Medical Do I have a chance and how do schools look at uGPA vs Masters vs Postbacc?

[Mr.Smile12]

Hi everyone,

I want an honest opinion on if I have any chance at getting into medical school. I did horribly at my undergraduate univseristy and received a 3.0. In my freshman year I got 2 D's in the same biology course and C's in the first two chemistry courses. After taking those classes, I decided to change my major because I thought I had essenitally no chance at getting into medical school. Fast forward to now being 27, I just graduated with my MPH in epidemiology and biostatistics since my undergraduate career I have consistently been doing cancer research and working in the hospital that I did my Master's in. With that being said, after finishing my MPH I was sure I wanted to pursue a career in medicine. Since then, I have been retaking courses at a non-formal post bacc program at a local university. I have received A's (3.89 gpa) in every course (including the ones I got D's and C's in). My concern is that even with these courses, my cummulative gpa is well below a 3.6 which seems to be the average gpa to get into medical school. Do medical schools look solely at my science gpa at the university that I am in now? Or do they weigh it all as a whole including my undergrad gpa.

Thank you!

1) Could you specify which science courses you've taken in your postbac study post-MPH? What was your original bachelor's degree?

2) So why medicine instead of being part of a strong interprofessional and interdisciplinary team focused on public health? Public health is being pushed hard in medical education, especially in interprofessional teams. What do you see yourself being able to do better as a doctor as opposed to a public health official? Do you think you can really do that much more with a medical degree; how do you know?

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[Catalystik]

What is your combined undergrad GPA including your postbac coursework, but not the masters grades? What is your uBCPM (Bio, Chem, Physics, Math) GPA?
What is your grad GPA?
What is your overall GPA including all classes taken? What is your sGPA (not including math)?

MD schools primarily look at undergrad GPAs, and generally disregard masters work, even if it's in a hard science discipline. They will look at your entire undergrad GPA, but will give you credit for a steep upward grade trend

DO med schools also calculate a GPA including graduate coursework and are more lenient about stats and MCAT score. Note that their sGPA does not include math grades. They also give crdit for upward grade trends.

This AMCAS GPA calculator will help: AMCAS GPA Calculator (Revised)
BCPM GPA includes: https://aamc-orange.global.ssl.fast...ab328dc/amcas_course_classification_guide.pdf

View attachment 276465
Let us know what you come up with.

 

[Mr.Smile12]

1) Sure, so I've taken the Biology series, General Chemistry series, and Organic Chemistry series at UCLA extension. My original bachelor's degree was in Human Development.

2) Don't get me wrong I enjoyed public health however, I always knew that it was more of a stepping stone for me to further assess whether I wanted to do medical school. Being in the epidemiology track was very interesting but the aspects that gauged my interest the most were all related to disease and the clinical aspect of medicine. The reason I did my MPH was because I knew I didn't have a chance in pursuing medical school but as time progressed during my MPH I realized the more I really did want to pursue medicine. I agree with your input on interprofessional teams and the importance of public health specially nowadays. However, it is the human interaction and engagement as a doctor as well as working in a hospital which drives me to enter that field. I hope to use my public health knowledge to be a better doctor but I know having my MPH is not enough for me to be fully fulfilled.

Following up on point 2) have you talked with other doctors about your interests, especially those with whom you worked with public health issues? What do they say are pros and cons?

 

[Catalystik]

1) I calculated my undergraduate GPA with my postbacc and got a 3.3. I had 223 units in my undergraduate and only 23 units in postbacc so far.
My overall undergrad gpa is a 3.0 with a strong upward trend in my post bac where I have a 3.89. My sGPA including undergrad and post bac is a 2.7. I really only took a few science courses in my undergrad and pretty much bombed them. My Master's GPA was a 3.45.

2) Do they take into consideration that now, I am taking 3 sciene courses at a time and showing a huge upward trend.

As you can see my undergrad sGPA is very bad but my hope is that I am able to redeem myself with my post bacc grades. I have so many undergrad units that even with my post bac grades it is difficult to raise it. From what you've said
3) it seems like I only have a chance of getting into a DO program.

1) If you've entered everything into the GPA calculation program, you might take the further step of extrapolating what your GPAs might be when the postbac is done if you got straight As.

2) Yes.

3) Yes, for the most part, but you might also look into Wayne's policy of primarily using the last 20 postbac hours for decision-making. Check out your state MD schools, too, in case their metrics would also be in your favor.

 

[Mr.Smile12]

I currently work with a few doctors at the hospital that I am doing research at. A lot of them believe public health is important and think it is necessary to have both play hand in hand with each other. From what they have told me is the cons of medical school is obviously the time it takes to complete it and getting in however, those are not an issue for me.

You should network with all admissions staff to ask how they evaluate postbaccalaureate applicants and how they look at GPA. Of course, your situation will be challenging if you are applying OOS, since most of those candidates usually need to have a much higher GPA and MCAT compared to in-state applicants. The smaller the proportion of OOS in a class, the higher your GPA/MCAT may need to be.

 

[Catalystik]

1) I appreciate the feedback, I am not familiar with Wayne's policy can you elaborate on what that is.
2) I live in California so getting into medical school here is very competitive however, I am willing to go out of state.

1) Not long ago, I copied this from Wayne's website, "Once you have 20 hours in science in a graduate or postbaccalaureate program those grades supercede undergraduate GPA. Coursework updates are not allowed."

Of concern is that I can't find it today at https://www.med.wayne.edu/admissions/application . Note that the bottom-most link is broken. They may be updating the page, or their policy. Consider giving them a call to ask. If you do, please let us know what they say.

2) California has a 15% instate acceptance rate, so it is a very-competitive place to get a seat. (40% are accepted nationally, of all those who apply.)

1) Oh wow I did a little research and found something called the 32 hour rule. I'm not sure if you have heard of it but it is similar to Wayn'es last 20 hours rule. I got this directly from LSU's website..

"The 32-Hour Policy was a policy adopted by the LSU-New Orleans Admissions Committee many years ago. This policy allows for an applicant to obtain 32 or more post-baccalaureate hours of coursework in biology, chemistry, physics or mathematics. The admissions committee would then consider the GPA for those 32 or more hours to be that applicant’s GPA for the medical school application process. This policy allows for those applicants to distance themselves from a weaker undergraduate GPA which may otherwise hinder them from gaining acceptance into our medical school."

I guess what I can do is look for other schools that participate in this however, not every school may be as open in stating that they look at applicants grades in this fashion.

2) Yes, unfortunatly it is extremley difficult to get into a California school which is a bit disheartening. However, we do have some smaller private schools such as North State which I'm hoping may be a bit easier compared to UCLA and USC and the other large universities.

 

[Mr.Smile12]

Since I am planning to apply to so many schools should I network with all of them or is it best to do it with a handful?

It's up to you. You have to ultimately make decisions about your higher preferred schools. Like the Bachelor or Bachelorette.

 

[Catalystik]

I guess what I can do is look for other schools that participate in this however, not every school may be as open in stating that they look at applicants grades in this fashion.

This thread has a few more possibilities for you to research: Schools that favor last 2 years

 

[Catalystik]

There are more possibilities to consider here: Schools that Consider GradGPA