Can a person with a Pharm.D. call themselves "Dr. ..."?

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After I graduate, I'll have my mail go to Dr. such and such because I believe I will have earned the right to have that title. But I'm not gonna demand people call me Dr.
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I would never insist on being called Dr. for all the reasons stated here. And those who are so 'touchy' about it have some kind of issue. I overall would prefer to be called by my first name. But then again if someone wanted to be formal and address me by my last name then I would want them use my correct title as doctor. If you earned a doctorate in anything and someone wanted to be formal and use your last name it would be kind of disrespectful to call them Mr. or Mrs. rather than acknowledging their title of Dr.
 
trailrider400 said:
I would never insist on being called Dr. for all the reasons stated here. And those who are so 'touchy' about it have some kind of issue. I overall would prefer to be called by my first name. But then again if someone wanted to be formal and address me by my last name then I would want them use my correct title as doctor. If you earned a doctorate in anything and someone wanted to be formal and use your last name it would be kind of disrespectful to call them Mr. or Mrs. rather than acknowledging their title of Dr.
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+1 you said it perfectly.
 
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hokierx said:
Psychiatrists are the only ones who are allowed to write prescriptions in treating mental diseases because they have a PhD in psychology AND went to med school.
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:eek: Many people fail to realize psychiatry is a specialty within medicine just like dermatology or pediatrics. I am not sure where all the confusion started but people often blend psychology and psychiatry together. Psychologists have PhDs or PsyDs. Some physicians do have a PhD/MD but that is not unique to becoming a psychiatrist and a PhD is not required to practice medicine as a psychiatrist.

Also it is untrue that psychiatrists write prescriptions that mental illness specific. Theoretically a primary care physician can write you a prescription for depression. However, most physicians will refer patients out if the case is out of their area of expertise.
 
rycetrix said:
If someone graduates with a PharmD., they are considered a doctor. The PharmD. is an abbreviated version for Doctor of Pharmacy. PharmD.'s cannot put PhD after their signatures because a PhD is a different type of abbrevation for a doctor. PhD stands for Doctor of Philosophy of (insert subject here). You can have a PhD in Chemistry and be considered a Doctor.
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Theoretically if you graduate with a PharmD you are considered a doctor. However, whether this is considered socially appropriate is another story. Lawyers have Juris Doctors and are never referred to as "doctors". It's considered tacky in the profession to refer to oneself or another colleague as a fellow Doctor of Law. This may have to due with the association of doctor being linked heavily to health-care/medicine. Because the majority of pharmacists currently hold only bachelor-level degrees it may take some time for the public perception of pharmacists to change and evolve.

Personally I would prefer being called by my first name as it is the name that I have always responded to. "Dr" seems overtly formal to me and people who have a PhD in basketweaving are also considered "doctors" so the title is overrated. I am secure enough with myself that if someone did not refer to me as doctor that I would not take offense or think twice about it.
 
The only two times anyone prefaces my name with "Doctor" is when I get alumni mailings from the School of Pharmacy or when one of us at work makes a ******* mistake and we call the guy "Doctor" just to be cute. I.E. "You forgot that you can't send insulin through the tubes? Hahahaha. Excellent work, Dr. Jones."
 
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I think it would probably confuse the hell out of older patients if suddenly pharmacists and nurses were called doctor. My 86 year old grandmother already gets confused and we don't even call pharmacists doctor yet. :rolleyes: For me, I'll stick with my first name--less pretentiousness and it lets the old people keep a bit of their sanity.
 
The term PhD. is for the Doctor of Philosophy. This term has been used way back in the prescientific time period and has nothing to do with medicine. Its about reaching the highest degree of truth - which is a hard task no matter what the subject. I dare you to go into a chemistry doctorate program and tell me that medicine is 10x harder. Every field requires the highest degree of dedication, passion, and commitment if you want to achieve the highest degree of truth. So give respect when respect is due. You are naive if you think it is right to call your professor "dude", or any name you choose because you are using the wrong definition of a PhD.

But, I communicate with the pharmacist I work for on a first name basis. If I am writing a serious email though, i'll be sure to use Dr. It all depends on the situation.
 
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pharmacist are not doctors!! I am sorry but it is the truth.

According dictionary.com
"a person licensed to practice medicine, as a physician, surgeon, dentist, or veterinarian."

A person, especially a physician, dentist, or veterinarian, trained in the healing arts and licensed to practice.

Also, a pharmacist may not prescribe medications. do you still think that pharmacist is a doctor? LOL NO!
 
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medordent said:
pharmacist are not doctors!! I am sorry but it is the truth.

According dictionary.com
"a person licensed to practice medicine, as a physician, surgeon, dentist, or veterinarian."

A person, especially a physician, dentist, or veterinarian, trained in the healing arts and licensed to practice.

Also, a pharmacist may not prescribe medications. do you still think that pharmacist is a doctor? LOL NO!
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Let's look at the big picture here. So would you say that someone who has earned a Doctorate (I.E. the only way you can officially become a doctor) does not have right to be referred to as a doctor in certain settings. I'm sure your professors would love to discuss this one. Besides, that definition is a current one. If you go back and look in history a doctor was someone who taught in theology and physicians were not denoted with term. However, society has tricked any and everyone into thinking that if you didn't receive and MD (Which is funny because I wonder what we call our "doctors" if it was a medical masters or something) you are not officially a doctor. Doctorate=Doctor, it just depends on when and where you are called a Dr..... but can we just put this one to rest please, it's kind dividing people at this moment. Just another way to present a hierarchy in society...
 
Pharmdapp87 said:
Let's look at the big picture here. So would you say that someone who has earned a Doctorate (I.E. the only way you can officially become a doctor) does not have right to be referred to as a doctor in certain settings. I'm sure your professors would love to discuss this one. Besides, that definition is a current one. If you go back and look in history a doctor was someone who taught in theology and physicians were not denoted with term. However, society has tricked any and everyone into thinking that if you didn't receive and MD (Which is funny because I wonder what we call our "doctors" if it was a medical masters or something) you are not officially a doctor. Doctorate=Doctor, it just depends on when and where you are called a Dr..... but can we just put this one to rest please, it's kind dividing people at this moment. Just another way to present a hierarchy in society...
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" I have been told by one person with lots of post graduate education that PhD stands for "pig-headed determination."
Another less charitable soul explained it as "piled higher and deeper."
In truth PhD is the abbreviation of Philosophiae Doctor, which is the Latin for "Doctor of Philosophy."
These degrees are the highest that are awarded by universities and originally the title was given because once a candidate had achieved this level he—and back in the 1300s it was always he—was qualified to teach.
In fact at first doctor meant "teacher."
The root of the word doctor is from the Latin word docere, meaning "to teach" and also unexpectedly shows up in the roots of the word docile because someone who is docile is easy to teach, and also the word document, which was originally the thing from which you took information that was to be taught.
Some sources point to an Indo-European root dek meaning "to take" or "to accept."
The sense as it moved from accepting to teaching was that a teacher caused one to accept information.
Right from the entry of the word doctor into English in it also referred to physicians. So there has always been that mild confusion as to whether someone with the title doctor actually has patients.
Although the verb to doctor must have originated with a sense that a doctor changes things for the better, the sense of doctoring things for the worse emerged first in the written record. A meaning of "patch up" and "set to rights" isn't seen before 1829 but doctoring wine shows up in 1820. Altering someone's appearance "doctoring his face" comes through 1774.
Like doctor the word physician came to English with the French of the Norman Conquest and so had to wait until after 700 or 800 years ago before being called an English word.
Skilled medical personnel before that were known as leeches in Old English."
the link- http://blog.oup.com/2008/11/doctor/

I also found this at medicinenet.com
"Doctor: In a medical context, any medical professional with an MD, a PhD, or any other doctoral degree. The term doctor is quite nonspecific. A doctor may, for example, be a physician, psychologist, biomedical scientist, dentist, or veterinarian. In a nonmedical context, a professor of history might be addressed as doctor, an eminent theologian might be named a doctor of a church, and a person awarded an honorary doctorate by a college or university might also be called a doctor."
Here is the link http://www.medterms.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=9237


At my current job, a group of doctors came in from India. I addressed them as Doctors the whole time right before they left I found out that some of them had their Bachelor's of medicine and surgery and not a MD. They are still referred to as doctors. This did not change the respect I had for them and continued to call them Dr.
 
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medordent said:
pharmacist are not doctors!! I am sorry but it is the truth.

According dictionary.com
"a person licensed to practice medicine, as a physician, surgeon, dentist, or veterinarian."

A person, especially a physician, dentist, or veterinarian, trained in the healing arts and licensed to practice.

Also, a pharmacist may not prescribe medications. do you still think that pharmacist is a doctor? LOL NO!
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Get your facts straight, and everyone else that thinks this way. Listen to the last 3 post above not including the one from this poster. When you are calling one a doctor not in the medical field, it is used in a differnet context. You are naive. Thats all.
 
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medordent said:
A person, especially a physician, dentist, or veterinarian, trained in the healing arts and licensed to practice.

Also, a pharmacist may not prescribe medications. do you still think that pharmacist is a doctor? LOL NO!
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Actually some pharmacists can prescribe! And a pharmacist is "a person trained in the healing arts and licensed to practice."
 
vinny808 said:
Get your facts straight, and everyone else that thinks this way. Listen to the last 3 post above not including the one from this poster. When you are calling one a doctor not in the medical field, it is used in a differnet context. You are naive. Thats all.
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And I thought one that looked at the definition of "Doctor" on dictionary.com would also FIND OUT, that the SECOND definition stated on dictionay.com is:

"2) a person who has been awarded a doctor's degree: He is a Doctor of Philosophy."

wow..just wow. And thats the truth.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/doctor
 
I just read this for the first time today, lol. I just wanted to say that I don't really care whether people call me Dr., but I kinda want to put it on the mail headers when I get married. I majored in Women's Studies and it would amuse my feminist side to see "Mr. and Dr. John Smith" on the incoming mail. How many people would double take and think about that heading based on the stereotype that Dr. refers to a male? Just my own little sociological experiment. If I end up married to someone who also has a doctorate of something, I wouldn't even bother... not as amusing anymore, lol :p
 
pharmant said:
" I have been told by one person with lots of post graduate education that PhD stands for “pig-headed determination.”
Another less charitable soul explained it as “piled higher and deeper.”
In truth PhD is the abbreviation of Philosophiae Doctor, which is the Latin for “Doctor of Philosophy.”
These degrees are the highest that are awarded by universities and originally the title was given because once a candidate had achieved this level he—and back in the 1300s it was always he—was qualified to teach.
In fact at first doctor meant “teacher.”
The root of the word doctor is from the Latin word docere, meaning “to teach” and also unexpectedly shows up in the roots of the word docile because someone who is docile is easy to teach, and also the word document, which was originally the thing from which you took information that was to be taught.
Some sources point to an Indo-European root dek meaning “to take” or “to accept.”
The sense as it moved from accepting to teaching was that a teacher caused one to accept information.
Right from the entry of the word doctor into English in it also referred to physicians. So there has always been that mild confusion as to whether someone with the title doctor actually has patients.
Although the verb to doctor must have originated with a sense that a doctor changes things for the better, the sense of doctoring things for the worse emerged first in the written record. A meaning of “patch up” and “set to rights” isn’t seen before 1829 but doctoring wine shows up in 1820. Altering someone’s appearance “doctoring his face” comes through 1774.
Like doctor the word physician came to English with the French of the Norman Conquest and so had to wait until after 700 or 800 years ago before being called an English word.
Skilled medical personnel before that were known as leeches in Old English."
the link- http://blog.oup.com/2008/11/doctor/

I also found this at medicinenet.com
"Doctor: In a medical context, any medical professional with an MD, a PhD, or any other doctoral degree. The term doctor is quite nonspecific. A doctor may, for example, be a physician, psychologist, biomedical scientist, dentist, or veterinarian. In a nonmedical context, a professor of history might be addressed as doctor, an eminent theologian might be named a doctor of a church, and a person awarded an honorary doctorate by a college or university might also be called a doctor."
Here is the link http://www.medterms.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=9237


At my current job, a group of doctors came in from India. I addressed them as Doctors the whole time right before they left I found out that some of them had their Bachelor's of medicine and surgery and not a MD. They are still referred to as doctors. This did not change the respect I had for them and continued to call them Dr.
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I completely agree, thank you for helping solidify my argument! I hope everyone reads this post seeing as I'm sure nobody read my earlier posts on the exact same information. Oh, and I would expect someone to call a physician of any type a Doctor, but I was just suggesting (and I should have stated this) that if Doctors had never been awarded Medical Doctorates and more like Bachelors or Masters how would society react? Because it's implemented in our society so heavily that Physician=Doctor, I'm not even sure what the answer would be. But I would love to hear everyone else's take on it. But AWESOME POST PHARMANT!:D
 
folks, the title of Dr. simply means teacher in latin. It's a title earned by anyone who has reached the highest academic degree awardable (a doctorate) in a field of learning. Anyone who has a doctorate degree should be addressed as "dr. so and so".

Example: before pharmacy school, I was a medicinal chemist. Dr. is how we address all Ph.D colleagues in non-casual settings.

Now I know everybody has seen an Indiana Jones movie. Remember friends and foes alike call him "Dr. Jones". That's because he has a doctorate in archeology, not because he medically treat ancient mummies. :p
 
Has a pharmacist been addressed as "Dr. so-and-so" from your experiences? The pharmacists at the hospital I work at always refer to themselves by their first name while communication with other personnel in the hospital, even those with PharmD rather than a Bachelor's.
 
The word "doctor" is transitioning from describing the traditional physician to all healthcare professionals with their doctorate. In the hospital I worked at we called the MD and DO's physicians. I addressed the Pharmacist (PharmD) as doctor, as it was listed on his badge. Most old time pharmacists are Rph's ( with Bpharm), so the practice of pharmacy as a whole has not made the transition to Dr. XXXX. Once the majority of pharmacists have their PharmD's, pharmacists will be referred to as Dr. XXXX in the clinical or retail setting.
 
fhx06 said:
Has a pharmacist been addressed as "Dr. so-and-so" from your experiences? The pharmacists at the hospital I work at always refer to themselves by their first name while communication with other personnel in the hospital, even those with PharmD rather than a Bachelor's.
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in the hospital, there will be too much confusion if everybody who has a doctorate are being called doctors. Next thing you can't tell if a person is a physician, pharmacist, optometrist, dentist, social worker, biologist, or even a chaplin. LOL.
 
Thats why you specify, " I need a surgeon, physician, pharmacist, dentist, chaplain, etc" But when you address each you say Dr. XXXX, and they can be recognized by the last name.
 
English is the only language that equates physican=Doctor. And there aren't that many countries where entry-level medical degree is "doctor of medicine" - in most, you have to do a lot of additional work before you become a "doctor of medicine" as opposed to just a "physician". The debate is therefore worthless and only serves to tickle the egos of a few. :D
 
Hmm...we've been going in circle for how long huh? lol :smuggrin::D:smuggrin:
 
civex said:
lol, makes me think of the first day of calculus. Professor says, " I don't have my doctorate,so you can't call me doctor, but if you'd like you can call me master."
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sweet!!!:laugh::laugh::laugh:
 
dangerdog said:
in the hospital, there will be too much confusion if everybody who has a doctorate are being called doctors. Next thing you can't tell if a person is a physician, pharmacist, optometrist, dentist, social worker, biologist, or even a chaplin. LOL.
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Oh no! How are we going to distinguish people being called "Mr." and "Mrs." and "Ms."...there is so much of them!
 
As everyone here knows, the profession of pharmacy is rapidly changing. As such, we as pharmacists must change along with it. Pharmacists perform many tasks in today's society but we're known best for dispensing medication. As technology has advanced, dispensation is gradually being taken over by robots and we will continually be challenged to prove our relevance to both other health care practitioners and to society itself.

This is why we must begin to take ourselves seriously by requesting that we be referred to as Dr. XXXX in professional settings. Honestly, if we don't consider ourselves to be the professionals that we are, then who will? This is precisely what the American Association of Colleges of Pharmacy were thinking when they mandated that the BS in Pharmacy be replaced with the Doctor of Pharmacy degree. Antimony stated earlier that, as the BS pharmacists retire and PharmDs replace them, there will be a greater tendency for pharmacists to refer to themselves as the doctors that they are. After reading this thread, I'm relieved that future pharmacists will have a greater sense of pride in their profession. This will bolster our workforce, increase morale and ensure that pharmacists continue to have a place within the health care team.
 
Yeah with the amount of clinical training pharmacists are getting along with the level of knowledge they possess, being referred to as a doctor after receiving a PharmD seems more than reasonable. I think Antimony is right about the whole BS and PharmD distinction, and who knows, maybe in a few years pharmacists will be widely addressed as "Doctor xxxx" and such. As for morale, I hope that pharmacists do not require that title to boost their morale, but I can understand how a situation like that would be a little discouraging. As long as the professionals working in healthcare treat each other with some level of respect, I think we all can have a happier career... but that's just me.

If we do start referring ourselves as doctors... can I be addressed as "the Love Doctor?" :D
 
fhx06 said:
Yeah with the amount of clinical training pharmacists are getting along with the level of knowledge they possess, being referred to as a doctor after receiving a PharmD seems more than reasonable. I think Antimony is right about the whole BS and PharmD distinction, and who knows, maybe in a few years pharmacists will be widely addressed as "Doctor xxxx" and such. As for morale, I hope that pharmacists do not require that title to boost their morale, but I can understand how a situation like that would be a little discouraging. As long as the professionals working in healthcare treat each other with some level of respect, I think we all can have a happier career... but that's just me.

If we do start referring ourselves as doctors... can I be addressed as "the Love Doctor?" :D
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The biggest hold back is still -- most pharmacists out there are not Pharm.D's. Given a person work about 40 years in their life, it will take another 10 years for the majority to be doctorates. Even then, there will be confusion who's a doctorate and who's not for another 20 years beyond that.

A profession changes slowly. I suspect most of us will not commonly called doctors until around the year 2030. But personally, I don't think being called a doctor by joe-blow the patient is as important as being recognized by fellow health professionals as a doctorate holder.

This is happening as we speak, especially for clinical pharmacists. Now a days, with a collaborative agreements with physicians, pharmacists could prescribe, which is how some of the clinics operate. The amount of theraputic info we had to learn practically means -- if you can give me a diagnosis (a non-rare condition that's treated with drugs), I know how to treat it.
 
confettiflyer said:
hahah, if you do initials and your name is laura anar or something, your initials will be L.A., P.D.

I can think of a few people that don't like it. I kind of like PharmD. It's descriptive. If you told people you had a PD, PmD, or other...you'd have to explain that it's pharmacy. Sometimes when I see DNP I have to think that it's for nursing and not some random government agency.
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omg, u r so funny :laugh:.
i like PharmD also. but i would like to have mds acknowledge that there are other professionals besides them that deserve to be called doctors.
 
Hels2007 said:
English is the only language that equates physican=Doctor. And there aren't that many countries where entry-level medical degree is "doctor of medicine" - in most, you have to do a lot of additional work before you become a "doctor of medicine" as opposed to just a "physician". The debate is therefore worthless and only serves to tickle the egos of a few. :D
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Hahaha...exactly! I have two cousins who graduated from universities in the UK with their MBBS (Bachelors of Science in Medicine) - neither went to grad or professional school (undergrad med school is not considered professional school there) but are still called Dr. XXX (physician). In order for them to even obtain an MD title they must first complete 4 years of grad school w/ a thesis defense. Also, both my parents have PhD's in non-medical fields and are called "doctor" by their colleagues and underlings alike. It is an earned professional title; and if someone earns the title of "doctor" then who are we to say they shouldn't use it. If you personally don't want to... feel free, but try not to judge, aye? :p

Only in the US do so many folks insist that MD=doctor only. Kind of silly really... :D
 
I think one of the problems here is when people try to find what "doctor" means in any dictionary, it will simply translate into "physician" in their languages. Also, I haven't tried this, but try to make a movie or a clip about doctors specifically, then have dentists and pharmacists in it ONLY, see what people saying :)

I rather pple call me my name, but I can use my title Dr. to joke around with my family
 
MollyBrown said:
It is an earned professional title; and if someone earns the title of "doctor" then who are we to say they shouldn't use it.
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I could not agree more. The title of doctor is earned through experience and expertise that comes with the degree. Having a degree and not having the knowledge is the same as a fancy piece of paper you can buy at the $1 store. You would not call a quack MD a doctor nor would you call an incompetent PharmD a doctor either.
 
Back from the dead, the thread rises!! It's alive!! It's alive!!!
 
Just to keep the fun going...

It would seem that at commencement, most schools call every single graduate "doctor" when their names are announced as they cross the stage.
 
Kirbypuff said:
Technically you are a doctor, but do you really need to be called that?

I think it's cooler to humbly refrain from calling yourself Dr. blahdidah and insisting people to call you that.

Dr. Kirbypuff
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then again, if bill cosby calls himself dr. cosby....
 
trailrider400 said:
I would never insist on being called Dr. for all the reasons stated here. And those who are so 'touchy' about it have some kind of issue. I overall would prefer to be called by my first name. But then again if someone wanted to be formal and address me by my last name then I would want them use my correct title as doctor. If you earned a doctorate in anything and someone wanted to be formal and use your last name it would be kind of disrespectful to call them Mr. or Mrs. rather than acknowledging their title of Dr.
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I agree with this. The tittle of a PharmD is Doctor of Pharmacy. Many people take it out of context. I rather people still refer to me by first name, but once I graduate, if you dont feel comfortable enough to adress me by first name, then yes, I wold expect to adress me as Doctor. Doesnt matter to me. The important part is that I am respected and my hard work is realized.
 
So, let's talk about the future. We all need to step up to the game and pass some bills that gives us more authoritative values + residencies after rotations. We will be called Dr. XXX someday without a hint of tackling egotistic doc's and clear up the misunderstood context :D
 
AngelaCL said:
Lawyers have JDs, but I've yet to hear a lawyer (without an MD or Ph. D) insist on being called "doctor". I think it's inappropriate for non-MDs to call themselves "doctor" in a health care setting, as that + white coat is going to make patients think you are an MD, when you are not. And if you are in retail pharmacy and insist on being called doctor, people are going to think you are a douchebag.

Yeah, we're all earning or have earned our doctorates, and can all technically use the title of "doctor." But besides your own mother, don't be surprised if no body wants to call you that.
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I have to admit that this is very much how I feel, especially where the medical field is concerned as it may mislead/confuse patients. I also feel that professors etc shouldn't be called Dr either. I do agree that people most definitely deserve respect for getting a PhD, or whatever other type of doctorate, but I really wish there were better terms for each one. I Personally feel that the title "doctor" should be reserved for physicians - MD or DO. Then professors with PhDs could be called Master, or something. Some other, respectable title. Other doctorates would have their own title as well. Just my personal thoughts on it.
 
HurricaneKatt said:
I have to admit that this is very much how I feel, especially where the medical field is concerned as it may mislead/confuse patients. I also feel that professors etc shouldn't be called Dr either. I do agree that people most definitely deserve respect for getting a PhD, or whatever other type of doctorate, but I really wish there were better terms for each one. I Personally feel that the title "doctor" should be reserved for physicians - MD or DO. Then professors with PhDs could be called Master, or something. Some other, respectable title. Other doctorates would have their own title as well. Just my personal thoughts on it.
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No. In academia it's appropriate to call a PhD "doctor".

lol @ master

That's silly.

MD aren't special little snowflakes.
 
That being said, since we don't have specific titles, if a person has a doctorate it's respectful to call them Dr. (As long as they aren't in a medical setting.)
 
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