless your husband stays at home. I can't imagine doing all the work of med school/residency if I had 3-4 kids in elementary school. I would want to spend time with them at home. There's just so much I'd miss out on from class/studying and then residency demands. But you have to ask if you're always going to regret "giving up on your dreams" if you don't go into medicine.

It's certainly doable, but you just have to think about what your priorities in life are, and if any of them can be altered/delayed to accommodate for some of your other hopes/dreams. What are you going to look back at when you're 80 years old and be proud of? What would you regret? That was certainly part of my motivation to become a physician-I wanted a job I felt more meaning from. But I can tell you I'm going to be thinking more fondly about my memories with my wife and son (and any future kids) than my job (which I also really like!)

 

[theKingLT]

Residents and fellows seem to be timing their pregnancies to coincide with the end of training... take a couple months off before the first job and voila! At that point you have an attending salary so you can more easily afford child care. Some families find an au pair (a live in caregiver) to be a good option, particularly if work hours don't mesh well with traditional child care options.

I would worry so much on getting it timed right if i were trying that strategy! How much time off would you say is too much time off. For instance if you just finished residency would a year off before starting working be disadvantageous to 2 months?

 

[deleted804295]

I think it's also a discussion worth having with your parents if both were full time workers.

I asked my dad the other day of how him and my mom were able to work full time and simultaneously take care of us and I learned that he was actually the one who raised me in infancy while my mom worked day shifts. He would get peaceful sleep at night with second shifts while my mom took care of me through the night.

It's all possible with a supportive partner. I know for us women it's extra stressful since we have the stigma of having to do all the child rearing but have these conversations with your parents and husband!

 

[LizzyM]

.

I would worry so much on getting it timed right if i were trying that strategy! How much time off would you say is too much time off. For instance if you just finished residency would a year off before starting working be disadvantageous to 2 months?

I'm not a physician so I don't know how hard it is to be hired after a year out of the workforce. I imagine that it might depend on geography and specialty both of which are unknown now but which you'd have figured out the year before residency ends. (unless you are totally open to relocating anywhere).

 

[doc05]

Hello everyone,

This is a bit of a long dilemma, (thank you so much for reading) but I've been agonizing over it for a very long while now and would really appreciate any advice or insight anyone has to offer.

I'm a female in my mid-20s, and I find that it's as important for me to be an active mom as it is a physician. My dilemma is that I currently have an opportunity to go to a post-baccalaureate program for medical school, but I'm not sure if I want to take it just yet or put off medical school for later on in the future. I want to have start having kids before I'm 30-years-old, aim for a decent-sized family with around 3-4 kids, and I also think one of the most important times to be most present in their lives is when they're young before grade-school age.

A possibility my fiance and I considered was, I could go into nursing first so that I can allocate more time on being present during the earlier years' of our kids lives (nurses can work 3 12-hour shifts a week and their schedule is super flexible), and around when I'm in my mid-30s, they'll be in grade school, my then-husband will be settled in his job as PA, and he would be willing to move, work, and take care of our kids and finances while I'm in medical school. I guess I'm just concerned that if I have kids DURING medical school (which would ideally be between MS3MS4), it can largely affect my performance and I'll miss out on a good portion of the earlier years of my kids. Not just that, but my then-husband will barely be a PA when Im in MS3/MS4, and me dumping a newborn/toddler on him while I go off into residency and am essentially barely home sounds rather intimidating. A few of my physician-mentors warned me about how difficult it was to balance time for a baby during medical school and residency, but I'm hoping that maybe it can still be done or if I would have a lot of regrets.

Is this a viable idea? To sum up: I'd reject my post-bacc offer, become a nurse first, have my kids and be more present in the earlier years of their lives, wait until they're in grade school and my husband to be settled as PA, and THEN pursue medical school when I'm like 32 or 33.

OR,

1) Is there something I'm missing where I can actually be both a good mom and a good student during medical school?
2) Are medical schools really supportive of maternity leave? If so, what kind of programs did they offer?
3) If you took a year off during medical school to have a child, how was your experience with that and would you recommend it?
4) Do you know a lot of women who were able to balance a good amount of time left with their families while performing well in medical school?

I also considered working part-time once I finally finish medical school and residency, but I'm not sure how common that is or what the pros/cons are other than the obvious.

Thank you so much, I know I just threw out a bunch of concerns all at once, but I'm just stressed beyond believe. Please let me know your insight.

Wow, you are very ambitious. Here's the truth, and I know you don't want to hear it...

1. You can't have it all. Sure, there are many stories of women docs raising several kids, being around for them, and also developing successful medical careers. But that's the exception. Be realistic about your goals, because you're human.
2. Going into nursing as a stepping stone for medicine is a bad bad idea. Not only does it do a disservice to the nursing field, but frankly, most adcoms don't look favorably of RN applicants to med school, for various reasons.
3. Have your kids before med school or after, it's up to you, nobody really cares. Just keep in mind that if you have 3-4 kids, then wait for them to get to school age, then go to med school, youll be old and tired and your priorities may change to the point where starting med school doesn't actually happen (not to mention the costs involved, you'll be in debt forever).

 

[cntran]

My priorities really changed after the birth of our son. My wife's priorities certainly did as well (and even more).

There is a best time to get pregnant (biologically speaking)--now! As more time goes on, it does get harder to get pregnant--it took my wife and I over a year (we're in our early 30's). But otherwise I agree with others that getting pregnant in medical school would be difficult on you/your family (and probably delay graduation). Getting pregnant in residency is much more doable if you have supportive coworkers-it helps to go into a family-friendly specialty like psych or PM&R (both have better hours than most others), or go into one where they're very supportive of families like family medicine/peds (they love babies!).

You should think about what your priority is--having a big family or going into medicine. It is certainly not impossible to do both, but it may be extremely difficult to do both well if your husband works full-time or you don't have a ton of family support (think "Full/Fuller House" help). If you go into medicine before having kids, you may end up regretting not having kids sooner (my wife isn't in medicine, and is now a stay at home mom, and we wish we had started sooner). You may also end up deciding you can only support (emotionally) a smaller family, and only have 1-2 kids.

If you have kids first (especially if you have 4), I think the odds of going into medicine later in life are very low unless your husband stays at home. I can't imagine doing all the work of med school/residency if I had 3-4 kids in elementary school. I would want to spend time with them at home. There's just so much I'd miss out on from class/studying and then residency demands. But you have to ask if you're always going to regret "giving up on your dreams" if you don't go into medicine.

It's certainly doable, but you just have to think about what your priorities in life are, and if any of them can be altered/delayed to accommodate for some of your other hopes/dreams. What are you going to look back at when you're 80 years old and be proud of? What would you regret? That was certainly part of my motivation to become a physician-I wanted a job I felt more meaning from. But I can tell you I'm going to be thinking more fondly about my memories with my wife and son (and any future kids) than my job (which I also really like!)

I really really appreciate your contribution to this thread. Your last bit really made me think through a lot from another perspective (hopefully I live long enough to be 80 or more haha). Thank you so much!

 

[cntran]

Some schools have mandatory attendance for some learning experiences during first and second year. Active learning is a buzz word right now in curriculum design and just sitting home listening to lectures is not going to be a viable alternative. And the kid is too young for boarding school when you hit M3 so you have your clinical rotations including overnights and a toddler/pre-school child at home.... what then?

Residents and fellows seem to be timing their pregnancies to coincide with the end of training... take a couple months off before the first job and voila! At that point you have an attending salary so you can more easily afford child care. Some families find an au pair (a live in caregiver) to be a good option, particularly if work hours don't mesh well with traditional child care options.

I'll definitely consider this. Thank you!

 

[cntran]

I think it's also a discussion worth having with your parents if both were full time workers.

I asked my dad the other day of how him and my mom were able to work full time and simultaneously take care of us and I learned that he was actually the one who raised me in infancy while my mom worked day shifts. He would get peaceful sleep at night with second shifts while my mom took care of me through the night.

It's all possible with a supportive partner. I know for us women it's extra stressful since we have the stigma of having to do all the child rearing but have these conversations with your parents and husband!

Will do, thank you! I'm hoping that if I go through with the postbacc, I can get into medical school closer to where my parents are and have their support. Of course, that's just the hope, but I'll see where life takes me. Your parents sound badass haha

 

[cntran]

Wow, you are very ambitious. Here's the truth, and I know you don't want to hear it...

1. You can't have it all. Sure, there are many stories of women docs raising several kids, being around for them, and also developing successful medical careers. But that's the exception. Be realistic about your goals, because you're human.
2. Going into nursing as a stepping stone for medicine is a bad bad idea. Not only does it do a disservice to the nursing field, but frankly, most adcoms don't look favorably of RN applicants to med school, for various reasons.
3. Have your kids before med school or after, it's up to you, nobody really cares. Just keep in mind that if you have 3-4 kids, then wait for them to get to school age, then go to med school, youll be old and tired and your priorities may change to the point where starting med school doesn't actually happen (not to mention the costs involved, you'll be in debt forever).

Yeah, you're right. Initially, I didn't see being an RN as a stepping stone, but I can definitely see how it comes across that way. I just want to express again that I have a lot of respect for nurses. I was initially drawn to the idea of being an RN because of the schedule flexibility and that RNs are also in healthcare, and that they can still make a great difference in people's lives.

I also recently looked more into RNs who went into medical school, and I was kind of surprised adcoms don't look favorably on RNs for medical school. I thought the experience in healthcare would be ideal, but it seems not every medical school agrees. Something to do with the nursing model vs the medical model, I heard, but I'm not too sure what that means. Can you please elaborate more on this?

 

[PTPoeny]

I had a co resident who took a year off of medical school with each of her two children, so that is an option especially going into more family friendly specialties. Probably not going to go over well if you are gunning for a surgical sub-specialty.

Fourth year of medical school was definitely the best time to have a baby at my medical school, but will definitely vary by school. We had two months of vacation and a couple of electives that expecting mothers could complete most of the requirements for ahead of time.

Babies in residency are incredibly common in many specialties (think Peds, family, ob). Families have babies in residency because it works. Making up time depends on your specialty board and your program's interpretation of the rules.

Babies as an attending is not necessarily as easy as some have made it sound. If you are in private practice if you aren't working you aren't mashing any money.

What about your husband staying home for a while? Is that an option?

 

[deleted480308]

I'm just not fond if the idea of practicing as nurse just to use it as a stepping stone to attempt to get into medical school. The profession deserves more than that.

A bachelors degree is a stepping stone to a medical degree, quite literally. Even a nursing one, nothing sacred about it.

Wow, you are very ambitious. Here's the truth, and I know you don't want to hear it...

1. You can't have it all. Sure, there are many stories of women docs raising several kids, being around for them, and also developing successful medical careers. But that's the exception. Be realistic about your goals, because you're human.
2. Going into nursing as a stepping stone for medicine is a bad bad idea. Not only does it do a disservice to the nursing field, but frankly, most adcoms don't look favorably of RN applicants to med school, for various reasons.
3. Have your kids before med school or after, it's up to you, nobody really cares. Just keep in mind that if you have 3-4 kids, then wait for them to get to school age, then go to med school, youll be old and tired and your priorities may change to the point where starting med school doesn't actually happen (not to mention the costs involved, you'll be in debt forever).

I’m not convinced #2 is true.


I pretty much agree with 1,3

 

[DrHubby]

I can contribute a few thoughts on this. I will be starting M1 this summer at 38 with a 2 year old, a failing marriage, and a six hour move. Nothing in life is guaranteed. I never imagined this is where I’d be. I had a plan! But plans change, relationships end, babies happen- or dont happen- all of it is unknown. You may get pregnant right away, or you may miscarry several times or need fertility help. Don’t wait! Pursue your dreams with unwavering passion! Love to the deepest depths and be vulnerable and speak your truth. Have babies and go to medical school and it will all come together just the way it’s meant to. At least thats what I’m telling myself.

 

[medstar11]

A few months old but I will also contribute a few thoughts to this thread! I am an OMS-3 and currently in rotations and pregnant my first child. We tried to plan to have our first between second and third year after I had taken COMLEX but in all honesty sometimes it takes way longer to have kids than you originally plan. Right now my school is extremely supportive and my preceptors have been super supportive as well. I will get 6 weeks off without having to extend graduation or make up anytime down the line. It is definitely possible to have kids in medical school but definitely find out if your school is supportive of the idea or not. There are multiple men and women in my class who have had kids in the last 2 years and I do not believe any of them except 1 had to take any time off and repeat. It is not an easy road but it will be worth it in the end. Definitely make sure your husband is also very supportive of the idea. Mine knows that with rotations my time is not my own so he will be doing the bulk of the work on my last busy rotation after baby is born in inpatient internal medicine when I will be at the hospital for 12 hours a day. Thankfully timing worked out well so my core rotations will be finished 2 months after returning to rotations and then some elective time before 4th year starts. 4th year is so much more flexible but we did not want to wait. I am currently 25 and he is 27. We also want at least 3-4 kids and would like to be done having kids before 35. PM me if you have any questions!

 

[grateful_phys]

Why don't you do medical school now and have kids later when you are 32?

 

[hmockingbird]

I'm in peds, which is as family-friendly as medicine can get, so maybe I have a different perspective. But I think it is more possible to have kids in medicine as a woman than people may assume. I know tons of women physicians who have kids, some who took time off and some who didn't. In residency you can definitely strategically schedule your vacation time and electives to graduate on time (I also know people who graduated a few months off-schedule which especially doesn't matter if you are not doing fellowship). I imagine in some other fields they may not be as flexible but I am not sure. I also know people who had kids in medical school and some took time off and some didn't. That being said it's not without struggle, there are some harder rotations in residency for example during which you may not see your kids as much, but then there are lighter ones where you have essentially normal work hours. I also know a lot of people who work part-time/locums/etc.

I honestly think the bigger issue here though is what do you want from a career. You say that you want to help people in healthcare and want flexibility. That's not specific to medicine or nursing. What role do you want on the healthcare team? Why medicine? Nursing is an entirely different field from medicine and I imagine an accelerated program would be pretty intense given that you are completing a 4-year degree (including clinicals which I'm sure can have odd/long hours depending on your luck) in 1-2 years. So I would give that some thought before committing just because it's a "flexible" career. PA would also have you complete a degree and be able to practice medicine in a somewhat similar way to a physician in a shorter amount of time with some flexibility (such as in switching specialties, and many PAs work more "normal" hours than physicians). Yes, you can always go back, but you have an acceptance in hand now... Maybe some shadowing of other healthcare careers in order? There are soooo many other options out there besides nursing, PA and physician as well. You don't have to answer in the thread but just some things to think about. Another thing is that priorities change throughout our lives. It's ok, for example, to give up a childhood dream because something new fulfils you. At the same time, if you really/ONLY want to be a physician than there are ways to make it work, don't let fear hold you back.