CCLCM (Cleveland Clinic) vs Hopkins/wash u/U Mich

[UnassumingToad]

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[BombsAway]

Tuition free is the place to be!

 

[Spectar]

I would say if it's a difference of more than 60-100k, then it should play a major factor. Those are all excellent schools and you will do well in any. You just have to balance Class size preference, Tuition, and Location. Post back when you get your financial packages, but AFTER you try and convince all 3 other schools to give you more money based on your CCLCM acceptance (full ride). At least one of those schools would be receptive to this.

 

[UnassumingToad]

I would say if it's a difference of more than 60-100k, then it should play a major factor. Those are all excellent schools and you will do well in any. You just have to balance Class size preference, Tuition, and Location. Post back when you get your financial packages, but AFTER you try and convince all 3 other schools to give you more money based on your CCLCM acceptance (full ride). At least one of those schools would be receptive to this.

Thank you so much for the advice!!!

Do you know if that is a Kosher thing to do? It feels just a little slimy since I'm already in a fortunate position.

 

[freedoctor17]

Thank you so much for the advice!!!

Do you know if that is a Kosher thing to do? It feels just a little slimy since I'm already in a fortunate position.

I mean if they can't give you more money they won't but if they can then no harm in trying. Just be like I really want to go here but cclm offers a full ride and I wouldn't be able to afford this one (if that's actually true). Then see what they say. At least that's the way I'd do it if I liked one of the other schools better. Though for me cclcm would be perfect since it's so close to home and an amazing school while also free on top of everything else.

 

[scienceguy95]

Hey all! I recognize I'm in a super fortunate position and I was just looking for a little guidance on how to assess the programs I've been accepted to. I'm still waiting to hear back from a number of schools, but for most part, I've got my decision laid out for me. CCLCM seems like the obvious choice because it is tuition free and I really like the program, but I want to make sure I'm really considering all my options.

Does anyone here have any insight as to how large a role money should be playing when making a decision? I'm definitely don't come from a wealthy family and I don't have a massive savings, so funding my medical education is all on me. In terms of specialty, I am not interested in anything surgical or competitive, but I hope to go into academic medicine. As of right now, I am most interested in med-peds, internal medicine (probably infectious disease), or psych (especially addiction medicine).

I loved CCLCM, especially the students I met, but I have to admit I have a few reservations about the school. First off, I am concerned about finding 'my people' in a group of 32. Obviously I'll try to make friends outside of medical school, but I wont pretend I am not a little nervous about the class size. Secondly, I am interested in public health research and working with urban undeserved groups; clearly Cleveland has no shortage of need, but I get the idea that the Cleveland Clinic is very much a tertiary center, and isn't quite as engaged with adjacent community as I would like. I feel like I might have to carve out my own opportunities to stay engaged with the community if I went here. I feel like if I went to a place like Wash U, Mich, or Hopkins there would be more robust opportunities for community engagement and (perhaps) more opportunity to work on issues relating to health equity (?)

I realize it is really early to be making a post like this, as I haven't even received financially aid packages at most places, but I'm trying to get a better understanding of what is really valuable when choosing a school.

Thanks so much in advance!

To me this is competition between CCLCM and Hopkins. Those two are better programs than Wash U and UMich in my opinion. Hopkins offers the ‘name’, but honestly CCLCM has a big name too with the Cleveland Clinic. Adding the tuition coverage, small class size, and no grades, I think CCLCM is the clear winner.

 

[CCresearcher]

Hey all! I recognize I'm in a super fortunate position and I was just looking for a little guidance on how to assess the programs I've been accepted to. I'm still waiting to hear back from a number of schools, but for most part, I've got my decision laid out for me. CCLCM seems like the obvious choice because it is tuition free and I really like the program, but I want to make sure I'm really considering all my options.

Does anyone here have any insight as to how large a role money should be playing when making a decision? I'm definitely don't come from a wealthy family and I don't have a massive savings, so funding my medical education is all on me. In terms of specialty, I am not interested in anything surgical or competitive, but I hope to go into academic medicine. As of right now, I am most interested in med-peds, internal medicine (probably infectious disease), or psych (especially addiction medicine).

I loved CCLCM, especially the students I met, but I have to admit I have a few reservations about the school. First off, I am concerned about finding 'my people' in a group of 32. Obviously I'll try to make friends outside of medical school, but I wont pretend I am not a little nervous about the class size. Secondly, I am interested in public health research and working with urban undeserved groups; clearly Cleveland has no shortage of need, but I get the idea that the Cleveland Clinic is very much a tertiary center, and isn't quite as engaged with adjacent community as I would like. I feel like I might have to carve out my own opportunities to stay engaged with the community if I went here. I feel like if I went to a place like Wash U, Mich, or Hopkins there would be more robust opportunities for community engagement and (perhaps) more opportunity to work on issues relating to health equity (?)

I realize it is really early to be making a post like this, as I haven't even received financially aid packages at most places, but I'm trying to get a better understanding of what is really valuable when choosing a school.

Thanks so much in advance!

First of all, congratulations on all of your acceptances! You have nothing but wonderful choices, and I'm sure you'll end up successful wherever you end up going.

I'm current first year at CCLCM, and I just wanted to weigh in on some of your points. Also, feel free to ask me if you have any more questions!

Just to start, I will say that I LOVE our school, and I am so beyond glad I ended up here. We are probably the happiest/least stressed batch of medical students you'll ever meet.

Anyhow, to your specific concerns:
1) Class size
This is a concern for many incoming students. I love the small class size, but it does come with both advantages and disadvantages. It is wonderful to get to know all of your classmates so well (we frequently have social events with the entire class in one person's apartment), and I think it's even more unusual that all of the faculty know all of our names (and many have since day 1). Being so small presents so many academic opportunities. The Cleveland Clinic is very proud of the medical school, and as a result we have just about any opportunity for shadowing or research you could possibly want. At the end of every weekly research talk we've had, the presenter has said they'd be happy to have us in their lab. You won't find that at other schools. I also would guess that you'd have no problem finding your people, since the school is pretty deliberate in choosing its students to make a cohesive class. That said, if you had a hard time finding friends, or felt like you didn't fit in or whatever reason, you could certainly connect with older students, and more importantly we also have the luxury of being the "sixth society" at Case Western. There are tons of opportunities to get involved with Case Med students, which is a much bigger cohort, and you'd have no trouble finding your group there. I know a few of my classmates intentionally joined clubs at Case or chose to live with Case students so they'd have a wider network of friends.

2) Community involvement/public health
So your point about the Clinic being a tertiary center/not as engaged with the community is partially correct. The main campus of the Clinic does primarily serve that function. But one of the many benefits of the Clinic is that it is a massive institution with tons of sites spread all around Cleveland (and the world), and starting their first year CCLCM students have clinical duties in some of these outside sites, many of which are in low income areas. Second, there are tons of opportunities for students to get engaged with the surrounding community, both through the Cleveland Clinic and Case. You will find no shortage of opportunities to get involved/give back, and the administration would be very supportive if you decided wanted to carve out your own instead. Also, a few of my classmates are pursuing a public health master's at Case (which we get to do for free as well).

Anyhow, I really love Lerner and I think it has a ton to offer, but I do think it's not the right program for everyone. It's smart on your end to wait until you have financial aid (if that's a huge factor in your decision) and I would highly recommend attending as many second look weekends as you can. You'll get a much better picture of your future classmates that way.

Best of luck!

 

[Willy38]

Hey all! I recognize I'm in a super fortunate position and I was just looking for a little guidance on how to assess the programs I've been accepted to. I'm still waiting to hear back from a number of schools, but for most part, I've got my decision laid out for me. CCLCM seems like the obvious choice because it is tuition free and I really like the program, but I want to make sure I'm really considering all my options.

Does anyone here have any insight as to how large a role money should be playing when making a decision? I'm definitely don't come from a wealthy family and I don't have a massive savings, so funding my medical education is all on me. In terms of specialty, I am not interested in anything surgical or competitive, but I hope to go into academic medicine. As of right now, I am most interested in med-peds, internal medicine (probably infectious disease), or psych (especially addiction medicine).

I loved CCLCM, especially the students I met, but I have to admit I have a few reservations about the school. First off, I am concerned about finding 'my people' in a group of 32. Obviously I'll try to make friends outside of medical school, but I wont pretend I am not a little nervous about the class size. Secondly, I am interested in public health research and working with urban undeserved groups; clearly Cleveland has no shortage of need, but I get the idea that the Cleveland Clinic is very much a tertiary center, and isn't quite as engaged with adjacent community as I would like. I feel like I might have to carve out my own opportunities to stay engaged with the community if I went here. I feel like if I went to a place like Wash U, Mich, or Hopkins there would be more robust opportunities for community engagement and (perhaps) more opportunity to work on issues relating to health equity (?)

I realize it is really early to be making a post like this, as I haven't even received financially aid packages at most places, but I'm trying to get a better understanding of what is really valuable when choosing a school.

Thanks so much in advance!

I'd go Hopkins or WashU. CC is an amazing clinical institution but I think WashU and Hopkins have a little more juice behind them. Specifically for health equity, Hopkins seems like a no-brainer given its location and association with the top ranked School of public health. Def wait on fin aid and it its absurd at WashU and hopkins then go for CC.

 

[scienceguy95]

I'd go Hopkins or WashU. CC is an amazing clinical institution but I think WashU and Hopkins have a little more juice behind them. Specifically for health equity, Hopkins seems like a no-brainer given its location and association with the top ranked School of public health. Def wait on fin aid and it its absurd at WashU and hopkins then go for CC.

I'm sorry but I have to completely disagree with the assertion that Hopkins or Wash U have more "juice" behind them than CC. CC is the #2 hospital in the United States (ranked higher than Mass Gen and Hopkins Hospital, mind you). The quality of the clinical training you'd receive at CC is going to be hard to find elsewhere (except maybe Mayo). The small class size at CCLCM also lets you develop closer relationships with faculty at a top academic medical center. Combine all of this with no grades/ranks and free tuition, and you have yourself a no-brainer. The match list for CCLCM really does speak for itself.

The only circumstance under which I'd advise OP to forego CCLCM is if the financials are equivalent AND he/she liked the other schools better for subjective reasons (e.g., larger class size, location, specific programs). Another reason to forego CCLCM would be if you don't see academic medicine or research as part of your career in the future. But to choose the other programs over a perceived "reputation" advantage is absurd. At this level, there really isn't a difference---it's all about fit.

 

[Willy38]

I'm sorry but I have to completely disagree with the assertion that Hopkins or Wash U have more "juice" behind them than CC. CC is the #2 hospital in the United States (ranked higher than Mass Gen and Hopkins Hospital, mind you). The quality of the clinical training you'd receive at CC is going to be hard to find elsewhere (except maybe Mayo). The small class size at CCLCM also lets you develop closer relationships with faculty at a top academic medical center. Combine all of this with no grades/ranks and free tuition, and you have yourself a no-brainer. The match list for CCLCM really does speak for itself.

The only circumstance under which I'd advise OP to forego CCLCM is if the financials are equivalent AND he/she liked the other schools better for subjective reasons (e.g., larger class size, location, specific programs). Another reason to forego CCLCM would be if you don't see academic medicine or research as part of your career in the future. But to choose the other programs over a perceived "reputation" advantage is absurd. At this level, there really isn't a difference---it's all about fit.

I see you are still pre-med so I'm sure you have a bit of a different perspective than me. US news hospital rankings matter much less than training quality which is typically represented by doximity. A strong hospital by the metrics US news uses isn't necessarily the best place to train.

I'm not the reputation expert or anything but I can just say from my time in med school that Hopkins and WashU are powerhouse names that everyone knows and talks about all the time while I've barely heard CC mentioned. This isn't to throw shade on CC, its just my experience at my school (and very well may have to do with the small class size). I know its an excellent clinical hospital with some amazing work going on but the size of Hopkins and WashU gives them certain advantages at least in the circles I've been in.

I would think what type of research you're interested in would matter a lot too given their affiliations with the university at large. Again, Hopkins for health equity is incredibly strong bc of their public health ties.

 

[scienceguy95]

I see you are still pre-med so I'm sure you have a bit of a different perspective than me. US news hospital rankings matter much less than training quality which is typically represented by doximity. A strong hospital by the metrics US news uses isn't necessarily the best place to train.

I'm not the reputation expert or anything but I can just say from my time in med school that Hopkins and WashU are powerhouse names that everyone knows and talks about all the time while I've barely heard CC mentioned. This isn't to throw shade on CC, its just my experience at my school (and very well may have to do with the small class size). I know its an excellent clinical hospital with some amazing work going on but the size of Hopkins and WashU gives them certain advantages at least in the circles I've been in.

I would think what type of research you're interested in would matter a lot too given their affiliations with the university at large. Again, Hopkins for health equity is incredibly strong bc of their public health ties.

Although I agree that a high ranking hospital isn't necessarily a good teaching hospital, this assessment is just wrong for the particular case of the Cleveland Clinic. CCLCM has established itself as a high calibre program with students both performing exceptionally on board exams (much better than the UMich average, I might add) and matching into the best residency programs in the country. The fact that the OP is even considering CCLCM with other top 10 programs is a testament to its reputation (and if you go back through the years, you'll see posters often ask for help choosing between CCLCM and other top schools).

I am not disputing the fact that Hopkins and Wash U are powerhouses. I'm simply saying the Cleveland Clinic is on the same level in terms of clinical and translational medicine. I've personally spoken with students who attended CCLCM over acceptances to Harvard and Yale. Again, at this level, your choice of medical school should be determined by financials and fit. A tuition free education at CCLCM is an incredible opportunity--one which would not limit OP's residency or career prospects in any way compared to the other schools he/she is considering. If you are partial to the other schools for certain subjective reasons, I think it's important to make that clear. Otherwise, I believe it's irresponsible to suggest OP forego free medical school at a top academic medical center with a truly unique program because of your own biases.

 

[Willy38]

Although I agree that a high ranking hospital isn't necessarily a good teaching hospital, this assessment is just wrong for the particular case of the Cleveland Clinic. CCLCM has established itself as a high calibre program with students both performing exceptionally on board exams (much better than the UMich average, I might add) and matching into the best residency programs in the country. The fact that the OP is even considering CCLCM with other top 10 programs is a testament to its reputation (and if you go back through the years, you'll see posters often ask for help choosing between CCLCM and other top schools).

I am not disputing the fact that Hopkins and Wash U are powerhouses. I'm simply saying the Cleveland Clinic is on the same level in terms of clinical and translational medicine. I've personally spoken with students who attended CCLCM over acceptances to Harvard and Yale. Again, at this level, your choice of medical school should be determined by financials and fit. A tuition free education at CCLCM is an incredible opportunity--one which would not limit OP's residency or career prospects in any way compared to the other schools he/she is considering. If you are partial to the other schools for certain subjective reasons, I think it's important to make that clear. Otherwise, I believe it's irresponsible to suggest OP forego free medical school at a top academic medical center with a truly unique program because of your own biases.

Irresponsible ? LOL

Taking yourself a little too serious there premed.

Wasn’t knocking CC, just saying Hopkins has more clout among many and has the best public health school in the country. Fit is of course what it comes down to but given stated interests of the OP, sounds like Hopkins may be better.

 

[scienceguy95]

Irresponsible ? LOL

Taking yourself a little too serious there premed.

Wasn’t knocking CC, just saying Hopkins has more clout among many and has the best public health school in the country. Fit is of course what it comes down to but given stated interests of the OP, sounds like Hopkins may be better.

Well I've said my piece and I hope the OP makes the best decision for him or herself. I'll just say I disagree with the assertion that Hopkins has more clout than CC in medicine (unless your only metric is the USNWR research rankings, which has a very specific methodology). Free medical school is no joke and it's not worth incurring extreme debt for a non-existent reputation advantage.

Finally, I just wanted to say that I find your condescension incredibly disrespectful. I'm not sure what possessed you to believe you have so much more wisdom than an accepted but not matriculated student. I certainly hope you don't treat your patients like that in the future.

 

[Lawpy]

Well I've said my piece and I hope the OP makes the best decision for him or herself. I'll just say I disagree with the assertion that Hopkins has more clout than CC in medicine (unless your only metric is the USNWR research rankings, which has a very specific methodology). Free medical school is no joke and it's not worth incurring extreme debt for a non-existent reputation advantage.

Finally, I just wanted to say that I find your condescension incredibly disrespectful. I'm not sure what possessed you to believe you have so much more wisdom than an accepted but not matriculated student. I certainly hope you don't treat your patients like that in the future.

Burnett's Law achieved in 13 posts. Nice!

I have no idea why this thread got heated and why members are so polarized. The decision is up to OP in the end. Personally, I'm leaning towards JHU/WashU over CCLCM but that's just me. If OP prioritizes money heavily, CCLCM is probably a better choice. All we can do is give our honest thoughts and let OP make the final decision.

 

[efle]

Wait for financials and attend second looks. Costs or your sense of happiness there might make the decision for you.

If they don't, it's hard to beat Hopkins for you. They offer free MPHs to about a dozen students per year over at Bloomberg, one of the best public health schools, if that's your thing. Dunno much about hospital rankings but if you just want to go straight for the academic IM residency matching to JHU IM can't be beat, that and MGH are at the tippy top for kickstarting your career.

 

[Willy38]

Well I've said my piece and I hope the OP makes the best decision for him or herself. I'll just say I disagree with the assertion that Hopkins has more clout than CC in medicine (unless your only metric is the USNWR research rankings, which has a very specific methodology). Free medical school is no joke and it's not worth incurring extreme debt for a non-existent reputation advantage.

Finally, I just wanted to say that I find your condescension incredibly disrespectful. I'm not sure what possessed you to believe you have so much more wisdom than an accepted but not matriculated student. I certainly hope you don't treat your patients like that in the future.

Hahaha thank you for your assessment science guy. Calling someone irresponsible for posting a more informed opinion than your own (hence the reference to premed) is laughable and I called you out on it. Sorry if that hurt your feelings. I’m not the most wise but I’ve certainly learned a lot in med school which has changed my opinions from when I was a premed 4 years ago. And I’m sure the same will go for residency. Wasn’t meant to be condescending, just saying opinions mature with experience. As always, consider the source.

Anyways, to OP, sorry for this ridiculous side convo. Best of luck with your decision. You have some great options.

 

[mehc012]

I see you are still pre-med so I'm sure you have a bit of a different perspective than me. US news hospital rankings matter much less than training quality which is typically represented by doximity. A strong hospital by the metrics US news uses isn't necessarily the best place to train.

I'm not the reputation expert or anything but I can just say from my time in med school that Hopkins and WashU are powerhouse names that everyone knows and talks about all the time while I've barely heard CC mentioned. This isn't to throw shade on CC, its just my experience at my school (and very well may have to do with the small class size). I know its an excellent clinical hospital with some amazing work going on but the size of Hopkins and WashU gives them certain advantages at least in the circles I've been in.

I would think what type of research you're interested in would matter a lot too given their affiliations with the university at large. Again, Hopkins for health equity is incredibly strong bc of their public health ties.

Hopkins and WashU have about 120 students graduating each year. CCLCM has 32. Hardly surprising that the larger programs would pop up more often. You see this with undergrads, too...every lay person talks about Harvard and Stanford, and few mention the Williams and Amhersts and Pomonas of the world. And yet, those schools frequently top all of the Ivies on ranking lists, and the people who count - the ones hiring, or working in admissions offices - know about them and give them their due credence.

The only thing bigger about WashU and Hopkins is the number of MD students. And for those going on about research opps at the others, don't ignore the fact that CCLCM is specifically designed around research and has a ressearch year built in for all students. You can't get out of there without research on your resume. Mix in free tuition and, well...why is this a question?

The only factor here should be whether OP has a strong preference for the school style one way or the other. CCLCM has a pretty unique curriculum setup, and as one member of a very small class, if you don't like it, you're gonna have a bad time. This is not a prestige question, it's one of the few times where 'fit' with the school as a whole is the key factor.

 

[efle]

Hopkins and WashU have about 120 students graduating each year. CCLCM has 32. Hardly surprising that the larger programs would pop up more often. You see this with undergrads, too...every lay person talks about Harvard and Stanford, and few mention the Williams and Amhersts and Pomonas of the world. And yet, those schools frequently top all of the Ivies on ranking lists, and the people who count - the ones hiring, or working in admissions offices - know about them and give them their due credence.

The only thing bigger about WashU and Hopkins is the number of MD students. And for those going on about research opps at the others, don't ignore the fact that CCLCM is specifically designed around research and has a ressearch year built in for all students. You can't get out of there without research on your resume. Mix in free tuition and, well...why is this a question?

The only factor here should be whether OP has a strong preference for the school style one way or the other. CCLCM has a pretty unique curriculum setup, and as one member of a very small class, if you don't like it, you're gonna have a bad time. This is not a prestige question, it's one of the few times where 'fit' with the school as a whole is the key factor.

Isn't lerner brand new, like 10 years old? No doubt they're a fantastic program but I don't think the only difference in rep vs Hopkins/WashU is based on size, they're still establishing themselves. Hence the full rides to recruit?

do they publish their match list that could be some good evidence

 

[mehc012]

Isn't lerner brand new, like 10 years old? No doubt they're a fantastic program but I don't think the only difference in rep vs Hopkins/WashU is based on size, they're still establishing themselves. Hence the full rides to recruit?

do they publish their match list that could be some good evidence

The full rides aren't to recruit. It's not like everyone gets a scholarship, it's a baseline characteristic of the program.
They do publish their match lists. Easy Google search.
And yes, CCLCM branch specifically was founded as a collab between CWRUSOM and CCF 15-20yrs ago, but it's technically a part of the CWRU school of medicine, which has been around longer...Cleveland Clinic just wanted a specific, more research-oriented track that was affiliated specifically with the Clinic itself, rather than primarily with the other Cleveland hospitals like CWRU.

I'm just saying that their name isn't going to hurt you in the match. You'll be doing your AIs at Cleveland Clinic, you'll have guaranteed solid research, you'll be good. And one is free...

 

[scienceguy95]

Isn't lerner brand new, like 10 years old? No doubt they're a fantastic program but I don't think the only difference in rep vs Hopkins/WashU is based on size, they're still establishing themselves. Hence the full rides to recruit?

do they publish their match list that could be some good evidence

I don't think it's fair to say they are still establishing themselves. While obviously the full-ride helps with recruitment, it seems to be more in line with their philosophy of freeing students to choose a specialty based on academic interest rather than finances. This makes sense especially when you consider that academic medicine is generally less financially rewarding than private practice.

Yes, their match lists are public. From 2017: CCLCM Class of 2017 Match Results

Again, I don't think it can be overstated that you receive your training at the Cleveland Clinic.

 

[efle]

The full rides aren't to recruit. It's not like everyone gets a scholarship, it's a baseline characteristic of the program.
They do publish their match lists. Easy Google search.
And yes, CCLCM branch specifically was founded as a collab between CWRUSOM and CCF 15-20yrs ago, but it's technically a part of the CWRU school of medicine, which has been around longer...Cleveland Clinic just wanted a specific, more research-oriented track that was affiliated specifically with the Clinic itself, rather than primarily with the other Cleveland hospitals like CWRU.

Does being baseline mean it wasn't intended to help their yield?

So that looks like they sent 1 person to JHU IM and the other 4 to solid but not "big 4" academic IM programs. And only 3 home matches, two in family med. Weird

 

[scienceguy95]

Does being baseline mean it wasn't intended to help their yield?

So that looks like they sent 1 person to JHU IM and the other 4 to solid but not "big 4" academic IM programs. And only 3 home matches, two in family med. Weird

What more are you looking for in a match list? In 2017, there was a couples match to JHU in internal medicine and ENT. Almost every match is either a top program, a competitive specialty, or both.

 

[mehc012]

Does being baseline mean it wasn't intended to help their yield?

So that looks like they sent 1 person to JHU IM and the other 4 to solid but not "big 4" academic IM programs. And only 3 home matches, two in family med. Weird

What are you looking at? The one I linked had 11 home matches, plus a Mass Gen, couple of NYUs. Plenty of ENT/Plastics/Uro if that's your thing, also fair amount of Anes/Optho/Derm if you're more lifestyle.
You're strangely fixated on JHU IM. Not everyone wants to end up at Hopkins, ever.

 

[efle]

What more are you looking for in a match list? In 2017, there was a couples match to JHU in internal medicine and ENT. Almost every match is either a top program, a competitive specialty, or both.

What are you looking at? The one I linked had 11 home matches, plus a Mass Gen, couple of NYUs. Plenty of ENT/Plastics/Uro if that's your thing, also fair amount of Anes/Optho/Derm if you're more lifestyle.
You're strangely fixated on JHU IM. Not everyone wants to end up at Hopkins, ever.

Was looking at the one scienceguy linked. Was looking for either tons of home advantage and/or extraordinary IM placement (thought I also don't think cleveland has a rep among medicine residency to rival its hospital ranking). For someone in OP's position with public health interests, academic IM interests I think JHU is unbeatable its true. Thought as I said before anything else, wait to see costs and second look impression because that's more important.

 

[scienceguy95]

Was looking at the one scienceguy linked. Was looking for either tons of home advantage and/or extraordinary IM placement (thought I also don't think cleveland has a rep among medicine residency to rival its hospital ranking). For someone in OP's position with public health interests, academic IM interests I think JHU is unbeatable its true. Thought as I said before anything else, wait to see costs and second look impression because that's more important.

I mean if your goal in life is to go to JHU for IM, then sure attend JHU for medical school to maximize your chances. CCLCM will not prevent you from landing your desired program/specialty. I think you’re forgetting that match lists are also shaped by personal preferences.

 

[efle]

I mean if your goal in life is to go to JHU for IM, then sure attend JHU for medical school to maximize your chances. CCLCM will not prevent you from landing your desired program/specialty. I think you’re forgetting that match lists are also shaped by personal preferences.

Haha true, though I think the people willing to live in St louis or Baltimore or Cleveland tend to be a less picky bunch

 

[scienceguy95]

Haha true, though I think the people willing to live in St louis or Baltimore or Cleveland tend to be a less picky bunch

Or just people who will sacrifice a good location for a good program I suppose.

 

[oncology2020]

wow that 2017 CCLCM match list is really impressive, one of the best I've seen. CCLCM is free tuition and no grades and no exams AND you get a degree from a top 20-25 med school (Case Western) and a top 2 hospital? The choice is definitely between CCLCM and Hopkins no doubt. My vote goes to CCLCM.

Brigham & Women’s Hospital, MA for psych
Brigham & Women’s Hospital, MA for psych/research track
Harvard Medical School/Mass Eye and Ear, MA for ENT
Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center, MA for IM
Johns Hopkins Hospital, MD for IM
Johns Hopkins Hospital, MD for ENT
Duke University Medical Center, NC for IM
UCLA Medical Center, CA for orthopedic surgery
UCLA Medical Center, CA for general surgery
Stanford University, CA for Pathology
Stanford University, CA for Thoracic surgery
Stanford University, CA for pediatrics
Stanford University, CA for Rad Onc
Yale-New Haven Hospital, CT for EM
Yale-New Haven Hospital, CT for IM
Vanderbilt University Medical Center, TN for IM
Vanderbilt University Medical Center, TN for Med-Peds
UPMC Medical Education, PA for Peds
NYP Hospital-Weill Cornell Medical Center, NY for Neurology
University of Texas Southwestern Medical School, TX for urology
Cleveland Clinic for Rad Onc, and Family Med x 2

that represents 23 out of the 32 students..most of those are highly competitive specialties at some of the best institutions in the US (the other 10 went to strong programs as well but those were the highlights)

 

[scienceguy95]

There has been some debate here, but in the end I would strongly recommend OP choose the school he/she has the best gut feeling about after second looks. The academic opportunities will be similar at all these schools. I would especially advise against choosing CCLCM if you’re not certain it’s the best fit for you—not just for your sake but for the sake of your fellow classmates in such a small program.

 

[mehc012]

There has been some debate here, but in the end I would strongly recommend OP choose the school he/she has the best gut feeling about after second looks. The academic opportunities will be similar at all these schools. I would especially advise against choosing CCLCM if you’re not certain it’s the best fit for you—not just for your sake but for the sake of your fellow classmates in such a small program.

This times 1000. CCLCM is a very different environment than most med schools, so this is one where fit is a far bigger factor than usual.