Do I have a chance Getting a ER spot?

[riosdsg]

Hi
I 'm a 3rd year med student from Puerto Rico with a step 1 score of 200 a 3.0 GPA , speak spanish and english fluently. I had worked at an ER department as a Registered Nurse for 3 years prior to getting in to a U.S. medschool.
The truth is that I dont know what are the average stats of people who get in ER residencies.

Thanks

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[edinOH]

You and I have similar numbers. My advice would be to do a strong rotation or two in EM early in your fourth year. Both strong in performance and institution. If your school doesn't have an academic EM program I would strongly advise doing an away rotation. Work very hard there and try to work some quality shifts with some of the attendings, preferrably the program director. From that experience you can get some good/great letters and may have your foot in the door for a spot in the next residency class. (private note to mike...ironic yes )

I myself applied to 44 programs and received 14 invites. I took all interviews since my numbers are kind weak. If I had it to do differently I would have applied to even MORE programs. There were some programs I didn't even apply to thinking that I wouldn't get an interview. In retrospect I realize that I may have picked up one or two more quality interviews if I just would have sucked it up and spent the little extra money. As it stands now, I have 5 or 6 programs at the bottom of my ROL that I quite frankly don't want to go to. But I will if it means the difference between matching or not.

I am pretty confident that I will match with 14 interviews. I'm sure you will have similar results. Just develop some thick skin. As you can see, many more places will reject you than interview you. Don't be surprised when that happens. I would be sure to mention that you are fluent in two languages. I've been told sometimes people that can only speak spanish seek care in the ED.

 

[pinbor1]

I agree with EdinOH

The only thing I would include is to rock your M3 clerkships. I know it's kinda late in the year to tell you this, but I've been told during interviews that they a number of programs look highly at evaluations, you EM rotation grade, and your clerkship grades. The latter being that as an EM resident you need to know about all the core clerkships and be able to work with these specialties.

I would also recommend taking step @ relatively early.

As for programs to do away rotations at, feel free to posts some regions that your interested in going to and I'll tell you what I know about them. Places I can recommend off hand are Hennepin and UIC, I did a month at both of these places and got great experience. Indiana, U Pitt, Cincinatti, and Wright State are some places in the midwest that I've heard have great 4th year rotations.

Good luck

 

[m and m]

I am sorry Riosdsg, but I don't think you have a snowballs chance in hell.





Just Kidding. I actually know of a several people who had 200 step one scores, had nothing but B grades through their medschool carrer, including the ER rotation, and they all matched in their top 3 choices. Just make sure you play the numbers. Apply to plenty off places, do it early, and have some variety of programs. It is better to be torn between which place you are going to cancel an interview at than not having enough interviews or not matching. It does cost you $25 a pop after a certain number of applications, but it is more than worth it IMHO.

 

[DrQuinn]

I agree with the above posters. The BEST strategy is to:

A) Obviously do as well as you can on your rotations, get good letters, rock your EM rotation, etc...

But as the underdog, you need to apply to lots and lots of programs... don't limit yourself geographically if you dont' have to (I was lucky as I don't have any limits to where I NEED to be). If you get too many interviews, then you have the luxury of turning them down. If you get only a 20% yield of interviews, and you only applied to 10 programs, well, your up the creek. But if you applied to 40, that's 8. Yeah, you'll pay $700 or so, but, if EM is what you want to do, I couldn't ever imagine letting anything stop me.

Considered a general underdog, since I am a DO student, I had to apply to many more programs than I would have liked to, but hopefully in four weeks, all that work will have paid off (applying to lots o' programs).

Also, thanks M&M for contributing to the forums.
Q

 

[blackcat]

QuinnNSU the perpetual underdog....i wish you the best...you have with several others (you know who you are) have kept this forum running that last several months.
thanks and good luck

riosdsg - play the numbers and don't be discouraged by the 'heismans'

 

[anonymousEM]

Another thing to think about is your fourth year transcript. My school only sent transcripts on ERAS as of the end of third year. If I hadn't thought to ask to have it resent with my Honors grades in my EM clerkships, some of my programs would never have seen them...You'd hope it's in their LORs, but you never know. Ask to have your 4th year transcript to date posted on ERAS.

 

[DrQuinn]

Originally posted by blackcat
QuinnNSU the perpetual underdog....i wish you the best...you have with several others (you know who you are) have kept this forum running that last several months.
thanks and good luck

Thanks for the kind words, blackcat, and good luck to you, too.

I don't mind being the underdog. I made the decision to attend the DO school, unfortunately there's still a stigma associated with it. But, whatever... I'm just glad I'm going to be a doctor. Thankfully, DOs have been in the MD EM world for a while now...

Actually, the top four programs on my ROL have very few DOs which is another reason why I am really pushing for them. Just to open the door for my fellow brothers and (hot) sisters behind me.
Q

 

[The White Coat Investor]

I agree with the above posters. Yes your stats are below average, but hey, someone has to be below average for there to be an average. Don't worry though, because the only people who don't match in EM are those who think they're better than they are and 1) Don't apply to enough programs, 2) Don't go to enough interviews, or 3) Are complete freaks on their EM rotations or at interviews. Its not dermatology. 50 programs is not unreasonable for you. Its all a numbers game, just like getting into medical school.

Oh, and apply to lots of programs in the MidWest. Due to location issues, there are a lot fewer people applying to those programs than the programs on the East and West coasts. (Especially West)

 

[Annette]

Desperado, where did you get the info about where the applicants are coming from? Is it from last year? Do you have access to the total number of applicants? THere is another thread wondering about #applicants/# spots.

 

[pinbor1]

On Scutwork.com there is a link to match statistics for the last 2 years. It breaks down which programs did not fill and also has some regional statistics. It's worth checking out, some of those programs are pretty good. I guess it's a matter of playing the numbers game for both us and them.

 

[blackcat]

quinnNSU
for the last 4 years i have worked in an emergency department that is very DO heavy. i have to say that they are some of the finest physicians that i have met. i grew up in a medical family (MD family) and went to med school in boston where DOs are unheard of so I understand the bias towards DOs.
Mostly unfounded in my direct experience. The poorest physician's i've met in my 5 years as an MD are MDs and not DOs.
as i've posted in other places, as long as someone devotes the time and effort to learning their specialty they will be good doctors.

 

[The White Coat Investor]

Picky, Picky, Picky. Always asking for sources.

My sources for the statement that riosdsg's stats are below average:
1) Average Board Scores are 215 for all takers. I suspect for EM it is slightly higher. 200 is nearly a standard deviation below average.
2) I'm sure that 3.0 is no better than average, unless his is the only school I know of that doesn't suffer from serious grade inflation.

My sources for the fact that MidWest interviews are easier to get than interviews on the coasts.
1) This site
2) Personal experience
3) Knowing the "stats" for people at my school and people I've met on the interview trail and where they've secured interviews and where they haven't.
4) Programs director at Madigan: 290 apps for 4 spots
Program director at Irvine: 400 apps for 6 spots
Program director at UNC: 790 apps for 8? spots
Program director at Arizona: 700 apps for 11 spots
5) I don't know anyone who applied to a program in Michigan that didn't get the interview. People just simply prefer the coasts.

My sources for the fact that EM isn't as competitive as Derm
1) Personal experience
2) NRMP match stats http://www.nrmp.org/res_match/tables/table5_2002.pdf

My sources for number of applications one should send off:
Personal experience from friends at my school (rated in top 1/3 by U.S.News and World Report if that means anything)
1) High 220s on boards, significant honors as MS3, Honors in EM, 30 Apps, 22 invites
2) 230s on boards, a few honors as MS3, High Pass in EMx2: 40 apps, 17 interviews
3) 240s on boards, mostly honors as MS3, Honors in EM: 35 apps, 21 interviews
4) 260s on boards, mostly honors as MS3, Honors in EM: 30 apps, 28 invites.
5) 250 on boards, AOA, mostly honors as MS3, Honors in EM: 30 apps, 28 invites
6) 215 on boards, a few honors as MS3, High Pass in EM: 40 apps, 8 invites.

Yea, so my sources ain't so hot, but hey, if we only posted things with good sources, no one would ever post anything.

 

[DrQuinn]

Desperado,
Can you please post your sources on the way that you type your sentences and the font that you prefer? Much appreciated.

J/K.

I would have to agree with D's statement about the midwest programs being *generally* easier to get into.

A) I think geography plays a big part in people's ROL. A student told me that they talked to the PD at Akron General (community EM program), and they were had a couple unfilled spots last year. The program sent out a survey to the people that interviewed but didnt' match there, and the #1 reason why they didn't pick AGMC was becasue of location. Now this is through the grapevine but I can see that. I am ranking AGMC in the top half of my ROL, though, since it is a strong program (the question is, how many places am I ranking?!??!).

B) Look at Ohio. There are oodles and oodles of programs there. A few states away, in VA/DC... there are only a handful (two in DC (although Howard lost their accreditation as far as I know), and three in VA). You can only draw so many residents from OH until the applicants are exhausted, so you have to depend on out of staters for the rest...

C) Who doesn't want to stay in the big cities (Chicago, NY, Philadelphia), etc. The midwest has numerous residencies in smaller cities (Toledo, Peoria, etc). They are great training places, and places I applied, but I know several students who "wouldnt' be caught dead in a city like that." Granted, I went to school in Ft. Lauderdale/Miami, so there's the snob factor...

Q

 

[mikecwru]

Originally posted by edinOH
You and I have similar numbers. My advice would be to do a strong rotation or two in EM early in your fourth year. Both strong in performance and institution. If your school doesn't have an academic EM program I would strongly advise doing an away rotation. Work very hard there and try to work some quality shifts with some of the attendings, preferrably the program director. From that experience you can get some good/great letters and may have your foot in the door for a spot in the next residency class. (private note to mike...ironic yes )

I missed this little note the first time:

You know what you need to do.

mike

 

[edinOH]

it is done.

 

[DrQuinn]

Edin/Mike-

Are you guys having a private conversation? Is it about my breasts or my curvy waist? If it is let me join and I'll trade pics with you.

 

[edinOH]

Actually Quinn, Mike and I were discussing how we hardly recognize you in that picture. I think it is because I've never seen you with your clothes on.

 

[mikecwru]

If Quinn changes his avatar does that change the avatar for all his previous posts? If so, what if he posts a dude's picture?

We're all going to look really gay to the first time readers.

"Awww, Quinn's so hot."

"We hardly recognize you with your clothes on!"

mike

 

[mikecwru]

Originally posted by edinOH
it is done.

It's about time.

PS, you sounded kind of Jesus-like with that phrase.

mike