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do american citizens have an advantage over greencard holders?

Discussion in 'Pre-Medical - MD' started by asdasd12345, Apr 18, 2004.

  1. asdasd12345

    asdasd12345 Membership Revoked
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    on a different forum someone told me that having a greencard is a disadvantage because they prefer applicants to be US citizens. does anyone know if theres any truth to this?
     
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  3. Jumpu

    Jumpu Tiger Mom/Physiatrist
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    When I was applying as a greencard holder, I called all the schools I was applying to and asked the very same question. It turns out greencard holders and US citizens are treated exactly the same. Since matriculating, I have not had to fill out any different or extra forms.

    Hope that helps.
     
  4. 34140

    34140 Senior Member
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    Since your a green card holder, I was wondering where did you get into?

    OH CONGRATS on getting in!
     
  5. Ms.Doctor

    Ms.Doctor Senior Member
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    Students with green cards are given the same weight as US citizens. However, if applicants don't have one or are "in the process" of getting their green card, it's a different story... Apparently, it's really hard to match in that case...
     
  6. Jumpu

    Jumpu Tiger Mom/Physiatrist
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    It's in my signature. :)
     
  7. derf

    derf Ohio Land
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    MSAR talks about this in the initial chapters as does Barron's guide. MSAR said that for a given year (I believe 2002) only 174 foreign nationals and green card holders recieved acceptances. Hence, they group PR's with FNs together...go figure.

    I also confirmed this with AMCAS. So even though I was a PR earlier, I decided to wait until my citizenship was granted before I would apply. Good luck!
     
  8. asdasd12345

    asdasd12345 Membership Revoked
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    i have no desire to become an american citizen. i believe if you wanna be an american you have to stop being a citizen of whereever you are from.
     
  9. CalBeE

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    Green card holders are not being discriminated against in the process, but international students are. This is what I gathered from various sources.

    ~170 Int'l students + Green Card Holders?? That sound pretty low to me. I'm under the impression that there are more green card holders that got in.

    I'm an int'l student and the school that I'm going next year is same as where I went for undergrad. I think connection matters much more when an int'l student applies to med school...
     
  10. Fish3715

    Fish3715 Senior Member
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    Can you get dual citizenship?
     
  11. asdasd12345

    asdasd12345 Membership Revoked
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    i dont think america allows dual citizenship unless you are born from american parents in a foreign country. for example i have a friend whose parents were in the US army and he was born in belgium, so hes a US citizen and a belgium citizen
     
  12. ndi_amaka

    ndi_amaka Senior Member
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    That's not entirely true. I'm a dual citizen of nigeria and the US.
     
  13. asdasd12345

    asdasd12345 Membership Revoked
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    how did you get to do that?
     
  14. 10minutes

    10minutes M.D.Candidate
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    No difference. I'm a green card holder.
     
  15. 34140

    34140 Senior Member
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    You apply for dual citizenship
     
  16. lotanna

    lotanna Child of God
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    not true, if ur born in US to parents who are natives of another country, u can have both. If you are born elsewhere, move to US and naturalize, u dont have to give up previous citizenship/s. I mean I've friends who have triple citizenships and its completely legal (from parent, by birth, and by naturalization).

    @derf, thats not accurate.
     
  17. asdasd12345

    asdasd12345 Membership Revoked
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    no your wrong - it really is true, i do have a friend from whose parents were in the US army, and he was born in belgium, and now hes got dual citizenship.
     
  18. TIMMY

    TIMMY I search after truth....
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    I am also an int'l student from Nigeria and I totally agree with you on the having connections as an international student...I worked as a summer research student for 2 summers at a school that I hope to get into for the MD/Phd program. This connection was huge especially while I interviewd up there and my interviewer kept saying he'd seen me around the reserarch building quite a bit.
    I spoke to a Dean of Admissions and he said the major concern with foreign students is thier ability to cover the financial expense...getting loans. As a green card holder you are as eligible as U.S citizens for any loans available so there should not be any concern with discrimination from my point of view. Good luck!!!
     
  19. Pinkertinkle

    Pinkertinkle 2003 Member
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    Does the MSAR say that permanent residents have a lower acceptance rate than citizens, or was it just listing the number that got in?
     
  20. lotanna

    lotanna Child of God
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    makes sense, it all has to do with both countries dual citizenship laws. Some countries like India i believe dont let their citizens have dual citizenship, Germany was like that, dont know if they changd it yet
    I dont quite get what you are saying though. :confused: You say "i dont think america allows dual citizenship unless you are born from american parents in a foreign country."

    Like stated previously, that statement isnt true!!
    For more of US dual citizenship laws, pls check it out here, and its a govt website
    http://travel.state.gov/dualnationality.html
     
  21. asdasd12345

    asdasd12345 Membership Revoked
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    i wouldnt worry about what i was saying, because it turns out im wrong. you can be a US citizen and a british citizen at the same time, without having been born from a US citizen in Great Britain.
     
  22. lotanna

    lotanna Child of God
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    Aaagh finally u've seen the light! :laugh:
     
  23. mackaikai

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    I am a PR (no citizenship yet) and I interviewed at several med schools. None of them brought the issue of citizenship up during interviews and I don't think it's that big a deal :)

    as long u have Green Card, you are fine.

    (but if you don't have a green card yet, it's totally ANOTHER story....it's very hardddd)
     
  24. supereagles

    supereagles Spread your wings and fly
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    I would not have guessed from the name. Just kidding. What's up my Nigerian sister.
     
  25. Spitting Camel

    Spitting Camel Anteater for Life!
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    Wow... Nigeria is representing on SDN! I'm just waiting for the "Any Nigerian pre-meds?" thread! Congrats on all of the acceptances, green cards, permanent residencies, interviews, etc... :laugh:

    nope, I'm not Nigerian ;)
     
  26. bruinrab

    bruinrab Senior Member
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    Hah, yes you can have dual US/UK citizenship, and I have the passports to prove it.
     
  27. celticmists18

    celticmists18 california dreaming
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    I'm guessing since you don't want to become an American citizen (and from the way you wrote it I sense a bit of disdain for us) you are planning to leave the U.S. after med school. Why pay an insane amount for an education you could get much cheaper outside of the U.S.?
     
  28. chintu

    chintu Senior Member
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    I agree with others that it doesn't matter as long as you are a permanent resident of US. However, I should mention that at some of my interviews I was asked whether I had become a naturalized citizen. I think the point here is that med schools want their graduates to stay and eventually practice medicine in this country, which is why i think the international applicants have a much harder time.
     
  29. lotanna

    lotanna Child of God
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    yup usually BushBaby holds it down 4 the rest of us, but yeah we're deep :laugh:
     
  30. Bintu

    Bintu Junior Member

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    There is a difference. Some scholarships are for citizens only. Also, all schools want proof of my greencard. Some of my interviewers asked me how I got the card (work got it for me). Also, some scholarships don't consider greencard holders african-americans and others do. I just figure I am in, so it doesn't matter.

    If I didn't love Nigeria and mind upsetting my relatives, I would probably get the citizenship.
     
  31. JohnHolmes

    JohnHolmes Large Member
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    At public schools, residency requirements differ by states and they may discriminate against permenant residents. I don't know, but if you meet the requirements for residency (differs by state, and may require US citizenship in some states) you should be ok.

    JH
     
  32. CalBeE

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    Even if you guys are not planning to be citizens, at least try to get your green card. When residency app comes, it'll again make things easier. Competitive specialties are reluctant in admitting international students, even if they graduated from US Med schools...
     
  33. 34140

    34140 Senior Member
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    Oh I guess I could have used me as an example. I also have dual citizanship. When I became naturalized, they asked me if I wanted to give up my Pakistanni citizenship. So now I have two passports, one from US of A and one from Pakistan. Its great.
     
  34. ZephyrX

    ZephyrX Member
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    Although i applied to medical school a few years back and i have somewhat forgotten about it, i too was a PR at the time (still am). It didn't held me down one bit during the process. The only thing that i got confused about was if i was eligable to apply to UMass but i thought to myself that i should save the headache and not apply there at all.

    I was accepted to HMS, WashU, UPenn, Columbia, Yale, Tufts and Jefferson. I had a few waitlists and a couple of rejections but that is to be expected for every applicant. I am forgetting a few schools but you get the idea.

    I am about to become a dual citizen also. But one doesn't have to. I have a good friend who also holds a green card and he has no interest on becoming a US citizen although he is staying here after he finishes his MD.

    Actually what you say is wrong. The competitive hospitals/residencies are usually the ones that want to attract the "best" people. American or not. PR or not. I know at least of 5 people who matched into competitive residencies without having PR status. It's the "middle tier" (wrong term but i don't know how else to express it) that may present some problems. But no, international students can do exceptionally well during the match process.
     
  35. CalBeE

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    NO offense, but what I was saying was just similar to the whole International student applying to med school argument. In the case of med school, most of the schools that consider int'l students are the more competitive ones. Int'l students who ended up getting in are the very bright one as well. But if you look at the ratio of applicant to matriculant, it's extremely low compared to that citizens and PR. (The data on AAMC website: ~500-600 applied, 80+ matriculate)

    That is, if you're a top applicant, it probably would have made little difference...but for majority of the applicants to competitive specialties, not having a green card or US passport will be a disadvantage.
     
  36. asdasd12345

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    wrong on all counts. if i went back to england to study medicine i would be classified as an international student regardless of the fact that i am british because you have to live there 3 years before starting classes to get resident rates. i dont plan on leaving the US after medical school, maybe much later on in life perhaps, and i dont have any disdain for americans. the reason i said i didnt want to become a US citizen is because i incorrectly believed i would have to give up being a british citizen, which i dont want to do. now i know what i know, i will obviously pursue dual citizenship. simple explanation really.
     
  37. ZephyrX

    ZephyrX Member
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    Your numbers are solid proof of my point. Where do those 80-100 international matriculants attend each year? Usually it's 2-3 at Harvard, 2-3 at Hopkins, 2-3 at WashU, 4-5 at Columbia, 2-3 Duke, 2-3 Yale, etc. People who have already done great and were able to gain admissions to prestigious medical schools. Outside of the elite schools, the number of schools that accept international students is really small (a couple of SUNYs, Jefferson, etc).

    The above people were brilliant enough to gain admission to great schools. Usually they remain just as motivated through medical school as well.

    You can't say the majority of international medical school students trying to match because the majority of intl medical students are coming from strong backrounds.

    You will rarely find "average" intl med school students. Those 10 or 20 out of 80 anually, usually go after the not-so competitive residencies but at really good hospitals, which usually have a strong history of awarding H1s/J1s and have good experience with foreigners.
     
  38. prettyslick

    prettyslick Member
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    Do you guys think that Adcoms will look more favorably upon students with H-4 rather than, lets say, F visa type students since they know H-4 is more likely to stay here after graduation than F-1 or something?
     

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