Concept of a residency rejection?

[turkleton]

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I was thinking the other night how strange the concept of getting rejected by a residency program was- and believe me, I've been rejected. Yes, I know it's based on grades, boards, the best of the best go to the best etc etc. But doesn't it seem a little odd that they're kind of telling you- Congratulations on your effort during medical school, unfortunately we don't consider you qualified enough to be a doctor at our hospital, but you're more than qualified to practice medicine at another hospital. We want to train the best based on numbers touching our patients, not some joe schmo MD.
All this somehow suggesting residents from different hospitals are unequal, or providing different levels of care. Maybe its the stress of the match rewiring my synapses, but this just seemed a little strange.

 

[dutchman]

The strange thing is a slave being rejected by a slave master.

 

[LADoc00]

Did you show up to the interview wearing your knee pads and dog collar?

 

[dynx]

I wouldnt know the feeling.

 

[(nicedream)]

How is it different than a job interview? They're selecting the applicants they'd most like to have.

 

[LanceArmstrong]

I was thinking the other night how strange the concept of getting rejected by a residency program was- and believe me, I've been rejected. Yes, I know it's based on grades, boards, the best of the best go to the best etc etc. But doesn't it seem a little odd that they're kind of telling you- Congratulations on your effort during medical school, unfortunately we don't consider you qualified enough to be a doctor at our hospital, but you're more than qualified to practice medicine at another hospital. We want to train the best based on numbers touching our patients, not some joe schmo MD.
All this somehow suggesting residents from different hospitals are unequal, or providing different levels of care. Maybe its the stress of the match rewiring my synapses, but this just seemed a little strange.

there's only SO many people they can interview ... most residencies get X applicants per spot and can only interview Y people ... chances are somebody is gonna reject you just on their time and work constraints especially at the end of the season...

 

[mlw03]

I was thinking the other night how strange the concept of getting rejected by a residency program was- and believe me, I've been rejected. Yes, I know it's based on grades, boards, the best of the best go to the best etc etc. But doesn't it seem a little odd that they're kind of telling you- Congratulations on your effort during medical school, unfortunately we don't consider you qualified enough to be a doctor at our hospital, but you're more than qualified to practice medicine at another hospital. We want to train the best based on numbers touching our patients, not some joe schmo MD.
All this somehow suggesting residents from different hospitals are unequal, or providing different levels of care. Maybe its the stress of the match rewiring my synapses, but this just seemed a little strange.

i would argue that there ARE different levels of residents, just like there are different levels of doctors. we've all seen some docs who are great: smart, current, geniunely care about their patients, good teachers, etc. We've also all seen docs who are not so good. like someone else said, it's similar to a job interview in that programs want the "best" candidates. the interesting discussions begin when you try to define "best" and determine which hospitals and doctors are better. while numbers should play a part of it because there is a minimum fund of knowledge necessary to practice medicine, that's not the only factor, which is why there are interviews so that each party can evaluate the other.

i think the OP makes an intesting discussion point, but it's more complex s/he makes it sound i think.

 

[TUCOMSam]

I was thinking the other night how strange the concept of getting rejected by a residency program was- and believe me, I've been rejected. Yes, I know it's based on grades, boards, the best of the best go to the best etc etc. But doesn't it seem a little odd that they're kind of telling you- Congratulations on your effort during medical school, unfortunately we don't consider you qualified enough to be a doctor at our hospital, but you're more than qualified to practice medicine at another hospital. We want to train the best based on numbers touching our patients, not some joe schmo MD.
All this somehow suggesting residents from different hospitals are unequal, or providing different levels of care. Maybe its the stress of the match rewiring my synapses, but this just seemed a little strange.

I'm confused... by "rejection" do you mean getting rejected before or AFTER an interview? If it's before the interview... I wouldn't take that too much to heart... I got interviews at great places and rejections at my "safety" programs, and vice versa. Haven't gotten any rejections post-interview. I figure the match will take care of that quite well, since there's no rejection at all, unless I fail to match anywhere.

 

[turkleton]

It sounded simple because it seemed too abstract/vague and I was unsure if there was any substance to it at all. And I meant getting rejected off the bat before the interview- from BWH in my case. It just struck me a little bit as you're not intelligent enough to practice medicine here, but you're intelligent enough to practice medicine. I'm probably not explaining this properly but there seemed to be a paradoxical element in it.

Dynx, you're supercool and my hero. Silent pause to bask in your awesomeness.

 

[TUCOMSam]

It sounded simple because it seemed too abstract/vague and I was unsure if there was any substance to it at all. And I meant getting rejected off the bat before the interview- from BWH in my case. It just struck me a little bit as you're not intelligent enough to practice medicine here, but you're intelligent enough to practice medicine. I'm probably not explaining this properly but there seemed to be a paradoxical element in it.

Dynx, you're supercool and my hero. Silent pause to bask in your awesomeness.

Well, as someone who ISN'T ask awesome as Dynx, I can attest to the rejection from the program you were hoping for, BUT if there ARE other places who are interested in you, then that really is all that matters. Trying to understand the programs' rationales for acceptance/rejection is enough to make you go mad. There are so many variables for the why they choose/don't choose candidates. REmember... there are only a few if not one person choosing who gets an interview. Chalk it up to game we know as the Match.

 

[gutonc]

The criteria for who programs will interview is so multivariate, with different programs using different variables and numbers of them as to make the process essentially completely random. As an example, I applied to all 3 Harvard IM programs and got interviews at 2 of the 3 with my rejection from the 3rd coming very late in the season. Are these 3 programs really so different from each other in the quality/type of residents they select? I somehow doubt it. Once this happened I stopped getting upset by which programs did or didn't interview me.

This is also when I developed my "drunk monkeys with darts" theory of the Match.

 

[TUCOMSam]

Now THAT sums it up! LOL! 👍

 

[Entei]

You shouldn't base your self esteem so heavily on whether or not a program deems you "worthy" for an interview. It's not a statement on whether or not you're "fit to practice medicine" there or any place else. There are only so many spots at The Brigham, after all, and there are more than 40 (or however many spots they have) people who can deliver good patient care.

This is like saying that everyone who didn't get accepted to HMS is a second rate medical student, and anyone who wasn't accepted to Harvard undergrad might as well be working at McDonalds. I know it's easy to get caught up in all the games that are associated with the Match and its blindfolded monkeys, but you should have a little more faith in yourself.

 

[turkleton]

I regret starting this thread a little because I did such a poor job explaining what I was thinking. Believe me I'm not looking for a tears of support. I'm really happy with the interviews I got, my self esteem is in tact. This was a purely- and stupidly thought out- philosophical point.

 

[Entei]

Don't beat yourself up over it. This is a stressful time of year for all of us. Just chill out and watch a movie or something. Something funny, like... Swingers, maybe. (Clip linked since language not quite SFW.)

 

[footcramp]

you know, having had some time to actually talk to my friends outside of medicine, this whole notion of prestige is really something they gave up a long time ago. my friends get the jobs they do for salary, benefits, and other stuff. they don't give a rat's ass how famous the company is, what superstar CEO works there, or whatever else we medical students focus on. something to consider.

 

[radonc]

i realized that after a while it was inevitable that i would not be at the top of my 'class' anymore.

HS - top 2%
college - top 10%
med school - top50%
radonc - top40-50% (based on inservice scores)

im happy where i am, but its tough to be at the top as the competition gets stiffer.

 

[mlw03]

i realized that after a while it was inevitable that i would not be at the top of my 'class' anymore.

HS - top 2%
college - top 10%
med school - top50%
radonc - top40-50% (based on inservice scores)

im happy where i am, but its tough to be at the top as the competition gets stiffer.

good point, however i would also note that being top numerically does not a great doctor make. there are some people towards the top of my class who i wouldn't let treat my uncle, who's a piece of **** who i hope dies because it'll help my inheritance. some of these smart people are aloof, some are as*holes, some are just naive. and then there's middle in the middle who'd i'd refer my best friend to.

i think that as we progress thru med school, often the difference between top 10% and bottom 33% is knowing the esoteric details - and i'm ok with the bottom 33% people knowing how to look something up in a book. knowing the exact mutation in some rare glycogen storage disease doesn't help you practice pediatrics as long as you can recognize abnormal metabolic screens and have access to a biochemistry book. but that kind of thing may show up on an exam and there's gotta be something to separate the As from the Bs.

anyway, my point is simply that numbers are only part of being at "the top" of one's field.

 

[Faebinder]

In all reality...


The top whatever is used to separate people because there are just too many applicants to too many things.

So it's either they use the scores or they get that good old drunken monkey, give him the darts and hang the applications on the wall.

I believe many have utilized the monkey.

 

[lateness]

How is it different than a job interview? They're selecting the applicants they'd most like to have.

but at least at a job interview you are already in the office interviewing, face to face, unlike a residency rejection, where you wouldnt even get to the interview portion