COMLEX Step 1 Pass Rates By School

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Does anyone know where I can find recent information on the pass rates by school? Thanks.
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As of 2011 , no osteopathic schools are required to submit COMLEX results. So finding a database on that is gonna be pretty hard.
 
RVUCOM said they have the highest pass rate with the second highest average (behind North Texas).
 
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The quality of education most likely plays at least some role in pass rates.
 
hawkeye pierce said:
The quality of education most likely plays at least some role in pass rates.
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Not really. The education can held definately, but when it comes down to it, its all the students job to study hard both during and outside of class. The course work maybe better geard toward the boards but either way the student needs to know that material. No way around it. The only advantage that some schools have is that they pay for a review course to come in and teach the students. That a big help but not required to do well.
 
I think our (LECOM-SH) first-time pass rate (based solely on scuttlebutt, since we are not supposed to know) was a little over 90% (including as failures those who weren't allowed to take it).
 
DuxburyPembroke said:
I think our (LECOM-SH) first-time pass rate (based solely on scuttlebutt, since we are not supposed to know) was a little over 90% (including as failures those who weren't allowed to take it).
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Have heard the same.
 
DoktorB said:
Was the whole class allowed to take it? (just curious, not skeptical)
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At first, no. The top 90% had to take it (but only 1 failed). Then 6 weeks later, the bottom 10% had to take it (middle of August). The 97% was for the entire class though and includes the bottom 10%.

There has been a lot of RVU haters over the past 5 years and based on principle alone, I can completely understand. However, for the class of 2013, whatever RVU was doing, certainly worked. Personally, I think RVU sits in the best location of all of the DO schools (I mean come on, your 1.5 hrs away from Breck, Keyston, and A basin) and I'd attribute that to heavily influencing quality students to come to the school.
 
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Es Pontas said:
At first, no. The top 90% had to take it (but only 1 failed). Then 6 weeks later, the bottom 10% had to take it (middle of August). The 97% was for the entire class though and includes the bottom 10%.

There has been a lot of RVU haters over the past 5 years and based on principle alone, I can completely understand. However, for the class of 2013, whatever RVU was doing, certainly worked. Personally, I think RVU sits in the best location of all of the DO schools (I mean come on, your 1.5 hrs away from Breck, Keyston, and A basin) and I'd attribute that to heavily influencing quality students to come to the school.
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Nice.

I really wish I was a bit closer than a 10-12hr drive to those ski resorts...such a great stress reliever. Not to mention the hiking/great outdoors! Denver is awesome.
 
PeepsLove said:
Not really. The education can held definately, but when it comes down to it, its all the students job to study hard both during and outside of class. The course work maybe better geard toward the boards but either way the student needs to know that material. No way around it. The only advantage that some schools have is that they pay for a review course to come in and teach the students. That a big help but not required to do well.
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So you'd have no problem going to a school with a 60% pass rate? You wouldn't be the least bit skeptical that while all other schools manage to at least get up in the 80's, this one school couldn't?
 
As a 4th year student, I have to say pass rates don't mean much. It really depends on the individual student working hard and studying every day. For example one of my classmate (who received the same education as me) used to play world of Warcraft every day and not study much and he failed. His failure was not a reflection on our school, but on him.

Also what is comlex good for? Ans: it helps you get into residency of your choice. You also have to take other things into account: how established the school is, how are the clinical rotations, research opportunities in your 1st yr summer, ect
 
This is an email we received last fall from the dean at DMU.

Dear Faculty- Just wanted to let you know we just received the NBOME annual report for COMLEX-Level 2 CE for first time applicants taking the exam between July 2010- June 2011 (class 2011). Our pass rate was 94% compared to a national average of 86.5%. We were #1 in the nation in mean score of 541 (national 504 with range 420-541) and # 3 in the nation in pass rate (one at 95% and one at 96% range -55%-96%). Every subject matter was well above the national mean. For the COMLEX PE for the same dates , our pass rate was 99% vs national average of 96% (tied for #2 in nation with one school at 100% ; range 85-100%). All I can say is fantastic job! These are the best scores we have ever had and as you know, are why the class 2011 matched so strongly into some of the best GME slots in the country. Keep up the great work and don’t change a thing- whatever you are doing is working. I am proud of our students and you !
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Bacchus said:
88% at PCOM-PA. Also, if you look at Pre-Osteo it seems as if COCA will start requiring this information.
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Yikes that's terrible. But then again, I'm not surprised since PCOM doesn't teach towards boards AND they recommended Northwestern review.
 
Rollo said:
Yikes that's terrible. But then again, I'm not surprised since PCOM doesn't teach towards boards AND they recommended Northwestern review.
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LOL, did I miss something?? Isn't PCOM one of those highly sought after DO schools that people claim is much better because it's so established??

Also, on the note of some students not being allowed to take boards, I just figured I'd share....
At our most recent dean's hour, we were informed that we get to take one of the COMSAE tests for free, proctored at school in real test conditions. Of course the question arises of whether or not this test is used to screen those ready for boards, but it was stated quickly and clearly that this will not be the case. Thank GOODNESS because it's in April and I'm just gonna throw it out there that there's no WAY I'll be ready by then lol. I mean I hope that I can pass one at that point, but still, I'm glad they're not doing that to us. They said if someone performs poorly, they will have the opportunity to take some intensive review sessions with faculty but no one will stop them from taking their exam.
 
Coltran said:
As a 4th year student, I have to say pass rates don't mean much. It really depends on the individual student working hard and studying every day. For example one of my classmate (who received the same education as me) used to play world of Warcraft every day and not study much and he failed. His failure was not a reflection on our school, but on him.

Also what is comlex good for? Ans: it helps you get into residency of your choice. You also have to take other things into account: how established the school is, how are the clinical rotations, research opportunities in your 1st yr summer, ect
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:thumbup: Couldn't agree more :thumbup:

Don't let anyone tell you otherwise.


Es Pontas said:
At first, no. The top 90% had to take it (but only 1 failed). Then 6 weeks later, the bottom 10% had to take it (middle of August). The 97% was for the entire class though and includes the bottom 10%.

There has been a lot of RVU haters over the past 5 years and based on principle alone, I can completely understand. However, for the class of 2013, whatever RVU was doing, certainly worked. Personally, I think RVU sits in the best location of all of the DO schools (I mean come on, your 1.5 hrs away from Breck, Keyston, and A basin) and I'd attribute that to heavily influencing quality students to come to the school.
Click to expand...

On a side note, pass rates are even more useless when schools (e.g. RVU and others) play games and hold people back (btw that's what Caribbean schools do and it's pathetic). It is not fair to the rest of us who had a defined number of months/days to study. We were forced to take it by a given date, while others got an extra 6+ weeks to study for the same exam. If I had an extra 6 weeks of vacation to study for my COMLEX, obviously I would have done much better. Given that we are all graded on a curve it is BS that schools are allowed to do that. Everyone in my class knew 90% of the people who were going to fail COMLEX and guess what, they failed COMLEX. If my school would've prevented them from taking the exam, our pass rate would've been close to 100%!

If you are using pass rate to asses the quality of education at a school where they hand select students to take COMLEX you should find another method.
 
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bala565 said:
:thumbup: Couldn't agree more :thumbup:

Don't let anybody tell you otherwise.




On a side note, pass rates are even more useless when schools (e.g. RVU and others) play games and hold people back (btw that's what Caribbean schools do and it's pathetic). It is not fair to the rest of us who had a defined number of months/days to study. We were forced to take it by a given date, while others got an extra 6+ weeks to study for the same exam. If I had an extra 6 weeks of vacation to study for my COMLEX, obviously I would have done much better. Given that we are all graded on a curve it is BS that schools are allowed to do that. Everyone in my class knew 90% of the people who were going to fail COMLEX and guess what, they failed COMLEX. If my school would've prevented them from taking the exam, our pass rate would've been close to 100%!

If you are using pass rate to asses the quality of education at a school where they hand select students to take COMLEX you should find another method.
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you sound mad rvu beat your school bro
 
Deceptacon said:
you sound mad rvu beat your school bro
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:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:

You're Funny!!!

The only thing that makes me mad about RVU it's its existence (I don't have any problem with its students; just the school, its tax status and its founder/owner).
 
GraceEuphoria said:
LOL, did I miss something?? Isn't PCOM one of those highly sought after DO schools that people claim is much better because it's so established??

Also, on the note of some students not being allowed to take boards, I just figured I'd share....
At our most recent dean's hour, we were informed that we get to take one of the COMSAE tests for free, proctored at school in real test conditions. Of course the question arises of whether or not this test is used to screen those ready for boards, but it was stated quickly and clearly that this will not be the case. Thank GOODNESS because it's in April and I'm just gonna throw it out there that there's no WAY I'll be ready by then lol. I mean I hope that I can pass one at that point, but still, I'm glad they're not doing that to us. They said if someone performs poorly, they will have the opportunity to take some intensive review sessions with faculty but no one will stop them from taking their exam.
Click to expand...

My school requires us to get a certain score on the COMSAE before we take Comlex (both step 1 and 2)- it was kinda helpful. There are some people who don't need that, but I think some people are in denial about how prepared they are for the exam and end up failing the first time. Heck, some people just cheated on their COMSAEs to get the required score and then failed the first time anyway.

It was annoying last year during the process, but in retrospect I understand why they do it. Yes, it helps make the school look better re: pass rate, but also it can really mess up your chances if you fail the first time. Some people just need that structure.

We are required to take it anywhere from 10-14 days beforehand, so it is a bit different than your situation. By 2 weeks out, I'd hope I'd be able to pass. :p
 
Vita said:
My school requires us to get a certain score on the COMSAE before we take Comlex (both step 1 and 2)- it was kinda helpful. There are some people who don't need that, but I think some people are in denial about how prepared they are for the exam and end up failing the first time. Heck, some people just cheated on their COMSAEs to get the required score and then failed the first time anyway.

It was annoying last year during the process, but in retrospect I understand why they do it. Yes, it helps make the school look better re: pass rate, but also it can really mess up your chances if you fail the first time. Some people just need that structure.

We are required to take it anywhere from 10-14 days beforehand, so it is a bit different than your situation. By 2 weeks out, I'd hope I'd be able to pass. :p
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I can see your perspective, but the cynic in me feels that filtering who takes the test is strictly about image. 2 weeks out is different....if you are failing it 2 weeks out, then it's understandable to delay some I suppose. But 2 months...I'd probably be in trouble if the practice COMSAE had any influence on my status for taking the exam. I plan to study as much as possible through this semester of course, but everyone knows the bulk of studying occurs during that month after classes.
 
Does anyone have any info on kcumb?
 
bala565 said:
:thumbup: Couldn't agree more :thumbup:

Don't let anyone tell you otherwise.




On a side note, pass rates are even more useless when schools (e.g. RVU and others) play games and hold people back (btw that's what Caribbean schools do and it's pathetic). It is not fair to the rest of us who had a defined number of months/days to study. We were forced to take it by a given date, while others got an extra 6+ weeks to study for the same exam. If I had an extra 6 weeks of vacation to study for my COMLEX, obviously I would have done much better. Given that we are all graded on a curve it is BS that schools are allowed to do that. Everyone in my class knew 90% of the people who were going to fail COMLEX and guess what, they failed COMLEX. If my school would've prevented them from taking the exam, our pass rate would've been close to 100%!

If you are using pass rate to asses the quality of education at a school where they hand select students to take COMLEX you should find another method.
Click to expand...


The holding back students could account for pass rates (ended up with a 99% with top 90% and 97%ish with everyone) but not for having the second highest average board score (again, behind North Texas). And with regards to the tax status thing, we are a second year DO program with the second highest average COMLEX score....maybe the "for profit" thing is actually working out instead of all of the negative connotations (and oh yea, our tuition is no more expensive than the Midwesterns and a few of the other private schools so you can't use the price thing against us).....hmmmmm interesting concept
 
Once you get above 90% or so pass rate, the difference between pass rates at schools is negligible. It comes down to the individual people in each class at that point. Does anyone really think it matters if 2 more people in a class pass the test at one school as compared to another? Somehow, I don't think that that means one school is better than another. Sure it matters to those people obviously, but does not say much about the quality of the education as a whole. My school sucks and we still had like a 92% pass rate.
 
Es Pontas said:
The holding back students could account for pass rates (ended up with a 99% with top 90% and 97%ish with everyone) but not for having the second highest average board score (again, behind North Texas). And with regards to the tax status thing, we are a second year DO program with the second highest average COMLEX score....maybe the "for profit" thing is actually working out instead of all of the negative connotations (and oh yea, our tuition is no more expensive than the Midwesterns and a few of the other private schools so you can't use the price thing against us).....hmmmmm interesting concept
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Do you know how to calculate an average? Of course holding students back will affect your average. People who fail have lower scores than people who pass therefore decreasing the average!

With regards to the tax status, it has nothing to do with tuition. It is a matter of conflict of interest in providing educational services. In the U.S. in the 1920s we decided that the best/most ethical way of educating future physicians was through non-profit medical schools. A for-profit school is responsible to its investors/shareholders who want to make money (i.e. for-profit). Therefore, the fear is that they may cut corners and compromise education in order to enhance their profit (e.g. Caribbean medical schools). On the other hand, non-profit institutions are only responsible to their board of trustees who have no financial stake in the outcome therefore, decreasing the likelihood of any compromise.

Furthermore:
1) The average board score of ONE class is irrelevant.
2) Even if everyone at your school scores a perfect 800, still doesn't legitimize the school's tax status and says NOTHING about the quality of the graduating class.
3) To re-emphasize again, I have NO problem with RVU students, just the institution itself!
 
Unfortunately, many non-profit medical schools are run with the same corner-cutting and general moral turpitude that we fear from for-profit schools. If they let my school exist, they might as well let RVU exist. Après nous, le déluge.
 
DuxburyPembroke said:
Unfortunately, many non-profit medical schools are run with the same corner-cutting and general moral turpitude that we fear from for-profit schools. If they let my school exist, they might as well let RVU exist. Après nous, le déluge.
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I don't know what school you go to, but if that's the case let's close your school too. Still doesn't change anything about RVU.

I'm all about closing schools! We are expanding way too rapidly and we are all going to suffer in the near future because of it.

Any other volunteers who want to nominate their school for closure please feel free to do so!
 
bala565 said:
I don't know what school you go to, but if that's the case let's close your school too. Still doesn't change anything about RVU.

I'm all about closing schools! We are expanding way too rapidly and we are all going to suffer in the near future because of it.

Any other volunteers who want to nominate their school for closure please feel free to do so!
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you remind me of my omm teachers in school
 
GraceEuphoria said:
LOL, did I miss something?? Isn't PCOM one of those highly sought after DO schools that people claim is much better because it's so established??
Click to expand...

Come to Philly and find out exactly how established PCOM is.

Hint: It is well established and has an excellent reputation.
 
GraceEuphoria said:
I can see your perspective, but the cynic in me feels that filtering who takes the test is strictly about image. 2 weeks out is different....if you are failing it 2 weeks out, then it's understandable to delay some I suppose. But 2 months...I'd probably be in trouble if the practice COMSAE had any influence on my status for taking the exam. I plan to study as much as possible through this semester of course, but everyone knows the bulk of studying occurs during that month after classes.
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Agreed. 2 months is a little too long out. COMSAE is good to guide your studies, though. On my first COMSAE I took (about a month before the test), I got "borderline" or lower performance on Anatomy (can't remember), so I was able to improve it for the next one.

I def. suggest buying a COMSAE for yourself for a week or so before the test, too, just to see how you improved.
 
I think the bottom line is that kids looking to do urology (or some other competitive specialty) could care less about passing average and those looking to barely pass aren't looking to do urology (or at least intelligently).
 
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docnotsopc said:
Ok, buts its RVU..... Enough said
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Dude. You go to a DO school. Not Harvard. Not Yale. Not Wash U. Not Emory. Not UChicago. A DO school. Don't act like you are some elitist who goes to a way better school than RVU.
 
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RVU campus looks gorgeous btw...just curious how far is the closest skiing? What is the surrounding town like?
 
sexyman said:
RVU campus looks gorgeous btw...just curious how far is the closest skiing? What is the surrounding town like?
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Its an hour and a half from keystone, A basin, and breck. About 2 hours from Vail and 2 hours and 15 minutes to Beaver Creek. Also, you can get the Copper/Winter Park pass as well.

Parker is about 20 minutes from South Denver so a lot of kids live there and commute. Parker itself is really just like any other suburb.
 
Es Pontas said:
Dude. You go to a DO school. Not Harvard. Not Yale. Not Wash U. Not Emory. Not UChicago. A DO school. Don't act like you are some elitist who goes to a way better school than RVU.
Click to expand...

Don't mean to hate on RVU too much (if that's even possible) but, the same way that not all MD schools are created equal not all DO schools are created equal!
 
DuxburyPembroke said:
Unfortunately, many non-profit medical schools are run with the same corner-cutting and general moral turpitude that we fear from for-profit schools. If they let my school exist, they might as well let RVU exist. Après nous, le déluge.
Click to expand...

You saying that means you have no clue what the actual difference between for profit and not for profit is. It seems easy, but its not the literal words, its about limitations as to what percentage of the tuition and fee money can go to what things. Every penny has to be delineated out and accountable. It also limits the ability of inept people to get hired. (on the other hand, it makes it easier to fire inadequate faculty and purchase excellent ones since you dont have to hire based on payment limitations). No american school comes close to RVU based on how its run and what *could* happen. I honestly dont think anything nefarious is happening. But comparing how its run to any other school is showing a complete lack of awareness of the differences between the two and how deep and central they are to "what you can do".

I guess my comment boils down to RVU likely does run like every other school. But it doesnt have to. And thats the difference that everyone is concerned about, not its acutla performance. which has been totally fine.

bala565 said:
I don't know what school you go to, but if that's the case let's close your school too. Still doesn't change anything about RVU.

I'm all about closing schools! We are expanding way too rapidly and we are all going to suffer in the near future because of it.

Any other volunteers who want to nominate their school for closure please feel free to do so!
Click to expand...

I would say that closing for-profit schools is probably a very smart move in the long run. But the for-rofit experiment has already begun. Might as well let it run its course.

Rollo said:
Come to Philly and find out exactly how established PCOM is.

Hint: It is well established and has an excellent reputation.
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Very very well. If anyone else rips on PCOM, I'm sending Rollo's avatar after you.
 
I'm graduating in may, so I don't really have any stake in any of this...

But I sort of agree with the guy who was saying hey you go to a DO school, chill out on ****ting on RVU (paraphrasing here)...it's not a big deal guys....get your degree, work hard while you're doing it and get the residency you want. If you can enjoy breckenridge being an hour away while you're doing it that's cool to me... You're going to look back and think a lot of this stuff you thought was important just are not...
 
sexyman said:
I'm graduating in may, so I don't really have any stake in any of this...

But I sort of agree with the guy who was saying hey you go to a DO school, chill out on ****ting on RVU (paraphrasing here)...it's not a big deal guys....get your degree, work hard while you're doing it and get the residency you want. If you can enjoy breckenridge being an hour away while you're doing it that's cool to me... You're going to look back and think a lot of this stuff you thought was important just are not...
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What does going to a DO school have anything to do with criticizing RVU? So are you telling me that if I went to Harvard it was OK for me to s*** on RVU but since I go to another COM then RVU is off the table?

Besides, if anything, the only people who should voice concerns are other DOs as RVU can POTENTIALLY affect them negatively more than any other group.

Your post seems to suggest that it is all about the individual (get a degree/residency/etc) but some of us actually care about the profession and believe that RVU is bad for our profession.

Congratulations on your upcoming graduation and good luck in the match!
 
bala565 said:
What does going to a DO school have anything to do with criticizing RVU? So are you telling me that if I went to Harvard it was OK for me to s*** on RVU but since I go to another COM then RVU is off the table?

Besides, if anything, the only people who should voice concerns are other DOs as RVU can POTENTIALLY affect them negatively more than any other group.

Your post seems to suggest that it is all about the individual (get a degree/residency/etc) but some of us actually care about the profession and believe that RVU is bad for our profession.

Congratulations on your upcoming graduation and good luck in the match!
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You're an M1, aren't you? Humor me...
 
Yes balsa that's what I was implying/meant. Thanks, appreciate it.
 
DocEspana said:
You saying that means you have no clue what the actual difference between for profit and not for profit is. It seems easy, but its not the literal words, its about limitations as to what percentage of the tuition and fee money can go to what things. Every penny has to be delineated out and accountable. It also limits the ability of inept people to get hired. (on the other hand, it makes it easier to fire inadequate faculty and purchase excellent ones since you dont have to hire based on payment limitations). No american school comes close to RVU based on how its run and what *could* happen. I honestly dont think anything nefarious is happening. But comparing how its run to any other school is showing a complete lack of awareness of the differences between the two and how deep and central they are to "what you can do". I guess my comment boils down to RVU likely does run like every other school. But it doesnt have to. And thats the difference that everyone is concerned about, not its acutla performance. which has been totally fine...
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I see your point, but are you sure that those standards apply with satellite campuses as well? LECOM may be reinvesting a certain amount of its income, but they aren't investing it at Seton Hill. Honestly, I wonder if the investment in every new branch or school falls within the letter of the law as well (using Erie and Bradenton money to finance Seton Hill, using all that money to finance the two new dental schools, etc.). As for inept people being hired, there has been little evidence of any standard of that or any other sort being enforced at my campus. No anatomy lab, no histology lab (not a microscope in the place, actually), few clinical faculty (or competent faculty, for that matter), no research. It seems like cutting corners for economic reasons to me. I do understand that there are theoretically greater constraints put on not-for-profit schools, but I see my own school being run (for whatever reason - growth for its own sake? glory? the mind boggles) under a for-profit paradigm.
:(
 
sexyman said:
Yes balsa that's what I was implying/meant. Thanks, appreciate it.
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So you must have a lot of self-esteem issues! in any event, I guess we must agree to disagree on that one!

DuxburyPembroke said:
I see your point, but are you sure that those standards apply with satellite campuses as well? LECOM may be reinvesting a certain amount of its income, but they aren't investing it at Seton Hill. Honestly, I wonder if the investment in every new branch or school falls within the letter of the law as well (using Erie and Bradenton money to finance Seton Hill, using all that money to finance the two new dental schools, etc.). As for inept people being hired, there has been little evidence of any standard of that or any other sort being enforced at my campus. No anatomy lab, no histology lab (not a microscope in the place, actually), few clinical faculty (or competent faculty, for that matter), no research. It seems like cutting corners for economic reasons to me. I do understand that there are theoretically greater constraints put on not-for-profit schools, but I see my own school being run (for whatever reason - growth for its own sake? glory? the mind boggles) under a for-profit paradigm.
:(
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Just curious, then how do you study/learn anatomy?
 
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DuxburyPembroke said:
The best we can from books and pictures.
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Wow! I wonder if COCA knows about this or if they just don't care!

That's very sad! I mean do they tell these things to the applicants during their interviews or you find out first day of classes that btw we don't have an anatomy lab and we learn from a book with pictures?

I was just reading another thread on Pre-Osteo forum about LECOM and a PD's opinion about LECOM graduates (it didn't sound promising)! This is what happens when COCA allows Walmart-style proliferation of schools!

I wished we could cap the admission numbers for all schools and stop opening new schools/branch campuses/etc.; They are planning to open bunch of other new schools too (both DO and MD) :thumbdown: :mad:

Here in 10 years, there is going to be a buttload of unmatched graduates!
 
Quite the contrary on the self esteem bala, I think you might be missing the point...
 
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