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SgtDoc

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I am a California resident, but am currently living and going to school in Nevada (but maintaining my CA residency). I plan on applying to all of the UCs and a lot of other OOS schools, both public and private. Seeing how CA has so many great public med schools, do schools "discriminate" against OOS applicants from CA? Would I be better off switching my residency to Nevada? Or does it make no difference and all OOSers are considered equal?
 

horhay1241

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If I were you, I would switch to NV residency. I think with your stats you have a great chance at getting into UNR. But only a decent shot at a UC. Play the odds and go for UNR. As for the discrimination, I definitely get that feeling even during interviews. It's like they know you don't want to leave CA so they are doubting your reasons for going to their school. Thats just my opinion. Good luck!
 
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SgtDoc

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Two opposite opinions, but thanks! That MCAT score is just my first practice test before any studying, so I'm pretty confident that the real thing will be higher.
 

notdeadyet

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Seeing how CA has so many great public med schools, do schools "discriminate" against OOS applicants from CA?
UCSF and UCLA do not state an in-state bias, but both are majority in-state and both are very hard to get in to for anyone. UCSD has in state bias but allows OOS. UC Davis and UC Irivine both have very strong in-state preference (only a handful of OOS matriculants).
Would I be better off switching my residency to Nevada?
I seem to recall Nevada having a pretty strong in-state preference. And it's probably a les competitive school than the UC system.

But there's one big wildcard: in the UC's, you have multiple campuses/opportunities. One bad interview in Reno and you're done with Nevada.

California is tough, but folks make it out to be a bit worse than it is. At the end of the day, 2/3 of California medical school acceptees stay in California. It's competitive and tough, but it's like that lots of places.

Your GPA is higher than mine and your MCAT is about the same and I was happily accepted to a UC. I'd roll the dice if I were you, for the chance to go to some fantastic medical schools in a great state.

*** This is not a slam on Nevada, by the way. If Nevada is where your heart is, ignore my advice and jump ship there...
 

vicinihil

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yeah Ca residency hurts you. Most schools out of CA have plenty of other CA applicants so there is definitely a quota in place. However, in CA, your CA residency DEFINITELY helps.
 

horhay1241

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Two opposite opinions, but thanks! That MCAT score is just my first practice test before any studying, so I'm pretty confident that the real thing will be higher.

If that was your first practice MCAT, then I have to change my mind about this. If you can score 31+ (which you most likely will with that practice test) then I would go for a UC and keep your residency. People always say there are so many public schools in CA, but the competition is so high thats why I was saying UNR might be a better bet. But with your good stats, you should be very competitive. Good luck with the MCAT!
 

SgtDoc

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See, the problem is that I would prefer to go to an OOS school. If I got in to a UC and to somewhere out of state, I would probably not choose the UC...which is why I was thinking changing my residency to NV might help for other states. If only I could get Texas residency some how...
But seeing how the goal is to get into ANY med school, I suppose I'm better off keeping my CA residency and just hoping for the best as far as OOS goes.
 

notdeadyet

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See, the problem is that I would prefer to go to an OOS school. If I got in to a UC and to somewhere out of state, I would probably not choose the UC...which is why I was thinking changing my residency to NV might help for other states.
An OOS is an OOS in the eyes of a medical school. Whether you're from NV or CA will not impact admissions decisions in any schools outside of NV or CA. Don't worry about that.
 

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I'm kind of in the same boat as the OP, but wondering the reverse question. Is it worth getting CA residency if I'm OOS and interested in CA schools (I live in CA part-time, but am not a resident)? My stats are similar to OP, but with a bit higher GPA and 32 MCAT (1st practice test). Isn't it easier to get into CA schools if you're a resident?
 

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CA residency helps for all UC's except UCLA. However, CA residency hurts for schools outside CA because they assume you are using them as a back-up to a better and cheaper UC school.
 

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I am a California resident, but am currently living and going to school in Nevada (but maintaining my CA residency). I plan on applying to all of the UCs and a lot of other OOS schools, both public and private. Seeing how CA has so many great public med schools, do schools "discriminate" against OOS applicants from CA? Would I be better off switching my residency to Nevada? Or does it make no difference and all OOSers are considered equal?
I am not sure "discriminate" would be a correct term to use. What I think happens is, if you are a strong applicant, many out of state schools, especially those that are not in the top 10, will be naturally skeptical if you are sincerely interested in attending their expensive, oos school in the middle of nowhere. They know that if you have a very strong application, you are very likely to get into a UC school and stay in CA and pay cheaper tuition. Why would they waste their interview spot and an acceptance on someone who's not likely to attend?
 
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Mister Pie

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As a California resident with decent stats who is waitlisted at only one UC (and rejected from the others), I can offer anecdotal evidence that being a California resident kind of blows for med school applications.

Well, anecdotally, anyway.
 

SgtDoc

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I am not sure "discriminate" would be a correct term to use. What I think happens is, if you are a strong applicant, many out of state schools, especially those that are not in the top 10, will be naturally skeptical if you are sincerely interested in attending their expensive, oos school in the middle of nowhere. They know that if you have a very strong application, you are very likely to get into a UC school and stay in CA and pay cheaper tuition. Why would they waste their interview spot and an acceptance on someone who's not likely to attend?

And that's the problem...I would rather go OOS. Oh well, I guess I'll just have to see what happens. I mean, there are worse things in life than only being accepted to a UC! Of course, I still have to get accepted to a UC.
 

notdeadyet

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CA residency helps for all UC's except UCLA. However, CA residency hurts for schools outside CA because they assume you are using them as a back-up to a better and cheaper UC school.
Myth. Other than Harvard and JHU, every school is someone's back-up. The only mention I ever had of California residency when I interviewed out of state is "will you miss the California winters?"

They really and truly don't care about what state you're from if you're from out of state.
 

pntgrd

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Myth. Other than Harvard and JHU, every school is someone's back-up. The only mention I ever had of California residency when I interviewed out of state is "will you miss the California winters?"

They really and truly don't care about what state you're from if you're from out of state.

No. Two equally ranked schools, one a UC and one a school somewhere else, the student is much more likely to matriculate to the UC for location and cost reasons. Schools know that and are more reluctant to accept somebody who would lower their yield and US news rankings.
 

notdeadyet

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thats not true....its still a UC....read the numbers in the AMSAR...they take mostly CA kids!!!
UCLA and UCSF both do not have a stated preference for California residents. Their matriculants are majority Californian, but so is their application pool.

It still seems slightly skewed towards accepting Californians, but your stats need to be sky high anyway. Regardless, you'll probably have a better go at one of these schools as an OOS student than at UCD/UCI.
 

pntgrd

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thats not true....its still a UC....read the numbers in the AMSAR...they take mostly CA kids!!!

Being a UC doesn't mean it preferences CA residences. The MSAR and UCLA both clearly state they do not preference CA residents. Them taking more CA people is an obvious consequence of getting a hell of a lot more applications from CA residents and a hell of a lot more CA residents matriculating after getting in.
 

pntgrd

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UCLA and UCSF both do not have a stated preference for California residents. Their matriculants are majority Californian, but so is their application pool.

It still seems slightly skewed towards accepting Californians, but your stats need to be sky high anyway. Regardless, you'll probably have a better go at one of these schools as an OOS student than at UCD/UCI.

UCSF does have a CA preference, UCLA does not.
 

lil'trooper

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I would recommend getting residency in NV, if you don't mind going to med school in Nevada.

I applied in-state to all the UC's, got no interviews. Got 3 OOS interviews and am going to Wayne (unless I get off Pitt's waitlist.) But it would have been really nice to have a state school with lover scores to fall back on. When your in-state schools are some of the best in the country, it's really hard to get in. Especially now b/c the economy is shaky and more folks are applying to professional schools.
 

notdeadyet

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Two equally ranked schools, one a UC and one a school somewhere else, the student is much more likely to matriculate to the UC for location and cost reasons.
In general, I think students are more likely to attend their state school that an overpriced, equally priced OOS school. Check. I'd agree with you here.
Schools know that and are more reluctant to accept somebody who would lower their yield and US news rankings.
Schools have absolutely no idea where you've applied or where you've accepted. An OOS school will not assume you have been tagged for inteviews at a UC, much less been accepted to one.

Don't sweat it. You'll see when the time comes. You're either in state or out-of-state. Schools don't deliniate if you're from California vs. Oregon vs. Mississippi vs. wherever. At least, that wasn't my experience, nor the experience of anyone I've ever met who's been through this. If folks talk about prejudice against Californians, they're probably blowing steam at a bad cycle.
 
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Silk800

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I am not sure "discriminate" would be a correct term to use. What I think happens is, if you are a strong applicant, many out of state schools, especially those that are not in the top 10, will be naturally skeptical if you are sincerely interested in attending their expensive, oos school in the middle of nowhere. They know that if you have a very strong application, you are very likely to get into a UC school and stay in CA and pay cheaper tuition. Why would they waste their interview spot and an acceptance on someone who's not likely to attend?

I was definitely asked at a few interviews on the east coast why I would leave California to attend their school (pay more money, leave my family, etc). I guess I gave good enough responses to get accepted to a couple of them...To be honest, once I got into a UC, I withdrew from them pretty quickly. Not that I wasn't interested in them but I mean, they were right. Why would I pay a ton more money, uproot my life, leave california, etc, when I can get a good deal on a great education here? But there are Californians all over the place, at a lot of schools--so ADCOMs definitely know that many will go out of state.
 

searun

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Myth. Other than Harvard and JHU, every school is someone's back-up. The only mention I ever had of California residency when I interviewed out of state is "will you miss the California winters?"

They really and truly don't care about what state you're from if you're from out of state.

I would substitute Stanford for JHU. So you have the East Coast and the West Coast. Probably alot of east coast folks use JHU as a back up to Harvard. Stanford has almost the same cachet as Harvard but better weather and more laid back. Not that this is particularly relevant to the discussion but whatever.
 

nogolfinsnow

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I go to school in NY, and after NY, CA is by far the most represented state. My interviewer said they could easily fill every class with all CA residents. As to the question "why do you want to leave CA?" it can be a little tricky. I said "because I've already been rejected by every CA school." You can also honestly say that your goal is to become a physician, not to go to medical school in CA, and if becoming a physician means leaving CA for school then that's what you'll do. Or say you're young, this might be your best chance to see a different part of the country, etc. I was definitely not looked down on for being from CA.
 

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Schools know that and are more reluctant to accept somebody who would lower their yield and US news rankings.

I think if schools are reluctant to accept any OOS applicants, it is because those applicants failed to convey their interest in the school and their intent to attend rather than it being any assumptions made on the part of the adcoms. My East Coast interviewers were intent on finding out why I wanted to go to their school. It's the first question they opened with after the standard introductions. If an applicant can expressly convey their interest in the school, then I don't think it matters which state they were from as an OOS.
 

searun

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I go to school in NY, and after NY, CA is by far the most represented state. My interviewer said they could easily fill every class with all CA residents. As to the question "why do you want to leave CA?" it can be a little tricky. I said "because I've already been rejected by every CA school." You can also honestly say that your goal is to become a physician, not to go to medical school in CA, and if becoming a physician means leaving CA for school then that's what you'll do. Or say you're young, this might be your best chance to see a different part of the country, etc. I was definitely not looked down on for being from CA.


I left California when I was 12 years old. I can honestly say it was the best thing that ever happened to me. I moved to Oregon and started fly fishing for trout and camping along trout streams, and when I was a teenager, I learned how to manuever a McKenzie River river boat like a guide, and drifted Oregon rivers and caught steelhead trout on a fly, what is better than that, backpacking into the mountains of Oregon in the summer, and snowboarding big mountains in the winter.

So it would not be difficult for me to explain why I wanted to leave California. I would just say, yeah, I did leave Cali and it worked out for me. I went back a few times to play soccer in some tournaments in high school, good weather, good soccer fields, but not a fan of the whole scene down there. I just never figured out why people who live in So Cal would buy Mercedes SUV since the roads never have snow. Why have a SUV if you never put it in 4 wheel drive. People in Oregon actually put it in 4 wheel drive once in awhile. But LA, no way. And why do so many people in San Diego have 4 wheel drive SUV vehicles. News flash, it never snows in San Diego. Oh, wait, they ski at Aspen. But, no, they fly to Denver and rent a car. So sure, go green and save the planet.
 

pntgrd

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I think if schools are reluctant to accept any OOS applicants, it is because those applicants failed to convey their interest in the school and their intent to attend rather than it being any assumptions made on the part of the adcoms. My East Coast interviewers were intent on finding out why I wanted to go to their school. It's the first question they opened with after the standard introductions. If an applicant can expressly convey their interest in the school, then I don't think it matters which state they were from as an OOS.

So what are you supposed to say at an east coast interview at say, Jefferson, when they ask why you'd go there over UCLA or UCSF? I think they know you are using them as a safety.
 

notdeadyet

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So what are you supposed to say at an east coast interview at say, Jefferson, when they ask why you'd go there over UCLA or UCSF? I think they know you are using them as a safety.
If you have a strong app, Jefferson might be happy to accept you on the very real possibility that you won't get in to UCLA or UCSF. No more than a couple hundred Californians get in to those two schools. Odds are you won't be one of them. Jefferson isn't taking a bad gamble here.

Besides, few schools in my experience ask what other schools you've interviewed at. When they do, they're fine with you saying, "I've applied fairly broadly and I'm very prepared to leave the state to attend Jefferson. I'm interested in your program because...." Telling a school where else you're interviewing is a zero sum game. Don't play it. You won't be penalized.
 

SketchLazy

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So what are you supposed to say at an east coast interview at say, Jefferson, when they ask why you'd go there over UCLA or UCSF?

I really don't know. In my interviews, they didn't put me on the spot like that. Asking me why I want to go to their school is completely different from them asking a question that implies they are my safety. Ironically, the only school that asked me where else I interviewed was a California school. The interviewer was very casual about it and was fine with an answer similar to what Notdeadyet posted.
 
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SgtDoc

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So it sounds like as long as I can get the point across that I'm hoping to go out of state (except to the CA schools!) it shouldn't be a major problem.
 

pntgrd

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OK, I just looked at your numbers. Unless you raise your MCAT, you will have a very very slight chance of getting into a UC as a non-URM, so it would be to your advantage not to be a CA resident so that you have a shot at NV state school.
 

notdeadyet

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OK, I just looked at your numbers. Unless you raise your MCAT, you will have a very very slight chance of getting into a UC as a non-URM, so it would be to your advantage not to be a CA resident so that you have a shot at NV state school.
Disagree. His GPA is above average for most UCs. His MCAT is a little below average.

And an average is just that: an average. People get in with below the average all the time. With a 29/30 MCAT you still have a real shot with the UCs. So long as you have some good life experience. His years in the Marines will give him something to talk about and set him apart from 3/4 of the applicants who will be 22 year old bio majors fresh out of colllege.
 

SgtDoc

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OK, I just looked at your numbers. Unless you raise your MCAT, you will have a very very slight chance of getting into a UC as a non-URM, so it would be to your advantage not to be a CA resident so that you have a shot at NV state school.

That MCAT score is my first practice test with no studying whatsoever, so I'm fairly confident it will be higher.
 

pntgrd

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Look on MDapplicants, talk to people. With an MCAT of 30 or lower, it is very very hard to get into a UC. Don't listen to the other poster who says you have a real shot. Your GPA and marine experience will help, but it would still be very hard unless you bring it up.
 

SgtDoc

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Look on MDapplicants, talk to people. With an MCAT of 30 or lower, it is very very hard to get into a UC. Don't listen to the other poster who says you have a real shot. Your GPA and marine experience will help, but it would still be very hard unless you bring it up.

I agree with you- But if 29 is my baseline, I don't see how a few months of studying wouldn't improve that by at least a couple of points at the minimum. I guess I'll get a better estimate once I take another practice test. I know you are using my score of 29 since that's all you have to go by, and given that score, I do agree with you.
 

slidingDoors

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I have not read all the posts on here so sorry if this is redundent. After my interview experiences this year I would recommend that if you want to go to an OOS school that is not in california you should preferably not be a california resident. Although this is never explicitly stated I have a strong feeling that there is a bias against Californians that is not to their advantage. I'm not saying this for all out of state schools but at every interview that I was at they asked me why I want to leave Cali, and some interviewers continually poked at that question. I'd say it doesn't hurt to be from Cali but its better to not be from Cali if you apply out of Cali in my opinion. Good Luck.
 

notdeadyet

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Look on MDapplicants, talk to people. With an MCAT of 30 or lower, it is very very hard to get into a UC.
It is hard to get in to a UC with just about any grades/MCAT. UCs have their fill of applicants, so they can be choosy. Folk with killer numbers get turned down every year.
Don't listen to the other poster who says you have a real shot.
Uh, unlike spouting theory/opnions/fears/rumors, the "other poster" is actually currently a med student at a UC who got in with a 30 or lower MCAT and a lower GPA than the OP. So it's definitely possible if you have good outside experiences that medical school will value.

Bringing up his MCAT is a great idea, but he has a shot regardless. I'm living proof. So are many folks I know with MCAT scores of 30 or below that are here at the UC with me now. So you can nay say all you want, and I'm sure it looks impossible when you're applying from undergrad and hearing horror stories, but it happens every day. Sorry to disappoint.

Anyway, OP, good luck with your cycle. Apply broadly regardless and for the love of god don't try to blend in. Especially with the UCs. They are very much a beyond the numbers schools. They have high average stats, but you get folks much higher and much lower, assuming you have a story to tell. Best of luck.
 

SgtDoc

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Anyway, OP, good luck with your cycle. Apply broadly regardless and for the love of god don't try to blend in. Especially with the UCs. They are very much a beyond the numbers schools. They have high average stats, but you get folks much higher and much lower, assuming you have a story to tell. Best of luck.

Thank you. I will be applying broadly (as you can see from my MDApps)...right now I have 40 schools and want to cut that by quite a bit, and I'm sure switch some out for others.
 

alwaysaangel

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California is tough, but folks make it out to be a bit worse than it is. At the end of the day, 2/3 of California medical school acceptees stay in California. It's competitive and tough, but it's like that lots of places.

Oh, out of curiosity may I ask where you got this stat? I'm curious to see the new numbers. When I applied 50% of CA applicants got into med school and 50% of those stayed in CA.
 

TheRealMD

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Thank you. I will be applying broadly (as you can see from my MDApps)...right now I have 40 schools and want to cut that by quite a bit, and I'm sure switch some out for others.

Unless your MCAT hits 34/35, cut all the Texas schools. It's a separate app and Texas schools have to take 90% in-state residents. Now, you're down to 33 schools!
 

Mister Pie

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I definitely agree that CA schools seem to be more than stats, though obviously the lower they are the more incredible your ECs better be to make up for what you lack in numbers. Referencing my previous post in this thread though, I will say that I had several friends who had good ECs, great numbers, and ultimately were unable to stay in California because they 0 acceptances (and in some cases, 0 interviews). They ended up going to "top 20" schools, which seems to indicate to me that they were fairly competitive applicants. There aren't any guarantees really in med school admissions and being a California resident really seems to amplify that quite a bit.
 
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I definitely agree that CA schools seem to be more than stats, though obviously the lower they are the more incredible your ECs better be to make up for what you lack in numbers. Referencing my previous post in this thread though, I will say that I had several friends who had good ECs, great numbers, and ultimately were unable to stay in California because they 0 acceptances (and in some cases, 0 interviews). They ended up going to "top 20" schools, which seems to indicate to me that they were fairly competitive applicants. There aren't any guarantees really in med school admissions and being a California resident really seems to amplify that quite a bit.

Your MDapps looks great. Any idea on why you haven't had more acceptances.
 

notdeadyet

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Oh, out of curiosity may I ask where you got this stat? I'm curious to see the new numbers. When I applied 50% of CA applicants got into med school and 50% of those stayed in CA.
I have no idea. I thought it was from one of the AMCAS data tables but I could be wrong.

50/50 could very well be the right figure now, alwaysaangel. Since more folks are now applying to medical school, I would think actually more Californians would be leaving the state to go to school. But that would be a guess on my part.
 

notdeadyet

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Thank you. I will be applying broadly (as you can see from my MDApps)...right now I have 40 schools and want to cut that by quite a bit,
Don't cut it by too much. I applied to 37 schools and everyone thought I was insane, but I ended up with five interviews. And two of those were from schools who would have made the cut if I trimmed to 25. You only want to go through this once.
and I'm sure switch some out for others.
For your list...
- if you can't get your MCAT above 31, I'd drop Mayo, Duke and the Texas schools.
- since you're open to VA, did you consider EVMS? Good school with easier admissions than UVa.
 

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I have no idea. I thought it was from one of the AMCAS data tables but I could be wrong.

50/50 could very well be the right figure now, alwaysaangel. Since more folks are now applying to medical school, I would think actually more Californians would be leaving the state to go to school. But that would be a guess on my part.

Oh, ok. I wasn't trying to be rude or anything - my numbers were pretty old so I thought maybe some new ones were out.
 

notdeadyet

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Oh, ok. I wasn't trying to be rude or anything - my numbers were pretty old so I thought maybe some new ones were out.
Nah, I didn't think you were being rude. Most of my info has started to get stale too. We've got other fish to fry.
 
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