committee letter curve ball

[flip26]

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Well, I got thrown a curve ball today when I met with the director of my post bacc program.

It seems that this year they want to see a copy of the completed AMCAS application before cranking out a letter...not just the PS, but the entire AMCAS app...so assuming I jump on AMCAS at the first chance, the earliest I can get this to them is in May, right?

But if they simply asked for all the information NOW I could give it to them NOW and they could crank out a letter much earlier...I am perplexed and frustrated by this unnecessary delay in the process.

Is this a common requirement for committee letters? What are the possible reasons for placing such a ridiculous obstacle in the path, greatly increasing the probability of apps being late (in terms of completion status)?

Thoughts?

 

[olemissbabydoc]

Well, I got thrown a curve ball today when I met with the director of my post bacc program.

It seems that this year they want to see a copy of the completed AMCAS application before cranking out a letter...not just the PS, but the entire AMCAS app...so assuming I jump on AMCAS at the first chance, the earliest I can get this to them is in May, right?

But if they simply asked for all the information NOW I could give it to them NOW and they could crank out a letter much earlier...I am perplexed and frustrated by this unnecessary delay in the process.

Is this a common requirement for committee letters? What are the possible reasons for placing such a ridiculous obstacle in the path, greatly increasing the probability of apps being late (in terms of completion status)?

Thoughts?

I have heard of this happening before at several schools.... my schools didn't do committee letters, so I don't have any personal experience.

 

[stixx]

If it only takes a month or so for them to write the letter, it really won't make a difference. You'll still have the letter before most secondaries are released.

 

[Premed Worrier]

Sucky, my school doesn't have committee letters, so i didn't ever have this problem, but for the most part it sounds like a HUGE hassle having such a committee and a big waste of time among many other things...sorry for you guys

 

[flip26]

If it only takes a month or so for them to write the letter, it really won't make a difference. You'll still have the letter before most secondaries are released.

I agree, but the burden is on me (and others) to basically fill out the AMCAS on the first possible day - something I intend to do, but that is beside the point. They are creating a potential delay that is avoidable.

If they need the info that goes into the AMCAS, why not just ask for it ASAP? I don't understand their need to see the actual AMCAS...and I am really curious if this is typical at other schools.

 

[aznb0y129]

Well, I got thrown a curve ball today when I met with the director of my post bacc program.

It seems that this year they want to see a copy of the completed AMCAS application before cranking out a letter...not just the PS, but the entire AMCAS app...so assuming I jump on AMCAS at the first chance, the earliest I can get this to them is in May, right?

But if they simply asked for all the information NOW I could give it to them NOW and they could crank out a letter much earlier...I am perplexed and frustrated by this unnecessary delay in the process.

Is this a common requirement for committee letters? What are the possible reasons for placing such a ridiculous obstacle in the path, greatly increasing the probability of apps being late (in terms of completion status)?

Thoughts?

Definitely did not have this problem getting a committee letter from my school. Maybe you should talk to them again and stress the timeframe about when AMCAS opens and when you need the committee letter?

 

[dhbighit]

Shouldn't make that big of a difference. That was not a requirement for me, but that is what I did anyway. It is organized better for them to skim it quickly, and they can tune their letter to your "theme" if you have one.

Also, most schools don't require LOR's untill at least a month or two after submission of your primary application, which should be plenty of time.

I wouldn't worry about it too much.

 

[Dr Roboto]

http://www.aamc.org/students/amcas/amcas2009.htm

One of those pdfs is basically the entire AMCAS application with all the instructions. You can definitely start working on it now. When May comes around, copy and paste.

 

[flip26]

Definitely did not have this problem getting a committee letter from my school. Maybe you should talk to them again and stress the timeframe about when AMCAS opens and when you need the committee letter?

I intend to do that, plus I am going to crank out in a sensible format all of the information contained on the AMCAS and present it to them well before May 1.

This is not the first nonsensical administrative glitch from this bunch - the less I have to deal with them, the better.

 

[flip26]

http://www.aamc.org/students/amcas/amcas2009.htm

One of those pdfs is basically the entire AMCAS application with all the instructions. You can definitely start working on it now. When May comes around, copy and paste.

Thanks - I was just about to search for something like this.

 

[235009]

I intend to do that, plus I am going to crank out in a sensible format all of the information contained on the AMCAS and present it to them well before May 1.

This is not the first nonsensical administrative glitch from this bunch - the less I have to deal with them, the better.

wow. stop. breathe. calm down.

stop being so neurotic. this was a requirement for me too. i had to give them my submitted AMCAS app before they started on the committee letter. it won't make a difference in terms of timing of your application, especially if you submit it super early (in june) as it seems you are planning on doing and which i didn't do (submitted in july).

if you think giving them the info much earlier (in may) will get them to do your letter that early then you are living in a fantasy world. just calm down, follow the instructions, do your part and you'll be fine.

 

[scarletgirl777]

Well, I got thrown a curve ball today when I met with the director of my post bacc program.

It seems that this year they want to see a copy of the completed AMCAS application before cranking out a letter...not just the PS, but the entire AMCAS app...so assuming I jump on AMCAS at the first chance, the earliest I can get this to them is in May, right?

But if they simply asked for all the information NOW I could give it to them NOW and they could crank out a letter much earlier...I am perplexed and frustrated by this unnecessary delay in the process.

Is this a common requirement for committee letters? What are the possible reasons for placing such a ridiculous obstacle in the path, greatly increasing the probability of apps being late (in terms of completion status)?

Thoughts?

Welcome to premed committee bureaucracy. My committee had the same policy. It's actually a great policy from their perspective because it forces all the applicants from the school to apply early and it makes sure that they only write letters for people who are actually applying this year. As a result my letter came out in late August. In the grand scheme of things, this won't matter (as long as you don't apply to Madison I guess 😉)

Oh, and you can fill out AMCAS in may but you can't submit it till June--does it have to be verified or just completed?

 

[nick_carraway]

I'd ask if one of these two files is okay as they contain fields for almost everything you need to enter. If it's the information they want, I don't see how they can refuse this packet.

 

[flip26]

Welcome to premed committee bureaucracy. My committee had the same policy. It's actually a great policy from their perspective because it forces all the applicants from the school to apply early and it makes sure that they only write letters for people who are actually applying this year. As a result my letter came out in late August. In the grand scheme of things, this won't matter (as long as you don't apply to Madison I guess 😉)

Oh, and you can fill out AMCAS in may but you can't submit it till June--does it have to be verified or just completed?

Not sure, but I am going to force the issue with them...I don't understand their need to see the app in the first place, but I am willing to provide them with any information they deem necessary to write a letter. Either they need the info, or they are just playing a game...and this is a formal post bacc program with approx 20 - 30 "grads" each year, so it can't be for crowd control purposes...something else is going on with this request (it was nothing like this last year), but I am not holding my breath for a genuine explanation.

Thanks to everyone for all input on this thread.

 

[Timberwolf]

Not sure, but I am going to force the issue with them...I don't understand their need to see the app in the first place, but I am willing to provide them with any information they deem necessary to write a letter. Either they need the info, or they are just playing a game...and this is a formal post bacc program with approx 20 - 30 "grads" each year, so it can't be for crowd control purposes...something else is going on with this request (it was nothing like this last year), but I am not holding my breath for a genuine explanation.

Thanks to everyone for all input on this thread.

Hmm.. Who's worried about committee letters now?

 

[nick_carraway]

Hmm.. Who's worried about committee letters now?

Uh oh. Them be fighting words.

 

[cbrons]

Well, I got thrown a curve ball today when I met with the director of my post bacc program.

It seems that this year they want to see a copy of the completed AMCAS application before cranking out a letter...not just the PS, but the entire AMCAS app...so assuming I jump on AMCAS at the first chance, the earliest I can get this to them is in May, right?

But if they simply asked for all the information NOW I could give it to them NOW and they could crank out a letter much earlier...I am perplexed and frustrated by this unnecessary delay in the process.

Is this a common requirement for committee letters? What are the possible reasons for placing such a ridiculous obstacle in the path, greatly increasing the probability of apps being late (in terms of completion status)?

Thoughts?

I feel bad for all of you who go to schools with this type of bureaucratic BS to put up with.

 

[cbrons]

Not sure, but I am going to force the issue with them...I don't understand their need to see the app in the first place, but I am willing to provide them with any information they deem necessary to write a letter. Either they need the info, or they are just playing a game...and this is a formal post bacc program with approx 20 - 30 "grads" each year, so it can't be for crowd control purposes...something else is going on with this request (it was nothing like this last year), but I am not holding my breath for a genuine explanation.

Thanks to everyone for all input on this thread.

University politics suck
If there is something personal in play here (with a committee member) you definitely don't want a letter from them. If this is the case, you might consider going an alternate route.

 

[Rebs28]

My school had the same policy - no committee letter is written until they have a completed (submitted, not verified) AMCAS in hand. I got into trouble with this because I was later with my AMCAS, and my letters weren't sent until mid-Oct, but if you're early you should be golden.

This really shouldn't be an issue so long as your committee writes letters during the summer - I have heard of schools that won't write letters when school is not in session. eek! So long as you get your AMCAS done as early as possible, I wouldn't stress. Like others have said, most schools don't need your LORs until after you submit the secondary.

 

[scarletgirl777]

Hmm.. Who's worried about committee letters now?

 

[halekulani]

my pre-health committee required the PS and a biography detailing all the activities i did, which is pretty much the same thing.

just write it as if it were your draft and turn it in. obviously revise it a few times, but it's not going to be what you submit to medical schools. the way i see it, they just want you to put in a little effort and have a foundation to work with when application time does come around. don't submit a poor piece of work to them, but it doesn't have to be 100% perfect either.

 

[hermit]

Not sure, but I am going to force the issue with them.

So your plan is to piss off the people who will write your letter of recommendation?

 

[202781]

Tell them they are being dumb. I would seriously throw a fit and just see what they do. Explain your reasons and then tell them why it may put you at a disadvantage.

Or get a professor/advisor who you like to write the committee letter instead of your own department (many people in my school just went to this awesome professor who would write them...he has gotten his last 36 people who did this into a medical school BTW, he is kinda selective though)


BOOM!
You are very welcome

 

[flip26]

So your plan is to piss off the people who will write your letter of recommendation?

Not at all. I want them to explain the reasons for this policy (it is a total change from the way it was done last year with no explanation offered), and I will explain to them the applicants' side of the equation. Surely there is a middle ground, but with bureaucracies, you never know...

If they can't accommodate me and guarantee the availability of this letter by, say, mid June, I may tell them "no thanks" and forego their services. Or I may go through with it, but not use it unless I need some supplemental letter later in the cycle. The last thing I want to do is tell a med school to expect this letter, only to have the letter delayed until August, thus delaying my application status.

Since this is a new format for them - they have never done it this way - I question their ability to turnaround letters in a timely fashion, but I certainly would like to hear their explanation first, along with some assurance that they will expedite these letters and not drag out the process to late summer.

These premed committees that delay letters until mid summer or later are completely out of step with the competitive realities applicants face today. The letter writing process should not begin at the time it should be ending - waiting until June or later to gather the info needed to write the letter places their applicants at a competitive disadvantage.

 

[stixx]

I'm sorry, mid-June? You realize most schools don't even release their secondaries until July, right? And even then, many don't start reviewing until late July/August?

Once you actually apply, you're going to realize how absurd this is.

 

[flip26]

I'm sorry, mid-June? You realize most schools don't even release their secondaries until July, right? And even then, many don't start reviewing until late July/August?

Once you actually apply, you're going to realize how absurd this is.

Several schools I am highly interested in start interviewing in late August, and they make offers on October 15 - they send out secondaries in mid june, and they start making interview invites right away, so I want all my ducks in a row...

So I don't really care what "most" med schools do.

When I press the submit button in early June, I want all things in place, or very nearly so. I find the committee request unreasonable - I am prepared to provide them with every bit of information they need to write the letter NOW, and I intend to ask them to consider my request for an earlier letter.

If they can't guarantee me that the letter will be done by mid June, I will still ask for it, but I won't rely on it for the earliest secondaries. For the later ones, fine. And even for the early ones, I can always submit it later.

These pre-med committees should be more accountable to students, especially smallish post bacc programs like I am in (actually, that I finished last summer - they told me to wait to ask for the letter until this year, and it sounded reasonable to me at the time, but they have completely changed the requirements this year, not a favorable change for me). So it isn't as if they need to see my grades for the spring semester - I completed all pre-reqs last year - I really can't understand what the reason for the delay is this year, and I think they owe students some explanation and assurances that have not been provided.

The med school app process has changed in recent years, shifting the favor towards early applicants. That my post bacc program is taking a step backwards is not a good thing IMO...

 

[NicoDuval]

Them looking at the AMCAS app might be a good thing. Then they can call attention to some experience in your app that would be overlooked. I would get everything to them asap and talk to them about how long it will take for their letter.

 

[Dr Roboto]

I'm sorry, mid-June? You realize most schools don't even release their secondaries until July, right? And even then, many don't start reviewing until late July/August?

Once you actually apply, you're going to realize how absurd this is.

That's assuming everything goes according to plan. Not to mention, the OP has no idea how long it'll take them to write the letter. I've heard enough stories anecdotally of situations where depending on a third person goes horribly wrong. The OP's methods may be extreme, but not absurd. There's nothing wrong with being pro-active.

 

[Depakote]

could you fill out AMCAS 2008-2009, print-preview it, but not submit it? would they accept that?

That would give you an essentially complete AMCAS application (for the year prior to your app), with the exception of your AMCAS verified GPA which I'd hope they wouldn't wait for next year.

 

[flip26]

could you fill out AMCAS 2008-2009, print-preview it, but not submit it? would they accept that?

That would give you an essentially complete AMCAS application (for the year prior to your app), with the exception of your AMCAS verified GPA which I'd hope they wouldn't wait for next year.

Higher up in the thread some people gave links to those PDFs, so that is exactly what I am going to do.

What I would really like to know is the reason they have added this layer of bureaucratic BS to the process. If they need the info that goes into the AMCAS, then just ask for it - I can provide all of that without waiting for AMCAS to open. But if for some reason they now feel they need to "police and approve" the apps of their grads, then I don't want to be bothered.

One clarification: this is more accurately called a post bacc "director's" letter with input from a small committee of people, not the traditional "committee" letter that many undergrads get and are expected to have by med schools. I am collecting letters of rec from other sources (the usual suspects: 2 sci, 1 non-sci, etc., and all of them from people I am extremely confident of the letter content), and ironically these are not asked for by the director, nor are they included in some sort of post bacc packet...those letters will be sent separately via Interfolio, by me, and frankly are all I think that I need anyway.

The more I think about it, this director's letter is starting to feel superfluous and not worth the aggravation. I intend to get it, but I may end up not using it, especially if it gets dragged out and would delay my completion at any schools.

My main purpose for starting this thread, other than to vent, was to find out how common this is, and some people have offered some helpful ideas and links, too. Thanks to all...

 

[A Long Story]

Higher up in the thread some people gave links to those PDFs, so that is exactly what I am going to do.

What I would really like to know is the reason they have added this layer of bureaucratic BS to the process. If they need the info that goes into the AMCAS, then just ask for it - I can provide all of that without waiting for AMCAS to open. But if for some reason they now feel they need to "police and approve" the apps of their grads, then I don't want to be bothered.

One clarification: this is more accurately called a post bacc "director's" letter with input from a small committee of people, not the traditional "committee" letter that many undergrads get and are expected to have by med schools. I am collecting letters of rec from other sources (the usual suspects: 2 sci, 1 non-sci, etc., and all of them from people I am extremely confident of the letter content), and ironically these are not asked for by the director, nor are they included in some sort of post bacc packet...those letters will be sent separately via Interfolio, by me, and frankly are all I think that I need anyway.

The more I think about it, this director's letter is starting to feel superfluous and not worth the aggravation. I intend to get it, but I may end up not using it, especially if it gets dragged out and would delay my completion at any schools.

My main purpose for starting this thread, other than to vent, was to find out how common this is, and some people have offered some helpful ideas and links, too. Thanks to all...

Try not to get too worked up on this one aspect of your application...the committee letter. It is hard for one student to have an influence on how things are run. I wouldn't recommend asking for an explanation as it may come off as presumptuous (sp?). Do what you can, send polite reminder emails and call the schools to check receipt of the LOR. It is hard being an applicant but don't lose your mind over things that you can't change....

 

[Jolie South]

could you fill out AMCAS 2008-2009, print-preview it, but not submit it? would they accept that?

That would give you an essentially complete AMCAS application (for the year prior to your app), with the exception of your AMCAS verified GPA which I'd hope they wouldn't wait for next year.

I'd try this. 👍