Columbia - what I saw. what did you think?

[DarkChild]

I just got back from my Columbia interview, so I wanted to start up a dialogue about the school and hopefully hear from some other applicants and some current Columbia students.
Here's what I saw:
Contrary to what I had thought about the school, the facilities were pretty nice. The classrooms we saw, study room and parts of the hospital we saw were all very nice. I saw some of the labs and apart from in the Black building, they were very very nice. Students were very friendly. Faculty was engaging and laid back. The neighborhood wasnt that bad and I've seen a lot worse.
Now here are some of the things I saw that I didnt like at all:
The students (while drawn from excellent ugrad institutions) seemed pretty immature and into their drinking. A class president told us with some pride how hung over he was. All in all, the diversity at the school was very low and the students seemed to have been pulled from ivy league frats. It was very surprising given the nature of Washington Heights and its patient population. I got a sense that the students werent really vested in the neighborhood. In comparison to Mount Sinai, the students at Columbia just didnt seem that thrilled about getting involved with the community at large. All in all, more so than any of the other NYC schools I interviewed at (Cornell and MSSM) the students at Columbia seem too psyched to be in NYC and were much more focused on going out, eating out down town and visiting museums et al. than any where else. I guess maybe I'm a little jaded because I've been in NYC for a while...?
MSTPers here are some things that I found interesting:
1) One out of 5 interviewers asked about my research and even then I was only able to touch on it briefly!
2) More so than any other school I've seen, the faculty were very eager to sell the school and did a fair amount of trash talking about other institutions.
3) I really liked my student interviewer and I got a chance to meet two other MudPhudders and they were much more personable than I have seen at other schools.
Anyway, lets hear what y'all thought about Columbia. If there are any current students at CU - I'd love to hear from you guys as well!!

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[ValleyGal]

Hey there--
I am a current columbia first year and would love to give you my two cents on all of your thoughts about Columbia. I am rediculously happy here, so fair warning that I might be a little biased!!!

You are right about the facilities being good -- that is one of the parts of Columbia that I liked so much when I visited (I tended to think that if all the buildings were falling down and the paint was peeling in the classrooms, that was a reflection on how the students were treated by the administration and how much money and effort was funneled into the program. Besides, who wants to spend four years inside crappy buildings) We have a great hospital and they just built new research labs and are always doing construction on something. The first year lecture hall is great and the anatomy lab has tons of windows and is spotless (this is key for making spending countless hours in a stinky room with lots of dead body parts managable.) The library I would give a fair -- not all that much study space and it is really really cold -- but it is great when you really want to hunker down and do some serious brain stuffing. Thus, we tend to spread out through the classrooms and our 17th floor student learning center (gorgeous view that I am sure you saw) as well as hop a train to the undergrad campus and pick up some younger undergrads ummm I mean study. You are right about the students being nice and friendly and the faculty being great, and the neighborhood is alright. It is not dangerous, and although it can be difficult to find food, it keeps us out of trouble.

As for your critiques of the student body here as a whole, that is something about which you have to make up your own mind whether you like. I am a number one offender of your points (sorority, right out of college) and I chose Columbia for the fact that students here do have some fun. Med school can suck you in dude, and if you don't throw a party party sometimes then you will loose your mind. There is a core of 30-40 first years here who go out a lot (out of 150) because that is how they spend their social scene time. Other people spend their free time doing other stuff that they like. I love grabbing a few beers with people in my class, but if that is not your scene, thats no problem. I am also one of those who are psyched to be in New York, and I think that is a good thing -- I love going out to fun clubs and wandering around the shopping neighborhoods and trying new exotic restaurants. This city has so much to offer that I would be remiss at not enjoying it. Besides, it is nice to live in a city where when you actually create some free time, there is always something going on. I could imagine nothing worse than taking a big test on a Monday when you live in some rinky dink town and then finding nowhere to go out and blow off some steam.

Getting involved in the neighborhood is also an option -- the P&S club has a group called Cultura that goes and volunteers in the neighborhood and hosts spanish speaking lunches so that you can learn the language that your patient population speaks. The opportunity is there is you want it. People volunteer in various enrichment programs and organizations.

Overall, you are right about the school having a very social student body -- with many the "work hard, play hard" mentality definitely applies. But that is why we chose the school, because we didn't want to be surrounding by a bunch of pent up, stressed out library moles who had an odd glow due to prolonged indoor halogen light exposure. People have interests outside of P&S, as our class is really athletic and musical. You would be amazed at the broad range of talents in our class, ranging from concert violinists to models to college varsity athletes to kung-fu champions. There is more to being a doctor than studying all the time and learning the material at the expense of having a party every once in a while. You understand the concepts enough to recall them when you need them on the wards, but developing a social repore is also part of being a doctor. If you don't know how to interact with others well (patients, collegues, those working for you) then you are going to struggle. Columbia seems to pick out those who are going to interact well rather than those who would rather gouge their own eyes with a spoon than talk to patients.

Anyways, to make a long story short, your impressions of Columbia are rather on target. I love the social atmosphere and the fun people here who know when to party and when to study (the weeks before our exam block the campus was remarkably dry) In picking your medical school, if you don't like the dynamic, then don't go to that school -- trust your gut feeling as it is normally right. Good luck and let me know if you have any questions.

 

[Iron Horse]

I was disappointed after my interview/visit for some of the reasons mentioned. Many students I met struck me as immature and tried hard to impress. One very pleasant student who went to Hunter had some pretty damning things to say about her classmates with regard to their attitide toward the Washington Heights community and the patients they would see. She was pretty blunt about how many students were happy to use them to learn, but didn't want to get thier hands dirty.

I have a friend who went to Columbia who was part of the drinking crowd. His fiancee (now wife) at the time was less than pleased as he and his pals used excessive drinking as their routine stress relief. I went to one of the parties and found it tiresome. These factors all contributed to a clear sense that Columbia was not for me.

Cornell and Mt. Sinai were much more positive experiences from my point of view. Good luck with your decision. Many of the issues you're struggling with are very personal, so in the end you know best where you will feel most comfortable.

 

[CycloneDub]

Darkchild,
Hey there. Congrats on all the interviews.
I am at Columbia and will tell you as honestly as I can the goings-on at P&S.
When I was choosing schools, I was fortunate and had several to choose from (including the whole bunch in NYC) and although it was a tough decision, I chose Columbia because of my classmates-to-be. Honestly that was the best decision I made.
Whatever Frantz's quirks are (and there are many), he knows generally how to get interesting and good people to come to Columbia.
Unfortunately as you noted, he also tends to pick a proportion of the students from his biases -- there tend to be a quite a few of the ivy-type, rugby-type, and of the Caucasian persuasion. I don't think he does this consciously, but I feel that the diversity is a bit thin (as someone who lived overseas and lived a while in NYC). But the people are really interesting -- and many have done some very cool things in their lives (fighter pilot, astrophysicist, peace corps, etc. in our class) as is true in many schools.
There are a group of people in each class (granted, most likely the most visible group) who either have not been in NYC before or been out of college really. These are probably the people that you saw frat-ting away with the booze. Sorry if it felt that those were the majority. In our class, we arranged to meet up at bars or whatnot as a class after exams -- in which a good time was had -- in order to get everyone out and about in NYC.
But, no fear, the majority are not the immature binge drinkers. Just be aware, there is that element in the school, especially after an exam block (which it may have been)-- for the first-years.

In terms of vesting in the neighborhood, the school is actually VERY much into Wash. Heights. There are tons of programs either through various activities (the "P&S clubs") of the school (run by medical students) or the hospital. There is Cultura, a program devoted to getting the medical students involved in all aspects of the community (hosting health fairs, children book readings, volunteer opportunities, family exchanges). Others include various health oriented opportunities in the neighborhood (the Dominican Alliance, Cancer Care, homeless healthcare, Child Health Plus, mental healthcare, etc.). A lot of these opportunities are organized by a Columbia student or a faculty member/hospital group and students can work with them on their spare time or during their "selective" (a one day/week part of your first and second year cirriculum. It is actually one of the stronger points of Columbia. The community really helps support the hospital (and a lot of the workers live in the community) and the hospital is vested strongly there.

The first two years of cirriculum is lecture, which I found sometimes helpful and sometimes a waste of time. When it was a waste, I spent my time doing more useful things. But overall, I think it has prepared me quite well (and I came from grad school before) for my clinical rotations. And the third year has really been fantastic across the board so far (almost all my class agrees).

Most of my good friends, actually are in the MD/PhD program, although I am not -- so I am glad you found them easy going. I agree. I think, in general, they are cool, interesting, and still remain solidly part of our class, even though they have absconded to backrooms and lab work.

As for me, I was out of school for 3-4 years before coming back. I lived in NYC for a bit and didn't feel like I needed to be initiated into a frat while in medical school. I thought similar things about Columbia when I toured it in December. However, the people who came to the revisit weekend were so relaxed, interesting in many ways, that I changed my mind and came.
There are shortcomings to Columbia and they annoy me as well. But the people, the community (Wash Heights and the faculty), and the hospital experience have made me really glad to have come here. So far.

I have plenty more I can say -- but if you send me your email or come up for half-a-day someday after Jan 1, I would be glad to have you meet some other people (who may be more your style (MD/PhD and MD)) or generally answer questions you may have.

Hope this helps a little.

CycloneDub

 

[DarkChild]

Valley Girl and CycloneDub - Thanks for the in-depth insiders view.
You guys are awesome!!

 

[ValleyGal]

What Scott said was right on target, especially about visiting the school again. Be sure to go to revisit weekend if you get in (at all the schools) as that will give you a better idea of the school as a whole, the student body, and how you would fit in. With the MD/PHD program especially, since it is a small group of people, meeting your peers and liking them is key. Also good would be to meet your potential classmates -- every class has its own flavor, and maybe you would like yours better than mine. Good luck!

 

[poloace]

i think the school rocks- i may have met one of you while watching that horrendous utah jazz game on sat. evening.

peter- not a med student

 

[TeinVI]

Originally posted by DarkChild

The students (while drawn from excellent ugrad institutions) seemed pretty immature and into their drinking. A class president told us with some pride how hung over he was.

i actually thought this was great. med schools can easily burn you out, and it was nice to see columbia students actually having time to chill out and relax.
i'd give up my arm for a columbia acceptance letter...

 

[JJNY]

Originally posted by TeinVI
i actually thought this was great. med schools can easily burn you out, and it was nice to see columbia students actually having time to chill out and relax.
i'd give up my arm for a columbia acceptance letter...

I'm with Tein on this one...

 

[Katie]

me too! and if you come to Tufts, there is plenty of fun to be had (both alcoholic and non-alcoholic) during the first semester. It is VERY much needed since the second semester here is tough with both Anatomy and Physiology going at the same time, and first semester second year is also a lot of work. Also, plenty of people who don't drink at all or just have a beer or two come to events where alcohol is served and they somehow manage to have a good time as well; in fact the majority of people who go out and party are not binge drinkers who have to be carried home. glad to see that Columbia doesn't seem to be the kind of school that encourages work and nothing else. Honestly, if other people want to get drunk once in a while I don't have a problem with it as long as they are not putting others' lives in danger by drunk-driving, etc.

 

[TeinVI]

key katie,
so do you find urself with enough free time to relax once in a while, like go to the gym regularly and hang out on the weekends? when i stayed with student hosts at tufts, they were just watching dvds until 3 in the morning!! and the host told me that you definitely have a lot of free time at tufts. just wondering if he's right or just pullin ma chains.

 

[bez2]

Hey,

Like we have all heard before, "you should choose the place where you feel most comfortable," or some offshoot of that. I think the student body and the "scene" at a school are a matter of opinion. I interviewed at all of the schools in NYC and the student body at Columbia definetely impressed me the most. I go to Cornell undergrad and I'm in a frat etc. and I liked the fact that the students seemed to have enough time to go out, unwind, and experience the city. So for me this is one of the schools biggest selling point and for others it may make it their last choice. There's diversity for you.