Do you love science, or did you take it because you had to?

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Thelema

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Sorry for bothering you with a pre-med question, but I was hoping to get the perspectives of people who are already through their undergrad work and in med school . . . (thanks!)

I am currently trying to decide if I should abandon my Humanities major to take pre-med classes. I'm a very motivated, hard-working person, and would probably be disappointed with a career that doesn't require working my tail off. And I love the idea of a job where I can actually have a tangible impact on others' lives.

But I don't especially love science. I'm very good at it, and could certainly tolerate 32+ units of science. But some people in these forums sound like they sit in an armchair and read a CRC handbook for pleasure. :) I would probably not take more than the general ed. requirements for science if I wasn't planning on med school.

So that's where I'm at. If I'm not extraordinarily passionate about science, is that an indication that I would be a train wreck in med school, or am I in a fairly common situation? Were any of you in that position as an undergrad?

Once again, sorry for the bother, but I really do appreciate your input!

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i love it!!! :love:

but no, you don't have to enjoy reading crc to enter medical school. there's more to medicine than science.

major in something you love, you will still make a difference.
 
I think what I love most about science is how powerful it can be. I've always really enjoyed knowing/learning how things worked. And, I'm looking forward to learning more, and how to fix/heal/treat, based on applying that knowledge.

That being said, there's a lot more to medicine than just science. If you're great with people, perhaps you'll shine in the wards or in private practice.
 
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To answer the OP: I used to love it...if you're hard working, you can definitely do it!!! It's only 8 of your 32 total classes (assuming 4 classes/semester for 4 years). But while you may not like science, the first 2 years of medical school are mostly science based (anatomy, biochem, histo, pathology, etc). Essentially you need to know the science behind the disease before you get into the clinic and start caring for patients.

BozoSparky said:
i love it!!!

but no, you don't have to love reading crc to enter medical school. there's more to medicine than science.

major in something you love, you will still make a difference.
:love: :love: :love: CRC is the devil :love: :love: :love:

I haven't cracked a copy of CRC since PChem lab, I should probably go catch up on the updated melting points for 2006...::barf::

I was a chem major/biochem concentrator because I needed a back-up plan for medicine that would get me a halfway decent job that wouldnt require a cubical or a suit. I used to love it...but after a 3 summers and a year full time in a hearing research lab, I'm fed up with the politics, jumping-through-hoops, and anti-climatic nature of science. The books leave all that crapola out.
 
Thelema said:
Sorry for bothering you with a pre-med question, but I was hoping to get the perspectives of people who are already through their undergrad work and in med school . . . (thanks!)

I am currently trying to decide if I should abandon my Humanities major to take pre-med classes. I'm a very motivated, hard-working person, and would probably be disappointed with a career that doesn't require working my tail off. And I love the idea of a job where I can actually have a tangible impact on others' lives.

But I don't especially love science. I'm very good at it, and could certainly tolerate 32+ units of science. But some people in these forums sound like they sit in an armchair and read a CRC handbook for pleasure. :) I would probably not take more than the general ed. requirements for science if I wasn't planning on med school.

So that's where I'm at. If I'm not extraordinarily passionate about science, is that an indication that I would be a train wreck in med school, or am I in a fairly common situation? Were any of you in that position as an undergrad?

Once again, sorry for the bother, but I really do appreciate your input!

Do not abandon a humanities major-- it gives your application depth. If you love that, your GPA will also be higher. I was a history/polisci double major and have a law degree. Use your humanities background. Bio majors are a dime a dozen.

That being said... you can double major with a science if you really like to work. I don't think that is necessary but I would suggest to all non-science majors that they take the following in addition to the required classes: anatomy and physio, histology, immunology and cell bio, micro and biochem. Take genetics if your school has a good program.
 
I took it because I had to but i Totally grew to like it. I cannot see my self having another major than Biology. It really fascinates me now.
 
I graduated with a BA in Anthro, and then went back to take the science classes I needed. I wanted to rip my eyes out taking gen chem, ochem, and physics, but I knew they were necessary evils. I liked general bio a lot more, and I ended up liking biochem, genetics, physio, and microbio.

Don't abandon your humanities major, you probably enjoy it. But definitely try to fit in some science classes and get some medical volunteer experience so you can have some motivation for why you're trying to care about oxidation-reduction reactions.

My first year of med school (basic sciences) was OK , but I really felt like I finally flourished when I started to learn MEDICINE second year. And I have plenty of friends who were not "science" people.

So no, you don't have to love reading the CRC to go into medicine. You should definitely have an appreciation for science, but novels or foreign languages or history can defiinitely be your first love.
 
Thelema said:
Sorry for bothering you with a pre-med question, but I was hoping to get the perspectives of people who are already through their undergrad work and in med school . . . (thanks!)

I am currently trying to decide if I should abandon my Humanities major to take pre-med classes. I'm a very motivated, hard-working person, and would probably be disappointed with a career that doesn't require working my tail off. And I love the idea of a job where I can actually have a tangible impact on others' lives.

But I don't especially love science. I'm very good at it, and could certainly tolerate 32+ units of science. But some people in these forums sound like they sit in an armchair and read a CRC handbook for pleasure. :) I would probably not take more than the general ed. requirements for science if I wasn't planning on med school.

So that's where I'm at. If I'm not extraordinarily passionate about science, is that an indication that I would be a train wreck in med school, or am I in a fairly common situation? Were any of you in that position as an undergrad?

Once again, sorry for the bother, but I really do appreciate your input!


I have always loved science but I truly HATED most of my college science classes. The problem with teaching science is that there is so much to cover and there are not a lot of great science teachers who are capable of covering sections of science so that they fit beautifully into a complete picture. Hopefully, at some point in medical school things will click for you and you will learn to appreciate it. This did not happen for me till grad school.
 
Loved science in high school, hated (most of) science in undergrad. It was like this:

Biology - If you could ever meet the professor, great. If not, and you ask the TA a question like, "Why," they'd roll their eyes at you and just say to memorize the syllabus.

Organic chemistry - same thing

Physics - You'd reach a point where it all becomes plug-and-chug. No point in asking TAs why one used a certain equation, because they just said that this was the way it was done.

Math - proofs were good, but upper division calc was annoying as heck because it was a bunch of glorified long division.

Long story short, the biological science people had long since forgotten their math and physics, so asking them why something worked (instead of just what) was pointless. The physics and math people, at the lower, non-honors division, seemed more interested in giving you equations to plug numbers into. The best science professors were ones in neuroscience or physical biochemistry, who knew the why and the how of their topics.

But the most intellectually stimulating classes that I had in college were humanities-type classes, such as religion and linguistics. Since everything is a human construct, derived from scratch instead of discovered piecemeal, you actually can understand the whole picture and all the details. So to the OP, stay in humanities if you like it. You can dislike science and still do fine in med school.
 
I really do love bio. It's just completely fascinating to me. I was a micro major, and was lucky to test out of all the big intro bio classes so that all of the classes in my major were pretty small. I had some incredible profs too.

I actually really enjoyed ochem because, especially once we finally started learning mechanisms and how to do syntheses, it was just one big puzzle. I had a so-so teacher for ochem 1, but my ochem 2 teacher was stellar. I actually looked forward to his class. Ochem (and calculus) taught me how to think methodically.

I HATED physics (just not my bag, terrible profs) and gen chem/biochem (horrible, horrible profs). It's too bad, because I actually kind of liked physics in high school, and it really is pretty interesting learning why everything works at the most fundamental level.

So, to sum it up, I loved the biological sciences and organic chemistry. Not so much with the straight up chem and physics.
 
You don't need to love it, but it helps.

Most of the stuff you learn in undergrad sciences is not relevant to med school classes, except some biochem, micro and basic chem + bio.
You're not going to need to know organic chem theories, how magnetism works, or what the physiology of a frog is...the study habits associated with learning those things are helpful, though.

The more understanding you have, the easier it is to grasp the 2nd time around (particularly the genetics / molec bio for USMLE).

eg. i've done tons of gel electrophoresis in undergrad, so questions pertaining to such are pretty easy because I have more of an understanding than what was briefly given in med school.
 
Love it...thats what led me to medicine.
 
There are some sciences that I still hate, and Im a med student. However, I must say that I enjoy the fact that each class has some clinical relevance to it. It gets better and better each year.
 
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I hate science. I wish I hadn't double majored in Chemistry and Biology. What the hell was I thinking? The worst years of my life. If I could go back in time I would knock my younger, delusional self out and take her place and actually major in something FUN and (personally) useful.
 
I think I more love learning. Science is wicked and I find it to be the most practical discipline out there, however, I am totally biased. I really enjoy biochemistry/molecular biology because of the many applications it has. But are there science courses I have taken just because I have to? Of course. Without all of those lame pre-reqs I wouldn't have been able to find my interest in biochem. To love something is a pretty powerful statement, I thoroughly enjoy learning about science and discovering things for myself in the process.

I think I might actually be close to loving math though. I just get excited sometimes from doing math problems. I don't have any advanced mathematics knowledge because I chose to go into biochemistry because it was something that I was good at and enjoyed just as much as math. I am tired and feel like I am rambling. This post is done.
 
I'm bumping this up because I'd love to hear some more recent answers to this!
 
I loved math and physics since I was a kid. I liked learning whys and hows and didn't care about the whats. While bio was semi-interesting, the way it was taught, it was pretty much whats. Chemistry was also interesting, but questions would be basic boring stuff like stoichiometry. I'm the guy that would take apart stuff and put it back together if I didn't understand how it worked.

That's why I majored in engineering. I didn't like medicine until I took anatomy and physiology (also took in undergrad), which showed me the whys and hows of the body as well, thus allowing me to integrate the two fields.

I still prefer math and physics over any subject though. I find it irritating in med school when I run into people who say math is useless and how they dumb down a lot of the physics associated with physiology.

I took Humanities in high school and it was boring, but it does help me when I play trivia games lol.
 
I like science, but I certainly did not love all my science classes. Because I started as a ChemE I took a lot of science/math that ended up not being necessary.

Classes I hated: Calc I/II, Multivariable Calc, Differential Equations, Physical Chem I and II, Linear Algebra, Gen Chem II, Fluid Dynamics :barf:.

Classes I tolerated, but didn't particularly enjoy: Biochem, Heat and Mass Transfer, Physics E&M.

Classes I liked: Gen Bio,Physics: mechanics, Organic, Physical Chem Lab,all my upper level Biomedical Engineering classes.
 
Love Biology, Cell Bio, Dev Bio, Molecular Bio, Anatomy, etc.

Thought I loved Chemistry. Even minored in it. PChem destroyed that love.

Physics. Hate. It's why I ruled out Radiology as a career.

Math. Love. So useful, methodical, there's a clear cut answer.
 
Science is ok. I'm in med school because it leads to a cool job, and I'm willing to trudge through the science for that. Out of basic science med school classes the only ones I took any liking to were microbio and neuro. Out of general science subjects math and physics are my favorites.
 
Love Biology, Cell Bio, Dev Bio, Molecular Bio, Anatomy, etc.

Thought I loved Chemistry. Even minored in it. PChem destroyed that love.

Physics. Hate. It's why I ruled out Radiology as a career.

Math. Love. So useful, methodical, there's a clear cut answer.


How do you love math, but hate Pchem and physics?

I hated Pchem but that was mostly because the calculus was so nasty.


You must be one of those math people who loves linear algebra, but hates calculus. :confused:
 
I think I loved the challenge more than the actual science. I did like understanding how things worked on a fundamental level. I liked taking biology classes and seeing the application of the general chemistry and physics principles (which I majored) in.

I did take a philo minor and I really liked it, though it was SOOO much easier than any of my other classes. After quantum mechanics, philosophy was a relaxing bout of mental masturbation.

Medicine requires a fundamental familiarity with various branches of science. Still the actual practice of medicine is two fold. The "sciencey" part is essentially pattern recognition, and knowing which algorithm to apply. The factoids you need to know are differential diagnoses, which labs give you which information, which medications are appropriate etc. The "humanities" part is being able to communicate with people who are both at your level (and above) professionally, as well as with people who may or may not have a high school education. You need to be able to deal with belligerent patients, scared patients, stressed patients, comatose patients, uncooperative patients, and everything in between.
 
I have always loved science and math (parents have pictures of me at 2 using my toys for physics experiments or instuments to learn math), as well as the social sciences and humanities. My favorites are the math-heavy courses, and that's my area of research. That being said, I've always hated the rote memorization in biology--simply kills the relationships and creativity in that subject...
 
I have always loved science and math (parents have pictures of me at 2 using my toys for physics experiments or instuments to learn math), as well as the social sciences and humanities. My favorites are the math-heavy courses, and that's my area of research. That being said, I've always hated the rote memorization in biology--simply kills the relationships and creativity in that subject...

Unfortunately I think the rote memorization found in biology courses is a product of how it's taught. Sadly, biology as a subject in undergraduate education is watered down (at least in the early classes) in a way that subjects like chemistry and physics are not. I certainly think it's possible to teach biology in a way that spurs critical thinking and creativity, but biology departments have caved into the expectations of the students who start out as bio majors because they think it's an "easier" science major.
 
I'm bumping this up because I'd love to hear some more recent answers to this!

You don't need to love science. I actually hated the majority of my science classes (I was a double major), but loved my Celtic Studies classes. I kept thinking it would get better, but it never really did. What I should have done was double major in something I liked (public health or chem...if the o chem didn't suck instead of the Bio), and just taken the required classes for med. Would have made my life so much easier (it's what I get for sticking with something my parents wanted and not what I wanted) gpa/med school path wise. It's really hard (but doable) to do well in classes you really dislike. That's why I think taking the one or two needed premed classes would have been much easier to swallow than doing all science classes for a few semesters.

I really like general chem however, bio was okay, 1st semester physics was ok (2nd with E&M was the suck) and o chem let's not even go there. Having taken a couple med school classes already (SMP), it's very different to me than those terrible premed classes/science classes back in undergrad. So even if you don't like them then, there's a chance you'll end up liking your med school science courses.

For me, the biggest disconnect was the seeming pointless-ness of the pre-med science classes with medicine - in the sense that how does knowing the force of two point charges separated help me fix patients in the future. That's why even though everything in med school doesn't relate to patients (memorize 20 amino acids! why? 'because i said so!') there's still a good majority that does (i.e. med school biochem is diff than undergrad) and why I like it. I feel like I'm learning something useful (biocarbonate buffer system and how that relates to breathing rates for example).

So no, you don't need to love the science. Do well in what you do love, and take the required pre-med classes in small doses if you dislike them. Obviously you need to make sure medicine is where you want to go so if you do end up disliking first couple of years of med school, you'll have some motivation to carry you through to clinical years.
 
I am calm about science, but I love medicine. I am more interested in how it applies to fixing someone rather than theory for the sake of theory. Some of the science bits will be more relevant to med than others, and there will be parts you will hate and parts you will find quite fascinating. You have to be interested in it, but being passionate about science or loving it is not necessary.
 
Loved science in high school, hated (most of) science in undergrad. It was like this:

Biology - If you could ever meet the professor, great. If not, and you ask the TA a question like, "Why," they'd roll their eyes at you and just say to memorize the syllabus.

Organic chemistry - same thing

Physics - You'd reach a point where it all becomes plug-and-chug. No point in asking TAs why one used a certain equation, because they just said that this was the way it was done.

Math - proofs were good, but upper division calc was annoying as heck because it was a bunch of glorified long division.

Long story short, the biological science people had long since forgotten their math and physics, so asking them why something worked (instead of just what) was pointless. The physics and math people, at the lower, non-honors division, seemed more interested in giving you equations to plug numbers into. The best science professors were ones in neuroscience or physical biochemistry, who knew the why and the how of their topics.

But the most intellectually stimulating classes that I had in college were humanities-type classes, such as religion and linguistics. Since everything is a human construct, derived from scratch instead of discovered piecemeal, you actually can understand the whole picture and all the details. So to the OP, stay in humanities if you like it. You can dislike science and still do fine in med school.

GAH. This drives me crazy. I hear this from old high school friends who majored in the humanities ALL. THE. TIME.

You caricature your science classes because you either didn't delve deeply enough to appreciate them, or you had extremely bad professors and no motivation for self-study. If electricity and magnetism was "plug-and-chug" for you then you did it wrong.
 
My favorites: Organic 2, Biology of Cancer, Immunology, Gen Chem 2
 
Science is cool. I fell in love with biology in high school, then I took as many cell/molecular bio courses as I could during undergrad and enjoyed most of them.

As far as chemistry and physics, I appreciate those fields a whole lot, but could never really get into them like I could with my bio classes.
 
GAH. This drives me crazy. I hear this from old high school friends who majored in the humanities ALL. THE. TIME.

You caricature your science classes because you either didn't delve deeply enough to appreciate them, or you had extremely bad professors and no motivation for self-study. If electricity and magnetism was "plug-and-chug" for you then you did it wrong.

Or you are just really good at it, in which case solving the integral you set up is the hardest part of the problem. I easily made an A in E&M but found the gnarly integrals to be a huge pain and it made the class feel like a lot of plug and chug. I would spend like 30 seconds "doing physics" and then 5 minutes slogging through math.
 
Also to the OP:

I don't think there is any reason to have to love undergrad sciences in order to get into medschool or a be a good physician. In fact the whole reason I changed majors and decided to go into medicine was because I hated many of my science courses.

Practicing modern medicine in not primarily about science, its about relating to another human being, evidence based care is making sure that a patients care is not determined primarily by your ability to do science. When you talk to physicians about the most challenging parts of their job, its never that they aren't smart enough to solve a science problem, it always has to do with making hard "human" decisions.
 
I love science. I took almost twice as many science classes as I needed to in highschool and I double majored in bio and physics in college.

Having said that, I don't think you need to enjoy any science other than medicine to do well in medical school. Your first year won't be fun but as long as you can push yourself to study stuff that you don't like you will do fine. Second year may be more enjoyable it may not, depending on where you consider the line between other sciences and medicine is and how well you learned the stuff that you disliked during first year.
 
Unfortunately I think the rote memorization found in biology courses is a product of how it's taught. Sadly, biology as a subject in undergraduate education is watered down (at least in the early classes) in a way that subjects like chemistry and physics are not. I certainly think it's possible to teach biology in a way that spurs critical thinking and creativity, but biology departments have caved into the expectations of the students who start out as bio majors because they think it's an "easier" science major.

Actually, I loved college biology. I was in the pre-research major, and most of it was experimental lab science and study design/reading research in each area of biology (we took the graduate courses for most of the major). Medical school, on the other hand, has been all rote memorization thus far and very watered down in the basic science courses :(
 
I was originally planning to be a marine biology researcher before I discovered that I would miss working directly with people (also, the job market is pretty horrid). Science is my first love - medicine is just a practical extension of science.

However, there are plenty of people in my class who made good grades without having any kind of passion for science (in fact, I think they hate the very essence of science in many ways). You don't have to love science to be a doctor.
 
I first discovered an interest in medicine when I took an AP biology course in high school. I loved nearly all of the science classes in undergrad, even organic (gasp).
 
The following are just my two cents. May be biased.

Biggest bullsh*t ever delivered to our kids: take a major you like in college.

Well, when you are 18 and showing up on an undergraduate campus as a freshman, you are only 48 months away from facing the tough job market and finding a career where you can bring home bread and butter. This is now even harder with all the crappy economy going on. You don't go to college to have fun. You don't go to college to fulfill the dreams you didn't fulfill in your teenager years. You don't go to college to get enlighened intelectually. You go to college to come out with some useful degree around your name so you can get a fairly well-paid job without a nasty boss.

That being said, can you imagine the difference between humanity majors and science/engineering majors? Compare a master degree in chemical engineering and European literature. I personally know a bunch of humanity Ph.D. roaming around, kissing the right asses, to get hired for something.

As a pre-med, you should always always have a backup plan. Medical school can never be guaranteed no matter how competitive you are. And having a science/engineering degree under your belt will make your life so much easier down the road. What if you don't like it? Pfff. You don't have to like your job. I was never really convinced that Michael Jordan actually likes playing basketball.
 
The following are just my two cents. May be biased.

Biggest bullsh*t ever delivered to our kids: take a major you like in college.

Well, when you are 18 and showing up on an undergraduate campus as a freshman, you are only 48 months away from facing the tough job market and finding a career where you can bring home bread and butter. This is now even harder with all the crappy economy going on. You don't go to college to have fun. You don't go to college to fulfill the dreams you didn't fulfill in your teenager years. You don't go to college to get enlighened intelectually. You go to college to come out with some useful degree around your name so you can get a fairly well-paid job without a nasty boss.

That being said, can you imagine the difference between humanity majors and science/engineering majors? Compare a master degree in chemical engineering and European literature. I personally know a bunch of humanity Ph.D. roaming around, kissing the right asses, to get hired for something.

As a pre-med, you should always always have a backup plan. Medical school can never be guaranteed no matter how competitive you are. And having a science/engineering degree under your belt will make your life so much easier down the road. What if you don't like it? Pfff. You don't have to like your job. I was never really convinced that Michael Jordan actually likes playing basketball.

Totally agree. I went to a high school with lots of wealthy kids, and a lot of them are floundering post-graduation because they took really (IMO) frivolous majors like musical theater and communications at random, unknown (and very expensive) private schools. College is for getting a job, not for becoming "enlightened". And what's more, I think enlightenment and truth come from really hard work, not from pretentious musings about literature.
 
Totally agree. I went to a high school with lots of wealthy kids, and a lot of them are floundering post-graduation because they took really (IMO) frivolous majors like musical theater and communications at random, unknown (and very expensive) private schools. College is for getting a job, not for becoming "enlightened". And what's more, I think enlightenment and truth come from really hard work, not from pretentious musings about literature.

Hm yes and no here. The original thing was about pre-med + science love. You can still go to med school with a humanities major provided you do well in the pre-med classes. The reason people push the do what you like is that the passion usually shines through. It's hard to be motivated if you don't like the major/what you're doing. And usually being super passionate about something leads to great things, rather than treating everything as a 9-5 and when can I go home yet.

Job wise I agree with you. That's why I'd tell someone to pick two majors - one you absolutely love and might have crappy job prospects, and another you can tolerate that has a lot better job prospects. I graduated with both a science and a humanities, and let me just say I couldn't get a job at Barnes and Noble for crappy pay but I got into pharma for a lot of $$.

My friend that graduated with poli sci/sociology worked temp job to temp job as an office secretary basically. He was luckier than most in that his temp job turned perm and now he does okay, but for a while his parents had to help.

I still think it's important to do what you love and that includes picking what major you like in college. I learned a lot from my humanities major and it was the reason I didn't hate my college experience. Just be smart about it and have a Plan B/C if Plan A in that major doesn't pan out.

Anyways, fair enough if that's your opinion :p, can't really say your opinion is wrong, but I don't share it.
 
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