Can they MAKE you take their insurance plan?

[gstrub]

So I had an interesting discussion yesterday about the possibility that, given the current possibility of a government sponsored public insurance plan, many doctors just won't accept that insurance. Now I've heard that there is talk of making doctors who accept Medicare also accept this plan, but what about doctors who don't? In other words, is there a possibility that the federal government might somehow FORCE doctors into accepting patients with their insurance plan?

For me, if I am running a business, I am not going to accept insurance from patients that will pay me less than the cost of said service. That's idiotic. But the question this individual had for me was, "what if they make it a law that in order to practice medicine, you have to accept this plan?" My answer was, of course, no one can force me to provide a service at the end of a gun, but I imagine if hoards of doctors refuse to accept this insurance, and many new doctors start to open cash only practices, then BHO will say "well that's not fair! you HAVE to treat these people! you healthy people have to buy this insurance because we have to pay for the poor!" and blah blah blah. It's enough to make my BP get into the range where diuretics may be required soon....

Someone reassure me that it would be unconstitutional or something for that to happen...please...

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[LADoc00]

if they simply gave the new patients bona fide Medicare numbers and accounts, there would be no way to stop it.

So yeah, the government is nearly infinitely powerful to force change here.

Here is the kicker and its GOOD: If you decided to stop accepting Medicare, you are actually disallowed from billing Medicare patients for something like 2 years as a "cool down" period. LOL!!! Once you are in, you are TRAPPED.

Welcome to the good old USA.

 

[gstrub]

Well that does it. No medicare patients for me. I need to find a small ski town in need of a cash only otorhinolaryngologist or something similar...

I'm just hoping that if lots of us just start dropping medicare/government insured patients, the Wesley Mooches in the government don't somehow find a way to make it impossible to practice (fines, taxes, licensure problems, etc).

 

[RGMSU]

None of that will make any difference. If the government lowers their reimbursements on a regular basis, insurance companies will do the same. It's a slippery slope. Nobody wants to pay doctors more than the minimum they can get away with basically. And doctors keep tolerating it.

 

[gstrub]

It will make a difference if I run a pay up front practice.

 

[RGMSU]

Whether a pay up front practice will be sustainable or not based on volume would then become the question. If the government starts mandating everyone be on an insurance plan or a government option, who will be left to pay up front? Even now it's difficult to get the kind of volume to run a cash only practice. Even more so after changes occur. I suspect increasing patient volume by more physician extenders (NPs and PAs) is what more physicians are likely to do, if it comes to that. Then, of course, you have to hope that Congress doesn't give them independent practice rights. If they do, you just trained your replacement and gave them all your patients. Honestly, though, I don't think the government can pass something to force physicians to accept certain plans. Whether it will really be financially advantageous for physicians to reject such plans is another matter altogether.

 

[Miami_med]

If they want to, they can simply make accepting the plan a requirement of licensure. If they ever feel that there is a problem, they will do exactly that.

 

[gstrub]

If they want to, they can simply make accepting the plan a requirement of licensure. If they ever feel that there is a problem, they will do exactly that.

Wouldn't that be up to the states? Honestly Miami....that's exactly what I DIDN'T want to hear.

 

[RGMSU]

Now, I'm usually a pessimist about all this, but I have to be a little positive. They're not going to change licensing requirements. If doctors are forced to except any type of plan, it will be out of their own financial necessity, more than likely. Not that that makes it any better, but it won't be nearly so blatant as - "Do this or lose your license." At least not in my estimation.

 

[LADoc00]

Folks, once the government decides to force us into their arms, there is no way to stop it, literally, short of armed resistence. Now, if you are armed and plan to resist, PM me.


Disclaimer: I know nothing of the Rebel Alliance(tm) and/or resistence movements currently taking shape within US borders.

 

[seelee]

I am not advocating armed resistance...yet. But I do think that doctors need to organize. If the vast majority of doctors moved to cash only practices (forcing people to go to the insurance companies for reimbursements themselves), then the people/government would have no choice but to listen to us.

Physicians need to realize that altruism, and being societies bitch are not the same thing. If society is calling for us to sacrifice everything so that they can glut themselves on our labors, then the time has come for us to stand up and say no.

 

[RGMSU]

I am pretty good with a 357 mag revolver. When you guys get ready to form a posse, we'll meet down here in Texas, take to horseback, and kidnap every doctor and medical student we find to make them see things our way. This is starting to sound way too much like a bar discussion over beer. I'm just not sure that most docs/med students understand that we are well on our way to becoming everybody's bitches already.

 

[seelee]

I am pretty good with a 357 mag revolver. When you guys get ready to form a posse, we'll meet down here in Texas, take to horseback, and kidnap every doctor and medical student we find to make them see things our way. This is starting to sound way too much like a bar discussion over beer. I'm just not sure that most docs/med students understand that we are well on our way to becoming everybody's bitches already.

How do you think the American Revolution started?

 

[MOHS_01]

I am pretty good with a 357 mag revolver. When you guys get ready to form a posse, we'll meet down here in Texas, take to horseback, and kidnap every doctor and medical student we find to make them see things our way. This is starting to sound way too much like a bar discussion over beer. I'm just not sure that most docs/med students understand that we are well on our way to becoming everybody's bitches already.

UPGRADE. Do it now (before you are placed on a no-fly list by Rahm's reincarnation of the Gestapo). Revolvers are terribly slow to reload and leave you underarmed....... Go with a .40 or 10mm (I would go with .40 -- high cap mags with effective knockdown, standard civil service caliber so ammo will be more plentiful and easier to find).

 

[RGMSU]

Hold on now. I have no problem with semi-autos, but don't start disrespecting the revolver here. The revolver will never die. Utterly reliable, durable. The legendary 357 mag cartridge will never fade away either. Underarmed with 357 mag? Don't ever say such a thing. Plus, it all fit into my cowboy renegade theme there. Incidentally, though, I've been thinking about buying a Glock 40 caliber though to diversify my range trips. You can buy tactical lights to attach to Glocks and all kinds of neat crap. Not, of course, that this has anything to do with medicine, unless one of us gives up on seeing patients altogether and becomes a forensic pathologist. Medical examiners don't have to worry about insurance plans at all. Way to hang loose and still bring it back around to the thread topic - see how that works?

 

[MOHS_01]

Yes, revolvers are nostalgic and less apt to malfunction.... but I'll take my chances with 14 or 15 rounds and 28-30 to spare in short order. You may be surprised when you check out the failure rate of the Glock when fed good ammo. I have a Beretta that is pretty nice too. Nothing to do with medicine, agreed.

 

[Instatewaiter]

UPGRADE. Do it now (before you are placed on a no-fly list by Rahm's reincarnation of the Gestapo). Revolvers are terribly slow to reload and leave you underarmed....... Go with a .40 or 10mm (I would go with .40 -- high cap mags with effective knockdown, standard civil service caliber so ammo will be more plentiful and easier to find).

This year Glock just came out with a 10mm that has interchangeable barrels so the same gun can be used with 10mm and 40cal shells and i think 357sig.
It's a pretty good option if you have the $ to spare.

 

[efex101]

**** that, just get yourselves a M16 or better yet a 60 cal...he he

 

[RGMSU]

Yes, revolvers are nostalgic and less apt to malfunction.... but I'll take my chances with 14 or 15 rounds and 28-30 to spare in short order. You may be surprised when you check out the failure rate of the Glock when fed good ammo. I have a Beretta that is pretty nice too. Nothing to do with medicine, agreed.

Do you collect handguns? I'm seriously considering getting started in that. Gradually though because it is expensive. My absolute favorite pieces aesthetically are stainless steel or nickel plated revolvers with custom wood grips. As far as Berettas, I have a soft spot for the Beretta 92. Not sure what I think about 9mm though. Of course, Sig is the queen jewel but also $$$. I'm the old-fashioned theoretical type who believes that, all else equal, shot placement is king. If you get into a gunfight with somebody who is excellent with a five-shot snub revolver, chances are they can send five people to the morgue with it. And my guess is nobody would volunteer to test it out and maybe be one of the five getting zipped up in the old plastic bag. Of course, I've never been in nor expect to be in a gunfight, so this is all theory. I would love to have a stainless steel sig p220 in 45 cal but hate to drop $1,000. The most dangerous dude is the one good with a rifle and scope who can hit you when you can't even see him. Not even an AK47 is going to help you much there. I hear that the majority of gunshot deaths are still reported by medical examiners to result from the diminutive 22 cal, so go figure?

As far as public uproar about health insurance, you couldn't get as many people to take the streets over health insurance as you could who showed up over the death of Michael Jackson!

 

[malpractician]

I love america, the thread started out "can they MAKE you..." and now we're talking about guns and revolution.

There is hope for us yet gentlemen, there is hope. (my paperwork is clearing on a S&W 9mm M&P glock)

 

[MOHS_01]

Do you collect handguns? I'm seriously considering getting started in that. Gradually though because it is expensive. My absolute favorite pieces aesthetically are stainless steel or nickel plated revolvers with custom wood grips. As far as Berettas, I have a soft spot for the Beretta 92. Not sure what I think about 9mm though. Of course, Sig is the queen jewel but also $$$. I'm the old-fashioned theoretical type who believes that, all else equal, shot placement is king. If you get into a gunfight with somebody who is excellent with a five-shot snub revolver, chances are they can send five people to the morgue with it. And my guess is nobody would volunteer to test it out and maybe be one of the five getting zipped up in the old plastic bag. Of course, I've never been in nor expect to be in a gunfight, so this is all theory. I would love to have a stainless steel sig p220 in 45 cal but hate to drop $1,000. The most dangerous dude is the one good with a rifle and scope who can hit you when you can't even see him. Not even an AK47 is going to help you much there. I hear that the majority of gunshot deaths are still reported by medical examiners to result from the diminutive 22 cal, so go figure?

As far as public uproar about health insurance, you couldn't get as many people to take the streets over health insurance as you could who showed up over the death of Michael Jackson!

Sorry, I missed this post.

I have never considered myself a collector, but I do have an assortment. I would have more but don't really need them and ammo is getting harder to come by and more expensive . I have a couple of work horses (Ruger P95DC .45 and a Beretta PX4 Storm .40), two .22 target pistols, an older .22/.22mag interchangeable revolver, and I sold my Sig P220 Super Match as I never shot it much and my brother kept drooling over it. I will probably pick up a Colt 1911 style model before it is all said and done.

The handguns constitute a small portion of the "portfolio".

 

[RGMSU]

Hah, maybe we're all a little more dangerous than I thought. Can't believe how many folks in these forums are admitting to packing some heat. Never knew so many docs were gun toters. Better practice up - if you can't make a living being a doc anymore in the future, you can always take up bank robbery on the side

 

[Paddington]

Obama will rape you until you love him.

 

[masterofmonkeys]

If they want to, they can simply make accepting the plan a requirement of licensure. If they ever feel that there is a problem, they will do exactly that.

bingo!

gstrub, ask the states how that whole 'state' thing worked re: drinking age, MADD, and interstate funding.

The federal government provides too much money to state governments. All the federal govt has to do is threaten to yank that line of credit, and cave the states will.

edit: 24" bull-barrel AR-15 and 22mag NAA mini revolver here. Also lifetime NRA member.