Can't decide on when to apply

[zma21]

Hey folks.

I'm currently at a crossroads in term of when I should apply. I'm planning on applying this coming June, but fear my stats are way out of line to do so. Applying this summer would be with a 3.2cGPA and 3.2sGPA and MCAT to be determined, taking it late May. I'm confident I will score above a 30, with 33 being the goal.

Schools I'd plan on applying to:
-Allo
-LSU-NO (3.4gpa/26ish )
-Illinois (3.4/28ish)
-Southern Ill (3.5/27ish)
-Mercer (3.3/25ish
-Morehouse (3.3/24ish)
-Howard (3.4/24ish)

-Osteo
-Nova
-Any and all Osteo's are fair game. I'm just trying to avoid those that list "Primary Care" in their mission statement. I'm interested in EM and General Surgery at this point, but don't want to be trapped going into primary care.

Here's the big question. Should I wait a year later to apply? I'm a senior this year, and will have to go to school next year anyway to finish my degree. Obviously, GPA is my down fall at this point. An extra year of straight A's puts me at 3.4 science and cum. However, that's another year of not starting my medical education. I'm already basically a year behind.

I'm somewhat confident that I can gain acceptance to a low-teir ostepathic school this upcoming cycle summer. Is it worth it to not be patient and go to a lower teir school rather than building my stats higher and increasing my chance at matriculation at a better institution?

Nova would be my top DO choice, and I feel I have about a 50-50 shot of admission next cycle if my MCAT is where it should be (>30)

I have no preference in terms of my #1 allo choice.

I should mention I have what others consider "good" EC's.

Clinical experiences:

-Medical assistant to MD psychiatrist
-Medical assistant to MD Deputy coroner
-Autopsy assistant to clinical pathologist
-Records and research assistant to small ER
-Dermatology and shadowing
-Orthopedic surgery shadowing
-OB/GYN shadowing
-General Practitioner shadowing
-Extensive Suicide research and statistical work

I have an increasing trend in grades:
Fresh: 2.8
Soph: 2.9
Junior: 3.4 (Decided to pursue medicine between soph and junior years)
Senior: 3.7

-For what it's worth, 4.0's are unheard of at my institution in the sciences (No curve policy etc. Long story)

So what do you say? Should I apply this upcoming cycle and take whatever acceptance (if I'm lucky) that comes my way? Or should I save myself some money, increase my GPA, and get into a slightly better school (a year later)? Assume my MCAT is a 30, as that will probably be the worst case scenario.

Be brutally honest. I wish so bad I could go back in time and redo my first two years so I'm not playing catch up all the damn time. Obviously I can't, so I'm trying to make forward steps in proving my academic success.

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[FrkyBgStok]

you can, but understand that MD schools are basically out of reach. and not wanting to go to a DO school with "primary care" in the mission statement is a bad reason. Most schools both MD and DO make this statement. It means nothing. It is entirely up to you during med school. And most med students change their mind, so picking a specialty is worthless as well.

so it is really up to you. If you do very well on the mcat and raise your gpa over the next year, you might have a small chance at MD, but it would still be hard. If you do well now, have everything else (like ECs), you might get into a DO school this coming season. But you would need to apply early and broadly. Assuming you get a 30, and your ECs are good, I wouldn't say nova is out of reach.

so basically, it is up to you.

 

[zma21]

you can, but understand that MD schools are basically out of reach. and not wanting to go to a DO school with "primary care" in the mission statement is a bad reason. Most schools both MD and DO make this statement. It means nothing. It is entirely up to you during med school. And most med students change their mind, so picking a specialty is worthless as well.

so it is really up to you. If you do very well on the mcat and raise your gpa over the next year, you might have a small chance at MD, but it would still be hard. If you do well now, have everything else (like ECs), you might get into a DO school this coming season. But you would need to apply early and broadly. Assuming you get a 30, and your ECs are good, I wouldn't say nova is out of reach.

so basically, it is up to you.

Thanks for the input man! I've seen you post around here and usually think your insight and opinions are spot on.

Anyway, with the whole mission statement thing, I was meaning more along the lines of schools like WCU, which is close to me. WCU, for example, lets people know that they are educating doctors going into primary care. After speaking to some faculty, they even screen for it in some interviews. I'm not going to lie and say I'm exclusively interested in PC.

I will be applying literally when the application period opens up. I'm going to apply to probably 20+ DO schools.

 

[zma21]

I forgot to mention, and I know it is somewhat important, but...

I'm a white male. : /

Also, the ER work I did and shadowing I did within the ER was exclusively with a DO. I can get a letter from him anytime.

 

[flodhi1]

OP, you have a decent chance at DO schools assuming that your MCAT score > 28 and you seem to be a decent fit with the school. The whole avoiding "primary care" might be a little alarming for certain schools especially since you're applying to Morehouse and Howard. Both schools are very "social mission" based and are huge into primary care. I'm going to be upfront with you, If you tell Morehouse you're trying to avoid the trap of primary care and want to become a surgeon you will have absolutely NO CHANCE no matter what your MCAT score. Obviously delaying graduation and spending another year would be ideal. I know you feel behind but in the general theme of things you're really not. You have another 40-50 years at least to practice medicine and the name of your school will always be with you. So, why not sacrifice 1 more year of hard work and get into the BEST school where you feel happy and you feel like you're receiving the best education. However, if you feel burned out and just want to get into medical school any where then I think a 3.2 and MCAT > 28 will get you into some DO school around the nation.

 

[FrkyBgStok]

If you decide to go DO this year, spend some time in the pre-osteo forums and you will see enough conversations to help decide which schools to apply to and which not to, based on your goals. WCU is very regionally biased and I am not sure what region you are in. You will also see what schools you are competitive for. But with a 28, I wouldn't say any DO school is completely out of reach. Maybe the op 5 oldest ones as their gpas are usually around 3.7 but I would apply anyways. If you ended up with a 30, I could see you getting in multiple places.

 

[BenzylAcetate]

Hey folks.

I'm currently at a crossroads in term of when I should apply. I'm planning on applying this coming June, but fear my stats are way out of line to do so. Applying this summer would be with a 3.2cGPA and 3.2sGPA and MCAT to be determined, taking it late May. I'm confident I will score above a 30, with 33 being the goal.

Schools I'd plan on applying to:
-Allo
-LSU-NO (3.4gpa/26ish )
-Illinois (3.4/28ish)
-Southern Ill (3.5/27ish)
-Mercer (3.3/25ish
-Morehouse (3.3/24ish)
-Howard (3.4/24ish)

-Osteo
-Nova
-Any and all Osteo's are fair game. I'm just trying to avoid those that list "Primary Care" in their mission statement. I'm interested in EM and General Surgery at this point, but don't want to be trapped going into primary care.

Here's the big question. Should I wait a year later to apply? I'm a senior this year, and will have to go to school next year anyway to finish my degree. Obviously, GPA is my down fall at this point. An extra year of straight A's puts me at 3.4 science and cum. However, that's another year of not starting my medical education. I'm already basically a year behind.

I'm somewhat confident that I can gain acceptance to a low-teir ostepathic school this upcoming cycle summer. Is it worth it to not be patient and go to a lower teir school rather than building my stats higher and increasing my chance at matriculation at a better institution?

Nova would be my top DO choice, and I feel I have about a 50-50 shot of admission next cycle if my MCAT is where it should be (>30)

I have no preference in terms of my #1 allo choice.

I should mention I have what others consider "good" EC's.

Clinical experiences:

-Medical assistant to MD psychiatrist
-Medical assistant to MD Deputy coroner
-Autopsy assistant to clinical pathologist
-Records and research assistant to small ER
-Dermatology and shadowing
-Orthopedic surgery shadowing
-OB/GYN shadowing
-General Practitioner shadowing
-Extensive Suicide research and statistical work

I have an increasing trend in grades:
Fresh: 2.8
Soph: 2.9
Junior: 3.4 (Decided to pursue medicine between soph and junior years)
Senior: 3.7

-For what it's worth, 4.0's are unheard of at my institution in the sciences (No curve policy etc. Long story)

So what do you say? Should I apply this upcoming cycle and take whatever acceptance (if I'm lucky) that comes my way? Or should I save myself some money, increase my GPA, and get into a slightly better school (a year later)? Assume my MCAT is a 30, as that will probably be the worst case scenario.

Be brutally honest. I wish so bad I could go back in time and redo my first two years so I'm not playing catch up all the damn time. Obviously I can't, so I'm trying to make forward steps in proving my academic success.

I would wait a year. I applied this year with a 3.38 cGPA, 3.19 sGPA, and a 32 MCAT, but did not receive any interview invites. I also took a late May MCAT and did not have my primary submitted until mid july, finished most secondaries/complete mid august to early september. By waiting another year you can add 2 more semesters of solid grades and ensure that you get your application in as soon as possible.

I was similarly concerned about not starting school right away and things moving to slowly, but in the greater scheme of things another year or two is not a big deal. I believe the average age of incoming med students is ~24, so going right into school out of undergrad is more the exception than the norm.

Also, if you are planning to apply DO you should try to get some shadowing experience, and ideally a LOR, from an Osteopathic physician. You mentioned a lot of clinical experience with several physicians but did not specify if any were DO trained, so my apologies if you already have this experience.

 

[zma21]

I would wait a year. I applied this year with a 3.38 cGPA, 3.19 sGPA, and a 32 MCAT, but did not receive any interview invites. I also took a late May MCAT and did not have my primary submitted until mid july, finished most secondaries/complete mid august to early september. By waiting another year you can add 2 more semesters of solid grades and ensure that you get your application in as soon as possible.

I was similarly concerned about not starting school right away and things moving to slowly, but in the greater scheme of things another year or two is not a big deal. I believe the average age of incoming med students is ~24, so going right into school out of undergrad is more the exception than the norm.

Also, if you are planning to apply DO you should try to get some shadowing experience, and ideally a LOR, from an Osteopathic physician. You mentioned a lot of clinical experience with several physicians but did not specify if any were DO trained, so my apologies if you already have this experience.

The ER I worked in was exclusively with a DO, and I'll have his letter. Also, MCAT scores aren't required for primary applications, correct? Waiting a year would put me in medical school at age 24.

 

[zma21]

OP, you have a decent chance at DO schools assuming that your MCAT score > 28 and you seem to be a decent fit with the school. The whole avoiding "primary care" might be a little alarming for certain schools especially since you're applying to Morehouse and Howard. Both schools are very "social mission" based and are huge into primary care. I'm going to be upfront with you, If you tell Morehouse you're trying to avoid the trap of primary care and want to become a surgeon you will have absolutely NO CHANCE no matter what your MCAT score. Obviously delaying graduation and spending another year would be ideal. I know you feel behind but in the general theme of things you're really not. You have another 40-50 years at least to practice medicine and the name of your school will always be with you. So, why not sacrifice 1 more year of hard work and get into the BEST school where you feel happy and you feel like you're receiving the best education. However, if you feel burned out and just want to get into medical school any where then I think a 3.2 and MCAT > 28 will get you into some DO school around the nation.

I guess at this point I should clarify. I'm not necessarily interested in attending a school who's main motivation is to pump out primary care doctors. I'm not sure whether I'll end up in primary care or not, but I don't want to feel disadvantaged if I decide to go outside of primary care. If the school asks "So why do you want to go into primary care?" in an interview (Like WCU has done in the past) I won't have a freakin' answer outside of "I'm not entirely sure that's what I want to do, but if you asked me today it's not what I want to do."

And to frky; I live 90 minutes from WCU. I think that's about as regional as it gets.

 

[Catalystik]

Schools I'd plan on applying to:
-Allo
-LSU-NO (3.4gpa/26ish )
-Illinois (3.4/28ish)
-Southern Ill (3.5/27ish)
-Mercer (3.3/25ish
-Morehouse (3.3/24ish)
-Howard (3.4/24ish)

SIU doesn't take OOSers. Last I heard, neither does Mercer. Morehouse and Howard are traditionally Black medical colleges who would expect to see substantive nonmedical community service that helps the poor.

 

[zma21]

SIU doesn't take OOSers. Last I heard, neither does Mercer. Morehouse and Howard are traditionally Black medical colleges who would expect to see substantive nonmedical community service that helps the poor.

I'm an IL resident, but haven't lived there in 3 years. Still an IL resident nevertheless. My father graduated from SIU undergrad, I doubt that holds any water.

 

[Catalystik]

I'm an IL resident, but haven't lived there in 3 years. Still an IL resident nevertheless. My father graduated from SIU undergrad, I doubt that holds any water.

Ahhh! I was distracted by the fact that you live near WCU and assumed you were in-state there.

You are right that the legacy factor won't mean much there, but if your folks live downstate (south of I-80) you would be considered a resident of the area that SIU aims to serve, and would have a much better shot. For the best chance at an MD school, if that is your primary goal, another year of high GPA on the transcript before applying (meaning 4 total semesters, to show that you can stay consistent), would be helpful. But you knew that.

 

[zma21]

Ahhh! I was distracted by the fact that you live near WCU and assumed you were in-state there.

You are right that the legacy factor won't mean much there, but if your folks live downstate (south of I-80) you would be considered a resident of the area that SIU aims to serve, and would have a much better shot. For the best chance at an MD school, if that is your primary goal, another year of high GPA on the transcript before applying (meaning 4 total semesters, to show that you can stay consistent), would be helpful. But you knew that.

I did, but it helps a hell of a lot to hear it from someone who knows exactly what they're talking about.

And as far as MD being my primary goal...it isn't. I have no interest in competitive specialties in which being an MD would give me a far and away advantage, so MD=DO for me. I was born and grew up (until I was 8 or so) about 15 miles from the SIU-C campus, and then moved further north and lived 1 hour away from the med school campus until I was 18 and moved away for college.

I'm not sure why I'm rambling on about this, I have no ambition of returning to IL to live there. If they threw an acceptance my way, however, I would oblige.

 

[BenzylAcetate]

The ER I worked in was exclusively with a DO, and I'll have his letter. Also, MCAT scores aren't required for primary applications, correct? Waiting a year would put me in medical school at age 24.

No, you don't need scores for the primary, but in order to be considered complete you do. So the earliest you can possibly be complete is late-June/early-July (once scores are released and received, as well as secondaries completed). However, this is assuming that you are able to put together your entire primary during the month you take your MCAT. Not that it can't be done, but it would require a lot of focus. (not to say that you wont be focused, but in my experience it was more difficult than I thought it would be)

Whereas if you took an extra year you would already have your scores and could spend the month of May getting your application together and casually pre-writting secondaries. (Much less stress and it gives you an entire year to retake the MCAT if necessary)

 

[Catalystik]

I have no ambition of returning to IL to live there. If they threw an acceptance my way, however, I would oblige.

Presumably, you are now a warm weather fan? Considering that Illinois has two very lenient public med schools, and RFU besides, I would keep this a secret, as you can apply wherever you wish for residencies. And considering CCOM's great reputation, I'd hope you'd apply there, too.

 

[zma21]

Presumably, you are now a warm weather fan? Considering that Illinois has two very lenient public med schools, and RFU besides, I would keep this a secret, as you can apply wherever you wish for residencies. And considering CCOM's great reputation, I'd hope you'd apply there, too.

I don't miss the midwest's weather, that's for sure.

I would probably play the whole "I'm ready to move home" card if I were to interview at a school up there. Is that b.s.? Probably. But who knows, I'm quite the loyal person, and if a school takes a chance on me I'll probably humor them and stick around the area unless I'm just completely sick of the area again.

And CCOM is definitely an option, as the ER doc I worked with graduated from CCOM, and apparently has a few drinkin' buddies still involved with the admissions process. He had nothing but positive things to say about the school, and it turned me on to ccom.

I will say, though, that somebody would have to hold a gun to my head for me to live in Chicago.

 

[Catalystik]

Fortunately, UIC has three other campuses not in Chicago. And CCOM is in a suburb, as is RFU, though you'd likely have clinical rotations in the city for either of these last two.