do supercompetitive premeds really bother you?

[shikantaza]

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i?m writing this because i'm sensing a lot of frustration and anger, after reading some of these theads, with ?supercompetitive premeds? taking spots in medical schools, and i think that anger is unjustified? when you believe in something so firmly that it drives you towards indignation, you condemn that which you rely upon for your own distinction... i think understanding this is what physicists call "getting the feel of relativity"... ... who really cares if some supercompetitive premeds take spots in top ten schools... should this really make people that angry?... if i've learned anything useful at all in life, it's that every act rewards itself, in silence and certainty... should cutthroat premeds suffer some sort of ill fate?... well, for better or worse, i think they do... actions become tendencies become habits become character becomes yada yada becomes your life... i know everyone knows this, but for those who really have a problem with the supercompetitive premeds, i'll remind you that there's more to life than medicine and if you feel you're taking the moral high road by fostering a community rather than a battle field, what more do you need than your own satisfaction?... do you really need an adcom to reward you in order for you to justify your good nature?... if you have a tremendous enough sense of self, this whole conversation is moot... i guess i just think it's a little silly to be annoyed by people who sit in the front row, study hard, and gun for top grades, especially assuming they don't attempt to hinder your learning in anyway... we can say all we want (and say we do) about how such individuals don't have a life or balance or are mean (my personal favorite, as if things are ever so simplistic) or whatever, but i think it's probably a little pretentious to assume that there's not a richness and depth to their lives that we can't see, or choose not to see for the purpose of upholding our own perceived superiority... i think we'd all be hard-pressed not to find little saints and devils running around in our minds, and "supercomptetive premeds" are probably not much different, with the saints and devils simply running to different locations... ok, i'm writing too much... thanks for your time

 

[phar]

not all students in the top ten schools are "supercompetitive" and for all i know there are some dumb ones & average ones. So, anybody has a shot at any school.

The probelm why people seem to against "supercompetitive pre-med" is thier lifestyle.
-they don't have a "life" outside school.
-they think getting Bs or Cs is the end of the world
-Extreme pressure from thier parents.
-Very likely that thier parent have phds or are doctors(which is good, i wish my parents did).

Trust me, i am a harvard graduate and some of my classmate were as geek as one can ever get. I tried to force them to party with me, enjoy life and so on. But they always declined. I personally blame thier parents for not teaching them how to live a life. Yup, not all harvard students are geeks....i am an example of it.

Am i jealous of them? Yes and No.. I would love to have a 4.0gp and a 40mcat but i wouldn't like thier lifystyle at all.


My advice...enjoy life and do good in academics.


Lastly...we are not against them, it merely that we are trying to wake them up. Sooner or later, they will have to face reality. Mommie and daddy will not always be there.

 

[gizzdogg]

Sooner or later, they will have to face reality. Mommie and daddy will not always be there. [/B]

truer words have never been spoken

 

[Fenrezz]

Super competitive people creep me out. Just my opinion. However, I don't have a problem with anyone who shoots for the best they can do. I think most of us so. I would, except that I enjoy studying about as much as getting a root canal.

Problem with competitive people is that it's not enough that they do well, they must also do better than you. And then there are those who openly celebrate when they get an A. These people could use my patented "thrown from a 5-story building" therapy. If you're one of those people who gets straight A's, and no one knows it, I salute you.

My opinion is that, although it's fine to be competitive and all that, in many cases, the behavior tends to annoy other people.

 

[Fenrezz]

Originally posted by phar
Trust me, i am a harvard graduate and some of my classmate were as geek as one can ever get. I tried to force them to party with me, enjoy life and so on. But they always declined. I personally blame thier parents for not teaching them how to live a life. Yup, not all harvard students are geeks....i am an example of it.

Phar, you never disappoint me.

🙄

 

[phar]

Originally posted by Fenrezz
Phar, you never disappoint me.

🙄

what more do you want?

 

[Fenrezz]

Originally posted by phar
what more do you want?

Well I would say "for you to never post again", but your ridiculously inane posts can be quite entertaining. Makes me glad I saved my money and not bothered going to an ivy league school for undergrad.

 

[HouseHead]

I've known the super-competitive types. One in particular was just about the most kiss-a$$ be-atch (would ignore anyone that she couldn't get something from; EVERYONE at my job- she worked there before I did- hated her except the boss, who saw only her constant a$$ kissing) that I've ever met. It annoyed me that my favorite school didn't see through her act and accepted her, but ignored me. But I will always remember that I beat her... um... into the dirt in the classes we had together, even though she graduated summa and I, only plain ol' cum laude. 😀

So the moral of the story is, I understand. But really, get over it. You've got to be confident with YOU, and not care what others are doing. I dunno, maybe it's just who I am, but I'm confident in my ability to DESTROY those that challenge me, yet I don't generally care what others are doing unless they actually do get a bug up their okole to directly challenge me (as the afore mentioned be-atch did)... Does that make sense?

 

[phar]

Originally posted by Fenrezz
Well I would say "for you to never post again", but your ridiculously inane posts can be quite entertaining. Makes me glad I saved my money and not bothered going to an ivy league school for undergrad.

Don't get me started on defending ivy league schools, many SDNers are ivy league geeks and they will disect you like a frog.

 

[Fenrezz]

Originally posted by phar
Don't get me started on defending ivy league schools, many SDNers are ivy league geeks and they will disect you like a frog.

Okay, can someone translate this for me? My English seems to be a bit rusty.

 

[ivyleague22ny]

I pretty much think you'll have your share of
ultra-competitive students no matter what
discipline you enter (medicine, law, PhD's
competing for tenure, the corporate world,
etc.)

Regardless of how cutt-throat my undergrad environment
was (believe me, practically all of us got 4-5's on our AP Chem, Bio, Calc, and Physics exams and were in the top of our class in HS), it was important for me to keep things in perspective and realize that my main competition was myself. Rather than focuss on how everyone else was doing, I would instead focuss on my short-commings whether it was weakness in certain subject areas
or simply time mismanagement. I saw each weakness
as an opportunity to be better and rather than envy
4.0+/45 MCAT students, I would rejoice in my own
progress, such as getting a B+ in a class where I started
out failing the first exam.

Also it's important to keep your life balanced, which means
focuss on studying hard during the week so you can
reward yourself by partying like it's no tommorrow on a friday night. Basically study hard and play hard 😉 And for those
students who'd rather just be a hermit in a library 24-7, if they're happy being that way, then just let them be. 🙂

That's my 2 cents.

 

[phar]

Originally posted by Fenrezz
Okay, can someone translate this for me? My English seems to be a bit rusty.

May i suggest you learn french..

 

[Fenrezz]

Originally posted by phar
May i suggest you learn french..

That must be why you used the word "frog".

 

[zer0el]

phar, my man, you are off the hook!

i don't know if youre high or if youre just mental. either way, its isanely hilarious. ive been reading your posts and i must admit that you get the "most disturbed SDNer" in my book.

if you ask me, i think you write the way you do and state the things you say to get kicks out of us. if so, you have a perverse sense of humor. but if thats really the way you are, wow. chalk one up for harvard!

keep it up, we need laughs around here.

 

[phar]

Originally posted by zer0el
phar, my man, you are off the hook!

i don't know if youre high or if youre just mental. either way, its isanely hilarious. ive been reading your posts and i must admit that you get the "most disturbed SDNer" in my book.

if you ask me, i think you write the way you do and state the things you say to get kicks out of us. if so, you have a perverse sense of humor. but if thats really the way you are, wow. chalk one up for harvard!

keep it up, we need laughs around here.

Honestly, i have been drinking(not yet drunk though) because my girlfriend pissed me off a couple of hours ago....i had enough of her ***** and right now i am going through the divorce of her *****(or rather ex-***** because we just broke up).

Since when did SDN become amcas personal essay writing skills or your english portofolio??? SDN IS ALL ABOUT INFORMAL ENGLISH.

 

[Fenrezz]

Originally posted by phar
i had enough of her ***** and right now i am going through the divorce of her *****(or rather ex-***** because we just broke up).

Another gem. I need to start collecting these. There's a thesis paper in here somewhere.

 

[BRUINGOLD]

Originally posted by zer0el
phar, my man, you are off the hook!

i don't know if youre high or if youre just mental. either way, its isanely hilarious. ive been reading your posts and i must admit that you get the "most disturbed SDNer" in my book.

if you ask me, i think you write the way you do and state the things you say to get kicks out of us. if so, you have a perverse sense of humor. but if thats really the way you are, wow. chalk one up for harvard!

keep it up, we need laughs around here.

SDN rocks! Man, do I need the comic relief.

 

[phar]

Originally posted by Fenrezz
Another gem. I need to start collecting these. There's a thesis paper in here somewhere.

good one fenrezz. She deserves it and may god curse her with a bad *****.

 

[jalfredprufrock]

Originally posted by ivyleague22ny
I pretty much think you'll have your share of
ultra-competitive students no matter what
discipline you enter (medicine, law, PhD's
competing for tenure, the corporate world,
etc.)

Regardless of how cutt-throat my undergrad environment
was (believe me, practically all of us got 4-5's on our AP Chem, Bio, Calc, and Physics exams and were in the top of our class in HS), it was important for me to keep things in perspective and realize that my main competition was myself. Rather than focuss on how everyone else was doing, I would instead focuss on my short-commings whether it was weakness in certain subject areas
or simply time mismanagement. I saw each weakness
as an opportunity to be better and rather than envy
4.0+/45 MCAT students, I would rejoice in my own
progress, such as getting a B+ in a class where I started
out failing the first exam.

Also it's important to keep your life balanced, which means
focuss on studying hard during the week so you can
reward yourself by partying like it's no tommorrow on a friday night. Basically study hard and play hard 😉 And for those
students who'd rather just be a hermit in a library 24-7, if they're happy being that way, then just let them be. 🙂

That's my 2 cents.

Honestly, how can you complain about ultra-competitive students when your handle is "ivyleague22ny?" And I love the statement "
Regardless of how cutt-throat my undergrad environment
was (believe me, practically all of us got 4-5's on our AP Chem, Bio, Calc, and Physics exams and were in the top of our class in HS), it was important for me to keep things in perspective and realize that my main competition was myself."
Looks like one of the more competitive students on this post took to complaining about his/her ilk as a form of self-aggrandizement. "My main competition was myself!" Ha ha ha ha ha ha! Priceless!

And to answer your question in advance, I will not post my stats.

 

[PhillyEaglesFan]

Nope. They don't bother me. It's their loss.

Now, people who whine about supercompetitive premeds on the other hand...😀

 

[Asclepius]

too true, prufrock...

we need to distinguish between success and competitiveness. There are some gifted pre-meds with great stats and numbers that spend a lot of time tutoring other people out of genuine desire to help; they don't boast, and they don't need to know where anybody else stands in comparison...they are competitive only in the sense that they're excellent candidates for admission.

On the other hand, schools are filled with super-competitive, crappy students (especially fresh. and soph. years). huge egos, grade grubbing, no qualms cheating, self-inflating etc. ...you know the type...no business being doctors.

My point - competitiveness as a behavior is divisive and deplorable whether the student is successful or not. Concerning yourself with students who adopt a particular lifestyle/ethic and are successful, judging their happiness, etc., I think, puts you in the above category.

 

[relatively prime]

Originally posted by phar


Lastly...we are not against them, it merely that we are trying to wake them up. Sooner or later, they will have to face reality. Mommie and daddy will not always be there.

What makes you so sure that supercompetitive premeds aren't independent of their parents? I know plenty of very competitive applicants who are not pressured by their parents and are for the most part rather independent.

A lot of times people are just competitive because that's their nature... or because there's something they want really bad.

If you were all honest with yourselves you'd realize that all your anger and fustration with these people is that they got what you wanted... and you're envious.

 

[relatively prime]

Originally posted by Asclepius


My point - competitiveness as a behavior is divisive and deplorable whether the student is successful or not.

This statement made me sick to my stomach. Competition is what drives our society... it's what drives people to be their best. It's the very foundation of capitalism. I think what you mean to say is that "being an ass as a behavior is divisive and deplorable"... a person can be competitive and still be nice and generous.

 

[carrigallen]

I agree with RP - don't let their problem become your problem. Stay objective, focus on your goals. A few obnoxious freshmen are not going to ruin things for you.

 

[Enkindu]

Competition is a great limiting/ motivating factor for primitive creatures. Once you have the leverage of a developed intellect, however, it be comes just as destructive as it is beneficial. Like using crystal meth to bump up your time in the 400- it works, but it can kill ya. Gratuitous competition is a human shortcut we like to take. I hope we survive to evolve beyond it.

 

[Asclepius]

Originally posted by relatively prime
This statement made me sick to my stomach. Competition is what drives our society... it's what drives people to be their best. It's the very foundation of capitalism. I think what you mean to say is that "being an ass as a behavior is divisive and deplorable"... a person can be competitive and still be nice and generous.

RP - sorry to make you sick... You're right, I must have meant to say something other than what you read, and think we're probablyl on the same page. From some of your other posts it does not seem that you want to be a doctor out of competition...or even to be a *good* doctor for the same reason. I think genuine concern for other people and the greatest good should be, and sometimes is, the greatest motivating factor. If competition is the motivation then success is determined by how well one measures up with one's competitors - not whether one does the best he can or achieves her goals.
I'm not saying that there should be absolutely no competitive spirit - when it is taken lightly. Competition can be a form of mutual encouragement and growth - *this* is the point behind capitalism and science...the greatest good. It's the competitive behavior which I had mentioned (egotism, cheating, self-agrandizement, failure to value one's competitor, etc.) that I think is deplorable.

 

[kito]

not a christian but in the spirit of the holidays here's a relevant one:

"Be strong and of a good courage, fear not, nor be afraid..."

-Deuteronomy


words to remember when confronting cut throat premeds, parents, adcoms, patients, HMOs, hardship, and life.

 

[phatsebz]

survival of the fittest? 😕

 

[QHamp]

Let me bring it from the 'super-competitive' side.

The pressure of financial difficulties, diabetes, autoimmune disorders, and multiple moves in my life, have all contributed to my becoming a gunner at a young age. As the pressures mounted I found books to be a great escape. Some people drink... I study. (It's a WHOLE lot healthier 😉 )

I am now beggining my freshman year at college. School comes quite easy for me, and I have inadvetantly obtained some of those hated labels (egoist, self-centered, know-it-all). On the other hand, I'm not inclined to worry myself extensively with a social life. Books can't reject you, or label you. They can only challenge you.

Thanks to the other SDNer's I've learned not to criticize those who aren't gunners. I'm a gunner. I enjoy being a gunner. And I look forward to that moment when I, a gunner, gets to respond to a code-blue with a 'socialite' who entered medschool w/ a 3.0.

😀