Case Western Vs. Wayne State

[membername3]

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I've been accepted to a few schools, but I'm having a difficult time deciding where I want to be for the next four years. Some pros/cons:


Case Western:

++ Cirriculum seems awesome. PBL/lecture mix, true p/f, class done by 12 every day
+ Cleveland > Detroit
+ ranked pretty high (top 20 if i recall correctly), well respected/known. May or may not matter.
+ lots of research opportunities, in fact research is required
++ Choice of mixing up rotations at three fantastic hospitals during third year
+ got really great vibes during my interview. Students seemed genuinely relaxed and very friendly.
--- cost is astronomical. about 50k a year for tuition alone. This is really the only con I can think of.

Wayne state:

+++ Substantially cheaper than Case although not cheap by any means. Would probably save between 80-100k if I went here over Case. Basically 150k vs. 250k in total debt.
+ close to family and friends
+ Wayne has a reputation for great hands on clinical experience during 3rd/4th year
- Not a nationally recognized program like Case. May or may not matter.
- I want to get out of Michigan at some point. Looking at their match list, a substantial portion of their students end up staying in SE Michigan whereas Case grads go all over the country
-- Very traditional cirriculum. H/p/f based on how the rest of class does. I've heard it can be more stressful/competitive than need be. Although this is anecdotal of course.
- Stuck with one hospital during third year. Lotto system. It might suck to be at a suburban hospital rather than one of the inner city ones.

So basically it boils down to cost. Is Case worth an extra 100k dollars? I'm doing this all through loans and not expecting any institutional grants (although grants would make this decision much easier). I know I'd be happier in Cleveland, but the extra debt I'd be taking on scares me.

I'm definitely leaning towards Case at this point, but I'd appreciate some insight/thoughts on this. Thanks.

 

[omgyou8myrice]

All I needed to read was Wayne State costing a hundred grand less. Reputation is not worth that price.

 

[membername3]

All I needed to read was Wayne State costing a hundred grand less. Reputation is not worth that price.

Honestly, the reputation isn't a huge factor to me (although we are talking top 20 vs. 70 something I believe). It's more about the curriculum, location, etc. which I think Case definitely has an upper hand.

So, yes, reputation probably isn't worth an extra 100k, but are all the other factors worth it?

 

[BigEast55]

Go where you are happiest. Happiness is worth the cost. You'll be able to pay it back, and maybe you will get some cash from Case.

 

[WingedOx]

Wayne is actually unranked. They've always declined to participate in the USNews ranking. (which is interesting since they do have a ton of research going on there).

 

[Reaction]

I've been accepted to a few schools, but I'm having a difficult time deciding where I want to be for the next four years. Some pros/cons:


Case Western:

++ Cirriculum seems awesome. PBL/lecture mix, true p/f, class done by 12 every day
+ Cleveland > Detroit
+ ranked pretty high (top 20 if i recall correctly), well respected/known. May or may not matter.
+ lots of research opportunities, in fact research is required
++ Choice of mixing up rotations at three fantastic hospitals during third year
+ got really great vibes during my interview. Students seemed genuinely relaxed and very friendly.
--- cost is astronomical. about 50k a year for tuition alone. This is really the only con I can think of.

Wayne state:

+++ Substantially cheaper than Case although not cheap by any means. Would probably save between 80-100k if I went here over Case. Basically 150k vs. 250k in total debt.
+ close to family and friends
+ Wayne has a reputation for great hands on clinical experience during 3rd/4th year
- Not a nationally recognized program like Case. May or may not matter.
- I want to get out of Michigan at some point. Looking at their match list, a substantial portion of their students end up staying in SE Michigan whereas Case grads go all over the country
-- Very traditional cirriculum. H/p/f based on how the rest of class does. I've heard it can be more stressful/competitive than need be. Although this is anecdotal of course.
- Stuck with one hospital during third year. Lotto system. It might suck to be at a suburban hospital rather than one of the inner city ones.

So basically it boils down to cost. Is Case worth an extra 100k dollars? I'm doing this all through loans and not expecting any institutional grants (although grants would make this decision much easier). I know I'd be happier in Cleveland, but the extra debt I'd be taking on scares me.

I'm definitely leaning towards Case at this point, but I'd appreciate some insight/thoughts on this. Thanks.

Honestly in a few years I may take this back but for now I would say go to where you would like it the best. It sounds like you would enjoy Case more than Wayne. Wayne State is actually a pretty good med school. It is surrounded by the DMC and there are many opportunities. The reason why its not ranked highly is that this is the first year that it allowed US News to rank it I think. Also it isn't a big school like U of M or MSU etc. Another thing you have to consider is whether you would want to live in Detroit for 4 years or would you rather want to live in Cleavland. Money is another important factor but you should also weigh in where you would be happiest.=]

 

[WingedOx]

Honestly in a few years I may take this back but for now I would say go to where you would like it the best. It sounds like you would enjoy Case more than Wayne. Wayne State is actually a pretty good med school. It is surrounded by the DMC and there are many opportunities. The reason why its not ranked highly is that this is the first year that it allowed US News to rank it I think. Also it isn't a big school like U of M or MSU etc. Another thing you have to consider is whether you would want to live in Detroit for 4 years or would you rather want to live in Cleavland. Money is another important factor but you should also weigh in where you would be happiest.=]

umm, what?

 

[omgyou8myrice]

Honestly, the reputation isn't a huge factor to me (although we are talking top 20 vs. 70 something I believe). It's more about the curriculum, location, etc. which I think Case definitely has an upper hand.

So, yes, reputation probably isn't worth an extra 100k, but are all the other factors worth it?

Only you can decide if those things are worth the cost. If you think you'll honestly be happier and less stressed throughout medical school (based on the curriculum), maybe that IS worth an extra 100k in loans to you. For me, it isn't.. but I (we) can't place worth on something in your eyes.

 

[startswithb]

I think you should go where you feel you will be the most successful. I mean successful in your individual pursuits. Many things that can affect your performance are extrinsic factors like environment, proximity to support system, etc. A loans savings won't mean as much if you struggled because you weren't in the right place mentally and you don't perform to your full potential. That's what I'd worry about first.

 

[deleted357625]

Case Western > Wayne

 

[WingedOx]

Case Western > Wayne

Case has mandatory 8am PBL sessions daily. Just sayin'

 

[omgyou8myrice]

Case has mandatory 8am PBL sessions daily. Just sayin'

Ef that, I don't care how great a school is, nooo way I'm getting up at 7 am every morning for class.

 

[mishaS]

I'm going to Wayne, but I think you might be happier at Case. Yes, it's a lot of money, but four years is a long time, and I would say that a $100K if you were sure you would be much happier. With that said, I would ignore school rankings. Have you looked up the methodology the US News and World Report has for their rankings? A major factor in ranking is how competitive the entering class is while not bothering to factor in USMLE scores. Some of the methodology is fine, but exclusivity has little to do with the quality of education.

 

[Evergrey]

Case has mandatory 8am PBL sessions daily. Just sayin'

Case also has max 4 hours of class a day 🙂 The afternoons on the pre-clinical schedule are listed as "self-directed learning," which is a euphemism for "free time."

Case is, hands-down, the best curriculum fit for me personally. The verdict is up though whether it is the best for my financial situation and relationship though.

 

[membername3]

I am bumping this thread to hear some more opinions. Thank you.

 

[SoyRicoSuave]

Ranking is nice, and Case Western has a very nice hospital. Assuming your paying for med school yourself and receive no aid I would lean towards the cheaper one, but that's just me.

 

[vc7777]

I'm going to Wayne, but I think you might be happier at Case. Yes, it's a lot of money, but four years is a long time...

....I'm going to Case, but I think you might be happier at Wayne. Yes, it's a lot of money, and four years is a long time....

First, people need to get over the 8am/PBL/stuff. We crushed the Match this year, and will continue to do so with less classroom time than most schools. Works for us. Maybe not for you.

Second, Wayne is a great option if the OP wants to stay in Detroit/Michigan. I'm from Detroit. Yes, it is ranked very low (and I don't buy the argument that it is ranked low b/c it is the first year it has been ranked). Yes, it is the largest single-campus medical school in the country. It isn't "small" by any metric. And yes, it is a very traditional curriculum. But you get the job done, at less cost. No question about that. I have friends at Wayne, and they will be docs just like me.

Detroit = Cleveland. The differences are minor for the sake of medical student life. If anything, Case's campus is in a little nicer area than Wayne's. But if you are from Detroit, and have family around, then it tips the scales in favor of Motown.

Save you money, unless you are really into research and want to do residency outside of Michigan. No shayme in Wayne, ok?

 

[bucks2010]

If you want to get out of Mich, like you said, Case is a pretty good option. Depending on what you specialize in, the debt may not be that much of a burden. See the thread called Paying back loans as a surgeon - in the surgery subforum. JackADeli ran some quick #'s on what that kind of debt would look like for a general surgeon.

 

[Myuu]

Case has mandatory 8am PBL sessions daily. Just sayin'

Seriously? That's your whole argument?

Like most people here (that's a giant surprise, I'm sure), I happen to learn much better on my own than in lecture. A traditional curriculum would bore me to death then batter my broken body with test after test.

 

[vc7777]

...A traditional curriculum would bore me to death then batter my broken body ....

Avoid this at all costs.​

 

[Myuu]

Avoid this at all costs.​

Well, I don't have much of a choice if I'm dead. They'd probably deep fry me. Or maybe a nice pan fry. Who knows.

 

[Ignatius M.D.]

Did you SEE the match list from Case this year? If you want to get out of Michigan for residency, you can do that from both schools, but it is much more likely if you go to case. I think Wayne is better than most people say, but I'd go to Case. Have you seen your financial aid yet? A lot of top private schools are the same price or sometimes cheaper than state schools. It's a myth that attending a private school will always yield higher debt. It often does, but it's not a rule. I looked at Case for undergrad, and the campus is really nice. I've never been to Wayne, but I'd assume the campus/surrounding area doesn't compare.

 

[searun]

I was accepted to Case 4 years ago but chose to attend another med school. I really liked Case and I got a pretty nice financial aid package with some significant grant money - about $25,000 per year as I recall.

So make your decision after you receive your financial aid packages. Case may not really be much more expensive.

 

[eli20]

Id avoid Wayne because of the grading, not that I know much about the school. On my interviews I noticed a pretty strong correlation with the strict % based curves and seemingly unhappy/mean students. It sets a subtle tone whether everyone admits it or not.

 

[drizzt3117]

Ef that, I don't care how great a school is, nooo way I'm getting up at 7 am every morning for class.

If you don't like getting up early you picked the wrong career...

 

[Evergrey]

If you don't like getting up early you picked the wrong career...

Haha yeah better get used to early mornings, late nights, and/or sleeplessness!

 

[searun]

If you don't like getting up early you picked the wrong career...

Amen, Brother. My body is now trained to wake up very early. I can't even sleep in on the occasional weekend nights when I wander home from the bars at 4am. I am now physiologically incapable of sleeping in.

Yep, if you are afraid of an 8am class, reconsider your career choice.

 

[WingedOx]

Seriously? That's your whole argument?

Like most people here (that's a giant surprise, I'm sure), I happen to learn much better on my own than in lecture. A traditional curriculum would bore me to death then batter my broken body with test after test.

then don't go to lecture and never come to campus except for tests... pretty easy to do at a "traditional" school with no PBL.

 

[JokerMD]

case

contrary to what most people say on here, i personally think the reputation IS worth 100K 😀

 

[Charles_Carmichael]

Seriously? That's your whole argument?

Like most people here (that's a giant surprise, I'm sure), I happen to learn much better on my own than in lecture. A traditional curriculum would bore me to death then batter my broken body with test after test.

I don't really understand this statement. Throughout my interview trail and pretty much all over on SDN, it's been said that most medical students don't attend lecture. How can you be bored to death when you're not going to class? Off the top of my head, I can't think of any schools that have mandatory attendance for lectures (though I'm sure a couple exist).

I would contend that med students at traditional curriculum schools are fairly independent learners as well. I don't think attending a school with a systems-based/traditional curriculum means that you're being "spoon-fed" information.

With that being said, I'm just a lowly premed, so what do I know? And it's very unlikely that someone on these boards has attended both a PBL and a traditional school. So, it's just going to be people who attend each type of school defending their system (which is understandable).

 

[FrickenhugeMD]

Haven't been or seen case so I can't comment on that aspect.

Wayne State can be an online medical school if you want it to be.... I didnt go to any classes after anatomy 1st year, so those who argue "they learn better on their own" as a reason against Wayne really have no clue what Wayne is like. I would guess 30 of 300 people in my class would regularly attend lecture during 2nd year. Not that lecture was bad, its just some people chose to manage their own time. I got up at 10 every day, streamed some lectures while others I would study on my own.

Also, if you are worried about "it might suck to be at a suburban hospital rather than one of the inner city ones." Here is some news for you, the suburban hospitals are the hardest to get matched to since most people WANT to go there. They have "easier" rotations on the whole, or at least that is the perception that exists. DMC is the easiest to get into, is arguably the most "inner city" and will give you an excellent inner city/underprivileged pt. population. I have spent the entirety of my 3rd yr in the DMC system and have been more than pleased with the quality and quantity of my clinical medical education.

Is Wayne all sunshine an rainbows? No. Everyone will give and hear stories about people getting "wayned" about some issue or another, but im sure there are flaws to every system.


The information for the first two years is the same everywhere, and regardless of how it is put infront of you, it's up to you to learn it

Is it worth 100K more to go to case? for me, no. But that's something you need to figure out on your own. Good luck, and feel free to ask me any questions about the school or clinical years

 

[MCAT guy]

I don't really understand this statement. Throughout my interview trail and pretty much all over on SDN, it's been said that most medical students don't attend lecture. How can you be bored to death when you're not going to class? Off the top of my head, I can't think of any schools that have mandatory attendance for lectures (though I'm sure a couple exist).

I would contend that med students at traditional curriculum schools are fairly independent learners as well. I don't think attending a school with a systems-based/traditional curriculum means that you're being "spoon-fed" information.

With that being said, I'm just a lowly premed, so what do I know? And it's very unlikely that someone on these boards has attended both a PBL and a traditional school. So, it's just going to be people who attend each type of school defending their system (which is understandable).

Agreed with you. Independent learning is fine and besides, you'll need it for the Steps. Curriculum is what the student makes it, schools that get too much into their curriculum scare me. While tweaks can help, the student is the driver of the learning process, not some unique educational process.

A good student will probably excel in 95% or more of the allopathic programs in the United States.

 

[MCAT guy]

Id avoid Wayne because of the grading, not that I know much about the school. On my interviews I noticed a pretty strong correlation with the strict % based curves and seemingly unhappy/mean students. It sets a subtle tone whether everyone admits it or not.

This is the type of stuff I would make a decision on.

I wouldn't focus on match lists or curriculum really, unless one school is really bad (forcing you to waste time). You will make your match happen, not your school. Also you will learn the sciences in year 1 and 2, not some magic.

Go where you think you will be happy AND don't focus too much on money. 100k is nothing to sneeze at. I definitely wouldn't chose a school solely based on 100k cheaper, but you better NOT like the cheaper school and LOVE the expensive school to do that.

Focus on people and atmosphere you will enjoy. The money will take care of itself.

 

[MCAT guy]

Did you SEE the match list from Case this year? If you want to get out of Michigan for residency, you can do that from both schools, but it is much more likely if you go to case. I think Wayne is better than most people say, but I'd go to Case. Have you seen your financial aid yet? A lot of top private schools are the same price or sometimes cheaper than state schools. It's a myth that attending a private school will always yield higher debt. It often does, but it's not a rule. I looked at Case for undergrad, and the campus is really nice. I've never been to Wayne, but I'd assume the campus/surrounding area doesn't compare.

Does not understand Match.

Match has to do with the individuals, not the school.

You are not more likely to match out of Michigan if you go to one school or another. An in-state school has more in-state matches because it has in-state people.

The students that have excellent matches will do well wherever they go to school.

 

[drizzt3117]

At resident conference in plastics the chair had this pearl for the residents, "every one of you is here bc someone whose judgment I trust made a phone call on your behalf."

I think you'd have a higher chance to be exposed to influential faculty at cw... Something to think about.

Does not understand Match.

Match has to do with the individuals, not the school.

You are not more likely to match out of Michigan if you go to one school or another. An in-state school has more in-state matches because it has in-state people.

The students that have excellent matches will do well wherever they go to school.

 

[MCAT guy]

At resident conference in plastics the chair had this pearl for the residents, "every one of you is here bc someone whose judgment I trust made a phone call on your behalf."

I think you'd have a higher chance to be exposed to influential faculty at cw... Something to think about.

Possibly.

But on the same token, it is better to get letters from the chair of a department. Where do you think you will have more attention from a department head? Cleveland Clinic or Wayne State's teaching hospital?

Also, do you really think that the same student, with the same 3rd/4th year rotation grades, research, board scores, etc would somehow match into a specialty only if they had a letter from someone at Case as opposed to Wayne?

You could argue, at some specific hospitals, but I'm just talking about matching into a specialty vs NOT matching into a specialty.

Identical applicants from each school with letters from identical positions at each institution will not result in magic at Case and poor results at Wayne.

 

[drizzt3117]

Possibly.

But on the same token, it is better to get letters from the chair of a department. Where do you think you will have more attention from a department head? Cleveland Clinic or Wayne State's teaching hospital?

I'd say CCF, personally. WSU has a lot more students than Case and the attendings there are more familiar with the system. I'm sure they got to where they are by the same way. Modern day patronage.

Also, do you really think that the same student, with the same 3rd/4th year rotation grades, research, board scores, etc would somehow match into a specialty only if they had a letter from someone at Case as opposed to Wayne?

First of all, I think there's far more research opportunities at Case/CCF then there is at Wayne, and their students also get 4 months to do independent research. The departments are also much more reputable.

You could argue, at some specific hospitals, but I'm just talking about matching into a specialty vs NOT matching into a specialty.

You missed the entire point of the previous post then, which was emphasizing that people were matching at top programs all over the country from Case. One could certainly make the argument that being a private school Case has students from more geographic areas and that these data don't prove that AN INDIVIDUAL is more likely to match at a better program, but it just is what it is. Case is a much stronger program. Is it worth $100k? That's a personal decision, I'd argue that it is, but you're welcome to disagree.

 

[gravitywave]

If you don't like getting up early you picked the wrong career...

getting up early for class =/= getting up early for work.

I don't really understand this statement. Throughout my interview trail and pretty much all over on SDN, it's been said that most medical students don't attend lecture. How can you be bored to death when you're not going to class? Off the top of my head, I can't think of any schools that have mandatory attendance for lectures (though I'm sure a couple exist).

most medical students do attend lecture when it's offered. the not attending class = better performance issue has an enormous selection bias. Myuu misspoke; i'd wager she just wouldn't attend class if she went to a lecture-based school, just as many others do (errr, don't).

At resident conference in plastics the chair had this pearl for the residents, "every one of you is here bc someone whose judgment I trust made a phone call on your behalf."

I think you'd have a higher chance to be exposed to influential faculty at cw... Something to think about.

best post in the thread. attend CWRU if you have your heart set on something competitive. If you know you don't, WS is your place.

 

[chiz2kul]

thing is - you'll never know if u'll love waking up at 8am for mandatory pbl or not till you start.

match list doesnt really mean much.

You can still get out of Michigan post med school if you wanna. If $$ means that much to you, go to Wayne. I'm already loving the online class thingy

 

[drizzt3117]

getting up early for class =/= getting up early for work.

We have mandatory 6 am conference every day in many 3rd year rotations... I'm just happy I'm on ortho/sports medicine and don't have to pre-round/round before it.

most medical students do attend lecture when it's offered.

I'd say it's about 1/2, at least during our 1st-2nd year

best post in the thread. attend CWRU if you have your heart set on something competitive. If you know you don't, WS is your place.

The only problem is most people have no idea what they want to do, and most people change their mind even if they do. The road is littered with med students that wanted to go into surgery that end up matching into peds or IM, and the converse is true in some cases.

 

[bucks2010]

At resident conference in plastics the chair had this pearl for the residents, "every one of you is here bc someone whose judgment I trust made a phone call on your behalf."

I think you'd have a higher chance to be exposed to influential faculty at cw... Something to think about.

+1 to whoever said this was the best post in the thread.

Yes, it is technically possible to match OOS if you go to Wayne. That said, going to Case will probably give you a couple of aforementioned advantages:

1. exposure to faculty that are well-known (to whoever said you may not get exposure to them, I think the key here is really to take initiative. Grand rounds attendance, clinical research, whatever else it takes to get to know them. Every medical school has a lot of faculty, most of whom are pretty busy. It's up to you to hang around them.)

2. a familiar name to OOS residency PD's. I believe it was an attending on here that mentioned that PD's may judge you based on previous applicants from your school. If they take someone from, say, Penn St., and that resident turns out to be sub-par, that may lower the school's reputation in the mind of the PD. The opposite is true as well. Since Wayne matches so many IS, you're less likely to be a "known quantity" when applying OOS - that could either work in or against your favor.

There's no saying you couldn't overcome these obstacles, but do you really want to fight the odds? I think if you want to go OOS for residency, your best bet is to go somewhere that routinely sends folks OOS. Don't try and fight the "momentum."

 

[MCAT guy]

Can the OP tell what specialties they are interested in and if they care if they match into a "top" hospital?

I'll give a specific example: While reading orthogate's forum, I found many people liked community programs over the "top" hospitals because of more family friendly schedules and much more operating experience. Hence allowing them to do the things they enjoy the most, compared to constantly being forced to do academic activities and having little operating time in their first few years.

I realize his/her interest can change, but it's interesting on SDN that everyone's default is to think a person wants to match Radiation Oncology or Derm with Mass General or Mayo.

Some people will be fine if they just match into their specialty at a good program, even if it isn't a top 10 hospital in the US. People match into certain specialties at every school.

Plus, it isn't like Case has well-known faculty in EVERY specialty and Wayne has well-known faculty in NO specialties. So again, depends on the specialty and what the ambition is of the OP. I will agree that Case has a huge leg up in reputation, but unless we are talking about the most competitive specialties matching into top hospitals, this isn't really that important.

 

[MCAT guy]

There's no saying you couldn't overcome these obstacles, but do you really want to fight the odds? I think if you want to go OOS for residency, your best bet is to go somewhere that routinely sends folks OOS. Don't try and fight the "momentum."

You make good points and all are valid. At the same time, 100k is nothing to sneeze at. As I said above, depends on the ambitions of the poster and how important it is to match into a top hospital.

Specifically, if the person just wants an IM, FM, or EM residency in the United States (not necessarily at a top 10 hospital) will this all matter? Doubtful.

A hard working individual will do fine at either school. I think we should talk specific specialties instead of saying competitive or not, so we have an idea of what each person is saying.

Edit: Btw, here is the Creighton match data from this year:

Here's some more proof that you can go where you want if even if you're at an 'unranked' school in the middle of flyover country, aka Omaha, NE! For some context, we were 4/4 ophtho, 9/10 ortho, 1/1 urology, 1/1 derm, 14/13 radar (1 ortho had radar ranked 3rd), 1/1 rad onc, 2/2 ENT, 7/7 EM, 10/9 anesthesia (1 gen surg went gas) and all the rest got the specialty wanted with almost all getting where they wanted. There is a midwest flavor given our location/students, but we also put people in all four corners of the country. It was a great, great day on Thursday! Also of note, we had all 4 couples successfully match together. For those curious, they were Med/Psych x 2 (LSU, Vandy), Gen Surg/Gen Surg (Creighton), and ENT/Radiology (Kansas).

They seem to have done fine and without the amazing reputation or influence that some schools possess.

 

[vc7777]

Haven't been or seen case so I can't comment on that aspect.

Fair enough. I don't think you understand our school's position within our community. In many ways it is very similar to Wayne's relationship with Detroit. We are also located in the university/cultural center of the city, and also have strong-ties and rotations at all of the local hospitals.

Wayne State can be an online medical school if you want it to be.... I didnt go to any classes after anatomy 1st year, so those who argue "they learn better on their own" as a reason against Wayne really have no clue what Wayne is like. I would guess 30 of 300 people in my class would regularly attend lecture during 2nd year. Not that lecture was bad, its just some people chose to manage their own time. I got up at 10 every day, streamed some lectures while others I would study on my own.

It all comes out in the wash, I say. That is, your USMLE scores should reflect your knowledge. If you learn better this way - kudos to you. 🙂
Personally, I am not sure I'd wake up at 10 even. The OP has to be honest with themselves and ask if they are truly disciplined enough to learn independently.

Also, if you are worried about "it might suck to be at a suburban hospital rather than one of the inner city ones." Here is some news for you, the suburban hospitals are the hardest to get matched to since most people WANT to go there. They have "easier" rotations on the whole, or at least that is the perception that exists. DMC is the easiest to get into, is arguably the most "inner city" and will give you an excellent inner city/underprivileged pt. population. I have spent the entirety of my 3rd yr in the DMC system and have been more than pleased with the quality and quantity of my clinical medical education.

😕 So first, I think you are introducing a new argument here? But I can't be sure? Second, you first say that suburban matches are desirable...and then you slide into talking about rotations at DMC being great? I'm honestly, trying to understand you. Are you talking about the Wayne Match List, or about medical student rotations? I'm confused.

Side note: I still live in Detroit, on the weekends (I'm here right now). I am pretty in-tune with local news. So my ears perked up when DMC's new owners in a recent press-release bad-mouthed non-profits, and then literally in the next sentence talked about how they want to be the next Cleveland Clinic, a major non-profit!

Is Wayne all sunshine an rainbows? No. Everyone will give and hear stories about people getting "wayned" about some issue or another, but im sure there are flaws to every system.


The information for the first two years is the same everywhere, and regardless of how it is put infront of you, it's up to you to learn it

Is it worth 100K more to go to case? for me, no. But that's something you need to figure out on your own. Good luck, and feel free to ask me any questions about the school or clinical years

Agreed.


Finally, why hasn't this been moved to the School-Specific sub-forum yet? Are we not doing that, this year?

 

[MCAT guy]

Finally, why hasn't this been moved to the School-Specific sub-forum yet? Are we not doing that, this year?

Wondering this myself since there were like 3 threads moved over there on the 1st page.

 

[Myuu]

getting up early for class =/= getting up early for work.

most medical students do attend lecture when it's offered. the not attending class = better performance issue has an enormous selection bias. Myuu misspoke; i'd wager she just wouldn't attend class if she went to a lecture-based school, just as many others do (errr, don't).

best post in the thread. attend CWRU if you have your heart set on something competitive. If you know you don't, WS is your place.

If that were the only option for hearing the material presented, you are correct. I would not go to class. I'd probably also suffer for it.

With only two hours a day, it's completely manageable and I might even pay attention. We have some really great lecturers. More than 2-4 hours a day and I don't care how could of a lecturer you are, my brain is going on standby.

Furthermore, the frequency of tests is probably more likely to do the damage. Not sure how WS does its testing, but we only test at the end of the block, so I'm never in a state of perpetual cram (which I feel like I would be if I were at a more traditional curriculum).

But that is a personal preference issue.

Wondering this myself since there were like 3 threads moved over there on the 1st page.

Moving to SSD. I've only been linked to this thread, so I only just realized today it was in pre-allo proper.

 

[FrickenhugeMD]

😕 So first, I think you are introducing a new argument here? But I can't be sure? Second, you first say that suburban matches are desirable...and then you slide into talking about rotations at DMC being great? I'm honestly, trying to understand you. Are you talking about the Wayne Match List, or about medical student rotations? I'm confused.

This is for the 3rd year of medical school. Clinical campuses are assigned through a lottery, which was what the OP was referring to in the sentence I originally quoted. Sorry for the confusion

 

[membername3]

Just wanted to thank everyone for their input.

I think I've pretty much decided on Case at this point. The much higher probability of doing residency outside of Michigan (or the midwest for that matter) plus the fact that I'm somewhat interested in doing academic medicine definitely tips the scale in Case's favor. Not to mention their curriculum seems like a much better fit for me.

Hopefully some grant money will seal the deal.

 

[Midfieldrulz]

Just wanted to thank everyone for their input.

I think I've pretty much decided on Case at this point. The much higher probability of doing residency outside of Michigan (or the midwest for that matter) plus the fact that I'm somewhat interested in doing academic medicine definitely tips the scale in Case's favor. Not to mention their curriculum seems like a much better fit for me.

Hopefully some grant money will seal the deal.

No, I think you need to reconsider and go to WS, because that will improve my chances for getting off the wait list at Case!😉 On a slightly serious note however (serious is not an option for me, sorry) I surveyed 8 practicing docs on med school choice and 7 of them told me to try and go to one that had the best match day stats. Random, I know, but still, food for thought.

 

[Evergrey]

No, I think you need to reconsider and go to WS, because that will improve my chances for getting off the wait list at Case!😉 On a slightly serious note however (serious is not an option for me, sorry) I surveyed 8 practicing docs on med school choice and 7 of them told me to try and go to one that had the best match day stats. Random, I know, but still, food for thought.

All the docs I talked to said go to the cheapest 😛 How odd