Best med schools to apply for MSTP programs as a URM

[darkdude]

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Hi y'all!

I posted a version of this on the Pre-MD forum but I was wondering if anyone could tell me what's the best med schools to apply for MSTP programs as a URM? I know I could look up stats and all that but was wondering if any of you other URMs could share your experiences as far as the schools that made you feel most comfortable as well as the level of support the med schools provided to URMs.

Peace.

 

[darkdude]

Yo'all, waasup? No responses? Quiet crowd....

K, how about this then....I know that MD programs tend to be more receptive to URMs but what about MD/PHd programs? Judging from the small percentage of URM MSTPs I've heard, would you agree that MD/Phd programs are not as receptive to URMs compared to MD only programs?

Peace.

 

[pathdr2b]

Originally posted by darkdude
Yo'all, waasup? No responses? Quiet crowd....

K, how about this then....I know that MD programs tend to be more receptive to URMs but what about MD/PHd programs? Judging from the small percentage of URM MSTPs I've heard, would you agree that MD/Phd programs are not as receptive to URMs compared to MD only programs?

Peace.

I didn't respond because I had to think about this one.

First MD/PhD is a different situation entirely. The schools I listed for the MD only question I wouldn't necessarily list here.

At this level of the game it's more about finding a PI for the PhD portion of the program that believes in you and will support you for the entire length of the program. And by support I mean emotionally more than academically. A person like this can be found at any school.

So it's for this reason that I think URM's should only apply to schools where they have already identified PI's that are willing to mentor them and guide their career. However, this doesn't mean that you have to have very strong idea about what area of research you want to pursue( although this helps). For example, before I matriculated at UNC-Chaple Hill's Chemistry department I met with a person in the minority recruitment offfice of the graduate school to find out which PI's in that department supported minority students but most importantly graduated them in a timely fashion. He gave me a list of about 5 PI's and I set up meetings with all of them right after I was admitted to
the department. Needless to say, this worked out extremely well and over the past year or so I've essentially done the same thing with the schools on my list now. The key is to start with the minority office of the schools on your list. They'll be able to tell you which professors have been receptive to minority students.

Finally, PI does not always equal mentor and it's a problem to discover this after you've already matriculated into a program. That's why research into the professors at the schools you're interested in is so very important in my opinion.

 

[bailey39]

I think I'd be able to better answer this question if you elaborated on what you mean by "best." Do you want the highest URM% of students, the schools that are recruiting the most, the schools that serve (patient population) the highest % of URMs, or other.

Path has some great ideas. I didn't look to specific offices for PIs, but that's totally personal. I just asked around (to students and even some of my interviewers) who they recommended as possible mentors. I also looked on websites and just emailed profs/researchers whose worked I liked. (Be sure to check with the MSTP offices that you won't actually be interviewing with these people, so you don't end up meeting with them twice!) This was probably one of the best things (especially for Stanford) I did because some schools tend to match you with interviewers who may share your interests, but others do not. One conversation I had reminded me why I truly want to combine research and medicine...definitely inspirational. These profs will not affect anything (that I know of, and I didn't ask anything of them other than time) with your apps, but are great in case you decide to go to the school.

I did, however, go to the minority/multi-ethnic offices and ask about volunteer stuff. I got some great info on high school programs, clinics and outreach groups--all run by med students. Good luck with your search!

 

[phar]

I think Upstate wants more URM. During my interview, the professor(a minority) was stating how much MSTP programs is dominated by whites, indians and asians(which are not considered URM by the way when applying to prof.schools).


Good luck.

 

[pathdr2b]

Just a reminder to minority applicants to MD/PhD programs that NIGMS also has money for minority MD/PhD students SEPERATE from the MSTP allocation. Here's the link:

http://grants2.nih.gov/grants/guide/notice-files/not94-051.html

 

[Neuronix]

I think most if not all programs heavily favor minority applicants and are looking to increase their minority applicant pool as MD/PhD programs have a lower percentage of URMs than either MD or PhD alone. As for support, at any well run MSTP, no program is going to let you go with a PI who can't support you financially or has a bad record of abusing grad students. After that, I can't imagine what separate issues inside the program you would face as a URM, except if you found an outright racist PI. If this were the case, I seriously doubt you would end up starting in their lab. My advice here would be to go to a large program that has lots of PIs, so you have plenty to choose from. Your interests will likely change, PIs will move, or things will happen that may affect your choices once you enter a program. My message is not to go anywhere for just one or two people.

As for why it is that there are less URMs in MD/PhD program, I have some ideas. I'd be happy to discuss them with you in private, but I fear of posting them publicly for fear of being too un-PC.

Good luck!

 

[Gradient Echo]

If you are interested in total numbers of URMs in programs I can tell you that my class at Hopkins is composed of 50% URMs.

Its not that high every year, but its usually at least 30% of the group.

 

[Neuronix]

The number will always be higher at the top-top programs (Harvard, Hopkins, UCSF). I think the reason is that the qualified URM pool is so small that they get competed for by all the programs and the biggest name/best location programs usually win. I don't have any statistics to back myself up, but my personal observation is that the acceptance rate for qualified URMs into MD/PhD programs must be very high.

This is part of my thinking on this topic. The reason the percentage of URMs is low in MD/PhD programs is not due to selection against URMs by the program, but rather due to a lack of qualified applicants. If anyone feels differently or has opinions why, I'm always interested to hear about it.

 

[pathdr2b]

Originally posted by Neuronix
The reason the percentage of URMs is low in MD/PhD programs is not due to selection against URMs by the program, but rather due to a lack of qualified applicants.

The reason I here most from friends and aquaintances that have marticulated at schools such as Harvard, Howard, and GWU is that academia isn't a very "friendly" place for URM's. A look at the number of URM's in tenured positions at any major academic institution speaks for itself. Therefore, "qualified" applicants that could get in don't even apply.

 

[johnnyMD]

i have a urm 3.6 32 friend who got into cornell,columbia,penn,ucsf mstp. seems like the answer to your question is: all schools

 

[Habari]

our class is also about 30% urm, but varies year to year. minority recruitment at the med school is always very aggressive, and this impacts the mstp program as well. our program is also about 30% female - another area which we could do a better job with. i'm not exactly sure what makes a school a much better environment than another, besides having other classmates, professors and medical personel that have had similar backgrounds, or are accepting/encouraging to said backgrounds.

 

[pathdr2b]

Originally posted by Habari
i'm not exactly sure what makes a school a much better environment than another, besides having other classmates, professors and medical personel that have had similar backgrounds, or are accepting/encouraging to said backgrounds.

I've found the minority affiars office there SUPERB in terms of supporting/advising students LONG before they matriculate. Also when I was looking for fellowships to do before going back to school full-time, many, many of the big name researchers were very open to me although since they had never met me, this probably had nothing to do with me being a URM. Finally, it isn't too hard in my book to sell NYC!

 

[plasticity]

I agree with previous responses that what matters the most for choosing an MSTP are the research options and research mentors you will have to choose from at that particular school. As a successful URM MSTP applicant, I can tell you from experience that schools are actively seeking out equally qualified URMs for their MST programs (and non-MSTPs as well), and I know that the NIH does encourage diversity among the schools that receive MSTP funding. But standards are not lowered to admit URMs. My opinion is that as URMs we should be comfortable with entering and environment in which we are few and far between, but at the same time we should also choose an environment where we will also be comfortable as ourselves and ethnicity is not an issue.
Hope this helps, if you have any more questions you can send me a PM. Good Luck!

 

[pathdr2b]

Originally posted by plasticity
My opinion is that as URMs we should be comfortable with entering and environment in which we are few and far between, but at the same time we should also choose an environment where we will also be comfortable as ourselves and ethnicity is not an issue.

Agreed! This is why I'm such an advocate for the NIH/NCI and for students doing their research here. This is also why I'm really reluctant to apply to schools that won't allow me to continue my current research here as well (supportive mentors are hard to let go of 😉 ).

However, since a few Cali schools are on my list, I'll send you a PM for more info. Right now, I have to focus on improving my expired MCAT scores next week! .😡

 

[Sixdegrees]

To give yourself an indication as to which programs are recruiting MORE heavily than others you should also look at those that have specific MD/PhD undergraduate summer programs for minorities. I can speak of one or two: the gateways to the laboratory of the Tri-Institutional MD/PhD Cornell/Sloan Kettering/ Rockefeller and Univeristy of Pittsburgh.

Look for a track record at schools. Some students who attended these programs as undergrads went on to MD/PhDs. Ask where they went and why. Their emails are posted. The schools who have these programs had to write grants to get them (i.e. they had to show substantial commitment).

Here are links to the programs:

http://www.mdphd.pitt.edu/sprogram_brochure.asp

http://www.med.cornell.edu/mdphd/summer2.html

Iowa has a program not just for URMs (thought I'D add it)
http://www.medicine.uiowa.edu/mstp/sumr/index.html

If anyone knows of others that would be nice.

 

[pathdr2b]

The minority affairs office at Pitt is also especially aggressive and like many other schools, will contact minorities after they have taken the MCAT (and registered with Med-Mar).The info they sent me a few years back around August of the year I took the MCAT, was very descriptive of the various programs at Pitt.

In general, schools whose MD programs are supportive of URM's usually have MD/PhD programs that share the same philosophy.

So far this list includes:

Harvard
Hopkins
Penn
Upstate
Cornell
Pitt
Columbia

Important point to URM applicants, REGISTER FOR MEDMAR WHEN YOU TAKE THE MCAT!!!!! Schools you never thought you had a shot at may just contact you!