Best Careers 2009 good and bad.....

Discussion in 'Pharmacy' started by Nemo777, Dec 12, 2008.

  1. Nemo777

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    http://www.usnews.com/articles/business/best-careers/2008/12/11/best-careers-2009-pharmacist.html


    Overview.With patient access to physicians getting costlier and more scarce, pharmacists are stepping into the role of caregiver. They spend less time filling prescriptions (now largely delegated to assistants) and more time on the front lines: teaching diabetic patients how to inject insulin, helping hypertension patients manage their blood pressure, dispensing advice on which over-the-counter medication to use. One of a pharmacist's most important jobs is ensuring that patients can safely take multiple drugs together—interactions can be deadly.
    [​IMG]

    Related News

    The jobs aren't all at the local drugstore. One fourth of pharmacists work in hospitals. Others work for pharmaceutical companies on new drug development—for example, in pharmacogenomics, custom designing drugs to work with an individual's genome. Just as cutting edge, if scarier: Pharmacists will also be key players in conducting mass immunizations and treatments in response to epidemics and bioterrorism.
    Good news and bad news on the job market: The good news is that current demand is strong and that more pharmacy schools are opening, which will make it easier for you to get in. The bad news is that those new schools will be pumping out lots of new graduates, which will make it harder to land a job.
    A Day in the Life.As a hospital pharmacist, you start your day as part of a team doing rounds, advising doctors, nurses, and patients about various drugs, especially side effects and interaction risks when combined with other drugs. Next, it's on to the hospital pharmacy, where you fill physicians' orders for intravenous and other prescriptions. Your top priority is to monitor patient records for potential side effects and unwanted interactions with other drugs. You also counsel patients about to be discharged, explaining how to take medications, watch for side effects, and use durable medical devices such as wheelchairs and breathing aids.
    Smart Specialty

    Research pharmacist. Drug research teams working on new medications for cancer, depression, and other diseases often include a pharmacist, to assist in understanding compounds' effects on the body. Unlike retail and hospital pharmacists, research pharmacists rarely need to work nights or weekends. Plus, you're involved in the important work of creating new drugs.
    Salary Data

    Median (with eight years in the field): $103,000
    25th to 75th percentile (with eight or more years of experience): $93,300-$118,000
    (Data provided by PayScale.com)
    Training

    Two or three years of undergraduate education plus a four-year doctor of pharmacy degree are required.
    The American Association of Colleges of Pharmacy publishes links to all accredited pharmacy schools.
    U.S. News rankings of pharmacy schools
    Learn More

     
  2. psurocks

    psurocks Junior Member
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    this caregiver role is overrated, its pharmacist who are doctor wannabes who cant hack it in med school

    -the nurse at the endocrinologist office teaches them how to shoot insulin
    -htn management? i think PCPs do that well enough
    -OTC meds? its real simple, look at the OTC thread, its only a few meds to give depending on condition
    -no qualms bout the interactions part
    -and that part about pharmacist counselin on hospital discharge, completely overrated, most of the time its the nurses that do it
     
  3. songaila

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    Yes, that is a good point.

    I am not too sure about all the doom and gloom shortage talk. Even the automation is true, pharmacists can still take more of a clinical role.

    Big cities are tough for any health care jobs. In my neck of woods, there are literally 10 dentists in one block. However, that does not mean there is no shortage of dentists.

    I see all the old farts getting older and the health care professionals getting retired in bunches. I don't understand all the doom and gloom talks.
     
  4. Aznfarmerboi

    Aznfarmerboi Senior Member
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    I like this quote from it. . .

    Good news and bad news on the job market: The good news is that current demand is strong and that more pharmacy schools are opening, which will make it easier for you to get in. The bad news is that those new schools will be pumping out lots of new graduates, which will make it harder to land a job.

    lol
     
  5. janeno

    janeno Senior Member
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    The pharmacist that I work with is heavily involved in diabetes education of patients. Plus, he also does immunizations. So I do believe that pharmacist can play a very active role in patient health care.

    I have also met pharmacists who counsel on discharge meds in hospitals.

    So pharmacists can do all of these things. I don't think you need to want to be a doctor wannabe because the doctors diagnose and choose the treatment while pharmacists can make sure the appropriate treatment has been chosen and educate patients on drugs. Certain physician have comfort level with a limited amount of drugs; pharmacists should have comfort level with variety of drugs. It's just some pharmacists choose not to be involved in patient care.
     
  6. psurocks

    psurocks Junior Member
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    -immunizations yea thats ok, its a big $$ maker for anyone who does it
    -diabetes education, again, i guess it depends on area and stuff, but the people in my area dont care (no wonder the wound clinics are packed with diabetics in my area)
    -discharge education probably depends on hospital, i did 18 weeks of rotation in hospitals, and hardly saw any counseling from the pharmacists (Except coumadin counseling, which is overrated in its own way)
    -specialists know more bout their meds than anyone else, so all those meds prescribed by specialists there is no reason for a pharmacist to be doing anything therapy wise (other than renal adjustment) (for xample, no one knows more bout seizure meds than neuro mds, so im not gonna question their decision)
    -i just love it when pharmacists are walking around with stethoscopes around their necks, im like what in the world are you doing? just pretending to act like mds...
     
  7. janeno

    janeno Senior Member
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    I am just curious what is your opinion of clinical specialist pharmacists? For example, oncology, critical care, infectious disease pharmacists, do they know less than MDs? Why would hospitals want to hire them then?
     
  8. psurocks

    psurocks Junior Member
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    i understand and support ID pharmacists, simply b/c 70% of PCP dont have any understanding of Abx

    and yes, pharmD cannot be compared to a md specialist, md specialists have far more training and experience
     
  9. maliciousdoc

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    What's with all the hypes with pharmacist taking on roles of MD's? You silly people, just do what you do best. After all, it's just a job. If you think MD's roles are better then you should go to medical school.
     
  10. Aznfarmerboi

    Aznfarmerboi Senior Member
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    Really. . . you saw pharmacists wearing stethoscopes?
     
  11. psurocks

    psurocks Junior Member
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    yep, the ID specialists, to check lungs for crackles or wheezes for CAP cases ...they think they are hot shots cuz theyve done a residency

    (also use it when checkin BP)
     
  12. Garfield3d

    Garfield3d An Orange Cat
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    Er, is it quite possible that they have a stethoscope because they will be using it?

    --Garfield3d
     
  13. psurocks

    psurocks Junior Member
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    huh?
     
  14. psurocks

    psurocks Junior Member
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    no...being a pharmacist is a job, being a md is a way of life...after my 8-4 shift, im done....too bad a doc isnt, at any time, any of his/her pts in practice can call em (or at least make an attempt to get a hold of em), 3 am calls from the hospital when on call, etc

    and i love being a pharmacist, i just dont like some of these pharmacists who act out of their league
     
  15. WVUPharm2007

    WVUPharm2007 imagine sisyphus happy
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    Overrated Career: Physician 2009
    By Marty Nemko
    Posted December 11, 2008

    The Appeal: You get to help keep people healthy and cure them when they're sick. Prestige is high, and so is the pay.

    The Reality: Fewer and fewer patients see their physicians as godlike, especially those who go online for medical information. Doctors are spending less time than ever with patients and more on paperwork. Insurers keep hacking away at physician costs. And it seems increasingly more likely that physician pay will decline as part of healthcare reform. Also, their workload will more likely increase as the existing cadre of physicians may be required to care for the 47 million currently uninsured people in the United States.
    Related News

    * Best Careers 2009
    * Overrated Careers
    * Ahead-of-the-Curve Careers
    * 11 Best-Kept-Secret Careers

    And those are just the new problems. This career has long had other liabilities. The training spans more than a decade, including four years of science-heavy college coursework, four demanding, expensive (often $200,000) years of medical school, followed by an internship year of 90-plus hours a week, and capped by a few years of residency. After completing all that, there's usually the ongoing stress of managing your office, trying to care for noncompliant patients, giving unsuspecting patients bad news, and seeing some get sicker and die.

    So it's not surprising that, according to a recent survey of primary care physicians by the Physicians Foundation, 49% of the 12,000 respondents said they would seriously consider leaving medicine within the next three years if they had an alternative.

    An Alternative: Physician Assistant
    ---------------------------------------

    Heh.
     
  16. CorduroyGlance

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    Heh him...

    [​IMG]

    DeBakey. Physician Assistant my ass.
     
  17. confettiflyer

    confettiflyer Did you just say something?
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    random picture of old dude.......grrreat :eyebrow:
     
  18. CorduroyGlance

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    Or not.
     
  19. aboveliquidice

    aboveliquidice No sacrifice - No victory
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    We ALL have stethoscopes at my school... We use them to take blood pressure. I have used mine at the pharmacy - talking with patients waiting to have their number called. Sit there, talk with them, and give them a BP reading.

    Somehow I'm pretty sure BP is within my scope of practice.

    You can always tell the slightly older people when you read things like this.

    I see my responsibilities expanding - and get excited. You see the same changes - but instead post the misinformation seen above.

    And don't refer to physicians as doc... That's what you call a Corpsmen.

    ~above~
     
  20. IamMDMBA

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    Of course, when you actually read the "comments" section posted almost exclusively by MD's, almost every one of them is overjoyed to be in Medicine. Now read the "comments" section under pharmacy....ooops..immediate bickering on how pharmacy sucks.
    Heh......
    My theory on those who bash medicine....jealousy...plain and simple, those who can't, bash.:laugh:
     
  21. WVUPharm2007

    WVUPharm2007 imagine sisyphus happy
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    Lol...like medicine is actually that elite of an occupation to get into. Give me a break. I just posted it because I thought it was funny. You're logic above is also quite comforting. It's great that a future physician is willing to allow anecdotal evidence trump the result of an actual study involving thousands of samples. It means I'll always have a job thanks to my "intellectual superiors" that are too ******ed to figure out that the Xopenex drug rep is a huckster. :laugh:
     
  22. bigpharmD

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    Completely not true. Read some of the comments sections of some of the New York Times stories on MDs. I dont think you will find many of them that are overjoyed to be MDs.
     
  23. ItsOverZyvox

    ItsOverZyvox Retired
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    I read "Best Cameras" of 2009.. oh shucks..
     
  24. bigpharmD

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    Are these MD wannabes??
    http://www.csmc.edu/12194.html
    http://bethesdatrials.cancer.gov/investigator-profiles/figg/default.aspx
    http://www.mad-id.com/rybakbio.htm
    http://www.fda.gov/commissionersfellowships/marcarelli_bio.html
    http://cancer.iu.edu/patients/support/complete_life/oncPharm.php

    or you could strive to be this guy and be MDMBAs boss in a few years as he works 80 hours a week listening to people yell at him for narcs, nurses paging him every 5 minutes, and pharmacists asking to switch lisinopril to ramipril due to formulary
    http://www.stjude.org/evans

    NOTICE that all of these people have done further training wether it be residency, fellowship, or education. Yeah an oncologist may be an expert on drugs used in cancer, but that doesnt mean they always do it right or look at the whole picture. Just go to MD anderson, the best onc hospital in the country and you will not find one MD that will go on rounds before the pharmacist is there. If you want to work at CVS that is fine, but dont hate on people that further their education, and strive to do something else.
     
  25. psurocks

    psurocks Junior Member
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    -uhhh, im not even 25 yet, nice try thou
    -and wats a pharmd supposed to do if he sees a high bp reading, administer nitrusprusside and save the day? :rolleyes:
    -there are so many factors that could lead to high bp, i cant comment on it unless i have the pts medical chart in front of me
    -i cant even tell them anything bout their diet cuz i dont know what the md told them
    -let pcp take care of the bp, while 70% of pcp know nothing bout Abx, i think they can handle bp readings
     
  26. meister

    meister Senior Member
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    It's actually a big money loser. Most of the time insurance companies don't reimburse enough to cover the cost.

    These articles always say a career as a physician is overrated, and as far as I'm concerned that's fine. The thing is, they actually mean a primary care physician is overrated. Because I'm pretty sure if you ask any radiologist, pathologist, plastic surgeon, orthopedic surgeon, dermatologist, or any number of other specialties, they're doing pretty damn well. And the survey that's cited in the article has a horrible amount of sampling error going on anyway.

    No person knowledgeable about healthcare would say that being a pharmacist is ****ing awesome while simultaneously saying being a physician is overrated. They both have their pluses and minuses, but it is not even close to being so black and white.

    And it's no big secret that a lot of PharmD graduates are MD wannabes, I don't know why people get so offended at the prospect. That doesn't say so much about pharmacy as a career as it does about the person who went into pharmacy even though they really wanted to go into medicine.

    And the same article says being an RN is a great job? LOL There's more burnout in nursing than anything else, that's for sure.
     
  27. janeno

    janeno Senior Member
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    As I said before, some people choose to be more involved in patient care than others. This does not mean that they are MD wannabes. Doing BP and diabetes screenings, and providing patient education does not put you anywhere close to being an MD. Nurses and PA, who have much less education than doctors and pharmacists, are capable of performing all these screening and plus prescribing, yet pharmacists still cannot do (meaning prescribing) that even though we are considered drug experts and we have an extensive education. I personally don't see anything wrong with having stethoscope. Some pharmacists want to be involved in direct patient care, and it is great to have this option if you decide to pursue it.

    Instead of point fingers at people and saying you are an MDwannabe, we should work together to expand the scope of our practice. Today, you might not want to be involved in BP and diabetes screenings, but maybe in few years you would want to change your work setting, and having an option of being involved in extended direct patient care is always a plus.
     
  28. psurocks

    psurocks Junior Member
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    so true

    i didnt go into medicine cuz i didnt want a pager after 5, and i love pharmacy, but i know my limits, which im afraid some of my colleagues dont and overstep
     
  29. RxWildcat

    RxWildcat Julius Randle BEASTMODE!
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    Now meister, I like you and your posts, you are usually very fair and balanced. The truth is that there are some individuals in pharmacy that desired to go into medicine instead, however to say that there are "a lot" would be very far from the truth. I can't think of anyone in my class or school for that matter that tried to pursue medicine, failed, and then pursued pharmacy. I have had friends from undergrad who struggled to get into med school and most of them looked to the DO option and didn't even consider pharmacy (they eventually got in to an MD program but I'm not even going to start a MD/DO debate). I understand why you'd get frustrated with an article that's bashing medicine saying its a crappy career. We all know the article doesn't really mean anything. And to psu, for someone who says they love pharmacy you sure seem reluctant to adopt any direct patient care activities. Just because someone does something outside the stereotypical pharmacist job does not make them s "MD wannabe"
     
  30. meister

    meister Senior Member
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    Fair enough, my characterization of there being "a lot" of them is probably a bit off. But I've met a couple, so I know they exist. But in no way was I criticizing pharmacy or anything like that.

    And while it is slightly annoying that articles like this exist, I just have to remind myself that they have nursing as a great career and took dentistry off. I don't know what their deal is, but have you met an extremely happy nurse? I don't think I ever have. While it is a high paying and highly valued job, there aren't too many jobs that are as stressful, generally speaking.

    Oh well.
     
  31. willxm

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    Wow... since when is coumadin counseling over rated? Sure patient #1 take this coumadin home and take 1 tablet every day, no problems. Don't worry about that blood in your urine or stool.. completely normal. Don't worry about starting a new medication, coumadin is only an NTI drug and most likely won't cause your INR to fluctuate.

    Coumadin counseling works. Try telling an uneducated patient he has to come in for labs every 28 days because you say so, not going to happen. The thing with coumadin therapy is that you cant watch every patient all the time. They have to be able to identify potential situations where there INR can become out of whack, how to respond to bleeding/stroke. The more they understand about their disease state, need for coumadin, INR goals, what can cause INR fluctuations the safer they will be. At the VA that I am working for has a pharmacist run coumadin clinic where they service about 100 patients a day. They have data to prove that their counseling dramatically decreases the number of coumadin related ER visits.

    I guess my beef is that a lot of people respond to pharmacist involvement as "why do we need a pharmacist to do this or that, we already do a good enough job". But 15 minutes later you can hear the same healthcare professional complain how the facility is understaffed and they are overworked. Meanwhile you hear on the news that US healthcare is falling behind. There is plenty of work to go around... each healthcare field has its strong points. Nobody is the total package, even if they feel they are.
     
  32. Aznfarmerboi

    Aznfarmerboi Senior Member
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    While I agree with you most of the times, I disagree with you that a lot of us wants to be MD. The majority of my class are fine being a pharmacist. They do not want to be physicians. I chose a 6 year phamD program over a 7 year DO program because I dont think I will make a good physician and want nowhere the responsibility that they have.
     
  33. ItsOverZyvox

    ItsOverZyvox Retired
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    puleez.. how pathetic and badly do y'all suffer from inferiority complex to argue online about which profession is better? Give it a rest..

    All of you.

    aight..so I'm guilty of bashing retail but that's different.. :smuggrin:

    btw,

    Happy Holidays! :love:
     
  34. meister

    meister Senior Member
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    Yeah I was wrong to say that there are "a lot" of those types, my bad. Didn't mean to make the turf war any worse.
     
  35. SpirivaSunrise

    SpirivaSunrise Go Gators!
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    What they recommend for a P&S?
     
  36. SpirivaSunrise

    SpirivaSunrise Go Gators!
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    You too!
     
  37. aboveliquidice

    aboveliquidice No sacrifice - No victory
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    My fault - you simply post like a 30 yr washout...

    The point isn't to diagnose - It's to inform. There are untold benefits to doing this - most revolving around patient-care giver relationship.

    You are delinquent as a pharmacist if you do not discuss diet with diabetic patients or those taking statins. How in the world can you be 1 or 2 years out from school and already lost your passion for health care (doesn't that take longer)?

    It doesn't seem like you are up for this whole "patient care" thing - Hospital basement jobs (with limited nursing interruptions) were practically invented for you.

    You may indeed be a decent pharmacist - but your "I can't, I won't" attitude betrays a piss-poor attitude. One best not representing our profession to the public.

    meh - odds are you have been doing retail for awhile... Change it up - You may yet find your passion.

    ~above~
     
  38. Ross434

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    a person's career doesnt have to be their passion, you know. that's why pharmacy is so nice with having so many part time jobs.
     
  39. aboveliquidice

    aboveliquidice No sacrifice - No victory
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    Fair enough... I am definitely an idealist...

    :confused: A better question would be why choose a career that has nothing to do with your interest? Its on par with marrying a woman for her looks, buying a book for its cover, etc.

    You only have one life - don't waste it doing something you aren't interested in doing.

    ~above~
     
  40. girllein

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    What? The number of hours a person works has nothing to do with their passion for working in a pharmacy.

    What if they're lazy, addicted to Oprah, tied down, always pregnant like Angelina Jolie, sickly, irritated and sick of anal DOPs, tired of getting nasty looking veins from standing up all day, obsessed with Dungeons and Dragons, suffering from multiple personality disorder (MPD), rotting in a prison, planning a trip to the moon, allergic to old person breath, too smart to count by five, learning how to speak Brazilero for the FBI or CIA, trying to avoid their ex wife, actively serving in the military, secretly leading a double life as a gigalo, in cahoots with the mafia, training to run a marathon, or trying to save the world?

    If the number of hours a person works directly related to their passion for working in a pharmacy, then the most passionate pre-pharmacy students would be the ones who work an average of 168 hours per week.
     
  41. girllein

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    A person can have multiple passions like pharmacy and telling children that Santa Claus isn't real.
     
  42. psurocks

    psurocks Junior Member
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    typical SE stuff that i hear nurses saying upon discharge, my beef with counseling comes with the diet with the leafy vegies, where i cant tell them anything cuz i dont know what their md told em on it
     
    #42 psurocks, Dec 13, 2008
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2008
  43. psurocks

    psurocks Junior Member
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    once again you assume things with no basis to back it up...my passion for is as strong as ever (last week i refused to change avelox CAP rx (too xpensive for pt paying cash) to cipro as the md wanted to, and made him go with doxy....if i didnt care, i wouldve gone ahead and filled it for cipro, right?:rolleyes:)

    ---> youre making a false assumption thinkin i dont care about patients just b/c i think other pharmacists are overstepping the line

    i can tell them all about diet stuff, but it could go against what their md wanted them to do, so im in no position to make recommendations since i dont have 100% info on pt

    a delinquent? i thought we are professionals, nice job resorting to deragtory adjectives :rolleyes:
     
  44. girllein

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    What's so hard about asking them to relay what their doctor recommended? You're not trying to make an atom bomb or anything. You don't have to know for sure, 100%, that it's this or that quantity of this, that, and the other leafy greens.

    They might just want some reassurance from you. :idea:
     
  45. psurocks

    psurocks Junior Member
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    plus coumadin clinics will be gone if Xarelto gets approved :thumbup:
     
  46. psurocks

    psurocks Junior Member
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    ummm, i think its fair to assume most patients cant recall what their md tells em, especially these older folks....and trust me, ive asked 100s, simple answer "ahh i cant recall" or "ahh i dont remember"
     
  47. psurocks

    psurocks Junior Member
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    this is the inferiority complex i see with these new pharmds coming out, and then when they do residencies they think they are some hot shots
     
  48. girllein

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    Operating by the lowest common denominator, huh? As always, it depends on the patient.
     
  49. girllein

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    but they're really just poor.
     
  50. psurocks

    psurocks Junior Member
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    its actually called operating by reality...real world experience, nothing beats it
     

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