SergeGainsbourg

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I'm a new GS intern. I'm wondering if I can spend my vacation time moonlighting in an ER or something. Is that possible? Would I need to get my own liability insurance or would I be covered by the hospital I moonlighted for? How do people go about getting ML jobs?

I know it may or may not be allowed by my PD but I'd like to find out if it's even possible before I ask him. Thanks.
 

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SergeGainsbourg said:
I'm a new GS intern. I'm wondering if I can spend my vacation time moonlighting in an ER or something. Is that possible? Would I need to get my own liability insurance or would I be covered by the hospital I moonlighted for? How do people go about getting ML jobs?

I know it may or may not be allowed by my PD but I'd like to find out if it's even possible before I ask him. Thanks.
You would need an unrestricted license to moonlight. To my knowledge, no state will license anyone before completing internship. Check with your state medical board, though. If you can get a permanent license, post your other questions again.
 

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SergeGainsbourg said:
I'm a new GS intern. I'm wondering if I can spend my vacation time moonlighting in an ER or something. Is that possible? Would I need to get my own liability insurance or would I be covered by the hospital I moonlighted for? How do people go about getting ML jobs?

I know it may or may not be allowed by my PD but I'd like to find out if it's even possible before I ask him. Thanks.
are you sh**tting me?

i'm sorry, but i can't imagine how one would have the time, or the energy, to moonlight as an intern. i'm reading/preparing/sleeping/doing laundry/getting groceries/catching up with family who think i'm dead/etc. with every spare second of my days. i can't imagine a program that is that much different.

but that's just me. i'm having fun, but there is NO WAY IN HELL i can imagine an intern having any time in which to have another job. whew, that's just crazy talk.

that aside, i think there are licensing issues. we are on limited licenses for now, which i think forbid moonlighting. here we can change status around year 3, i think.
 
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Pir8DeacDoc

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Initially I had the same reaction as geekgirl. However, keep in mind that he said during his vacation time. I'd bet he wanted to take one weekend of his vacation week and make a grand or so.


I think the licensing issue is gonna get you unfortunately.
 
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I'm pretty sure you need to finish intern year and pass Step 3. AND have it be approved by your PD.
 
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SergeGainsbourg

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Pir8DeacDoc said:
Initially I had the same reaction as geekgirl. However, keep in mind that he said during his vacation time. I'd bet he wanted to take one weekend of his vacation week and make a grand or so.
Exactly. Thanks.
 
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SergeGainsbourg

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Blade28 said:
I'm pretty sure you need to finish intern year and pass Step 3. AND have it be approved by your PD.
I know for sure it would have to be approved by my PD. I want to find out if it's even feasable.

I'm planning on turning my attention to Step 3 after the absite so that would rule out working during my first vacation block. But it's likely that I could have my step 3 out of the way before my second vacation block.

Anyone know if I need to pass step 3 AND complete internship to moonlight, or do I just have to pass step 3?

Thanks.
 
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SergeGainsbourg

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geekgirl said:
are you sh**tting me?

i'm sorry, but i can't imagine how one would have the time, or the energy, to moonlight as an intern. i'm reading/preparing/sleeping/doing laundry/getting groceries/catching up with family who think i'm dead/etc. with every spare second of my days. i can't imagine a program that is that much different.

but that's just me. i'm having fun, but there is NO WAY IN HELL i can imagine an intern having any time in which to have another job. whew, that's just crazy talk.

that aside, i think there are licensing issues. we are on limited licenses for now, which i think forbid moonlighting. here we can change status around year 3, i think.
Ha ha. No I'm not talking about taking an extra job during internship.

I'm just talking about moonlighting during vacation time.
 

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SergeGainsbourg said:
Anyone know if I need to pass step 3 AND complete internship to moonlight, ?

YES


The issue here is getting an unrestricted medical license. I don't know of any state that will give you one of these without finishing internship. Check with your state medical board to make sure. (Some states require more than 1 year - I know Illinois is 2.)
 

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To get your license is not a simple thing. Besides completing step 3, your intern year, etc... You will need to complete a bunch of paperwork, and pay about a thousand dollars (give or take a couple hundred). Then there is a substantial wait while the FSMB, and your state medical boards talk to each other, and verify your credentials. The whole process is long, and somewhat tedious. It requires a good deal of persistence. Getting licensed is not as simple as passing step 3, and voila you're licensed.

As far as moonlighting goes, check with some of your ER resident pals. My friends in the ER are the only residents I know of who moonlight, and they know all the tricks of the trade in my part of the country. You can make upwards of 120 dollars/hour covering a country ER. Pretty much once you have your license it's just a matter of phoning hospitals and offerring your services.
 

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I doubt if you'd be prepared to work in the ED independently with just a few months of internship behind you, either. Which is why you are usually required to at least complete a year of internship before you can get a license. Fee usually is in the $1000-$1500 range. Plus you have to get a DEA number, which is another $300 or so.
 

SurgeryChef

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Maybe I'm just stupid, but if you moonlight, aren't you in fact the "attending"? How in hell are you smart enough to play ER attending as an INTERN???!!!
 

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SurgeryChef said:
Maybe I'm just stupid, but if you moonlight, aren't you in fact the "attending"? How in hell are you smart enough to play ER attending as an INTERN???!!!

Depends on where you are moonlighting and their expecations. For example, yes at many institutions, ie, "Doc in the Box" type places, you would be considered the attending, with no back-up. However, other places (especially small community hospitals without residents or sufficient residents to cover the call schedule) need residents to moonlight to cover the call schedule. YOu have attending back-up (although generally not in house).
 

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My experience with moonlighting is that you function as an attending physician. If you go to a small-town ER, chances are you will have no back-up for ER work, and if you are lucky, you will have some primary care physicians in the town who will admit to the hospital when you have a patient that needs to stay. Plan on transferring out to larger hospitals cases that require ortho/ENT/cardiac type work.

While you are getting your feet wet, try to find a place that has double coverage. The best places are those that have a staff ER doc on duty all the time, and you moonlight on a swing shift, or provide some type of secondary coverage. This arrangement is what the ACEP has pushed for over the past several years, and their position is that only ER residents should be permitted to moonlight in ERs - with double coverage. This was their position a few years ago, perhaps it has changed.

Missouri requires the completion of step III, and the completion of your internship to be eligible for a license. Though there is a fair amount of paperwork involved, it is not impossible. ERAS is much more cumbersome.

Finally, don't forget that most places hire you as a private contractor to do their ER work. No taxes are neither withheld, nor social security. You can, however, deduct expenses related to your working as business expenses in many cases - get someone familiar with tax law to help if you have questions.

If you are an intern, and plan to moonlight, use this chance to prepare your credentials. You will need to demonstrate that you can put in lines and tubes, that you can handle a sick child, work up a trauma patient, and (heaven forbid) deliver a baby. Hospitals will ask you to fill out a "privilages" card, indicating the procedures you are able to perform. If you are going to be putting in tubes and lines, you had better be able to prove that you are proficient in doing so, in case you have to defend yourself in a case. Your case logs will be important if something were to come up.
 
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