Did I just $#&! myself?

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shoehornlettuce

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This semester I took 15 credit hours of nothing but science courses so I could be ready for the MCAT.

Organic II with lab
Physics II with lab
Biology II with lab

The general wisdom seems to be if you can do well, then the heavy course load looks good, however, I think my GPA is going to take a hit this semester. Realistically I'm probably going to end up with around a 3.4-3.5 GPA this semester. I'm wondering if admissions will look down upon this or if the heavy course load will compensate for the sub par GPA. It frustrates me because I know several people who have cup cake majors and take one science class at a time and have 4.0 GPAs. They have twice as much time to study for science exams as I do so they do better.
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It's not a heavy courseload considering all of those are pre-reqs and not upper division classes. Med schools won't give you a pass on that.

When you take p-chem + lab, analytical chem, partial differential equations, and chemical biology all in one semester then get back to me.
 
The MCAT is the most important test of your life.

In before someone else comes in and says that same thing
 
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yeah...this definitely isn't a heavy courseload. sorry bro
 
First of all, Classes don't really help with the MCAT. Studying for the MCAT is what helps with the MCAT. When you're in class, you're just studying for the next test, you'll forget it all well before the MCAT.
Secondly, Admissions committees don't really look at your "courseload" per se. They don't look in detail to see how concentrated hard classes were. They glance over to your GPA, look up your Major, and scan for any trouble spots (like that C in orgo). Overloading yourself can only hurt, not help.
Finally, I'm not sure that is overloading. Looking back over my college transcript, that load is pretty par for the course, you have to get those classes out of the way so that you can have 3-4 semesters of intensive high level electives to complete your major. That being said, if you do have the flexibility to space out those GPA killers, you should do it.
 
OH please... sophomore year i took Molec. Cell bio, Orgo, physics, the whole year, test every weekend...

the summer betw. soph year and junior year, i took the MCAT (pretty early), BEST decision ever...

end of junior year when people were worrying about spring midterms and finals, i had NOTHIng to worry about.

just get A's in those classes... you can do it if you like it!
 
Doodl3s said:
OH please... sophomore year i took Molec. Cell bio, Orgo, physics, the whole year, test every weekend...

the summer betw. soph year and junior year, i took the MCAT (pretty early), BEST decision ever...

end of junior year when people were worrying about spring midterms and finals, i had NOTHIng to worry about.

just get A's in those classes... you can do it if you like it!
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so very true. its so much easier to do well when you like the subject, so sometimes you just have to convince yourself that you like something
 
Whatever... don't listen to people who say that isn't a tough course-load. Of course it is. People here are masochistic and neurotic. Just do better next semester. Good luck.
 
Sometimes I am truly blown away by the blatant arrogance on SDN. You all plan on being selfless physicians but you can't seem to pull your head out of your rear-end. Comparing relative difficulties in undergraduate schedules .. Congratulations, you guys are really cool.

Seems like a solidly difficult schedule to me to be honest (assuming you have other courses), especially because those labs will take a lot of your time.


"Come on, man"
 
Thanks for the info. It has nothing to do with me not liking the subject. It's just a time thing. The labs take up a tremendous amount of time between 12 hours a week of in lab work followed by 3 reports every week. Throw in another 12 hours of lecture plus 3 hours of recitation. It's difficult to find the study time necessary to master the material for exams. I'm a bit surprised this isn't considered a difficult schedule. My school won't let me sign up for more if I wanted to. I guess everybody graduates in 4 years with 120 science credits.
 
Are all 3 classes combined lecture/labs or can you register for them separately? If all you're trying to achieve is squeezing in the courses before the MCAT then take the lectures now and catch up on the labs later (if possible).
 
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aSagacious said:
Are all 3 classes combined lecture/labs or can you register for them separately? If all you're trying to achieve is squeezing in the courses before the MCAT then take the lectures now and catch up on the labs later (if possible).
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The labs show up as separate 1 credit hour each but you are required sign up for the lab with the course when you register.
 
shoehornlettuce said:
Thanks for the info. It has nothing to do with me not liking the subject. It's just a time thing. The labs take up a tremendous amount of time between 12 hours a week of in lab work followed by 3 reports every week. Throw in another 12 hours of lecture plus 3 hours of recitation. It's difficult to find the study time necessary to master the material for exams. I'm a bit surprised this isn't considered a difficult schedule. My school won't let me sign up for more if I wanted to. I guess everybody graduates in 4 years with 120 science credits.
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Relax. I can understand the frustration. Just remember how people love to brag. It's like when you get a new car. Your neighbor has to show you how his new car is better. It's faster, it's got more cupholders.... anyway, usually those who act like this are trying to overcompensate for a lack of .... something else.
 
I was forced by my schedule to take all those classes at once and i got straight C's. It's been the biggest black mark on my applications, and it's haunted me for 5 years.

I didn't have a choice in when I could take those classes, but it sounds like you do.

If you CAN space them out. DO IT.

(also, again, don't take them for the MCAT, they won't help, when it comes time to take the MCAT, the prep book will have everything you need)
 
HokieMD1 said:
Sometimes I am truly blown away by the blatant arrogance on SDN. You all plan on being selfless physicians but you can't seem to pull your head out of your rear-end. Comparing relative difficulties in undergraduate schedules .. Congratulations, you guys are really cool.

Seems like a solidly difficult schedule to me to be honest (assuming you have other courses), especially because those labs will take a lot of your time.


"Come on, man"
Click to expand...

The lack of sympathy probably arose due to the way he worded his post. He comes in with a complaint (which he chose of his own free will) and claims he has a heavy load (it could be easier but it can also be a lot worse) and makes a lame comparison, blaming his lack of success on other people, who apparently decided to take "cup cake majors" that allows them to have "twice as much time to study".
 
HokieMD1 said:
Sometimes I am truly blown away by the blatant arrogance on SDN. You all plan on being selfless physicians but you can't seem to pull your head out of your rear-end. Comparing relative difficulties in undergraduate schedules .. Congratulations, you guys are really cool.

Seems like a solidly difficult schedule to me to be honest (assuming you have other courses), especially because those labs will take a lot of your time.


"Come on, man"
Click to expand...

chill out, i never said that

EDIT: I guess you're at VTC? see you in the fall :)
 
kpcrew2oo2 said:
The lack of sympathy probably arose due to the way he worded his post. He comes in with a complaint (which he chose of his own free will) and claims he has a heavy load (it could be easier but it can also be a lot worse) and makes a lame comparison, blaming his lack of success on other people, who apparently decided to take "cup cake majors" that allows them to have "twice as much time to study".
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Very true. After rereading the original post, it could have certainly been worded better. I can sympathize with the OP in that taking 3 sciences is tough. Diminishing the major of others though is very uncool. I suppose the OP deserves a certain amount of "flame." So now that the post has been sufficiently defended... Flame on. :p
 
flatearth22 said:
When you take p-chem + lab, analytical chem, partial differential equations, and chemical biology all in one semester then get back to me.
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Flatearth, taking a course load like that would be idiotic. That can only hurt you, not help.

OP, that is a heavy course load, not that is really matters. As long as your full time, Adcoms couldn't care less how "heavy" your courseload was. Do well in the rest of your classes and you'll be fine.
 
To make this thread fair and balanced I'll disclose that I'm taking organic and nothing but organic this quarter. Five credits and that's it. I'm not a bit worried.
 
dmf2682 said:
To make this thread fair and balanced I'll disclose that I'm taking organic and nothing but organic this quarter. Five credits and that's it. I'm not a bit worried.
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Very nice luxury to be able to focus on just that class. Nice! I'm jealous.
 
How are you guys even saying not to take the classes for the MCAT? If you have a good foundation in these classes before you begin your MCAT prep you'll do much better than depending on the prep books alone.
 
ShoTyme said:
Whatever... don't listen to people who say that isn't a tough course-load. Of course it is. People here are masochistic and neurotic. Just do better next semester. Good luck.
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That's not even close to a tough courseload.
 
Kalamazoo said:
How are you guys even saying not to take the classes for the MCAT? If you have a good foundation in these classes before you begin your MCAT prep you'll do much better than depending on the prep books alone.
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Knowing the material is the easy part. The classes definitely do not give you an edge. You can learn all the material that the MCAT requires in 2 months regardless of previous knowledge.
 
Perhaps I could have worded my post better but are you all telling me you've never had that kid that takes one science class and you know he studied for like 100 hours for it and after the test he condescendingly asks you how you did? You're like "I did ok but I had 2 other exams on the same day, how did you do?" and he says "98%, should have been 100% but I made a bubble error", and didn't make you want to beat a puppy with a baby seal carcass?

Also, I suppose I should have realized who my audience is in that these forums are self selecting in a way that most of the people on here are probably at the top of their class and obviously not representative of the pre-med population as a whole. That said, not very many people get into medical school so better to get a dose of reality before it's too late.
 
protip: the symbols you choose for your grawlixes matter. If you begin a four letter cipher with "$" people are going to think you're talking about poop.
 
Course-associated labs are time sinks. OP has three of them. That's what makes that schedule hard. I had plenty of science-heavy courseloads in undergrad, but I never took three labs at once.

Also, as another poster said, you study for the MCAT by studying for the MCAT, not by taking organic chem II (psst, barely any orgo on the MCAT nowadays!).
 
If it makes you feel any better, I am taking Microbiology with lab, Organic Chem I, Physics I with lab, Statistics with Matlab, and a general Psychology course. Also, I work about 10 hours a week at a retail store and I tutor about 6 hours/week in my school. Then, I have some positions in certain clubs.

Now, I am not bragging but merely giving you an example that IT IS POSSIBLE IF YOU COMMIT to it!

Stay strong and believe in yourself.
Good luck!
 
OP is worried about a getting a 3.5 semester when many sdn members are worried that they won't make a 3.5 gpa when they graduate.
You just made a lot of enemies. :D
 
notbobtrustme said:
It really isn't. It's like doing the minimum as a pre-med if anything.
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Ideally this should be split up into more manageable pieces. By your rationale, doing physics 2, Stats, bio 2, orgo 2, english, humanities, history, philosophy, tutoring, shadowing, research, volunteering, should all be done in one semester. That's asinine. Everyone has difficult semesters. The OP is merely venting about a difficult spot. We're all been there. A modicum of compassion I'm sure would be appreciated.At this point I think you are arguing for argument's sake so this will be my last post on the subject.
 
Don't worry. Bio 2 is a joke. I learn nothing in lecture. I learn everything on the review session and get 95%+ on the tests. If your teachers are not jerks about lab, you'll have it even easier.
 
ShoTyme said:
Ideally this should be split up into more manageable pieces. By your rationale, doing physics 2, Stats, bio 2, orgo 2, english, humanities, history, philosophy, tutoring, shadowing, research, volunteering, should all be done in one semester. That's asinine. Everyone has difficult semesters. The OP is merely venting about a difficult spot. We're all been there. A modicum of compassion I'm sure would be appreciated.At this point I think you are arguing for argument's sake so this will be my last post on the subject.
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This is a tough courseload:

BIOL 251 Cell Biology
BIOL 282 Genetics
CHEM 223 Organic Chem A Lec/Disc
CHEM 225 Organic Chemistry Lab A
CLST 271 Classical Mythology
MUSC 284 Applied Music: Piano
PHYS 111 College Physics I Lec/Dis
PHYS 131 College Physics Lab I
PSYC 306 Research Methods in Psyc

This is what I took my fall semester in my JR year in school, which worked out to be 21 credit hours. I also did ~20 hours of research a week.

The OP's courseload is a typical pre-med courseload.
 
notbobtrustme said:
This is a tough courseload:

BIOL 251 Cell Biology
BIOL 282 Genetics
CHEM 223 Organic Chem A Lec/Disc
CHEM 225 Organic Chemistry Lab A
CLST 271 Classical Mythology
MUSC 284 Applied Music: Piano
PHYS 111 College Physics I Lec/Dis
PHYS 131 College Physics Lab I
PSYC 306 Research Methods in Psyc

This is what I took my fall semester in my JR year in school, which worked out to be 21 credit hours. I also did ~20 hours of research a week.

The OP's courseload is a typical pre-med courseload.
Click to expand...


In before somebody else comes along and says "that's not a tough course load, last year I took 28 credit hours of science and math, volunteered 40+ hours a week, worked full time on top of 20+ hours a week of research. 20 credit hours is typical pre-med schedule." I see where this is going.
 
You are taking three courses. That's the second semester of freshman year of school....except you have to take two more courses to have a normal load (usually gen chem and a electice)
 
notbobtrustme said:
This is a tough courseload:

BIOL 251 Cell Biology
BIOL 282 Genetics
CHEM 223 Organic Chem A Lec/Disc
CHEM 225 Organic Chemistry Lab A
CLST 271 Classical Mythology
MUSC 284 Applied Music: Piano
PHYS 111 College Physics I Lec/Dis
PHYS 131 College Physics Lab I
PSYC 306 Research Methods in Psyc

This is what I took my fall semester in my JR year in school, which worked out to be 21 credit hours. I also did ~20 hours of research a week.

The OP's courseload is a typical pre-med courseload.
Click to expand...
what the f*ck, :eek:
 
Unfortunately, I don't think med schools are really going to care. They just won't look closely enough at your transcript or think about how much work you were actually doing. All they'll really see is the GPA. That said, you could find a way to subtely mention it in your application or interview, or somewhere.
 
I don't know why everyone is saying you shouldn't do this to prepare for the MCAT. I took my MCAT a year early just because I scored well on practice tests I took right after a science-overload year. Maybe it doesn't work like this for everyone, and maybe it depends on the curricula at your school, but I think it's a perfectly valid strategy to try to cram certain sciences instead of studying from prep books. Physics is probably the highest yielding class on that list, but I would suggest reviewing general chemistry during the semester and you should be good to go.

Oh, and ignore all the people saying that isn't a difficult semester. Each class at each school is different, and maybe those classes just didn't take much time for those people. I know my course work took only slightly more time taking 19 credits in the Spring (4 lab sciences + research seminar) compared to the 13 credit Fall semester because one of the classes in the Fall had such long, involved lab reports.
 
notbobtrustme said:
This is a tough courseload:

BIOL 251 Cell Biology
BIOL 282 Genetics
CHEM 223 Organic Chem A Lec/Disc
CHEM 225 Organic Chemistry Lab A
CLST 271 Classical Mythology
MUSC 284 Applied Music: Piano
PHYS 111 College Physics I Lec/Dis
PHYS 131 College Physics Lab I
PSYC 306 Research Methods in Psyc

This is what I took my fall semester in my JR year in school, which worked out to be 21 credit hours. I also did ~20 hours of research a week.

The OP's courseload is a typical pre-med courseload.
Click to expand...

Ironic, because your courseload that you posted is a typical pre-med courseload...
 
notbobtrustme said:
This is a tough courseload:

BIOL 251 Cell Biology
BIOL 282 Genetics
CHEM 223 Organic Chem A Lec/Disc
CHEM 225 Organic Chemistry Lab A
CLST 271 Classical Mythology
MUSC 284 Applied Music: Piano
PHYS 111 College Physics I Lec/Dis
PHYS 131 College Physics Lab I
PSYC 306 Research Methods in Psyc

This is what I took my fall semester in my JR year in school, which worked out to be 21 credit hours. I also did ~20 hours of research a week.

The OP's courseload is a typical pre-med courseload.
Click to expand...

I remember these days...

First semester - Organic I, Organic I lab, Biochem, P-chem, Physiology I, microbio lab

Second Semester - Organic II, Organic II lab, Physiology II, cell bio, genetics...


WORST YEAR EVER....
 
PennMedMan said:
Unfortunately, I don't think med schools are really going to care. They just won't look closely enough at your transcript or think about how much work you were actually doing. All they'll really see is the GPA. That said, you could find a way to subtely mention it in your application or interview, or somewhere.
Click to expand...

yea, but as an undergrad I wasn't really into the whole med school mentality otherwise I would have gamed the system like an *******. I actually wanted to learn :p
 
Personally I think there is no reason to be bragging so much about insane courseloads. Not enough credit is being given to students who can properly balance their semesters equally so that one really difficult semester doesn't kill their GPA. Every student choses their own courses and their own major. If you chose a major that has too many difficult courses, you're not planning well for your application. If you save three premed courses for one semester when its pretty easy to only take one or two reqs a semester, you're not planning very well either.

Fact is, people with "cupcake" majors and a high science GPA get into Medical School, people with notoriously over the top, difficult, science majors and a low GPA don't.
 
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