Canadian student wondering about US medical schools

[Michael W48]

Hi,

I am seriously considering applying to an American medical school but heard it is very difficult for Canadian students to get accepted. Does anyone know which American medical schools are the easiest to get into for Canadians? Does anyone know what a Canadian would need as a GPA and on his mcats to have a very good shot at an American school? If there are any Canadians who are currently attending or have attented an American medical school out there - I would really appreciate some input. What schools did you apply to? Why did you pick these schools? Are they know for accepting Canadians? I have a 85% at Queen's University after two years and will be taking the MCAT after third year. Does anyone know what my chances would be. I would rather save time and energy going down to the Caribbean right away if my chances at an American school are limited (Please note: don't want to apply to Canadian medical schools for various reasons). My final goal is to practice as an ER physician in the states.

Thank you

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[moo]

http://pub125.ezboard.com/bpremed101

Check out the above and go to the forums for "Applying to American schools." There is a lot of informative information there.

 

[RYSA]

As a Canadian who is near the end of my journey at a US med school....anxiously awaiting match results...I am interested in knowing just how many of us are out there that posts to this site.

Also moo..I've had a chance to look at your posts here and on ezboard...mostly accurate info provided, but a little simplified, because once you have been through it like I have...then you know that getting the coveted H1 visa is...although easier for a US med grad...is still a feat unto itself.... There are still many univerisities and non-profit hospitals who still have big qualms about sponsoring for the visa...regardless of the "no cap" situation and our being able to use OPT during your internship year

However.... in the end...my only advice is to only seek the H1 visa and do not even consider the J1 visa...waste of time due to all the restrictions and limitations associated with this visa.

 

[Michael W48]

Hi RYSA,

I am grateful for your reply and excited to hear from a Canadian who is graduating from a US medical school. I am hoping you could answer a few questions.

Why did you choose an American school?
What were your GPA and MCAT mark and what do you think I would need to get into an American school (I don't care which one it is) - I have been getting a wide range of MCAT scores and GPA's that I would need and I was wondering if you might have an opinion on this. Do you think I have a good chance with a 3.7 GPA and anyting over a 28 on the MCAT. If I am going to spend to more years here I want to be VERY sure that I will have a VERY good chance at an American med school. What is your take on the DO thing.

Thank you

 

[moo]

Hey RHYSA is there a list of hospitals and institutions that will sponsor you for the H1b?

 

[Jspev]

Hey Rysa,

I'm also at med school in the US and am Canadian. Rysa, congratulations on almost being done in school. Do you think you're going to get an H1 visa? I was wondering if you could explain the process that you've had to go through and how feasible it is. Look forward to hearing from you. Thanks.

 

[Clue]

I am a Canadian graduating from a US DO school. Alot of programs you apply to will tell you straight up that they only do J1's. Some won't even give you an interview. If you call them up ahead of time, almost every program will tell you that they don't do H1's.
A good approach I found is to go to the interview and if things are going well, mention that you need to speak with someone about visas. And that most programs are offering an H-1. I am applying to Family medicine and this approach worked well for me. PM me if you have any more questions.

 

[Renovar]

I am also a Canadian, 4th year US allopathic med student, and have recently matched in internal medicine with an institution that will give me my H1B.

I agree, even for Canadian who is USMG, you are not on the same footing as most native AMG's because practically speaking you can ONLY take H1B - Canada screws you over for J1 sponsorship, and if you get it, congratulations, you are screwed too. Basically that cuts my programs in 1/2 (about 50% of hospitals will only do J1, the other half will give me an option of H1B or J1). Hospitals that dont sponsor J1s, no matter how good they are, you can't match there. I have turned down categorical interviews at elite institutions such as Wash U, UCSF, UTSW, UCSD and such, because their insistance of non-H1B sponsorship. Dont waste your time and money traveling and interviewing there, you JUST CAN'T TAKE a J1.

But on the other side of the flip, make sure you call every program's coordinator (after you get an interview invite) and ask them nicely if they will do H1B, and explain to them your situation as an USMG rather than IMG (which most will stick with their J1 only rule). There are at least 2 programs that stated "J1 only" on their website agreed to give me H1B after I explained to them my unique situation.

The bottom line is, if you are trying to match at popular, medium/low competitive specialties (FP, IM, peds, anesthesia, psych, etc) and you are US grad, you should be able to get H1B no problem. Anything more competitive you will have to be damn well qualified, and be damn sure the program knows what to do because those competitive programs dont usually deal with visa issues too much, as they usually match the best of the US grads anyways.

NOW, if you are Canadian IMG (ie. Carib, Aussie,etc) your road will be a lot more difficult than the average IMG because again, as a Canadian, you can ONLY take a H1B, and as opposed to the US grads, you dont have the negotiation power of the US-awarded diploma. If you decide to attend an international school, especially one that has a negative connotation for taking USMG's (ie. the carribs), you better keep the above in mind. The key to securing H1B is 1. ridiculous grades, like try to get honor or A's in all med school classes, 2. ridiculous board scores. I am talking at least 230, 240+ if possible - lots of successful IMG's have 99/99 step 1/2 scores - you are competing with the boatloads of Indian grads who have these kind of scores, who is applying to residency for the fifth time, and would gladly do free labor, sell their soul, and most importantly, take a J1, to get that categorical program. Why should a program take you and your H1B-only problem when they have boatloads of these people will be happy with a J1? and 3. good letters in US clinicals.

It can technically be done, but it's hard. Many of the FMG's you will run into are either American citizens who have no visa problems, or those from other countries, which their country will write them that sponsor letter for them to take a J1 which we as Canadians dont have. Applying to residency as an FMG is hard enough as it is, add to that H1B only? Your chances are about as good as the chance of hell freezing over. You can maximize your chance by doing the above, but there is ABSOLUTELY no guarantee. And with the kind of tuition/fee you pay to go to one of those offshore schools, wouldn't a guarantee be nice?

The only real guarantee is a US MD or DO school. I would suggest trying to study hard, do a post-bacc if you must to improve your GPA and nail the MCAT's and try to get into a US MD school, while apply to some DO schools as backup. I know it sounds bad to us Canadians, but DO in the US is a valuable degree that basically leads to the same licensure as MD's. Yes you pay a lot, but still less than any offshore, and your future path is a clear striaght-ahead after you're done. In your situation, 3.7+ undergrad GPA from a major Canadian institution coupled with 31+ MCAT and some EC's should give you enough numeric competitive edge to secure at least a DO if not an MD school admission in the US. Make sure apply to a gazillion places (I would suggest at least 25 private MD schools and 5 DO programs as back-up) and hope good things will happen.

~Renovar

 

[Michael W48]

Hi Renovar,

Thanks for the reply - it was very helpful. Now I am very worried about possibly going to the caribbean. I am confused too. I am currently in touch with five different canadians who went through St.Georges in the caribbean and are currently practicing medicine in the US or in residency. They all had descent med school and board scores but not great or amazing. They said that getting a residency isn't too hard if you have descent marks. The thing they said for me to worry about is the debt I will have.

You said that getting an H1-B and residency in the US from a caribbean school is almost impossible. Where did you hear this? I am in touch with one Canadian IMG from Ross who had descent boards and med school marks and got his 2nd pick for residency in the match and got accepted at 70% of the residencies that he interviewd at. All of the Canadians he graduated with had similar success. Do you know of somewhere that gives stats for Canadian IMG's from the caribbean and obtaining residencies in the US. I am not sure what to believe now and it would be nice to have some info to refer to. He said that the primary care residencies are not filled each year and there is not a problem as long as you interview at hospitals that sponsor H1-B's.

My uncle is a practicing ER physician in the states and he said that I would be better going the IMG route than the DO route
That's just his opinion but what do you think?

Anyway, if you could let me know why you think think going to the caribbean and applying to the US would be so impossible I would really appreciate it.

The other thing that get me is about 30% of the students at SGU are Canadians and it's been like that for the past few years. Why would so many Canadians be going to SGU if they weren't getting residencies at the end of the road. You would think that if it was impossible as you say it is then Canadians wouldn't be going to this school at all.

Thank you for your time

 

[Clue]

It is definitely not impossible for Canadians at Caribbean schools to land residency spots. It is just alot more difficult than US grads or US citizens who go offshore.
The Carribean VS DO thing has been beaten to death on these forums, you may want to do a search. The visa issues are definitely easier to deal with if you graduate from a DO school. Alot of people from my DO school have landed competitive ER residency spots all over the US.
In the end, though, you still have a DO after your name and still have to deal with all the negative perceptions that come with it. It's up to you if you want to put up with that headache or not.

 

[RYSA]

Renovar's post was mostly correct...however you need to no tht it is NOT impossible to get the J1 visa as a Canadian...I know many Canadians who are residents in the US that are on this type of visa...it is just a hassle (not impossible) to get the sponsor letter from the Canadian govt and you also have to pass the Canadian boards.

For me the hassle was not worth it...I knew as a first year US med student that I wanted the H1B, so I made sure that I was damn competitive...honored all first and second year classes, honored most clerkships Step I and II >230. You need to make yourself look like a superstar, so that the residency program will want you bad enough so that they will be willing to sponsor the H1 visa (and in many cases, programs that stated J1 only visa were willing to sponsor me for the H1 because they felt that I was a highly desired applicant). You need to do very well in med school, especially if you want a specialty that does not traditionally accept a lot of FMG's.

I matched at a top name institution who frequently does H1 visas and I am in the process of waiting for my OPT application approval, so that I can use the OPT from my F1 visa during my internship year, in the meanwhile my program will apply for the H1 visa.

Also, I obtained an interview and a confirmation from U of Washington in Seattle that they would sponsor the H1 visa.

 

[Michael W48]

Hey guys,

Thank you for the posts. Does anyone know of any Canadians from SGU or one of the Big three that have NOT matched or gotten a residency? I would be interested in hearing their story and knowing what they did wrong.

Thanks

Mike

 

[Flankstripe]

What's the rush? As I understand it, you're still in/have just finished your second year of undergrad, with decent marks. You have an excellent chance of getting into either a Canadian or a US med school (both of which will give you a high chance of matching into either a desirable specialty or a highly competitive location), and you want to throw this away by heading to the Caribbean??? It's one thing to apply to the Caribbean if you've applied and been rejected multiple times from US and Canadian med schools, but that isn't your situation.

Caribbean med students will tell you that you can easily match US residencies, and that's true, but in general, only for less competitive specialties. Carib students cannot, and do not match into competitive specialties with the same regularity that students from even the worst US schools can obtain. A US grad, even from the crummiest US school, still has first dibs on spots in Derm, Urology, ENT, Integrated Plastics, Ophtho, Rad Onc, Ortho Surg, Radiology, etc, compared with Carib grads.

Sure, as a Carib grad, you can match Internal Medicine, Peds, Family Medicine, General Surgery, Ob/GYN, Path, and reach into Emerg Med and Anesthesiology, but why would you want to put yourself into that position when you have the capability to get into a Canadian or US school which you can get at equivalent cost? Particularly when you're also a Canadian who comes with extra baggage associated with visa issues, which would be alleviated by attending either a US or Canadian school, and would only be exacerbated if you went to the Caribbean.

I would seriously recommend listening to the above posters, as they are the perfect position (recently matched, graduating US med students who happen to be Canadians) to give you advice from experience. I think you would be making a huge mistake to go directly into a Carib school without having tried the Canadian/US schools first, and I think most any med student (Canadian, US, or Carib) would tell you the same as well.

 

[moo]

Originally posted by Michael W48
Hey guys,

Thank you for the posts. Does anyone know of any Canadians from SGU or one of the Big three that have NOT matched or gotten a residency? I would be interested in hearing their story and knowing what they did wrong.

Thanks

Mike

You can get into A residency from SGU or any of the other caribs, even being Canadian. The question is do you really want to spend three or four years at a really crappy institution in the middle of nowhere. Trust me, don't go caribs. You have the grades and scores to get into a good US school, if you just wait a couple years. There's absolutely no rush.

 

[Renovar]

Originally posted by RYSA


Also, I obtained an interview and a confirmation from U of Washington in Seattle that they would sponsor the H1 visa.

UW Seattle - yes. Wash U STL (Barnes Jewish) - no.

 

[Thewonderer]

If you go to the Carribeans as a Canadian and want to get a residency spot in the US real bad, you will get one. There is no doubt about (assuming that you don't fail out). There are hundreds of unfilled residency spots across the US every year so if you are not picky about being limited to Family Medicine or other primary care fields, and don't mind going to any part of the US for training, you will get a spot.

As for getting H1B, I see no other way of obtaining one unless you go to an US med school and use OPT during the internship and spend that WHOLE year applying for H1B because it takes a while for the government to approve it. If you go to the Carribean and want H1B, the only way is to graduate from med school by May the year BEFORE you start residency or by Dec during the interview process. And then pass step III of USMLE right AFTER you graduate and sign outside the match early with a program you like. Then the program can take up to 5-6 months to help you apply H1B. Remember, you cannot take step III of USMLE until you graduate. So in May, once you graduate, even if you take step III right away, you cannot make it to the internship start date of mid- to late-June and have H1B approval in hand (it takes one month alone for them to grade your Step III!!!). therefore, if you go abroad for med school and want H1B only, then be ready to sacrifice a year after med school to take step III, do the interview tour and for the actual application of the visa.

Lastly, I don't think that you have to be SUPER competitive to get sponsored for H1B. Usually you get sponsored for H1B because your institution allows the department to sponsor you for H1B as a whole. If the institution does not sponsor H1B, then no matter how much your department wants you, you will not get H1B from them. On the other hand, once you make it to the interview stage of that department, if the institution sponsors H1B as a whole, then the department has no problem with that. So it is institution-dependent.

As for institutions that sponsor H1B if you graduate from US med school, that list would include UCLA, U of Washington, Partners (Brigham and MGH), Columbia, NYU, Mt. Sinai, Penn, Drexel, Duke (depends on every department), Emory.... Some that turned me down included Northwestern, BU and Tufts. BUT THEN plenty of the programs changed their answer after I told them that I am an American medical graduate. So you always always have to confirm with them 3 times and if the program directors are not familiar with that, go straight to the visa office for an answer.

 

[moo]

Thewonderer, that's weird Northwestern turned you down. I'm at Northwestern med school now (second year) and may want to stay here for residency. Does this mean they won't want to even take their own students? We have a pretty large international student body here even in our med school class.

 

[RYSA]

Lastly, I don't think that you have to be SUPER competitive to get sponsored for H1B. Usually you get sponsored for H1B because your institution allows the department to sponsor you for H1B as a whole. If the institution does not sponsor H1B, then no matter how much your department wants you, you will not get H1B from them. On the other hand, once you make it to the interview stage of that department, if the institution sponsors H1B as a whole, then the department has no problem with that. So it is institution-dependent.---thewonderer


Not true in every case....rules can be bended, especially if the program director has a lot of clout with the institution AND he/she feels that you are worth the effort. He/She will think you are more worth the effort if you are a very competitive applicant, compared to an average applicant. So I stand behind my claim that being very competitive can open more doors.... I know this from direct experience that this can be done. This whole process is very political and is not as clear cut and black and white as it appears.

 

[Renovar]

I like to agree with the above, only to add that given 2 candidates with same qualifications applying to a residency program, a US citizen USMG will always get the spot regardless, compared to anyone US or international grad, who needs a visa. And among those who needs a visa, they much prefer doing a J1 than an H1B.

So it may or may not matter if you are applying to non-competitive specialties. Yea, I agree, if you are applying to FP or IM out in some community/county hospital programs, I wouldn't be surprised if H1B is not a problem. Most AMG's dont want to go there, and you are competing against FMG's, then yea, you'll get it.

But dude, when you are neck and neck with a bunch of AOA's fighting for that coveted categorical surgery/rads/high-end IM spot, the fact that you need a visa (especially an H1B) is going to weight on you heavily. Sometimes it is determined by institution, sometimes by department, and in fact (as I realized through this past application cycle), many of those who are "willing to sponsor" wont consider your application on the same basis without regarding to the visa need. Some programs have 30-40 people applying to one spot, and some will easily consider someone else and cut you and your visa needs - I know this for fact because my dean of student made a phone call on my behalf for one of the interviews she felt I absolutely should have gotten (Northwestern) and that's what the PD told my dean. This applies to pre-interview and post-interview ranking. As I said before, even for institutions that sponsor, given approximately same qualification, they will rank one who doesn't need visa ahead of one that does.

 

[eugene8080]

Hi,

I'm a Canadian citizen and I'm just applying to medical schools now. I was just wondering. You have been talking about getting H1Bs to get residencies in the US. But the H1Bs expire after 7 years right? Two questions:

1) What do you do after 7 years and you want to stay in the US? I'm guessing if you want to stay in the US, you'd have to obtain US Citizenship or a Green Card right?

2) What if you wanted to return to Canada? What would you have to do to get back on track there? Would to have to redo all the exams? How do you qualify for a specialty in Canada then?

-Eugene

 

[docbill]

Hi,

I'm a Canadian citizen and I'm just applying to medical schools now. I was just wondering. You have been talking about getting H1Bs to get residencies in the US. But the H1Bs expire after 7 years right? Two questions:

1) What do you do after 7 years and you want to stay in the US? I'm guessing if you want to stay in the US, you'd have to obtain US Citizenship or a Green Card right?

2) What if you wanted to return to Canada? What would you have to do to get back on track there? Would to have to redo all the exams? How do you qualify for a specialty in Canada then?

-Eugene

1) After you H1B visa is up and you have an employer sponsoring you, you may be able to apply for green card. If you live in the US for a long period of time, you can apply for one. Don't worry they will never say... oh we need you but the 7 years is up.. so you must go now.

2) Coming to back to Canada after you have been working in the US, is not that difficult. Depending on what province you want to come back to. Assuming you did your USMLEs and got an ACGME residency and registered in the board of specialty in the US, you may be able to come to Ontario and work. BC is starting to change that, and QC you will have to do one year training there. NOW, that said, you may have to do some exams depending on other provinces. There are also special situations where the hospital (normally academic), will help you getting practice rights... not a billing number, but you work in the hospital and bill via hospital... it is a grey area.

 

[j802002]

What so impossible about getting a J1 as a Canadian. For example, do the Canadian boards, pass them, file the paperwork for a sponsorship letter in the fall, and then get the J1, do a 3 year US residency, go back to Canada for a fellowship (thus fulfilling the J1 return requirement) What's so ridiculous about that?

 

[BlondeCookie]

There is a radical sentiment that states that if you go to med school in Canada and then go on to practice in the USA, then you are one of the most despicable pieces of vile anywhere. So, same should be said. You use the USA med school system and take your skills over to Canada and you are an equivalent piece of scum.

Actually, I don't believe that. However, alot of non-stop chatterboxes on this thread do. So, beware. Just take what you read with a grain of salt and remember that these people don't represent Canada. You will get a fanatastic basis for your education in either the USA or Canada. Good luck.

 

[trustwomen]

There is a radical sentiment that states that if you go to med school in Canada and then go on to practice in the USA, then you are one of the most despicable pieces of vile anywhere. So, same should be said. You use the USA med school system and take your skills over to Canada and you are an equivalent piece of scum.

Actually, I don't believe that. However, alot of non-stop chatterboxes on this thread do. So, beware. Just take what you read with a grain of salt and remember that these people don't represent Canada. You will get a fanatastic basis for your education in either the USA or Canada. Good luck.

I see that you still don't "get it". I don't think anyone has any problems with Canadians who go to school in the US and then practice in Canada. After all, the US government does not subsidize their medical schools (some states do, but you have to be a state resident for that). What we "non-stop chatterboxes" (I respectfully refuse that characterization, by the way) object to is somebody getting a taxpayer-funded education here and then giving the fruits of their labours to the US. Those who wish to have a fully self-funded education abroad and then come here, no problem. (They may have a bit more trouble paying off their loans though.)

 

[at_hashmi]

Hi everyone,
I'm a canadian citizen and was interested in applying to medical school in the US. I was considering taking the DO route, but would also like to consider the traditional allopathic route. I was having some trouble determining which schools accept canadian students as it is not always explicitly stated on there websites (especially the DO schools). So far i've found the below schools which accept canadians, but am not to certain on a few of them. Since my gpa is not that high (3.5) i have not included the obvious ivy league schools as i figure i have no chance of getting in.
If any of you know of any schools which also accept canadians, or any of the ones listed below that do not accept canadians, it would be greatly appreciated.

DO Schools
Arizona College of Osteopathic Medicine of Midwestern University
Western University of Health Sciences College of Osteopathic Medicine of the Pacific
Des Moines University (Not sure?)
Chicago College of Osteopathic Medicine of Midwestern University
University of New England College of Osteopathic Medicine
Michigan State University College of Osteopathic Medicine
A. T. Still University-Kirksville College of Osteopathic Medicine (Not sure?)
University of Medicine and Dentistry of New Jersey School of Osteopathic Medicine
New York College of Osteopathic Medicine of New York Institute of Technology
Philadelphia College of Osteopathic Medicine
Lake Erie College of Osteopathic Medicine
Edward Via Virginia College of Osteopathic Medicine (Not sure?)

MD Schools
Howard University College of Medicine (washington, D.C)
University of Hawai'i (Not to sure?)
Rosalind Franklin University of Medicine (Chicago)
University of Kentucky (Not sure?)
University of Louisville (Also Not sure)
Michigan State University
Wayne State University (Detroit)
Albany Medical College (New york state)
University at Buffalo School of Medicine and Biomed science
Brody School of Medicine (North Carolina)
Jefferson Medical College (Philadelphia)
Meharry Medical College (Nashville) (Not sure?)
University of Texas at San Antonio (Not sure?)

 

[trustwomen]

If any of you know of any schools which also accept canadians, or any of the ones listed below that do not accept canadians, it would be greatly appreciated.

C'mon, man. You have a list: go to their websites. Email them. Geez.

 

[hoomsy]

C'mon, man. You have a list: go to their websites. Email them. Geez.

hehehe...

Hi everyone,
I'm a canadian citizen and was interested in applying to medical school in the US. If anyone can do my pre-med requirements, complete a Bachelors degree and of course cover any and all expenses for me I would really appreciate it.

My SIN is 390012910
My DOB: 03/11/83
My Favourite Colour: Purple.

I would like to apply to the following schools:

Harvard University
Sanford University
University of California Berkley
Columbia University
Darmouth Medical School (Safety)


Thanks!

Joe Canadian

 

[cheer_up]

My SIN is.....

Hey hoomsy

I'm not really sure if you've given your real SIN/Social Security Number or not. However, if it's real, then it's best that you don't state it on the SDN for the world to see to avoid identity theft. Maybe I'm just a bit paranoid after watching the Montel show yesterday where people stole other people's social security numbers and got the owners of these numbers into all sorts of financial problems. Just a word of caution

 

[hoomsy]

Hey hoomsy

I'm not really sure if you've given your real SIN/Social Security Number or not. However, if it's real, then it's best that you don't state it on the SDN for the world to see to avoid identity theft. Maybe I'm just a bit paranoid after watching the Montel show yesterday where people stole other people's social security numbers and got the owners of these numbers into all sorts of financial problems. Just a word of caution

Thanks.

You're bored too??? I've been watching too much TV myself. Finally got myself a job today!

 

[cheer_up]

Thanks.

You're bored too??? I've been watching too much TV myself. Finally got myself a job today!

Me bored????. Nope, I'm just too busy, stressing out and cramming for my dental board exam, to be bored . I don't really watch that much TV myself, actually. Just yesterday, I decided to watch a bit of TV since I was home and was a bit bored.
BTW, congrats, on your new job.

 

[hoomsy]

Me bored????. No, I'm just tooooo busy stressing out and studying for my dental board exams to be bored . I don't really watch that much TV myself, actually. Just yesterday, I decided to watch a bit of TV since I was home and was a bit bored.
BTW, congrats, on your new job.

I'm going nuts! I thought it would be a good idea to come back home to Boston and take the summer off before I start "Band Aid" school in August...ehh I'm SOOO bored!...So I got me a job

There's so much TV you can take!

 

[cheer_up]

I'm going nuts! I thought it would be a good idea to come back home to Boston and take the summer off before I start "Band Aid" school in August...ehh I'm SOOO bored!...So I got me a job

There's so much TV you can take!

Hey, you should try to enjoy your summer before the madness of med school starts. Take a vacation to your favourite place. But a job will keep ya busy.

 

[docbill]

DO SCHOOLS ACCEPTING CANADIANS

From when I applied 2 summers ago are the following.

Arizona College of Osteopathic Medicine of Midwestern University YES

Western University of Health Sciences COM YES

Des Moines University YES

Chicago College of Osteopathic Medicine of Midwestern University YES

University of New England College of Osteopathic Medicine (YES DEFINITELY SURE ABOUT THIS ONE)

Michigan State University College of Osteopathic Medicine (RARE And tuition is 48k)

A. T. Still University-Kirksville College of Osteopathic Medicine YES

University of Medicine and Dentistry of New Jersey School of Osteopathic Medicine NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO


New York College of Osteopathic Medicine of New York Institute of Technology NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

Philadelphia College of Osteopathic Medicine YES

Lake Erie College of Osteopathic Medicine YES

Edward Via Virginia College of Osteopathic Medicine I THINK NO.


MD Schools

Howard University College of Medicine (washington, D.C)

University of Hawai'i (Not to sure?)

Rosalind Franklin University of Medicine (Chicago)
University of Kentucky (Not sure?)

University of Louisville (Also Not sure)
Michigan State University

Wayne State University (Detroit)

Albany Medical College (New york state) YESSSSS

University at Buffalo School of Medicine and Biomed science NOOOOO

Brody School of Medicine (North Carolina)

Jefferson Medical College (Philadelphia)

Meharry Medical College (Nashville) (Not sure?)

University of Texas at San Antonio (Not sure?) DON'T THINK SO.

 

[docbill]

Hey, you should try to enjoy your summer before the madness of med school starts. Take a vacation to your favourite place. But a job will keep ya busy.

YEahh enjoy the summer.. the weather today is IFFYYYY.. but better than humidity and hot weather.

When is your exam mammmm???

 

[docbill]

I'm going nuts! I thought it would be a good idea to come back home to Boston and take the summer off before I start "Band Aid" school in August...ehh I'm SOOO bored!...So I got me a job

There's so much TV you can take!

Hoomsy.. where abouts in boston are you.. are u studying there.. or what??? where you going to band aid school?

 

[karendong]

I'm a second year Canadian student at the U of Hawai'i - we've had two canadians per year for the last two years, taking up about 1/3 of the out of state/foreign spots - it's possible!

I'm wondering what options I have for when I graduate. I'm hoping i'm not shot in the foot for residency in both the US and Canada. What is the possibility of getting a green card if i stay for residency? Also, there any possibility at all of getting a green card while i'm in med school by some miracle (I'm on F-1)?

I heard the CaRMS treats US grads as 'foreign' even if they're canadians, has anyone else heard that?

 

[PistolPete]

Holy cow Batman, way to dig up an old (2004) thread!

Anyway, I'm a Canadian at a US osteopathic school, and I'll tell you what I know: you should be OK to return to Canada for residency if you want. I believe that Ontario considers US students (both MD/DO students) in the "first stream", separate from other IMG's. You should be OK to apply to residency in the states, but if you don't have a green card you'll need to get either a J-1 (more common) or H1-B visa. As a graduate from a US school, I hear that's a bit easier to get than a foreign national not from a US school. I don't think you can get a green card while in medical school, although that would solve A LOT of problems, wouldn't it? Let me know if you think of a way to get a green card that does not involve marriage. If you manage to get an H1-B for residency then you have the possibility of getting a green card.

By the way, what ties do you have to Hawaii? I thought that they only took people that had actualy ties to the state, and I wasn't aware that they even took Canadians! Good job! You must have had an impressive application.

 

[karendong]

Hi Pete - I have absolutely NO ties to Hawai'i other than that i'm Chinese which weak at best. My other classmate is Indian so he's even more of a longshot than me! I think the Vice-Dean is willing to take risks on people if they have some unique they've done or that makes them stand out. I had the lowest points possible to get an interview, but my interviewers were both wowed so i got it. It's really rough though. I think last year they had about 2000 applicants for 6 out-of-state spots, but miraculously, two more canadians got in - so it's definitely possible!!!

 

[M3dhop3ful]

Just want to keep this thread alive, What about school reputation? how much does that factor in for Canadians wanting to get the H1B and/or competitive residencies?

 

[JPR22]

The H1B is really a rare thing nowadays. The only programs I know of outside of primary care, that offer it make you pay for it, and in addition require you to pay them for sponsoring you. There are stilll community family med programs that sponsor H1B though.

 

[M3dhop3ful]

The H1B is really a rare thing nowadays. The only programs I know of outside of primary care, that offer it make you pay for it, and in addition require you to pay them for sponsoring you. There are stilll community family med programs that sponsor H1B though.

what do you mean pay for it? so if you have money, then the H1B isn't an issue anymore?

And how much are we talking about here?

 

[PistolPete]

I can only hope that 3 years from now they'll still be giving H1B's, because that is my only real option. I don't know how hard it would be to get a J-1 approval from Health Canada as a DO student.

 

[c3c4cam]

Your post is very helpful. However, I don't understand why you are saying apply DO as backups. Many DO medical schools are harder to get into nowdays than some MD schools (eg. 3.7 at my school). Also, you realize that medschool really makes undergrad look like a joke and the workload that you get is much more intense. So if you are not willing to work a little harder to learn OMM in DO school on top of all the MD stuff, then DO is not for you. You are better off applying MD and becoming a traditional doctor. However, if you think OMM will give you extra skills as a doctor, then by all means apply DO.

And it bothers me alot how some misinformed people on these forms actually compare DO to carribbean??????? DO is just another MD from American Medical school and you are guaranteed a residency depending on your USMLE or COMLEX scores. 90% of program directors have no biases against MD/DO, but most of them do have it against carribbean

I am also a Canadian, 4th year US allopathic med student, and have recently matched in internal medicine with an institution that will give me my H1B.

I agree, even for Canadian who is USMG, you are not on the same footing as most native AMG's because practically speaking you can ONLY take H1B - Canada screws you over for J1 sponsorship, and if you get it, congratulations, you are screwed too. Basically that cuts my programs in 1/2 (about 50% of hospitals will only do J1, the other half will give me an option of H1B or J1). Hospitals that dont sponsor J1s, no matter how good they are, you can't match there. I have turned down categorical interviews at elite institutions such as Wash U, UCSF, UTSW, UCSD and such, because their insistance of non-H1B sponsorship. Dont waste your time and money traveling and interviewing there, you JUST CAN'T TAKE a J1.

But on the other side of the flip, make sure you call every program's coordinator (after you get an interview invite) and ask them nicely if they will do H1B, and explain to them your situation as an USMG rather than IMG (which most will stick with their J1 only rule). There are at least 2 programs that stated "J1 only" on their website agreed to give me H1B after I explained to them my unique situation.

The bottom line is, if you are trying to match at popular, medium/low competitive specialties (FP, IM, peds, anesthesia, psych, etc) and you are US grad, you should be able to get H1B no problem. Anything more competitive you will have to be damn well qualified, and be damn sure the program knows what to do because those competitive programs dont usually deal with visa issues too much, as they usually match the best of the US grads anyways.

NOW, if you are Canadian IMG (ie. Carib, Aussie,etc) your road will be a lot more difficult than the average IMG because again, as a Canadian, you can ONLY take a H1B, and as opposed to the US grads, you dont have the negotiation power of the US-awarded diploma. If you decide to attend an international school, especially one that has a negative connotation for taking USMG's (ie. the carribs), you better keep the above in mind. The key to securing H1B is 1. ridiculous grades, like try to get honor or A's in all med school classes, 2. ridiculous board scores. I am talking at least 230, 240+ if possible - lots of successful IMG's have 99/99 step 1/2 scores - you are competing with the boatloads of Indian grads who have these kind of scores, who is applying to residency for the fifth time, and would gladly do free labor, sell their soul, and most importantly, take a J1, to get that categorical program. Why should a program take you and your H1B-only problem when they have boatloads of these people will be happy with a J1? and 3. good letters in US clinicals.

It can technically be done, but it's hard. Many of the FMG's you will run into are either American citizens who have no visa problems, or those from other countries, which their country will write them that sponsor letter for them to take a J1 which we as Canadians dont have. Applying to residency as an FMG is hard enough as it is, add to that H1B only? Your chances are about as good as the chance of hell freezing over. You can maximize your chance by doing the above, but there is ABSOLUTELY no guarantee. And with the kind of tuition/fee you pay to go to one of those offshore schools, wouldn't a guarantee be nice?

The only real guarantee is a US MD or DO school. I would suggest trying to study hard, do a post-bacc if you must to improve your GPA and nail the MCAT's and try to get into a US MD school, while apply to some DO schools as backup. I know it sounds bad to us Canadians, but DO in the US is a valuable degree that basically leads to the same licensure as MD's. Yes you pay a lot, but still less than any offshore, and your future path is a clear striaght-ahead after you're done. In your situation, 3.7+ undergrad GPA from a major Canadian institution coupled with 31+ MCAT and some EC's should give you enough numeric competitive edge to secure at least a DO if not an MD school admission in the US. Make sure apply to a gazillion places (I would suggest at least 25 private MD schools and 5 DO programs as back-up) and hope good things will happen.

~Renovar

 

[amandad]

Is it true that one or two American schools don't require the MCAT? If so, which ones? I know Mac, Ottawa, and NOSM in Canada don't require it.
thanks

 

[PistolPete]

I am not aware of any US medical schools that do not require the MCAT. This might only be the case if you are enrolled in a 6 year combined BS/MD program, where you do 2 years of undergrad and then go straight into medical schools. I'm pretty sure those students don't need to take the MCAT.

But other than that, if you are a normal applicant, you'll need to take the MCAT for US schools (as well as most Canadian schools).

Good luck!

 

[This server is annoying]

Hello everyone! Has the visa situation improve recently? I am considering applying for US Med school as a Canadian citizen but I don't want to waste my money on an expensive med school education and later on face with so many limitations. My whole family is currently applying for a Green card though but god knows how long will it take, I heard it takes at least 13 years to get it if I apply through family connections.

 

[UBC2014]

That huge necro bump

 

[UBC2014]

Hello everyone! Has the visa situation improve recently? I am considering applying for US Med school as a Canadian citizen but I don't want to waste my money on an expensive med school education and later on face with so many limitations. My whole family is currently applying for a Green card though but god knows how long will it take, I heard it takes at least 13 years to get it if I apply through family connections.

Yeah, you are not going to get the green card in time to be of any use.

The visa issue is getting a bit tougher, but mostly for IMGS. As a USMD or USDO, you will be far better off and less limited.

If you can get into a USMD or USDO program, and afford the high cost, then go without hesitation - just be prepared to work hard and stay abreast of changes in requirements etc.

 

[DoctorDuck13]

Hello everyone! Has the visa situation improve recently? I am considering applying for US Med school as a Canadian citizen but I don't want to waste my money on an expensive med school education and later on face with so many limitations. My whole family is currently applying for a Green card though but god knows how long will it take, I heard it takes at least 13 years to get it if I apply through family connections.

Hello there,

I'm a USMD grad from Canada and just matched this March, I think I've dotted most of the i's and crossed the t's on my visa situation for intern year, shoot me a PM if you want some details. Short story is I matched into internal medicine, where the programs are big and where it seems that visas may be easier to come by than smaller programs. For IM I think I would have been able to get a J-visa from Canada because there's no "cap" on how many statements of need they issue, but I went for the H1-B visa which limited which programs I could apply to and will limit it again for fellowship. The upside is that once you get it it comes with fewer restrictions than the J-visa, which sounded bad enough that I planned H1-B from the start.

 

[UBC2014]

Hello there,

I'm a USMD grad from Canada and just matched this March, I think I've dotted most of the i's and crossed the t's on my visa situation for intern year, shoot me a PM if you want some details. Short story is I matched into internal medicine, where the programs are big and where it seems that visas may be easier to come by than smaller programs. For IM I think I would have been able to get a J-visa from Canada because there's no "cap" on how many statements of need they issue, but I went for the H1-B visa which limited which programs I could apply to and will limit it again for fellowship. The upside is that once you get it it comes with fewer restrictions than the J-visa, which sounded bad enough that I planned H1-B from the start.

Actually NO, there is a CAP for this 2016 match onwards for IM. The cap is 200 for Internal Medicine for the 2016 NRMP match, with 196 being issued in 2015. I would not be surprised if there were some people left without a statement of need this year.