Chances are Slim, Outlook?

[Perspectives99]

Hey, I am a sophomore in college and I know that my chances for med school are going to be slim. I study a lot and I haven't even gone to one party but it that has no correlation to grades. My overall GPA is around 3.1 and Science is around 3.0. I am taking two science classes now and one math class. I will probably get an A in the math class but most likely at most a b+ in both bio classes. It will be around b- so far. I study a lot, I just don't get all A's. The school is very difficult tho. I was just wondering, with a 3.1-2 overall GPA in the end of college, even a solid MCAT won't give much of a fighting chance. MCAT's don't have much correlation to grades. I have seen MCAT questions already and I realize why they don't have a correlation. Anyhow, what does one do with a bio major? Go to work at a service desk in a hospital. The pay is not that bad, 30,000 a year. It's like a residency. Given that there is no emphasis on D.O. schools.

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[braluk]

I have absolutely no idea what you are asking, your post is extremely unorganized at best. You still have a chance, but its going to be a hard uphill battle. Maybe you need to improve your study habits to improve your grades. There are different ways for people to memorize information for an exam but it seems like the best way is to keep up with class, go to lecture, answer practice questions, and for me at least, to write down everything in shorthand as i read them because I learn better when I write it down and it is easier to review. If by junior or senior year, your GPA has not risen drastically you may want to stroll over to the postbaccalaureate forums and take a look at my thread- the official guide to SMPs, it has helped many students with low GPAs get into medical school. Good luck

 

[sunnyjohn]

Step back. Before you register for your next class, you need to focus on the reasons your grades are so low.

Books on study skills and time managment are in order. You might also want to look into books that teach you focus and concentration (ADHD?)

Start working on your writing and verbal skills (good MCAT prep).

 

[Law2Doc]

Hey, I am a sophomore in college and I know that my chances for med school are going to be slim. I study a lot and I haven't even gone to one party but it that has no correlation to grades. My overall GPA is around 3.1 and Science is around 3.0. I am taking two science classes now and one math class. I will probably get an A in the math class but most likely at most a b+ in both bio classes. It will be around b- so far. I study a lot, I just don't get all A's. The school is very difficult tho. I was just wondering, with a 3.1-2 overall GPA in the end of college, even a solid MCAT won't give much of a fighting chance. MCAT's don't have much correlation to grades. I have seen MCAT questions already and I realize why they don't have a correlation. Anyhow, what does one do with a bio major? Go to work at a service desk in a hospital. The pay is not that bad, 30,000 a year. It's like a residency. Given that there is no emphasis on D.O. schools.

First, MCAT does have some correlation to grades in that people who struggle with the sciences will struggle with the MCAT and vice versa. Believe it or not, it is the rare 3.1 average person who gets a really high MCAT score (although everyone anecdotally knows someone who did).
Second, it is largely myth that a high MCAT balances out a low GPA -- med schools expect both to be good.
Third, you are going to have to get your GPA up before you are ready to consider med school so no point focussing on the MCAT just yet. Try a lighter load, different study techniques, tutors, or whatever and start upping that GPA. If you can't get higher than a 3.1-2, you need to start considering postbac/SMP options. Currently the average med school matriculant has a 3.5, and so that is what you need to approach to start being confident in your application.

 

[Falco2525]

Hey, I am a sophomore in college and I know that my chances for med school are going to be slim. I study a lot and I haven't even gone to one party but it that has no correlation to grades. My overall GPA is around 3.1 and Science is around 3.0. I am taking two science classes now and one math class. I will probably get an A in the math class but most likely at most a b+ in both bio classes. It will be around b- so far. I study a lot, I just don't get all A's. The school is very difficult tho. I was just wondering, with a 3.1-2 overall GPA in the end of college, even a solid MCAT won't give much of a fighting chance. MCAT's don't have much correlation to grades. I have seen MCAT questions already and I realize why they don't have a correlation. Anyhow, what does one do with a bio major? Go to work at a service desk in a hospital. The pay is not that bad, 30,000 a year. It's like a residency. Given that there is no emphasis on D.O. schools.

you are stilla sophomore which means you have a whole year to pull up your grades...get A's the rest of the time...it is almost a must...get your overall up to 3.3...and know offense but your writing was very scattered and may correlate to why you dont get A's in the sciences...you may just be struggling to get your point across...just a thought

 

[Perspectives99]

Memorize information. I never tried that because it's useless. With that tactic you don't really understand the information, you are just memorizing it. It i useless when it comes to tests where you have to construct experiments to prove DNA techniques, for example. It's not that easy to get A's in all of your classes. I was pumped to start this semester and so long it seems slim that I will get anything above a B+, except math. My problem isn't memorizing though because if I understand a concept, basically I will not forget it, even down the road. How many of you actually memorize information, this is actually interesting.

 

[instigata]

The pay is not that bad, 30,000 a year. It's like a residency.

Yeah it's like a residency without the 100 G's afterward

 

[kevster2001]

Have you tried a tutor? If you're struggling this much on entry level science courses it might not bode well for the MCAT since they're comparable in that both ask science questions.

That being said, maybe you'll prove us wrong and rock the **** out of the mcat, in which case your low gpa is less of a concern. but dont forget, there's always Africa, land of the weak apps

 

[HumbleMD]

Memorize information. I never tried that because it's useless. With that tactic you don't really understand the information, you are just memorizing it. It i useless when it comes to tests where you have to construct experiments to prove DNA techniques, for example. It's not that easy to get A's in all of your classes. I was pumped to start this semester and so long it seems slim that I will get anything above a B+, except math. My problem isn't memorizing though because if I understand a concept, basically I will not forget it, even down the road. How many of you actually memorize information, this is actually interesting.

You can understand the Kreb's cycle all you want, but if you don't memorize the steps of it you're certainly not going to pass the exam, let alone get an A in the class. Understanding the concept is indeed key, but there's a hell of a lot of "memorizing" to be done in chemistry, biochemistry, MCAT, the USMLE and other courses down the road (did you ever try to learn a second language? Lots of initial "memorizing" to learn vocab succesfully). If you are a sophomore, you may actually want to listen to some of the people on here rather than argue with them. Many (but not all) are in med school or have succesfully applied.

You're about to get a lot of people telling you to "ace" the MCAT. I've got news for you though, as Law said, the chances are pretty slim for someone with a 3.1 GPA to pull out a 40. (Incidentally I would love to see how all of these "What are my chances with a 3.0 GPA" thread posters end up doing on the MCAT.)

And FYI, everyone thinks *their* school is "very difficult." I'll bet $10 an adcom won't.

 

[kevster2001]

And FYI, everyone thinks *their* school is "very difficult." I'll bet $10 an adcom won't.

who knows, maybe he goes to caltech

 

[Green Pirate]

Given that there is no emphasis on D.O. schools.

What do you mean by that? I think if you have a low gpa and a low (but not too low) of a an MCAT you might consider going the DO route. Sure you won't be an MD... but it's exponentially better than taking a clerical position at a hospital and making 30k for the rest of your life.

 

[HumbleMD]

who knows, maybe he goes to caltech

Yeah, there's a chance. That's why I'd bet $10 and not $1000. I'm still guessing it was a good bet though.

 

[Perspectives99]

They are not entry-level, they are upper level genetics and evolution required for the major. I haven't taken biochem, chem, organic chem or phys yet, it's a long story. 40 MCAT? Nobody gets above a 38 these days, handful only do. In the end it won't be a 3.0, it will be around a 3.4-3.5. I was just asking about what options there are besides med school. I was not asking about study skills, because they only get you so far. There's not of a difference between the 3.1 student and the 3.8 student. Neither is smarter or better and neither 'works harder'.

 

[rhsu84]

Don't be discouraged - I graduated with a 3.2, after getting a 2.7 my freshman year. Granted, my situation is sorta different (I partied my ass off and then had some crazy things happen to my friends that took my mind off school). But I had really good relationships with my profs and supervisors at work, so they wrote me really great recs (I can only assume), and I had pretty good extra-curriculars. Study your butt off for the MCAT, and do some real, meaningful ECs, and you can definately still get in. My semesters in college: 2.8, 2.55, 2.8, 3.1, 3.3, 3.4, 3.5, 3.8. 31q MCAT.

and, going to a U.S. allopathic medical school next fall. Keep your head up.

 

[HumbleMD]

They are not entry-level, they are upper level genetics and evolution required for the major. I haven't taken biochem, chem, organic chem or phys yet, it's a long story. 40 MCAT? Nobody gets above a 38 these days, handful only do. In the end it won't be a 3.0, it will be around a 3.4-3.5. I was just asking about what options there are besides med school.

News to us. We'll change our responses but have you read your initial post? It's almost unintelligible.

I was not asking about study skills, because they only get you so far. There's not of a difference between the 3.1 student and the 3.8 student. Neither is smarter or better and neither 'works harder'.

Sounds like a claim to save for your personal statement. Let me know how it goes over...

 

[Green Pirate]

I still think he sounds like a good candidate for a DO school... why is he looking for an alternative to med school entirely?

 

[armybound]

Don't be discouraged - I graduated with a 3.2, after getting a 2.7 my freshman year. Granted, my situation is sorta different (I partied my ass off and then had some crazy things happen to my friends that took my mind off school). But I had really good relationships with my profs and supervisors at work, so they wrote me really great recs (I can only assume), and I had pretty good extra-curriculars. Study your butt off for the MCAT, and do some real, meaningful ECs, and you can definately still get in. My semesters in college: 2.8, 2.55, 2.8, 3.1, 3.3, 3.4, 3.5, 3.8. 31q MCAT.

and, going to a U.S. allopathic medical school next fall. Keep your head up.

I agree with this guy/girl.

my semesters: 2.5, 2.7, 3.4, 3.2, 2.9 (wtf?), 3.8, 3.9, 4.0, 31P MCAT, graduated with a 3.3

 

[Perspectives99]

Oh yeah about recs. If I have around 300-400 hours for a hospital, is that enough? You know, since it's only in one place. My first semester was a 3.6, second was 2.8, third was a 3.6 and now is my third. The first semester was from another school.

 

[HumbleMD]

Oh yeah about recs. If I have around 300-400 hours for a hospital, is that enough? You know, since it's only in one place. My first semester was a 3.6, second was 2.8, third was a 3.6 and now is my third. The first semester was from another school.

Was that school difficult too?
Hours are important up to a point, but did you interact with patients from beyond that desk? Was there any meaningful clinical or patient contact experiences you could write about or talk about in an interview? If so, then yes, you've done enough time.

 

[Perspectives99]

Oh yeah, it's a huge private hosptial. Gastroentorology. The doctors there got paid more than they should. School is more difficult that I assumed at first. Some dude did get a 41 on the MCAT in this school last year tho.

 

[HumbleMD]

Hitting hot topics (MCAT and GPAs, MD v. DO)
+ Unintelligible posts
+ Not answering questions
+ Low post count
+ Bragging, ignorant tone
= Troll alert

Close the thread, stop responding.

 

[QuantumMechanic]

40 MCAT? Nobody gets above a 38 these days, handful only do.

 

[QuantumMechanic]

Some dude did get a 41 on the MCAT in this school last year tho.

thats amazing...were you that guy?

 

[instigata]

Double post

 

[instigata]

There's not of a difference between the 3.1 student and the 3.8 student. Neither is smarter or better and neither 'works harder'.

Umm...newsflash...there IS a difference between a 3.1 and 3.8 student. It's like saying there is no difference between a 36 MCAT and a 25 MCAT.

Perspective, it seems as though you are not thoroughly contemplating all of your options and not focusing on the correct things to do to become successful. For example, you could have 1,000,000 hours of volunteer work with a doctor but if you parked in the physician's reserved parking for all of those hours, he is not going to like you and write you a really bad recommendation (and warn the admissions committee that you take other people's reserved parkings). He might even recommend that the admissions committee sets up a good deal with a towing company if they accept you. Well....you get my point right?

Maybe if you hang around SDN a bit more you'll understand the more important aspects of your application. And by the way, you STILL do have a chance, don't give up yet.

 

[brianmartin]

School is more difficult that I assumed at first.

And you haven't taken organic yet!

 

[stiffany]

So I sat halfway through college (end of fall semester sophomore year) with a GPA very similar to yours, looking at my chances and wondering if I was even cut out for medicine since it's so competitive.

What I did is I chose to take some time away from my science coursework to reflect on why I wasn't doing well and to beef up my study skills. While this was difficult to do in part because it made me doubt my drive and ambition for pursuing medicine at all, it was ultimately one of the best decisions I made. Later on, when I was more mature and more able to handle the coursework I dove back into my premedical requirements and found that I did much better. I had a better sense of how I needed to study in order to get the grades I wanted and also didn't feel as lost. This may be an option you need to consider, especially if you think you're doing everything you can and are still struggling. As far as getting a tutor and talking to your professor about improving, I think the other posters in this forum have done an adequate job of addressing that.

That being said, while your science and cumulative GPA are low (as you know, otherwise why are you here?), they are not final roadblocks to your future as a physician neither in the sense of you being unable to improve them for a postbac (or expensive SMP) nor do they necessarily mean that you won't get into medical school. Contrary to what I've heard on this board and throughout my time as a flailing (and thriving) premed student, a mediocre GPA (and here I'm talking about that 3.0-3.2 range - I think GPA's lower than that do really hinder people in a lot of ways) is not the end of your medical career. If you have an interesting application with great EC's, a fantastic personal statement, and really great letters, a lower GPA can be overcome. Likewise, I'd like to see the study that shows GPA and MCAT correlating (especially science GPA). I still have a crappy science GPA and I did really really well on the MCAT. Doing well had very little correlation to my science coursework performance for me (since I had taken a lot of it five years ago) and instead had a lot to do with busting my bum taking practice exams, drilling the information into my head, and going back and forth between answering questions and understanding why my answers were wrong or RIGHT.

So, don't lose hope. You will have a more difficult time if you cannot bring your GPA up and you may not get consideration at the creme de la creme programs (Here, I'm talking top five/top ten - not top 50), but it's not the end of the world. I recommend taking time off from science course (like a semester where you spend time taking humanities/social science classes or maybe just one easy science class with those) to give yourself time to reflect on your study habits and learning style before making your GPA worse. I also think talking to a learning resources counselor at your school about opportunities and your professors about their input for improving would be helpful. Finally, I say start thinking about what things you'll have that will make you as an individual stand out in a pile of 5,000 AMCAS applications both in terms of activities and letters of rec. Good luck.

 

[Falco2525]

Oh yeah, it's a huge private hosptial. Gastroentorology. The doctors there got paid more than they should. School is more difficult that I assumed at first. Some dude did get a 41 on the MCAT in this school last year tho.

there was someone from my undergraduate (Trinity University) who got a 41...I wonder if it was him

 

[armybound]

I hear there's some girl from TX on this board that got a 41 on the MCAT..

 

[Perspectives99]

I finished all of my general ed's already. One of people I know studied 3 hours a week for organic chemistry and got an A. It's not hard for everybody. People are wired differently and environemnt (the one that you live in) of course plays a role. It's much easier to be a good student then it is to be a good doctor. I have been to many doctors and only 1 of them knew his stuff. He was a neurosurgeon and he was scared to do the surgery, so I mean I don't know. Getting a 41 on the MCAT doesn't mean anything, if you can't apply your medical knowledge to patients then they will be screwed. I'm not angry at that doctor though because the condition is known on a very small level.

 

[sunnyjohn]

Q of Quimica got a 42 or somthing like that.

 

[enviromed21]

They are not entry-level, they are upper level genetics and evolution required for the major. I haven't taken biochem, chem, organic chem or phys yet, it's a long story. 40 MCAT? Nobody gets above a 38 these days, handful only do. In the end it won't be a 3.0, it will be around a 3.4-3.5. I was just asking about what options there are besides med school. I was not asking about study skills, because they only get you so far. There's not of a difference between the 3.1 student and the 3.8 student. Neither is smarter or better and neither 'works harder'.

You can do graduate school work in bio. Maybe go work for a government agency- I've met quite a few microbiologist who don't have PhD's (you'd be surprised) and make pretty good money. IDK-ask around in the bio department at your school, try google. Hope I helped a little. Wish you the best of luck.

P.S. -Don't let any self-proclaiming pricks try and intimidate you on this site. They're usually the most insecure of the bunch who never got enough attention as children and seek out this attention by stirring up useless arguments in an attmept to avoid dealing with their own character flaws. My advice is not to waste your time arguing with them either - I'm so sure it could cause your IQ to decrease .