MD Can a 503 MCAT with a 3.37 GPA get into these Allopathic MD schools?

[GoPenguinsGo]

So above is my GPA and MCAT (individual sections are posted below if you care to look) score. I have shadowed 5 doctors and I have both an MD and DO writing LOR's for me just to give some light as to the rest of my app. My residency is in Ohio. These are the MD schools I selected:

1) Rosalind Franklin (Chicago, Illinois)

2) Loyola (Chicago, Illinois) [My preferred school]

3) Toledo (Toledo, Ohio [who literally just sent me a request for a secondary app])

4) University of Illinois

5) Wright State (Dayton, Ohio)

6) Northeast (Toledo, Ohio)

7) Rush (Chicago, Illinois)

I think theres one or two schools that I'm missing. I also applied to about 6 DO schools.

Chem/Phys: 128 (eh)
CARS: 123 (ew)
Bio: 125 (ew)
Psych/Soc: 127 (eh)

I don't have any misconceptions that I have good chances at any MD school. I just need to know if I'm still alive at those schools.

Side note: Toledo sent me a request for a secondary application even though their average MCAT is a 511. I find this odd.

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[GoSpursGo]

Moving to what are my chances

 

[Faha]

Almost all schools send out secondaries to almost every applicant. You may receive an interview at one of your Ohio schools. Which DO schools did you apply to ?

 

[Goro]

So above is my GPA and MCAT (individual sections are posted below if you care to look) score. I have shadowed 5 doctors and I have both an MD and DO writing LOR's for me just to give some light as to the rest of my app. My residency is in Ohio. These are the MD schools I selected:

1) Rosalind Franklin (Chicago, Illinois)

2) Loyola (Chicago, Illinois) [My preferred school]

3) Toledo (Toledo, Ohio [who literally just sent me a request for a secondary app])

4) University of Illinois

5) Wright State (Dayton, Ohio)

6) Northeast (Toledo, Ohio)

7) Rush (Chicago, Illinois)

I think theres one or two schools that I'm missing. I also applied to about 6 DO schools.

Chem/Phys: 128 (eh)
CARS: 123 (ew)
Bio: 125 (ew)
Psych/Soc: 127 (eh)

I don't have any misconceptions that I have good chances at any MD school. I just need to know if I'm still alive at those schools.

Side note: Toledo sent me a request for a secondary application even though their average MCAT is a 511. I find this odd.

Secondaries are often a tax on the hopelessly naïve, if not pathologically optimistic.

I am not sanguine at all about your chances at any MD school, except NEOMED, Wright State, MAYBE U Toledo and OH State, but you're circling the drain for the latter.
Chances fine for any DO school, except maybe AZCOM.

U ILL will be a donation. Take your SO out to dinner instead.

 

[drsombra]

same mcat but a tad higher gpa. fingers crossed for both of us!

 

[831929]

I would say chances at any out of state MD school are close to zero. Just being realistic here. If you have the money, do the secondaries but if money is an issue, I would use it on DO secondaries instead. Also, there has to be more to the app than just shadowing and grades/scores. What is your volunteering experience like? What is your research experience like? If you got multiple publications and spend hours in lab, that can make up for some of the score/gpa deficit. Do the secondaries for the Ohio schools. And apply to all of them because you never know. Once you share more info about your app people can probably help you a little more.

 

[GoPenguinsGo]

I would say chances at any out of state MD school are close to zero. Just being realistic here. If you have the money, do the secondaries but if money is an issue, I would use it on DO secondaries instead. Also, there has to be more to the app than just shadowing and grades/scores. What is your volunteering experience like? What is your research experience like? If you got multiple publications and spend hours in lab, that can make up for some of the score/gpa deficit. Do the secondaries for the Ohio schools. And apply to all of them because you never know. Once you share more info about your app people can probably help you a little more.

Loyola (my top choice) is private and it says on their admissions website that they don't distinguish between out of state and in state applicants so I hope I have a chance there

 

[GoPenguinsGo]

Almost all schools send out secondaries to almost every applicant. You may receive an interview at one of your Ohio schools. Which DO schools did you apply to ?

Ohio University (Athens, Ohio)

Lincoln Memorial (Tennessee)

Chicago Midwestern (Chicago, Illinois)

Kentucky-Pikeville

Lake Erie

Marian University

 

[Faha]

Ohio University (Athens, Ohio)

Lincoln Memorial (Tennessee)

Chicago Midwestern (Chicago, Illinois)

Kentucky-Pikeville

Lake Erie

Marian University

Add a few more DO schools such as
WVSOM
VCOM (all 3 schools)
ACOM

 

[831929]

Loyola (my top choice) is private and it says on their admissions website that they don't distinguish between out of state and in state applicants so I hope I have a chance there

Yeah that might be true but they do have a high MCAT average. The thing you have going for you is that you're in Ohio which I think has a lot more schools than other states. They might overlook a low MCAT since they do need a # of admissions from the state. but if that's your top choice, then keep it on the list and do the secondary for it since you never know. Jusy giving you advice since you asked.

 

[candbgirl]

Do you have hundreds if not thousands of hours in clinical experience and service to the unserved/underserved in your community? Rush has an insane amount of requirements for consideration in these two areas. UofI is awfully expensive. So if money is a consideration you might want to rethink Illinois. You seem to want to be in the Chicago area. UofI has campuses outside of Chicago so keep that in mind. Have you checked the MSAR to see what the 10th percentile of admitted students is for each of these schools? Are you above it? You never know what is going to pique the interest of an ADCOM member so it’s not possible to tell you if you are still alive. But your GPA is well below the average of matriculated students. (3.7)

 

[GoPenguinsGo]

Yeah that might be true but they do have a high MCAT average. The thing you have going for you is that you're in Ohio which I think has a lot more schools than other states. They might overlook a low MCAT since they do need a # of admissions from the state. but if that's your top choice, then keep it on the list and do the secondary for it since you never know. Jusy giving you advice since you asked.

I appreciate your advice! I looked on Loyola's website and they said their average MCAT of acceptees is a 507 or 508 (depending on which year you look at). Is that out of range from a 503?

 

[831929]

I appreciate your advice! I looked on Loyola's website and they said their average MCAT of acceptees is a 507 or 508 (depending on which year you look at). Is that out of range from a 503?

Like someone else said, youd have to check MSAR to see what the 10th percentile is. But I would say it is a big reach. Also, why are you set on that school? Have you been there? Did you read about it and though its the perfect match? In all honesty, the perfect match is the school you get into. What you get out of school is what you put in. I wouldn't get set on one school unless you spend months doing something there such as research, etc. Like I said earlier, what else is on your app. That will make or break your chances

 

[GoPenguinsGo]

Do you have hundreds if not thousands of hours in clinical experience and service to the unserved/underserved in your community? Rush has an insane amount of requirements for consideration in these two areas. UofI is awfully expensive. So if money is a consideration you might want to rethink Illinois. You seem to want to be in the Chicago area. UofI has campuses outside of Chicago so keep that in mind. Have you checked the MSAR to see what the 10th percentile of admitted students is for each of these schools? Are you above it? You never know what is going to pique the interest of an ADCOM member so it’s not possible to tell you if you are still alive. But your GPA is well below the average of matriculated students. (3.7)

You are definitely correct about the GPA circumstance! I don't think I'm going to be really pursuing Rush or Rosalind Franklin but I do have about 100 hours of clinical volunteering in Emergency Room and Nuclear Medicine as well as about 50 hours of clinical shadowing of various specialties. I can check the MSAR as you said as I have not yet. Going off the GPA idea, I saw on Loyola's admissions page that they've accepted a GPA into their school that was a 2.68 as well as a 14th percentile MCAT interestingly enough.

 

[GoPenguinsGo]

Like someone else said, youd have to check MSAR to see what the 10th percentile is. But I would say it is a big reach. Also, why are you set on that school? Have you been there? Did you read about it and though its the perfect match? In all honesty, the perfect match is the school you get into. What you get out of school is what you put in. I wouldn't get set on one school unless you spend months doing something there such as research, etc. Like I said earlier, what else is on your app. That will make or break your chances

A bit more thorough run down of my extracurriculars is:

- about 50 hours shadowing various medical specialties including Cardiology, Pediatrics, Neonatology, Orthopedic Surgery, and Internal Medicine
-about 100 hours in clinical volunteering in Emergency Room and Nuclear Medicine
-worked as head Supplemental Instructor for 2 semesters for Organic 1, 2 and General Chem 1 (Basically I'm a TA that also holds additional help sessions outside of class for any student to attend)


My undergrad doesn't really have much of a Chemistry research presence so I couldn't really participate in that unless I wanted to sacrifice clinical experience. Bit of a catch-22

 

[GoPenguinsGo]

Just a quick update on the MSAR findings:

-My 503 falls at the very tail end of the 10-90th percentile for Loyola for Accpetees but is more within range for Matriculants
-My 503 is in the 10-90th percentile for Wright State for Acceptees but in the 25-75th percentile for Matriculants

If anyone can make sense of why the matriculant range is different from the acceptees range and tell me which I should look at more would be great!

 

[831929]

I would say that if you want an MD shot you will need to take some time off from school and build up your CV.
100 hours of volunteering in a clinical setting is okay but only if you were busy with other things.
being a tutor is great, but its a job. probably wont help out much with making up for lack of extracurriculars or research.
shadowing for 50 hours is not really useful for anything. Its good that you got exposure for yourself, but for the application its really not significant.

As I see it, you got two options:
1. apply to state MD and a bunch of state/out of state DO schools. DO school will be your best chance at getting into medical school this year. I hear great things about OUHCOM so if you can get in there, I say try your best to do that. Submit applications one first day you can, pre-write the secondary and send it in right away and schedule the first interview you can.

2. Do not apply this year. Do one of those 1-year masters and retake the mcat (508+ should be okay but I would aim even higher like 510 min). Go to one that allows many students to go to their med school straight from the program. If not that, you can do a full 2 year masters in a field you like, get some research and pubs. I think you would still need to retake the mcat which might be harder since those 2 year programs do not prepare you for the mcat.

Also just realized, you must have already applied for this cycle. October is late for you to just be starting secondaries. Did you apply late? If this is the case, you need to submit everything and get secondaries in ASAP! if you want to go with plan 2, then withdraw the app and start looking/applying for the masters.

 

[831929]

also, take time this year to do research or volunteering. I think its a little too late for you to build up extracurriculars with unique extracurriculars but doing hospital volunteering is probably your best bet. If you got some kind of club at school that does volunteering then you can do that.

 

[GoPenguinsGo]

I would say that if you want an MD shot you will need to take some time off from school and build up your CV.
100 hours of volunteering in a clinical setting is okay but only if you were busy with other things.
being a tutor is great, but its a job. probably wont help out much with making up for lack of extracurriculars or research.
shadowing for 50 hours is not really useful for anything. Its good that you got exposure for yourself, but for the application its really not significant.

As I see it, you got two options:
1. apply to state MD and a bunch of state/out of state DO schools. DO school will be your best chance at getting into medical school this year. I hear great things about OUHCOM so if you can get in there, I say try your best to do that. Submit applications one first day you can, pre-write the secondary and send it in right away and schedule the first interview you can.

2. Do not apply this year. Do one of those 1-year masters and retake the mcat (508+ should be okay but I would aim even higher like 510 min). Go to one that allows many students to go to their med school straight from the program. If not that, you can do a full 2 year masters in a field you like, get some research and pubs. I think you would still need to retake the mcat which might be harder since those 2 year programs do not prepare you for the mcat.

Also just realized, you must have already applied for this cycle. October is late for you to just be starting secondaries. Did you apply late? If this is the case, you need to submit everything and get secondaries in ASAP! if you want to go with plan 2, then withdraw the app and start looking/applying for the masters.

Thank you so much for the advice! I have no problem with DO in fact my 3rd and 4th choices are DO schools (Chicago Midwestern and Ohio U, respectively). So things look grim on the MD side of out of state schools I'll look into what you are saying. Thank you for your honesty!

 

[candbgirl]

@anonymousdoctobe Oh I think OP applied a while ago and is nervous because(like lots of people) he hasn’t heard anything.

OP I’m assuming you know Loyola is a Jesuit school. Their mission is to serve the underserved/unserved in the community. Did you apply without any nonclinical volunteering. If so don’t be surprised if you don’t get an interview. You asked about schools accepting students with stats well below yours. Of course they do. If that person has an amazing story, fought overwhelming odds, is URM. a legacy or even a kid of the Dean. It happens but that doesn’t mean it happens a lot.
Hopefully you hear from some DO schools. Your stats are within their parameters but your ECs are still lacking. In case you have to reapply, you might want to start polishing them up. If you really have no nonclinical volunteering jump on that now. If you do get interviews that would be a good thing to tell them-how you are continuing to improve your application. Same for your clinical experiences (different than shadowing).

 

[GoPenguinsGo]

@anonymousdoctobe Oh I think OP applied a while ago and is nervous because(like lots of people) he hasn’t heard anything.

OP I’m assuming you know Loyola is a Jesuit school. Their mission is to serve the underserved/unserved in the community. Did you apply without any nonclinical volunteering. If so don’t be surprised if you don’t get an interview. You asked about schools accepting students with stats well below yours. Of course they do. If that person has an amazing story, fought overwhelming odds, is URM. a legacy or even a kid of the Dean. It happens but that doesn’t mean it happens a lot.
Hopefully you hear from some DO schools. Your stats are within their parameters but your ECs are still lacking. In case you have to reapply, you might want to start polishing them up. If you really have no nonclinical volunteering jump on that now. If you do get interviews that would be a good thing to tell them-how you are continuing to improve your application. Same for your clinical experiences (different than shadowing).

Loyola being Jesuit is why I am so interested in them specifically! I went to a Jesuit high school so I have been well educated on the mission of the Jesuits and their values. Do you think I should email/call them and talk to them about how I interested I am in them and express my excitement for applying to them?

Also, I applied on Aug 1 and have yet to submit my secondary apps for all of those schools because I just got my MCAT literally today and couldn't move forward without it.

 

[candbgirl]

Don’t call. You’d probably get a secretary. And they are busy going through thousands of applications. And they only have your primary and might wonder why, if this person is so interested , he hasn’t submitted the secondary. Letters of Interest aren’t very useful. I don’t remember if Loyola takes update letters or if they do it might be after interviews. But it doesn’t sound like you have much to update them about. Actually you have nothing because you haven’t submitted your secondaries. There might be someplace on the secondary you can plead your case. It is so late now. The first round of acceptances are usually on or around October 15. So you see how late you are.

 

[GoPenguinsGo]

Don’t call. You’d probably get a secretary. And they are busy going through thousands of applications. And they only have your primary and might wonder why, if this person is so interested , he hasn’t submitted the secondary. Letters of Interest aren’t very useful. I don’t remember if Loyola takes update letters or if they do it might be after interviews. But it doesn’t sound like you have much to update them about. Actually you have nothing because you haven’t submitted your secondaries. There might be someplace on the secondary you can plead your case. It is so late now. The first round of acceptances are usually on or around October 15. So you see how late you are.

Argh, I'm considering retaking the MCAT. I studied for about a little over 6 weeks and never took a practice MCAT to see how I was doing. I confidently think I can pull around a 512 or better seeing as how my Chem/Phys score would indicate I have the ability to score that high. I just need to figure out what went wrong.

@candbgirl how am i doing for DO schools like Chicago Midwestern or other out of state DO's (outside of Ohio that is)?

 

[candbgirl]

Well if you are going to retake don’t send in your secondaries. Just put the whole thing off until next year. I don’t know much about DO but I’ll tag @Goro and @Faha. They’ll be able to tell you! Good luck!

 

[Goro]

I appreciate your advice! I looked on Loyola's website and they said their average MCAT of acceptees is a 507 or 508 (depending on which year you look at). Is that out of range from a 503?

Loyola's median for acceptees is a 510. For matriculants it's a 508.

Their 10th% ile for matriculants is 3.31

You''ll need a lot of good volunteering for them, with your numbers. Loyola is a service-loving school

 

[GoPenguinsGo]

Loyola's median for acceptees is a 510. For matriculants it's a 508.

Their 10th% ile for matriculants is 3.31

You''ll need a lot of good volunteering for them, with your numbers. Loyola is a service-loving school

By service, what would you recommend? Like soup kitchens?

 

[Goro]

By service, what would you recommend? Like soup kitchens?

Yes. Demonstrations of your altruism. Medicine is a service profession, after all.

Service need not be "unique". If you can alleviate suffering in your community through service to the poor, homeless, illiterate, fatherless, etc, you are meeting an otherwise unmet need and learning more about the lives of the people (or types of people) who will someday be your patients. Check out your local houses of worship for volunteer opportunities. The key thing is service to others less fortunate than you. And get off campus and out of your comfort zone!

 

[GoPenguinsGo]

Yes. Demonstrations of your altruism. Medicine is a service profession, after all.

Service need not be "unique". If you can alleviate suffering in your community through service to the poor, homeless, illiterate, fatherless, etc, you are meeting an otherwise unmet need and learning more about the lives of the people (or types of people) who will someday be your patients. Check out your local houses of worship for volunteer opportunities. The key thing is service to others less fortunate than you. And get off campus and out of your comfort zone!

Gotcha, thanks! Btw, how well do my stats stack up for DO programs? Specifically Ohio U (I'm an Ohio resident) and Chicago Midwestern?

 

[Goro]

Gotcha, thanks! Btw, how well do my stats stack up for DO programs? Specifically Ohio U (I'm an Ohio resident) and Chicago Midwestern?

I think you're fine for almost all DO programs. AZCOM and CCOM might be the fussiest.

 

[westsidestoryz]

I think you're fine for almost all DO programs. AZCOM and CCOM might be the fussiest.

Are AZCOM and CCOM hard DOs to get into? What about Western-Pomona?

 

[Goro]

Are AZCOM and CCOM hard DOs to get into? What about Western-Pomona?

AZCOM and CCOm like high MCATs.

Western is more lenient.