Corona Virus: Idiot things people are doing

[DrMetal]

Hospital admin is asking that disposable (paper thin masks), like this one, be 'recycled' so that they can be sterilized and re-used. How do they intend to sterilize without destroying it? That's like putting a paper plate in a dishwasher.

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[NITRAS]

Ours are using 72 hours of uv light....

 

[Mad Jack]

Yeah, and I fear our over reaction and hysteria is more to blame than the virus itself.

I might be dead wrong (and I guess we'll find out in the coming weeks), but I think we'll be ok. The American hospital system---for all of its administrative and bureaucratic burdens, much of which have been relieved these last 2 weeks (interesting that it take a pandemic to do that)---is actually fairly robust. I'm sure we'll get busy, see a uptake in admissions, but I don't think COVID is going to break us.

I don't think any amount of hope and goodwill can procure ventilators from the void. This is going to be very, very bad. I know of two hospitals already that are hanging by a thread and will have to start triaging soon because the vents just aren't there. Thank god I'm not in one of those places... Yet...

 

[DrMetal]

I don't think any amount of hope and goodwill can procure ventilators from the void. This is going to be very, very bad. I know of two hospitals already that are hanging by a thread and will have to start triaging soon because the vents just aren't there. Thank god I'm not in one of those places... Yet...

Can you say where? I'm curious, b/c I'm military, may be deploying to said spots. PM me if you'd like.

 

[Meerkatology]

I might be dead wrong ... but I don't think COVID is going to break us.

you are. and it already has. unless you consider doctors/nurses dying from covid due to lack of proper PPE not a sign that our healthcare system have already been broken.

US healthcare system is hanging by a thread at baseline. in normal times, we have JUST enough personnel and JUST enough equipment. anything additional is pretty much the last straw already. let alone something on this scale.

whats ironic about the infection #'s is that we are so behind on testing, it actually masks the true extent of the damage.

if u are getting sent in as army aid, good luck and hope u have the right ppe.
some 40% of the first wave of healthcare workers in wuhan were infected, along with large portion of their families. at least the second wave of relief workers had good ppe and came out ok.
if only the US could do the same.

 

[DrMetal]

US healthcare system is hanging by a thread at baseline. in normal times, we have JUST enough personnel and JUST enough equipment. anything additional is pretty much the last straw already. let alone something on this scale.

Oh I agree. I find it very interesting that a lot of our bureaucracy and stupid rules have been shed these past 2 weeks to allow physicians some much needed latitude---for instance, relaxing the 72-hour admission for SNF rule, allowing for more telehealth when you obviously don't have to see the patient. Why we cant have such latitude on a regular basis is beyond me. The ABIM graciously extended MOC deadlines too (thanks: how bout getting rid of MOC altogether, another stupid administrative burden on your small body of physicians).

But, I still think we're going to be ok. We have reasonably good systems, good hospitals, good people, a good transfer system (many countries lack).

 

[NITRAS]

you are. and it already has. unless you consider doctors/nurses dying from covid due to lack of proper PPE not a sign that our healthcare system have already been broken.

US healthcare system is hanging by a thread at baseline. in normal times, we have JUST enough personnel and JUST enough equipment. anything additional is pretty much the last straw already. let alone something on this scale.

whats ironic about the infection #'s is that we are so behind on testing, it actually masks the true extent of the damage.

if u are getting sent in as army aid, good luck and hope u have the right ppe.
some 40% of the first wave of healthcare workers in wuhan were infected, along with large portion of their families. at least the second wave of relief workers had good ppe and came out ok.
if only the US could do the same.

The PPE crisis is largely due to the fact that basically all our PPE was produced in China, which stopped exporting PPE. Everyone, private, public, joe smo all decided to suck up what was left. You can criticize the US healthcare for other reasons, but the reasons why we are all out of PPE due to global supply disruption, not the way our healthcare is funded or utilized.

 

[Meerkatology]

The PPE crisis is largely due to the fact that basically all our PPE was produced in China, which stopped exporting PPE. Everyone, private, public, joe smo all decided to suck up what was left. You can criticize the US healthcare for other reasons, but the reasons why we are all out of PPE due to global supply disruption, not the way our healthcare is funded or utilized.

this is inherently flawed system in the event of an emergency.

its like saying, our bullets are all imported from another country. in the event we go to war with said country, we are screwed?

if a pandemic happens its likely global, if a nation as large as USA has minimal to no capability of self manufacturing basic medical supplies like PPE , then we are going to be screwed in a time like this. how can one not see this coming before hand?

even so, countries like france are importing large quantities of PPE from china after china got things under control. why doens't the usa do the same instead of continuing this literal flame war about chinese virus vs american virus? sure, this flame war is not purely one side's fault, but im sure things can be worked out when commerce is involved.

 

[thehundredthone]

Just curious: Where are you, what part of the country? Are you down because you have a lot of COVID patients (how many do you have?)? Or are you down b/c of your normal census (at a high volume place)?

Northeast. It's almost all just COVID now. ~60 in the ICU, almost all intubated. Other specialties with critical care (trauma, neurosurgery, neurology, etc.) continue to have their own needs. I do wonder, like @gutonc, where all the GIB and ACS patients have disappeared. I hope they're not dying at home.

 

[Instatewaiter]

I don't think any amount of hope and goodwill can procure ventilators from the void. This is going to be very, very bad. I know of two hospitals already that are hanging by a thread and will have to start triaging soon because the vents just aren't there. Thank god I'm not in one of those places... Yet...

There is an open source ventilator you can make from stuff at home Depot. The engineers at University of Florida have put it online... Fyi

 

[tantacles]

As a gay male, I've noticed that a lot of people on grindr, scruff, and other gay dating apps are still seeking hookups. Voraciously. I'm sure this is not exclusively a gay thing (Miami's beaches, anyone?), and I've seen many gay people having video zoom dates with new prospective companions, which is awesome. Just curious if anyone has seen this with less exclusively gay male-oriented apps.

I will also add that most of the people I've been getting solicitations from tend to be young (<35 years old), but I have been getting a few from older people. I want to shake both groups. To the younger group I want to say, "You're going to get everyone sick," and to the older group I want to say, "You're at risk for getting sick!"

There's no real solution.

 

[xoggyux]

Corona Virus: Idiot things people are doing
I'll start with one of my own confessions. Early on, perhaps December 2019 when it didn't even have a name I dismissed it as another Hype that the news are MAKING, rather than reported. In retrospect, I think I was justified, there were just a handful cases, all the way in a small part of China, it was "just a virus" and very small number of cases, few or none outside.
Just a handful of months forward, and it is obvious that this thing will leave a deep scar in our society, medical system and on ourselves.
Admittedly, my experience is short, but I don't think I have ever had more than 2 influenza patients in the ventilator at the same time, now my hospital has 10+ and we are not even in a "high incidence" area YET.
If for nothing else, I am fearful of what it is still to come because this minuscule entity has uncovered how unprepared we are, how ignorant we are and how arrogant we are.
Hopefully, enough of us (medical people and not) will remember long after this has passed, and make sure that next time we take it more seriously from the start.
For now, be safe, don't be more idiot than the bare minimum and thank you for the job you do.

 

[DrMetal]

Some more gems, courtesy of hospital admin . . .

"Wear a mask everywhere in the hospital, but only a surgical mask. Don't wear an N95, b/c that might freak out the patients."
As if they're not freaked out by my surgical mask. or freaked out by the fact that they're a f--in patient in the hospital during the worst pandemic in 100 years!!! I doubt a mask, N95 or otherwise, will freak them out any more.

"Use the yellow disposable gowns multiple times, to conserve. Keep the same one on as you move from room to room."
Ok, so either this instruction you're giving me is bullsht, or these yellow gowns are bullsht at really protecting anyone from anything (a point we've been making for years mainly with respect to cdiff precautions).

"SNFs are now requiring 2 negative swabs"
So I have to prolong the patient's hospital stay, to get a second swab (even if completely asymptomatic), to prove he's negative. But that prolonged stay increases the chance of him getting COVID. Plus how do we know he doesn't get it during his EMS ride to the SNF, maybe he should be swabbed there at the door? Insanity.

 

[Eyeronic]

Can't understand why on earth some states/metropolitan areas that are among the hardest hit and quickly running out of PPE are having local community parades outdoors to honor and thank all the healthcare workers (who are currently inside a hospital, post-call and sleeping, or properly abiding by the stay-at-home orders and not able to witness said parades) with law enforcement (probably getting paid overtime) and spectators all wearing the disposable masks (while outdoors, violating a stay-at-home order, and nowhere near another person let alone a sick citizen) that the healthcare workers themselves will be needing when supplies run out.

 

[DrMetal]

Can't understand why on earth some states/metropolitan areas that are among the hardest hit and quickly running out of PPE are having local community parades outdoors

Who's having parades right now? What City? That's too perfect.

 

[DrMetal]

The "Heroes Work Here" banners, posters, whatnot, being planted across the hospitals. Stop it, it's patronizing. It doesn't make anyone feel better after working a 12-hour shift with minimal PPE. Give us good PPE, good diagnostic tests, etc, that's what we care about (not being called a hero).

 

[john7991]

I like that one Chinese official proclaiming that the U.S. Military planted the coronavirus in China, to destabilize their gov't. I wish we were that good.

I’m sure we’re that good, but I don’t think that’s what happened; I think the original story is true.

 

[jdh71]

The "Heroes Work Here" banners, posters, whatnot, being planted across the hospitals. Stop it, it's patronizing. It doesn't make anyone feel better after working a 12-hour shift with minimal PPE. Give us good PPE, good diagnostic tests, etc, that's what we care about (not being called a hero).

I’m not a hero. This is what I do.

 

[DrMetal]

Where's the sense in making an mRNA vaccine? You need a -80 freezer to store it (how many outpatient clinics have one?). If out of the freezer, needs to be put immediately on dry ice (if left out on a benchtop for even a few minutes, it denatures, that's the nature of RNA). We expect all the lay nurses/medical assistants, even physicians in this country to know and execute correctly these nuances of handling RNA? The scope of error in such logistics seems too great. Maybe that's why we've never had a viable mRNA vaccine.

 

[Crayola227]

I think the sense was that initially we had no idea what we could make, so ANYTHING would be better than nothing. And even with the difficulties with mrna mentioned, we could still figure out how to get at least some people vaccinated.

 

[wamcp]

Where's the sense in making an mRNA vaccine? You need a -80 freezer to store it (how many outpatient clinics have one?). If out of the freezer, needs to be put immediately on dry ice (if left out on a benchtop for even a few minutes, it denatures, that's the nature of RNA). We expect all the lay nurses/medical assistants, even physicians in this country to know and execute correctly these nuances of handling RNA? The scope of error in such logistics seems too great. Maybe that's why we've never had a viable mRNA vaccine.

If Pfizer's press release is true, 90% decrease in infection rate in a trial with ~44000 subjects with half of them being elderly....the logistical challenges will be overcome. If true the efficacy is extremely high and well worth it to the governemnt.

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

If Pfizer's press release is true, 90% decrease in infection rate in a trial with ~44000 subjects with half of them being elderly....the logistical challenges will be overcome. If true the efficacy is extremely high and well worth it to the governemnt.

Yep. Hospitals will buy the right type of freezer (if they don't already have them) and set up a scheduling system for people to come get the vaccine. The pharmacies did the latter part when Shingrix first came out.

 

[DrMetal]

Yep. Hospitals will buy the right type of freezer (if they don't already have them) and set up a scheduling system for people to come get the vaccine. The pharmacies did the latter part when Shingrix first came out.

That's how it should go. Ok, we'll see. Problem is: you're gonna probably have to go to a hospital or large medical center (ie a campus with a large lab, that can provide proper refrigeration) in order to get the vaccine. You're not going to be able to get it at your local mom and pop clinic or pharmacy, at least not at first. It's going to be slow roll out, which I'm totally fine with (better slow and accurate), but I hope the lay public (and our politicians) understand that.

Shingrix is a protenaceous vaccine, much easier to handle (can sit at room temp for a while).

I wouldn't underestimate the difficulties in handling mRNA. I once saw a PhD microbiologist accidently leave his aliquots out on a benchtop for more than 15 minutes. 2 years worth of work down the drain. Much drinking ensued.

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

That's how it should go. Ok, we'll see. Problem is: you're gonna probably have to go to a hospital or large medical center (ie a campus with a large lab, that can provide proper refrigeration) in order to get the vaccine. You're not going to be able to get it at your local mom and pop clinic or pharmacy, at least not at first. It's going to be slow roll out, which I'm totally fine with (better slow and accurate), but I hope the lay public (and our politicians) understand that.

Shingrix is a protenaceous vaccine, much easier to handle (can sit at room temp for a while).

I wouldn't underestimate the difficulties in handling mRNA. I once saw a PhD microbiologist accidently leave his aliquots out on a benchtop for more than 15 minutes. 2 years worth of work down the drain. Much drinking ensued.

Given how 50% of the public has said they won't take a vaccine, I'm not too worried about them in the first wave of vaccinations.

You'll note I compared Shingrix to the latter part (the scheduling issue) not the storage issue.

 

[emergentmd]

Complaining about Trumps Rally's incessantly and banning large gatherings but then allowing all of these riots without a peep

 

[DrMetal]

Given how 50% of the public has said they won't take a vaccine, I'm not too worried about them in the first wave of vaccinations.

Quite true. Good, let 'em die. Much of this is evolution at work. Who are we to stand in the way?!

 

[Kaustikos]

Quite true. Good, let 'em die. Much of this is evolution at work. Who are we to stand in the way?!

Me "Would you consider taking the vaccine for COVID?"
Patient "No"
Me "Great, goodbye. Have a nice day. Don't forget to fill out that MOLST form."

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

Quite true. Good, let 'em die. Much of this is evolution at work. Who are we to stand in the way?!

Some days I feel this way (usually after the 5th in a row person to refuse ALL preventative care).

Given that the first round of vaccines will go to healthcare workers (likely to those actually working in the hospital first), its a great time to fine-tune storage and administration issues before opening up to the public.

 

[greatnt249]

Quite true. Good, let 'em die. Much of this is evolution at work. Who are we to stand in the way?!

I don't have an issue with stupid/reckless people being stupid/reckless as long as they stay in their own bubble of stupidity/recklessness. However, it would seem that they aren't staying in their own bubble and are essentially undermining the efforts of those who are just asking to do simple things we should have already been doing anyway (ie, washing hands regularly).

Apparently the logic is, if you yell it loud and long enough, not wearing a mask somehow becomes a "Constitutional right."

 

[DrMetal]

I don't have an issue with stupid/reckless people being stupid/reckless as long as they stay in their own bubble of stupidity/recklessness.

Yeah, I here ya. Well, if it's stupid/reckless non-compliant patients that we'll have to be dealing with soon in this regard, then it's business as usual for those of us in primary care.

 

[DrMetal]

Here ya go (this CNN reporter clearly follows this thread):

Pfizer's ultra-cold vaccine, a 'very complex' distribution plan and an exploding head emoji | CNN

As Molly Howell, a state health official in North Dakota, watched a webinar on how to distribute what's expected to be the first Covid-19 vaccine, her head began to spin.

www.cnn.com

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

Here ya go (this CNN reporter clearly follows this thread):

Pfizer's ultra-cold vaccine, a 'very complex' distribution plan and an exploding head emoji | CNN

As Molly Howell, a state health official in North Dakota, watched a webinar on how to distribute what's expected to be the first Covid-19 vaccine, her head began to spin.

www.cnn.com

It's North Dakota in January. They can leave the things on the front porch and it'll be fine.

 

[InvestingDoc]

Torn between stupid and kind of Nobel intentions trying to make sure some level of safety.

Here in Austin I have some patients who are very well off. We have been asked to test all their guests before a party so that they don't have to wear a mask at the party and can have fun without worrying about covid. We try to explain about false negative and it falls on deaf ears. They just want a negative result. One person in particular tells me they have had they estimate about 50 covid swabs so far during this pandemic.


We also see a lot more of people wearing face shields without a mask walking around town.


Lots of people going out to party and getting a test before and after to make sure they are still negative. Bachelorette party went on a party bus and wanted everyone tested before hand. Thats like 50% of our calls at this point for covid-19.

 

[DrMetal]

Torn between stupid and kind of Nobel intentions trying to make sure some level of safety.

Here in Austin I have some patients who are very well off. We have been asked to test all their guests before a party so that they don't have to wear a mask at the party and can have fun without worrying about covid. We try to explain about false negative and it falls on deaf ears. They just want a negative result. One person in particular tells me they have had they estimate about 50 covid swabs so far during this pandemic.

Wow, just wow. Pure idiocy. Humanity be damned. Maybe this should be our extinction event.

Bachelorette party went on a party bus and wanted everyone tested before hand.

Good looking ladies? Average BMI? I might be ok with this.

 

[Kaustikos]

Torn between stupid and kind of Nobel intentions trying to make sure some level of safety.

Here in Austin I have some patients who are very well off. We have been asked to test all their guests before a party so that they don't have to wear a mask at the party and can have fun without worrying about covid. We try to explain about false negative and it falls on deaf ears. They just want a negative result. One person in particular tells me they have had they estimate about 50 covid swabs so far during this pandemic.


We also see a lot more of people wearing face shields without a mask walking around town.


Lots of people going out to party and getting a test before and after to make sure they are still negative. Bachelorette party went on a party bus and wanted everyone tested before hand. Thats like 50% of our calls at this point for covid-19.

I'll say this kindly:


EFF THAT

Sorry you have to deal with that. Meanwhile our hospital finally got a ready supply of rapid covid swabs for all patients last month. So glad celebrities and atheletes took precedent over patients.

 

[InvestingDoc]

Wow, just wow. Pure idiocy. Humanity be damned. Maybe this should be our extinction event.


Good looking ladies? Average BMI? I might be ok with this.

It is infuriating that we have a group of patients who still throw house parties on the lake every weekend and just have everyone get swabbed before hand so that they don't have to wear masks. I try not to judge and they have since moved on to a local testosterone clinic that does rapid covid swabs for them

 

[zeloc]

How much do they have to pay for these covid swabs? Presumably the insurance is not going to cover 50 tests. If they are taking advantage of free testing, then that's the problem. A cost is the only way to disincentivize these ppl from wasting resources and getting tested indiscriminately.

 

[Crayola227]

Where's the sense in making an mRNA vaccine? You need a -80 freezer to store it (how many outpatient clinics have one?). If out of the freezer, needs to be put immediately on dry ice (if left out on a benchtop for even a few minutes, it denatures, that's the nature of RNA). We expect all the lay nurses/medical assistants, even physicians in this country to know and execute correctly these nuances of handling RNA? The scope of error in such logistics seems too great. Maybe that's why we've never had a viable mRNA vaccine.

So I read an article today where it is now clear to me the advantage of mRNA.

My background I did a lot of years working as a research aide doing a lot with protein expression and structure.

They point out how quick and easy it is to sequence the genome of a virus. OTOH, studying said virus' protein expression is a lot more complicated. Trying to create a piece of a protein that has a shape similiar to what it has when fully incorporated into the whole protein/virus can be VERY difficult, AND one that will trigger the immune response you're looking for AND will also inactivate the virus... well I can see how that might be loads more difficult to accomplish than chopping up some mRNA and seeing what chunk the body goes after.

From what I vaguely recall from med school, our immune system protections against foreign mystery mRNA is pretty robust, and I think it's what they're trying to capitalize on.

Now I'm gonna talk out of my ass and posit that you're more likely to get some autoimmune crossfire working with proteins than mRNA, but that's my gestalt and I'd be hard pressed to explain why.

They're saying these genomic vaccines might be wave of the future. And if the Moderna one holds at 94.5% effective, apparently would make it the second most effective vaccine ever made, second only to measles at 97%. Of course no one knows if that response will stick around or wane with time yet.

 

[DrMetal]

So I read an article today where it is now clear to me the advantage of mRNA.

My background I did a lot of years working as a research aide doing a lot with protein expression and structure.

They point out how quick and easy it is to sequence the genome of a virus. OTOH, studying said virus' protein expression is a lot more complicated. Trying to create a piece of a protein that has a shape similiar to what it has when fully incorporated into the whole protein/virus can be VERY difficult, AND one that will trigger the immune response you're looking for AND will also inactivate the virus... well I can see how that might be loads more difficult to accomplish than chopping up some mRNA and seeing what chunk the body goes after.

From what I vaguely recall from med school, our immune system protections against foreign mystery mRNA is pretty robust, and I think it's what they're trying to capitalize on.

Now I'm gonna talk out of my ass and posit that you're more likely to get some autoimmune crossfire working with proteins than mRNA, but that's my gestalt and I'd be hard pressed to explain why.

They're saying these genomic vaccines might be wave of the future. And if the Moderna one holds at 94.5% effective, apparently would make it the second most effective vaccine ever made, second only to measles at 97%. Of course no one knows if that response will stick around or wane with time yet.

I don't doubt the biochemistry of it. I'm sure it can work in theory. The problems I see are logistical. You need a -80C freezer and lots of dry ice, and competent people to draw it up quickly and inject it.

 

[HariboGoldbears]

So I read an article today where it is now clear to me the advantage of mRNA.

My background I did a lot of years working as a research aide doing a lot with protein expression and structure.

They point out how quick and easy it is to sequence the genome of a virus. OTOH, studying said virus' protein expression is a lot more complicated. Trying to create a piece of a protein that has a shape similiar to what it has when fully incorporated into the whole protein/virus can be VERY difficult, AND one that will trigger the immune response you're looking for AND will also inactivate the virus... well I can see how that might be loads more difficult to accomplish than chopping up some mRNA and seeing what chunk the body goes after.

From what I vaguely recall from med school, our immune system protections against foreign mystery mRNA is pretty robust, and I think it's what they're trying to capitalize on.

Now I'm gonna talk out of my ass and posit that you're more likely to get some autoimmune crossfire working with proteins than mRNA, but that's my gestalt and I'd be hard pressed to explain why.

They're saying these genomic vaccines might be wave of the future. And if the Moderna one holds at 94.5% effective, apparently would make it the second most effective vaccine ever made, second only to measles at 97%. Of course no one knows if that response will stick around or wane with time yet.

I think the immune response to dsRNA is mostly innate. Also wonder how it will trigger an antigen response if the RNA itself is encapsulated in the virus. While the market did not demand as strongly for it, we have never been able to make a vaccine for previous corona viruses. The rate of mutation of this virus - which sequence from when and where are we using? Is it the dominant sequence in our area? Is it from new york or cali? I am not an expert in vaccines nor immunology but these were my first thoughts! Please help me understand this if you guys know otherwise!

Logistical stuff we can sort out I think. I just hope diligent scientific scruitny occurs prior to its release.

 

[DrMetal]

I think the immune response to dsRNA is mostly innate. Also wonder how it will trigger an antigen response if the RNA itself is encapsulated in the virus. While the market did not demand as strongly for it, we have never been able to make a vaccine for previous corona viruses. The rate of mutation of this virus - which sequence from when and where are we using? Is it the dominant sequence in our area? Is it from new york or cali? I am not an expert in vaccines nor immunology but these were my first thoughts! Please help me understand this if you guys know otherwise!

Logistical stuff we can sort out I think. I just hope diligent scientific scruitny occurs prior to its release.

Good points. RNA is a very difficult target. It turns over quickly, hard to for the immune system to 'see', even harder to make an IgM/G against it. The spike protein would be the better target, I think . . .but your mutation point is very true. This is why we don't have vaccines against most respiratory viruses. It's taken 50 years of diligent work to come up with a decent influenza one.

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

Good points. RNA is a very difficult target. It turns over quickly, hard to for the immune system to 'see', even harder to make an IgM/G against it. The spike protein would be the better target, I think . . .but your mutation point is very true. This is why we don't have vaccines against most respiratory viruses. It's taken 50 years of diligent work to come up with a decent influenza one.

Are you aware of how these mRNA vaccines work?

 

[DrMetal]

Are you aware of how these mRNA vaccines work?

Not in great detail. I have no doubt that they work well, and would work well if administered correctly. Again, I'm more concerned about their logistics.

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

Not in great detail. I have no doubt that they work well, and would work well if administered correctly. Again, I'm more concerned about their logistics.

The mRNA of the vaccine gets taken up by the recipient's cells and those cells produce the spike protein on their surface for the immune system to see.

 

[DrMetal]

The mRNA of the vaccine gets taken up by the recipient's cells and those cells produce the spike protein on their surface for the immune system to see.

Lets do it! I hope the 19-yo medical assistant at local urgent care in Billings, Montana remembers to put it on dry ice!

 

[chessknt]

Not in great detail. I have no doubt that they work well, and would work well if administered correctly. Again, I'm more concerned about their logistics.

Is it accurate that it has to be injected within minutes of coming out of a freezer? Is it IV or IM?

I can see how they would need to have vaccination centers like maybe one or 2 per state depending on the size/population where they have specially trained staff who literally just administer this preposterous vaccine all day long 7 days a week if it is indeed that onerous. Outside of that I don't foresee this working since there are too many opportunities for error.

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

Is it accurate that it has to be injected within minutes of coming out of a freezer? Is it IV or IM?

I can see how they would need to have vaccination centers like maybe one or 2 per state depending on the size/population where they have specially trained staff who literally just administer this preposterous vaccine all day long 7 days a week if it is indeed that onerous. Outside of that I don't foresee this working since there are too many opportunities for error.

I believe most majors hospitals have/plan to have the necessary freezers. So same idea but more places to get it done.

 

[sunshinefl]

The mRNA of the vaccine gets taken up by the recipient's cells and those cells produce the spike protein on their surface for the immune system to see.

Wow! I didn’t know that. That’s actually really cool.

 

[chessknt]

I believe most majors hospitals have/plan to have the necessary freezers. So same idea but more places to get it done.

But what about transitioning from freezer to syringe/needle to patient? You think that'll be done correctly given the small window for failure?

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

But what about transitioning from freezer to syringe/needle to patient? You think that'll be done correctly given the small window for failure?

Sure. You have the vaccine administration area freezer adjacent. Have a small number of people trained to do it properly.