DO for Canadians: 2011-2012

[drgioiadds]

Because we didn't get into a Canadian med school and DO is a better route than the Caribbean? I am puzzled as to why you think it is unacceptable to voice doubts/concerns. No one is saying that the DO route will not lead to a residency.

From reading the past few posts, it seems that there are more than a few doubts, which is ok---but then why would you go ahead and apply, get accepted and start school with so many doubts? Its not as if school in the US is cheap.
It should be comforting to know that 1. there are DO's in Canada at present, 2. There are Canadian DO graduates in residencies at present 3. MSU has started a program to increase DO's in Canada. 4. Canadian DO students are increasing 5.COMSA is being set up to increase DO awareness.

As mash stated, you can't go into this with a closed mind. It may be a better option to try and make yourself more competitive for Canadian schools if you are dead set on surgery and returning to Canada. However, if you are open to other programs then DO route is a good option.

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[CdnDO]

Any Canadian students attending AZCOM this coming year?

 

[Optoed]

Like any major decisions, choosing USDO was never as obvious as black and white. It's about risk assessment and whether you think the time, money and efforts will be a worthy trade off. Even though we do have our doubts, but we applied considering the risk is tolerable. In my case, the worse case scenerio of getting a J1 is still an acceptable option, coming back to work in Canada or in underserved US.

I whole-heartedly commend the efforts of everyone who contributes to this forum. Their enthusiasm and motivation is very very admirable. However, I don't think think we should prevent/shun people from voicing their questions and doubts. We're on this forum to help each other, not to oppress people who diagree with you. Afterall, the right question and concerns help you see the blindspots in your own analysis of the situation.

I only pointed out the GME funding issue a while back, because we - the class of 2016, will be one of the first people to be affected by these policies, if they are instituted. The topic was the one of the most discussed topics in the Medical student and Residents forums, as well as one that was repeatedly raised by the New England Journal of Medicine and other media. As someone who is about to make a 200-300K investment and 4 years of your life, wouldn't you want to know every bit of information that you can get your hands on? Even if you won't go through the process until 4 years later and the policies may change.
Doesn't it make sense to be prudent than to be sorry? I don't understand why I'm being put down for sharing pertinent and potentially critical information to the group.

A few months ago, no one in this thread really gave much thought about the H1B visa process. Would you want to be the person looking into visa issues when you're in M4 or before you've committed to this path, so you can assess your options without biase?

Now that COMSA has de-mystified the application/Visa process and created a platform for future discussion, I think we're better equipped than ever for our journeys.

P.S. the Pathology match (from NSU) had personal connections to the residency, it's up to you to think whether or not that played favourably for him/her. (source: a fellow Canadian DO in that person's class)

Because we didn't get into a Canadian med school and DO is a better route than the Caribbean? I am puzzled as to why you think it is unacceptable to voice doubts/concerns. No one is saying that the DO route will not lead to a residency.

 

[FrkyBgStok]

I have nothing to add, but I am interested in how physician pay on a "single payer system" compares to American salaries, and who better to ask? And am interested on how Canadian physicians and premeds feel about the national medicine in Canada. I havent read any posts as I don't want to read all at this point. Looking for input either here or PM. It doesn't really pertain to the thread and I don't want to hijack, but I am really curious. Thanks guys. I started a thread in the international forum, but I doubt it will her looked at. PM is fine to keep the thread on topic.

 

[mashmetoo]

The western U upper year I talked about just matched in Canada. Residency/province unknown as the person got kicked out of the NRMP - which could only mean a Canadian acceptance =)

The person makes it sound almost like it was easy. Did I mention that the person turned away a prematch offer with H1B sponsorship because the person wanted Canada??

How's that for a success story?

 

[CXCR4]

Nice work! Did they say what residency they applied to, FM or something more competetive?

The western U upper year I talked about just matched in Canada. Residency/province unknown as the person got kicked out of the NRMP - which could only mean a Canadian acceptance =)

The person makes it sound almost like it was easy. Did I mention that the person turned away a prematch offer with H1B sponsorship because the person wanted Canada??

How's that for a success story?

 

[drgioiadds]

The western U upper year I talked about just matched in Canada. Residency/province unknown as the person got kicked out of the NRMP - which could only mean a Canadian acceptance =)

The person makes it sound almost like it was easy. Did I mention that the person turned away a prematch offer with H1B sponsorship because the person wanted Canada??

How's that for a success story?

NICE! For some reason I am not worried at all. I'm just going to focus on doing well. I'm pretty much set on FM anyway.

 

[docnotsopc]

Nice work! Did they say what residency they applied to, FM or something more competetive?

I believe he was interested in IM....... or at least those were the rotations he was doing back in Canada.... I will see if i can get some more info from that person

 

[mashmetoo]

He wanted IM like darkseid wanted the anti-life equation , also FM for backups

 

[osteooneill]

I have been reading through the 20 page post, and I am really new to the realm of DO information in the US, so please bare with me.
I have some very preliminary questions, as I am trying to get myself orientated for hopefully applying for a 2013 application.
First, and very basic, (and I know I am going to get a lot of responses saying use the search function), but I have my grades from UWO, and of course they are in percent, I am wondering how to convert my UWO percent to a GPA that can be used in the application.
I have seen a lot about using the AADSAS website, but its not entirely clear to me.
Help please?

 

[drgioiadds]

Your best bet is to get them evaluated by WES. That is what I did. My undergrad is also from UWO. If you are living in London and want to meet up to discuss your application, I'd be more than happy to help.

 

[newno55]

Just thought I would chime in with my experience also applying from UWO
I contacted both AACOMAS and AMCAS and those application verification services seem to be for international applications... and Canadians aren't considered international (I called a few schools like MSUCOM to make double sure as well). I had no problems applying/ interviewing/ being accepted to any MD or DO schools, converting % grades to letter grades myself, and sending my official transcripts into the application service. NO WES needed! I'm sure it wouldn't hurt if you did it, but in my own experience (n=1 haha) I did not have to do that.

 

[drgioiadds]

Just thought I would chime in with my experience also applying from UWO
I contacted both AACOMAS and AMCAS and those application verification services seem to be for international applications... and Canadians aren't considered international (I called a few schools like MSUCOM to make double sure as well). I had no problems applying/ interviewing/ being accepted to any MD or DO schools, converting % grades to letter grades myself, and sending my official transcripts into the application service. NO WES needed! I'm sure it wouldn't hurt if you did it, but in my own experience (n=1 haha) I did not have to do that.

That's good to know--I was given a different answer when I emailed AACOMAS last cycle. All WES did was give me a 4.0 for any A+/A and 3.0 for any B. 6.0 credit hours for a full year course and 3.0 credit hours for a half year course.

 

[newno55]

That's good to know--I was given a different answer when I emailed AACOMAS last cycle. All WES did was give me a 4.0 for any A+/A and 3.0 for any B. 6.0 credit hours for a full year course and 3.0 credit hours for a half year course.

haha, what a bunch of jerks! Well it all worked out in the end anyways I guess

 

[medcandidate]

anyone else having problems securing the funds??

rbc's giving me 150k. but td declined. i'm just worried that my credit isn't perfect anywayz, and the more we apply for loans the more it gets hit. just wondering which bank i should approach next..

this loan process is even more nerve-wracking than the actual med application.. & i kinda don't feel good putting the house on collateral, which is the only way i can get more from rbc.

...

 

[Kliffmeister]

anyone else having problems securing the funds??

rbc's giving me 150k. but td declined. i'm just worried that my credit isn't perfect anywayz, and the more we apply for loans the more it gets hit. just wondering which bank i should approach next..

this loan process is even more nerve-wracking than the actual med application.. & i kinda don't feel good putting the house on collateral, which is the only way i can get more from rbc.

...

You secured 150K with or without a cosigner? I was hoping to get 150k from RBC and apply for OSAP (up to 80k). With the money I saved up till now, hopefully it will be enough lol

 

[medcandidate]

You secured 150K with or without a cosigner? I was hoping to get 150k from RBC and apply for OSAP (up to 80k). With the money I saved up till now, hopefully it will be enough lol

rbc's 150 with 2 cosigners... osap's giving 80k?? i thought it was 10k max ~40k over the four years... ?? in my case, i don't have any savings..
need to start playing lotto everyday i guess

 

[drgioiadds]

I ended up going with rbc's 150k + home as collateral. I am also looking into the RSP Lifelong learning program which is the same as the first time home buyer program. I should be good for almost 2 years before I have to use the LOC if I do it this way. Lots to consider.

I agree securing funding was not that easy. These LOC are made for students in Canada. RBC gives more money without a cosigner to a student staying in Canada. Funny thing is I had both the TD and RBC rep tell me I might not need a cosigner--but this simply is not true.

 

[drgioiadds]

You secured 150K with or without a cosigner? I was hoping to get 150k from RBC and apply for OSAP (up to 80k). With the money I saved up till now, hopefully it will be enough lol

Are you still considering going DO? Its too bad that AZCOM's I 20 process is pretty ridiculous.

 

[Kliffmeister]

Are you still considering going DO? Its too bad that AZCOM's I 20 process is pretty ridiculous.

If i can go, then I will go. I don't want to wait around several yrs just to see if i can get into CDN school. I love AZCOM, but hate their I-20 requirement.
In regards to OSAP, you can get 20K/yr, but it's all a gamble. I heard 2 ppl from AZCOM getting 20K and 14K so it is not a secured loan. OSAP includes both provincial and federal funding.

 

[medcandidate]

I ended up going with rbc's 150k + home as collateral. I am also looking into the RSP Lifelong learning program which is the same as the first time home buyer program. I should be good for almost 2 years before I have to use the LOC if I do it this way. Lots to consider.

I agree securing funding was not that easy. These LOC are made for students in Canada. RBC gives more money without a cosigner to a student staying in Canada. Funny thing is I had both the TD and RBC rep tell me I might not need a cosigner--but this simply is not true.

u know it is so frustrating to go to these reps, who are supposed to be loan "specialists", and have them tell you that you may not need a cosigner at all, and then later on call you and tell you to bring in your cosigners (again!)... that's happened to me twice. i took my parents with me to see the rep, she told me i may not need a cosigner, and she's gonna put in just an application from me first. then called me to say it was declined, mainly because the school wasn't in canada.

it's a miracle getting into med school here (canada), and then they don't even support their students who want to go outside to get their education. we are students, how are we supposed to have an excellent credit history and a bundle of assets with which to apply for loans..

i might have to resort to putting our home u on collateral as well how much did you get with the collateral, btw?? even if i could manage to get around like 250k, and then 40 from OSAP..the rest my parents could handle, over the years.. :S

btw, this thing about applying to two banks at once, so that the loan you already have may not show up in your history.. can this have negative consequences? as in, my rbc isn't finalized yet, just got an approval, and am waiting to apply at another bank (s) before signing it..is it wise to delay the signing to shop around? :S

@kliff: but i thought the provincial part of OSAP wouldn't apply to us anymore since we're heading out. you know I read how OSAP varies with different provinces. sadly for ontario, we mostly get stuck with just the 10k.

 

[CdnDO]

Ontario students only get around $9240 per year from OSAP. Alberta students on the other hand get around $20,000 per year for their loans.

 

[drgioiadds]

u know it is so frustrating to go to these reps, who are supposed to be loan "specialists", and have them tell you that you may not need a cosigner at all, and then later on call you and tell you to bring in your cosigners (again!)... that's happened to me twice. i took my parents with me to see the rep, she told me i may not need a cosigner, and she's gonna put in just an application from me first. then called me to say it was declined, mainly because the school wasn't in canada.

it's a miracle getting into med school here (canada), and then they don't even support their students who want to go outside to get their education. we are students, how are we supposed to have an excellent credit history and a bundle of assets with which to apply for loans..

i might have to resort to putting our home u on collateral as well how much did you get with the collateral, btw?? even if i could manage to get around like 250k, and then 40 from OSAP..the rest my parents could handle, over the years.. :S

btw, this thing about applying to two banks at once, so that the loan you already have may not show up in your history.. can this have negative consequences? as in, my rbc isn't finalized yet, just got an approval, and am waiting to apply at another bank (s) before signing it..is it wise to delay the signing to shop around? :S

@kliff: but i thought the provincial part of OSAP wouldn't apply to us anymore since we're heading out. you know I read how OSAP varies with different provinces. sadly for ontario, we mostly get stuck with just the 10k.

Our credit history has nothing to do with the loan. Its the fact that the school is in the US. I make more money than my cosigners. As far as the home you can get around 80% of the appraised value. Yeah, its not easy. I'm lucky I have some savings to help me out and my cosigners had no credit problems. Every bank told me I wouldn't need a cosigner but then obviously I did!

 

[medcandidate]

extremely worried. it seems i'll have to put our home on collateral, because right now i just have an approval of 150 from rbc. cibc has this wierd requirement of having two family members as guarantors, and i just have one family member who is eligible to be a guarantor.

 

[mldiscovery]

So my interview at Western is tomorrow and I am trying my best to be excited for it despite all the stigma I am facing from my very own family members about the osteopathic med school and profession. I try not to blame them and educate them about the profession, but some people cannot be educated so quickly due to misconceptions. Take a look at what I found on the Gov of Canada website:

http://www.workingincanada.gc.ca/re...Keyword=Ottawa,+Ontario&source=2&action=final

Go to the job posting in Ottawa.

I really need some cheerleaders now as I head out for my Western interview. How does everyone deal with the misconceptions of the profession? What are good ways to educate other about it? Thanks!

 

[medcandidate]

So my interview at Western is tomorrow and I am trying my best to be excited for it despite all the stigma I am facing from my very own family members about the osteopathic med school and profession. I try not to blame them and educate them about the profession, but some people cannot be educated so quickly due to misconceptions. Take a look at what I found on the Gov of Canada website:

http://www.workingincanada.gc.ca/re...Keyword=Ottawa,+Ontario&source=2&action=final

Go to the job posting in Ottawa.

I really need some cheerleaders now as I head out for my Western interview. How does everyone deal with the misconceptions of the profession? What are good ways to educate other about it? Thanks!

aah.. the misconceptions.. they're not gonna go away that quickly.. even after showing them so many resources which talked about DO being equivalent to MD, my folks still bring up the "oh if only it was MD" topic from time to time, though they seem to have finally accepted that it is equivalent..

have you tried to give them some basic resources to read - like wikipedia page on osteopathic medicine..?? as well, try making them talk to some DO, if you could. maybe the one you shadowed..?? give them all the info you have, even the match lists of schools..don't worry, they'll eventually come around!

cheeer up though, u've got an interview coming up! i'm sure you're gonna do just fine! out of the whole application process, i think the interview phase was the most fun part! and hey it's at western, so enjoy the awesome california weather!
let us know how it went!
do you have any other interviews?

 

[mldiscovery]

cheeer up though, u've got an interview coming up! i'm sure you're gonna do just fine! out of the whole application process, i think the interview phase was the most fun part! and hey it's at western, so enjoy the awesome california weather!

have you tried to give them some basic resources to read - like wikipedia page on osteopathic medicine..?? as well, try making them talk to some DO, if you could. maybe the one you shadowed..?? give them all the info you have, even the match lists of schools..don't worry, they'll eventually come around!

let us know how it went!

do you have any other interviews?

Actually, it was raining cats and dogs the day of the interview. Cold & windy too. I couldn't find the interview building, parked really far away. Luckily, someone saved me from the rain & cold and gave me a lift from building to my car. Indeed, the interview at Western was the best part of the application process, mainly because I met some great people along the way. Thanks!

Yes, but someone in the field telling them in person is probably a more powerful and convincing way to show them the scope of practice of DO physicians. I wish there were more DO physicians in Canada. I have no doubt that I will convince my family eventually... just would have been nice to get their support before the interview. Anyway, some times, a little adversity is good for me.

Many great things to say about Western students, clinicians & science faculty. High quality, friendly, camaraderie, mature, breadth of experience.
Western was my last interview and it is one of my top choices.

 

[SkyRider]

Any Canadian classmates have got the I-20 form from MSUCOM yet? I've been waiting for 3 weeks now. Also anyone trying to activate your MSU NetID and having a problem ? Thanks.

 

[drgioiadds]

You have to have the I20 to activate your net id number.

 

[mathewm]

I spoke to the CIBC bank representative, and they said that Canadian students might be eligible for up to 215k line of credit (compared to the 150k at RBC) & their repayment policy isn't too bad either.

 

[limoncello]

The max at CIBC is actually 225K

 

[mathewm]

The max at CIBC is actually 225K

That's even better

 

[ziprasidone1]

Any recent acceptances lately?

 

[capuchin]

.

 

[medcandidate]

I'm not sure if this was asked previously, but with all the courses with labs, which are considered 3.0 credit here, do we write as 3.0 and "including labs" in the description? If so, does AACOMAS convert it to 4.0? Or, do we automatically convert it and write 4.0 in our application?

convert it yourself...all courses with labs go as 4 credits.

 

[newno55]

Any recent acceptances lately?

MSUCOM just yesterday (pulled off their "high" WL)

Will be deferring until next year probably.

 

[se20001984]

So my interview at Western is tomorrow and I am trying my best to be excited for it despite all the stigma I am facing from my very own family members about the osteopathic med school and profession. I try not to blame them and educate them about the profession, but some people cannot be educated so quickly due to misconceptions. Take a look at what I found on the Gov of Canada website:

http://www.workingincanada.gc.ca/re...Keyword=Ottawa,+Ontario&source=2&action=final

Go to the job posting in Ottawa.

I really need some cheerleaders now as I head out for my Western interview. How does everyone deal with the misconceptions of the profession? What are good ways to educate other about it? Thanks!

You should take your family to the interviews

Also I don't think gov job postings will be there for osteopaths.....if they did it would mean osteo isn't same as md

 

[RyRy89]

MSUCOM just yesterday (pulled off their "high" WL)

Will be deferring until next year probably.

I hope you don't mind me asking you what your stats were? I'm applying now for next year and i'd like to get a feel as to what kind of stats the typical Canadian applicant has.

I have a cGPA in the low 3.7s, an MCAT score of 26P and typical med school applicant volunteering stuff. I'm worried though because i've only shadowed an MD for like a few hours. It's super hard to find MD's around here to shadow anybody who isn't a med student.

 

[se20001984]

Mcat is pretty low
Gap looks good

Apply early n keep tight contact with admissions

 

[RyRy89]

Mcat is pretty low
Gap looks good

Apply early n keep tight contact with admissions

Yeah I have to redo the MCAT again this summer. I know the MCAT average is around a 27 though so my 26 miiiight be just enough.

 

[limoncello]

Some schools might give more weight to some sections over the others. For example when I interviewed at Touro-NY, they mentioned that they only look at your Bio score so as long as its 9 or above you're good even with a 26 MCAT.

 

[newno55]

Agree with the other poster. The GPA is good. The MCAT is reasonable. If you are able to bump that up, it would really pay off for you! Maybe even give you some more options

 

[RyRy89]

Agree with the other poster. The GPA is good. The MCAT is reasonable. If you are able to bump that up, it would really pay off for you! Maybe even give you some more options

Definitely Any ideas on how much/what kind of extracurriculars they look for? I know more is not always better, and that it's quality over quantity, but i'm pretty curious as to what kind of profile successful applicants have. I don't have a tonne of EC's and awards which is what makes me a bit nervous, although I am only applying to MSUCOM this year and on their website it says they're looking at accepting roughly 25 Canadians per year.

 

[se20001984]

The ec is jus bs lol lets be honest

It's all marks

This is comming from a guy with 4 1st authors

 

[drgioiadds]

The ec is jus bs lol lets be honest

It's all marks

This is comming from a guy with 4 1st authors

I would say this may be the case with some schools but MSU emphasizes EC's over MCAT. I don't know the exact breakdown, but I do know that they like to see good grades in upper year science courses and approx 800 hours of volunteer/EC. My MCAT was mediocre at best and I was told that it was fine.

 

[drgioiadds]

Some schools might give more weight to some sections over the others. For example when I interviewed at Touro-NY, they mentioned that they only look at your Bio score so as long as its 9 or above you're good even with a 26 MCAT.

This is true. Probably won't get an interview at CCOM, Nova (as a canadian) with a 26, but should be ok for western, Azcom, KCUMB, LMU dcom.

 

[newno55]

I would say this may be the case with some schools but MSU emphasizes EC's over MCAT. I don't know the exact breakdown, but I do know that they like to see good grades in upper year science courses and approx 800 hours of volunteer/EC. My MCAT was mediocre at best and I was told that it was fine.

I agree. Just look at MSU's application! It's so long. If it was just about the marks, the application would be 2 lines. No instead it's like 15 pages haha

I too have several publications and several years of research (plus a Msc) and I think it helped.

MSU does stress volunteer/EC, more than any school I've seen. I would start volunteering asap. It's never too late to start. I stayed with the same place for about 5 years!

 

[newno55]

Some schools might give more weight to some sections over the others. For example when I interviewed at Touro-NY, they mentioned that they only look at your Bio score so as long as its 9 or above you're good even with a 26 MCAT.

Got an 11 in bio, and I was placed on the wait list here. haha. Not sure what happened to me and Touro.

 

[se20001984]

Prob late apply

 

[GTP]

Hello all,

I know this is a bit off topic, but are there any people graduating soon who are starting to look into visas? Obviously h1b is more desirable. How easy are they to get at good hospitals? Or are they only offered at crappy places? Also, the j1 is undesirable because you have to leave after training and marriage doesn't exempt you. The only other option is a j1 waiver. Has anyone used this waiver? I've heard that the hospitals tend to abuse people on these visas.

Thanks