FunnyDocMan1234

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Aug 22, 2012
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After using epic vs. other EMR's in med school I find myself wanting to just pull my hair out when I am using a non-epic EMR and feel patient care is hugely compromised without features like the new search in epic. So, now that I have seen the light I can't imagine going back to a horrible EMR for 3 years (epic isn't amazing but it is far and away the least crappy of the EMRs, imo)

So, this will probably be a big factor in my residency decision - I am applying to most of the top IM residencies; anyone know which ones do/don't have epic?
 

chrissyxf

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Nov 22, 2010
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Hi,
First, I've used about 12 different EMRs and I would actually say Sunrise wins (but the vast majority of hospitals do not have this as it's too expensive). Second, every major university will be attached to a VA which currently uses CPRS but Cerner just won the contract to change. With that said, I would find it far more important whether or not you have home access.
In any case, I know that UPenn uses epic for both inpatient and outpatient. UW uses epic for outpatient at all facilities and cerner for inpatient at some facilities.
I think that the best people to ask are the residents on the interview trail, and that is indeed a question I will be asking as well.
 
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FunnyDocMan1234

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Aug 22, 2012
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Ah yes I agree remote access is also a huge timesaver that I would appreciate if anyone could comment on as well
 
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FunnyDocMan1234

7+ Year Member
Aug 22, 2012
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Yes this is obvious but I would like to be able to wean down applications and interviews before spending money to go out to a program because if, I have options, Cerner is a dealbreaker for me.
 

bananas85

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Aug 6, 2013
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Does sunrise come in different forms?? Cause we use sunrise/all scripts/ Apollo and it's absolutely terrible.
 

FutureInternist

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Can call the program co-od before applying

Or if you want to stay anonymous then just call any floor in the hospital (easy enough to get the #s) & say that you are doing a survey (which you are) & just ask the secretary
 

jdh71

Grim Optimist.
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Yes this is obvious but I would like to be able to wean down applications and interviews before spending money to go out to a program because if, I have options, Cerner is a dealbreaker for me.
Cerner is a "deal breaker"!?? lol.

I'm guessing you were born after 1990.
 

gutonc

No Meat, No Treat
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Cerner is a "deal breaker"!?? lol.

I'm guessing you were born after 1990.
Cerner really is a s***show.

But using EMR as a tool to decide which program is best for you is just embarrassing.
 
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pulmoblast

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Things you should focus on while choosing residency programs : quality of teaching, resident autonomy/supervision, patient exposure, procedural exposure , resident camaraderie and well being

Things you should not focus on : price of sandwiches in the cafeteria, pool table in the resident lounge, cable TV and whether you get HBO and (wait for it) ...the EMR
 

bananas85

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Aug 6, 2013
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I am not trying to be a smart ass but why is it such a huge deal if someone wants to work at a place with a good EMR. With my current job I am having issues with the EMR and when I speak with some more experienced folks (45 years or older) they kind of look at me like deciding on a job based on EMR is absolutely a mistake.

The truth is a good EMR saves you time, makes you efficient, prevents a lot of phone calls. And improves patient care. It reduces error. IT REDUCES ERRORS.

Why is that people that use that as a criteria for choosing job or reaidency are weak, or embarassing or making a mistake?
 

Beacopp665

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Sep 3, 2014
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I am not trying to be a smart ass but why is it such a huge deal if someone wants to work at a place with a good EMR. With my current job I am having issues with the EMR and when I speak with some more experienced folks (45 years or older) they kind of look at me like deciding on a job based on EMR is absolutely a mistake.

The truth is a good EMR saves you time, makes you efficient, prevents a lot of phone calls. And improves patient care. It reduces error. IT REDUCES ERRORS.

Why is that people that use that as a criteria for choosing job or reaidency are weak, or embarassing or making a mistake?
So then use an EMR to decide where you actually go work as an attending for a sustained period of time. But for residency that shouldn't be your focus. There are other factors mentioned above that easily outweigh your concern and I promise that patients arent dying by the hundreds because they don't have epic at those hospitals.

Fwiw I used Cerner in med school and have Epic in residency. There are pros and cons of both but Cerner isn't so bad that I'd exclude programs because of it lol. Places still using paper charts however is another story...
 
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jdh71

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Cerner really is a s***show.

But using EMR as a tool to decide which program is best for you is just embarrassing.
Actually Cerner is all about the build. It's much more customizable than EPIC. And the truth is you won't know how much you like or hate it before you start using it. Cerner is like a PC and Epic is like a Mac.
 
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VA Hopeful Dr

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Actually Cerner is all about the build. It's much more customizable than EPIC. And the truth is you won't know how much you like or hate it before you start using it. Cerner is like a PC and Epic is like a Mac.
Yeah, I'm forced to agree here. While I think Epic is a little better for multi-problem visits, it really is difficult to customize anything on there. The "dot-phrases" are just awful the majority of the time.

Cerner, on the other hand... I love those macros.

That all said, choosing residency based on EMR is stupid. Attending jobs are a different story, but for a known, finite amount of time - pick the best program and then live with the EMR.
 

jdh71

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Yeah, I'm forced to agree here. While I think Epic is a little better for multi-problem visits, it really is difficult to customize anything on there. The "dot-phrases" are just awful the majority of the time.

Cerner, on the other hand... I love those macros.

That all said, choosing residency based on EMR is stupid. Attending jobs are a different story, but for a known, finite amount of time - pick the best program and then live with the EMR.
These days I think my biggest pet peeve (ie stupid issue that annoys me) is that the font style and size of font NEEDS to be locked in and uniform across a platform. Giving people all these choices over font style and size makes for notes that sometimes become near unreadable due to my anger over the crime scene.
 
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gutonc

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Yeah, I'm forced to agree here. While I think Epic is a little better for multi-problem visits, it really is difficult to customize anything on there. The "dot-phrases" are just awful the majority of the time.

Cerner, on the other hand... I love those macros.

That all said, choosing residency based on EMR is stupid. Attending jobs are a different story, but for a known, finite amount of time - pick the best program and then live with the EMR.
This is actually true of Epic as well. I currently use it in 4 different hospital systems (inpatient only) and it varies dramatically between them. Fortunately, the best implementation is the one I use daily in the office.
 

2010houston

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These days I think my biggest pet peeve (ie stupid issue that annoys me) is that the font style and size of font NEEDS to be locked in and uniform across a platform. Giving people all these choices over font style and size makes for notes that sometimes become near unreadable due to my anger over the crime scene.
There is a subspecialty group at one of our hospitals that does all their notes in colored Comic Sans. Not kidding. And this is adult medicine, not peds...Makes it very hard to follow their reccs when you just want to scream in anger!
 

DrSnips

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every major university will be attached to a VA
I'm at UVA, which I would consider to be an example of a major university without an attached VA. But yes, MOST major universities will have a VA.
 

Raryn

Infernal Internist / Enigmatic Endocrinologist
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Hi,
First, I've used about 12 different EMRs and I would actually say Sunrise wins (but the vast majority of hospitals do not have this as it's too expensive). Second, every major university will be attached to a VA which currently uses CPRS but Cerner just won the contract to change. With that said, I would find it far more important whether or not you have home access.
In any case, I know that UPenn uses epic for both inpatient and outpatient. UW uses epic for outpatient at all facilities and cerner for inpatient at some facilities.
I think that the best people to ask are the residents on the interview trail, and that is indeed a question I will be asking as well.
VA is not changing from CPRS. Cerner won the contract to change the DODs system that they use for active duty military members, which is unrelated to the system that the VA uses (and is a completely separate cabinet department).

And I agree with the consensus that EMR is an absolutely terrible standard to judge a program by. I've used EPIC for going on5 years (between med school and residency) and while it would be nice if the program I do my fellowship in has EPIC (and most of the ones I'm interviewing at do), it is approximately criteria #128 on my list of things I'm judging the programs on.
 
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Gpan

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Jul 9, 2007
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I am using Cerner in all 4 hospitals and so far so good. I really like its interface and tabs. Easy to navigate. It's not the best but it's above average.

To the OP: how about call the programs and ask. Call those CME secretary ladies. or even make a COLD CALL to one of their floors and ask random nurses.
 
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