DO and Internal Medicine match

[SilverCat]

Would it be possible for a DO to match into IM programs such as Northwestern or Chicago, or, since I see no DO residents listed in their roster, are those residencies essentially impossible for DOs to match into?

I saw some DOs from CCOM going into the Northshore U Chicago campus IM program. How would this be different from the main campus IM program?

If these questions are ignorant, forgive me, for I am a pre- med.

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[DocVapor]

I'm not sure your question is ignorant (mainly because I asked the same sort of question not long ago), but it's a little early to be asking these questions. That's primarily because lots of things can change in the coming years. Here's a short list that I was enlightened about, but there are more:

1. Your specialty of choice
2. Your location of choice
3. The philosophy of the institutions, but more importantly
4. The Program Director and his/her philosophy towards DO's.

It's possible that someone could get in before you, and impress them so much they begin letting in more, or it's possible that you could be the first to break through. Either way it's more important to focus on what's right in front of you right now, and then after that, Step 1 boards.

 

[dozitgetchahi]

NW and UChicago main campus programs are going to be tough (read: basically impossible) for DOs to match for IM. I'm just being honest here - I had solid stats and didn't receive interviews from either, and I know of DOs with even better stats who were also snubbed.

UC Northshore is a community affiliate of UC that I interviewed at...it's perhaps one of the best community programs in the country, but it's not nearly as competitive or 'prestigious' as either of the above mentioned programs.

Agree with the fact that your main focus now should be crushing step 1. This will go a long way.

 

[S3S4]

NW and UChicago main campus programs are going to be tough (read: basically impossible) for DOs to match for IM. I'm just being honest here - I had solid stats and didn't receive interviews from either, and I know of DOs with even better stats who were also snubbed.

UC Northshore is a community affiliate of UC that I interviewed at...it's perhaps one of the best community programs in the country, but it's not nearly as competitive or 'prestigious' as either of the above mentioned programs.

Agree with the fact that your main focus now should be crushing step 1. This will go a long way.

I got a quick rejection from Uchicago and never heard back from NW. I can't see them matching (maybe even interviewing) DOs unless the PDs change or a family connection brings one in. Tradition vs ignorance...or both

 

[SilverCat]

Agree with the fact that your main focus now should be crushing step 1. This will go a long way.

Just have to ask--what is considered 'crushing' step 1, to be eligible for an ACGME IM residency?

 

[dozitgetchahi]

Well, this gets complicated.

Taking USMLE step 1 and scoring below average/around the average (~200-220) would most likely get you ACGME IM interviews. These might be mostly lower tier academic or community programs.

Scoring >230 (and I'm just making a somewhat educated guess here, given my own experience) would probably open more doors and get you more middle/upper-middle tier programs.

 

[Instatewaiter]

Well, this gets complicated.

Taking USMLE step 1 and scoring below average/around the average (~200-220) would most likely get you ACGME IM interviews. These might be mostly lower tier academic or community programs.

Scoring >230 (and I'm just making a somewhat educated guess here, given my own experience) would probably open more doors and get you more middle/upper-middle tier programs.

Most university IM programs have average board score (roughly 220). As you move toward midtier you are going into the 220-230 range. The top tier programs tend to have scores north of 240.

 

[SilverCat]

I suppose that, as a DO, you would have to score above a 260 to a have a shot at U Chicago main campus IM. Doggone, I was hoping that as a CCOM student, I could do a rotation there and do well on the boards to have a chance at IM. But I guess expecting a 260 on boards is like expecting a 40 on the MCAT?

 

[cliquesh]

I suppose that, as a DO, you would have to score above a 260 to a have a shot at U Chicago main campus IM. Doggone, I was hoping that as a CCOM student, I could do a rotation there and do well on the boards to have a chance at IM. But I guess expecting a 260 on boards is like expecting a 40 on the MCAT?

They'd probably still just reject you. Some places just don't interview DOs. The usmle is different than the mcat. Pretty much anyone can get a high score (240+) if they're willing to put in the time. A 260 is pretty ridiculous, though.

 

[dozitgetchahi]

I suppose that, as a DO, you would have to score above a 260 to a have a shot at U Chicago main campus IM. Doggone, I was hoping that as a CCOM student, I could do a rotation there and do well on the boards to have a chance at IM. But I guess expecting a 260 on boards is like expecting a 40 on the MCAT?

Again, UChicago is unlikely to take any DOs at this point (although if you look through past rosters, it seems like they still did take some DOs for IM as late as the mid-2000s iirc). DO bias does exist, and at many institutions you cannot overcome it with high performance.

Stratospheric scores as a DO do give you a shot at some of the upper-middle tier programs that either do not take many DOs or will only occasionally take an exceptional DO. Some examples of this include (and some of this was hearsay, so it could be wrong): OHSU, Mayo, Emory, UVa, Rochester, Dartmouth, UAB, Wisconsin, Hopkins Bayview, etc. I got shut down at all of these, but I do know DOs that have gotten interviews at many of these institutions. (Whether or not they'll actually be able to match is another story altogether.)