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Debt Ceiling Bill - No more Subsidized loans for Medical Students?

PTWOB02

Full Member
Jun 26, 2011
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Los Angeles, CA
  1. Pre-Medical
    I was reading "Debt Ceiling Bill" that was passed by the House today and noticed in Title V there was a section describing changes on Pell Grants and Student Loans. Specifically, starting on July 2012 (next summer) there will be:

    SEC. 502. TERMINATION OF AUTHORITY TO MAKE INTEREST SUBSIDIZED LOANS TO GRADUATE AND PROFESSIONAL STUDENTS.

    So it sounds like once we become medical students (aka "professional" students), we'll start accruing interest on our Stafford loans since the government no longer wants to subsidize it. I guess the idea is for the government to use generated savings to pump them back into Pell Grant funding.

    What do you guys think?
     

    DrMidlife

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      Subsidized loan limit on Staffords is $8500 per year and recently the rate is at 6.8%. If you don't need to borrow the full COA you might feel the change as discernible pain (and I'll be crying you a river). If you're borrowing full COA then it'll be drowned out by the interest accumulating on the likely quarter million total.
       

      bcd051

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        Subsidized loan limit on Staffords is $8500 per year and recently the rate is at 6.8%. If you don't need to borrow the full COA you might feel the change as discernible pain (and I'll be crying you a river). If you're borrowing full COA then it'll be drowned out by the interest accumulating on the likely quarter million total.

        So you are telling me that since my Master's Degree already has me 80k in debt, and I'm going to have to pay (out of pocket from what I had leftover from working fulltime) 10k to take the last classes I need for med school (o chem/physics, and I need health insurance). I'm going to be drowning in nearly 400k debt in 5 years?
         
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        DrMidlife

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          So you are telling me that since my Master's Degree already has me 80k in debt, and I'm going to have to pay (out of pocket from what I had leftover from working fulltime) 10k to take the last classes I need for med school (o chem/physics, and I need health insurance).
          There's no change in what you can borrow. The terms of repayment are changing if the Senate approves the bill and if nothing gets rejiggered in the next 12 months.
          I'm going to be drowning in nearly 400k debt in 5 years?
          You won't be alone, but I think you should seriously look at what that debt load means in terms of repayment requirements during residency. You should also seriously consider not applying to schools you can't afford.
           

          jsp132

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          Dec 17, 2010
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            There's no change in what you can borrow. The terms of repayment are changing if the Senate approves the bill and if nothing gets rejiggered in the next 12 months.

            You won't be alone, but I think you should seriously look at what that debt load means in terms of repayment requirements during residency. You should also seriously consider not applying to schools you can't afford.

            400k in debt? are you kidding me?
             

            DrMidlife

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              400k in debt? are you kidding me?
              Public med school for instate students in my state just hit $200k COA, and it's about average. (Also: guess who didn't get into her state school anyway?)

              For somebody starting undergrad today in my state, if they go public undergrad and public med school, which is the cheapest option, and they borrow full COA, which is highly common given the economy, that's $300k. That's the cheapest path. If you introduce private school, grad school and/or an SMP, you're at $400k. Easy.
               

              bcd051

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                400k in debt? are you kidding me?

                Well I just spent 80k getting a Master's, I was also including interest in my assessment. And to DrMidLife, I'm only REALLY trying to get into schools close to home (1 public which is 1/2 price, other is close enough that I could move in with 'rents *sigh* and have no living expenses).
                 

                Nasrudin

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                  Thank god...we still have enough for foreign state building and global corporate security.

                  Cause that would be really scary.

                  If that ever stops. We're screwed for real then huh?
                   

                  FiremedicMike

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                    Educated people is the new target of the rich/republicans. They no longer want the possibility of you making something better of yourself and going up the social ladder by education alone.

                    Allow the rich to stay rich and screw everyone else. I have been a registered republican since I could vote, but after the royal screwing the republican party is trying to give me in Ohio, as well as their antics nationwide, I doubt I'll be too loyal to them for much longer. Not saying I'm a democrat now, but I'm definitely going to make an effort to be an informed voter, and I will never vote party line again.

                    I'm not usually one of those who watches the propaganda films and buys into them, but I found the movie "Born Rich" to be interesting, it's available on netflix.
                     

                    Nasrudin

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                      Agree. I'm not into the current configuration of political parties at all. You take an Obama or you take a Newt. Not a whole lot of difference when it comes to the lunacy of our entire premise. One nation, under god, over the world, democratic but capital sacrosanct.

                      And also agree. The bubble on our education debt is reaching the breaking point.

                      How can people with art degrees owe $100,000. That's f'n ridiculous. Work at starbucks for 16 hr/day and your still not gonna make that note.
                       

                      dotdash

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                        Agreed that Republicans have a serious anti-intellectual streak in them these days (wasn't always that way). Look at Palin, with her 4-schools-in-6-years college degree. She thinks she is just as ready for the presidency as Obama, with his ivy law review credentials. That's the new Republican party.
                         

                        Prncssbuttercup

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                          Sooo, let me get this straight, you guys are worried that you will no longer qualify for subsidized student loans? So, you guys are worried that during four years of schooling you may have to pay the interest on a maximum of $65,500 out of a total possible debt of potentially over $300k? Considering the financial mess this country is in, you should be thankful they didn't cut loans to professional students entirely! They are saving a crap load of cash from people who will likely be able to easily pay off the debt they accrue... While I'm not pleased, it isn't the end of my world, and $25,500 isn't going to ruin my life...
                           

                          TriagePreMed

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                            Sooo, let me get this straight, you guys are worried that you will no longer qualify for subsidized student loans? So, you guys are worried that during four years of schooling you may have to pay the interest on a maximum of $65,500 out of a total possible debt of potentially over $300k? Considering the financial mess this country is in, you should be thankful they didn't cut loans to professional students entirely! They are saving a crap load of cash from people who will likely be able to easily pay off the debt they accrue... While I'm not pleased, it isn't the end of my world, and $25,500 isn't going to ruin my life...
                            You shouldn't come talk here about stuff that you're clearly unable to understand.

                            Yes, students becoming physicians will likely be able to pay it off. Now guess what? More will be deterred from going to primary care. Willing to take that? Okay. Now how about the thousands of other students that are getting Ph.D's and doing all the research so that you can have something to treat your patients with? Do you think they make 200k a year? Some will be lucky if they get to 80k a year after their doctorate. How about those in other health fields? PA, OD, DPM, MSN, etc.? These are not making gigantic amounts of money. The worst part in all this is that you're so willing to defend the government when just cutting defense spending alone could solve all the problems. We wouldn't even need to tax the rich like we should. Now with their tax holidays they will keep their money outside for the next one. What the rich are doing is trying to keep us ignorant or from progressing to the next bracket by education alone. Be thankful they didn't cut more? Seriously, f the government. We elect them to serve us, not f us.
                             
                            Last edited:

                            yankswin2011

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                            Feb 28, 2011
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                              Sooo, let me get this straight, you guys are worried that you will no longer qualify for subsidized student loans? So, you guys are worried that during four years of schooling you may have to pay the interest on a maximum of $65,500 out of a total possible debt of potentially over $300k? Considering the financial mess this country is in, you should be thankful they didn't cut loans to professional students entirely! They are saving a crap load of cash from people who will likely be able to easily pay off the debt they accrue... While I'm not pleased, it isn't the end of my world, and $25,500 isn't going to ruin my life...

                              He's kind of right. GradPLUS and Unsubsidized are already unsubsidized. So really, this bill really only affects the $8,500 per year in Subsidized Stafford loans, which multiplied by 4 years would be $34,000, so at 6.8% interest rate, that's about $1500-2000 bucks in savings in total over 4 years. Once you graduate, it is no longer subsidized. So $1500-2000 over 4 years (so it's about $400-500 per year) in the mix of $250-300K+ in loans, is kind of small. I don't know about you, but I think we're all pretty smart enough to figure out how to save $400-500 per year -- just eat out less, rent a place that's not as expensive, don't fly home as much, etc, etc.
                               

                              Nasrudin

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                                Sooo, let me get this straight, you guys are worried that you will no longer qualify for subsidized student loans? So, you guys are worried that during four years of schooling you may have to pay the interest on a maximum of $65,500 out of a total possible debt of potentially over $300k? Considering the financial mess this country is in, you should be thankful they didn't cut loans to professional students entirely! They are saving a crap load of cash from people who will likely be able to easily pay off the debt they accrue... While I'm not pleased, it isn't the end of my world, and $25,500 isn't going to ruin my life...

                                No just debt in general. Obscene levels of debt. Bubblelicious tuitions. PArt of a largter malaise of debt spending to be a middle class american.

                                While things generally crumble and get worse.

                                And why it doesn't even enter the political discussion that America will not last as an imperial force for global capital. At least. Not the america where the mailman can own a house and put his kids through college.
                                 

                                yankswin2011

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                                Feb 28, 2011
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                                  Yes, I agree that student loan bubble is due to burst.

                                  If we were serious about controlling the costs of education, the solution is not allowing more debt borrowing but trying to control the costs of higher education but being that (a) higher education has strong lobbyists in Washington, (b) private schools can charge whatever they want so long as students keep coming, and (c) tenure-track professionship may rear its ugly head the way labor unions ruined the American auto companies, I don't see how the costs of higher education is going to stop increasing any time soon -- I mean, it just rises every year to the point that scholarships and grants can't keep up with it.

                                  There's something wrong when undergraduates at elite private universities need to borrow up to $70K ($40K tuition, $30K room + board) a year (assuming no scholarships/grants), and so undergraduates from elite private schools graduating with $100K-200K debt is not uncommon and sickening.
                                   

                                  Prncssbuttercup

                                  Established Member -- Family Medicine Attending
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                                  Where ever I am, I wish I was in Versailles
                                  1. Attending Physician
                                    You shouldn't come talk here about stuff that you're clearly unable to understand.

                                    Yes, students becoming physicians will likely be able to pay it off. Now guess what? More will be deterred from going to primary care. Willing to take that? Okay. Now how about the thousands of other students that are getting Ph.D's and doing all the research so that you can have something to treat your patients with? Do you think they make 200k a year? Some will be lucky if they get to 80k a year after their doctorate. How about those in other health fields? PA, OD, DPM, MSN, etc.? These are not making gigantic amounts of money. The worst part in all this is that you're so willing to defend the government when just cutting defense spending alone could solve all the problems. We wouldn't even need to tax the rich like we should. Now with their tax holidays they will keep their money outside for the next one. What the rich are doing is trying to keep us ignorant or from progressing to the next bracket by education alone. Be thankful they didn't cut more? Seriously, f the government. We elect them to serve us, not f us.

                                    Triage, let me set YOU straight. FIRSTLY: PhD students don't pay a damn cent for their PhD education. They are PAID 20-25k/yr to do it, they pay ZERO tuition, nadda, none, ziltch, etc. The ONLY loans they have could be for cost of living or from UG or a MS/MA program. In regards to those with PAs/NPs/etc, they don't make meager wages compared to their debt. The total indebtedness for a PA student maxes out at about 100k for the most expensive schools. They're bringing in a minimum of 65k to start. NPs are bringing in more than that and typically have less debt. Sorry, again, they'll live. Subsidized loans are only subsidized for the time you're in school, once you're done, you're on your own.

                                    Secondly, do the freaking math will you! This is seriously not more than 25.5k TOTAL over how ever many years you're paying it back. That is the MOST it can be. If you don't make a lot of money, you qualify for income-based payments, if you work for the public sector, you get your loans forgiven after 10-15 years. Give it up, sorry but people who are educated are much more likely to be able to pay off their debts, and be able to finance them. Sorry you're in a tight spot and this seems scary to you, well guess what, I've qualified for subsidized loans all of once in my life, so my entire UG tuition was financed on Non-subsidized loans, guess what, on my meager salary, I still manage to pay them. Before you start blasting me, it is YOU who need to fact check.

                                    Thirdly, please quote me where I defended the feds. I said be thankful they didn't cut the loan program entirely. Where is that a defense of their actions? Please explain, if you can.

                                    No just debt in general. Obscene levels of debt. Bubblelicious tuitions. PArt of a largter malaise of debt spending to be a middle class american.

                                    While things generally crumble and get worse.

                                    And why it doesn't even enter the political discussion that America will not last as an imperial force for global capital. At least. Not the america where the mailman can own a house and put his kids through college.

                                    I agree with this.
                                     
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