doing it all again . . .

[jdub]

---

Members don't see this ad.

hey,
i was just wondering who all out there is a second year applicant, or a third year, etc? i think that it would be kind of cool to post some info for anyone who wants to listen, seeing how we have already gone through the process once, we may be able to help ourselves and others who are doing it for the first time. any advice, inspiration, or chit-chat might be interesting too.

i hope that this does not brake any rules or anything, but i think a big part of this medium is to put out info that can comfort and help people.

with that said . . . i also think that it is a good idea to reveal ones profile, at least as much as one is comfortable with, so that other people have an idea of whom is applying where and how they are doing in the whole process. i think that it is intersting to know, perhaps, where one stands in a certain crowd. if this helps out anyone, great, if not, well . . .

btw i applied to 13 schools last year, got an interview at mcp and univ of wash wwami program. got rejected from mcp and was the 9th alternate for u of w.

this year i am applying to 19 schools, even st georges in granada, i am applying to a lot more practical schools with respect to my gpa and mcats, which are 3.51 and a 32.
i have little research experience, but i have volunteered over a year in an er in seattle (harborview, for all who have been there), and i have spent an academic school year in ecuador, so i speak a little more than a little spanish, and i ran for a couple of years on the x-country and track teams at udub. i also have a double degree in zoology and psychology, and i am a caucasian male for those intersted in that.

hope this is useful and take care 😀

 

[mongoose]

I totally agree that this kind of info would be comforting/helpful. So here goes with mine. I applied to 24 schools, all on the east coast and they are of great variety, ranging from Yale and Dartmouth to East Tennesse State and Meharry (I AM from Tn.). I am non-traditional in that I am 24, almost 25 years old. I went to college the first time because my parents forced me to (I wanted to join the Air Force, but graduated high school at 17) and my grades were horrific (about 2.45 gpa) although I did manage to get a Business Administration degree. Well, to make a long story short, worked in the business profession as a supervisor for a couple of years and decided I didn't like it after all (no surprise since it wasn't my first choice). Well, since my father believes so heavily in education, he convinced me I should just go back to school and try something else (He is the greatest). This time I came back with a vengeance. My gpa at my new school is about 3.7 and this includes virtually all of my pre-reqs for med school. Also a 30 (10,10,10,o) MCAT. So I guess I am hoping some higher level school (e.g.Yale, Dartmouth) will have mercy on me with regard to my youthful indiscretions and if not, I am sure a 30 MCAT and proof that I am capable of an outstanding gpa will convince some school I am worthy of a spot in their incoming class.

 

[imtiaz]

With a 3.51 and a 32 you should be OK for US medical schools! Good luck!

Originally posted by jdub:
•hey,
i was just wondering who all out there is a second year applicant, or a third year, etc? i think that it would be kind of cool to post some info for anyone who wants to listen, seeing how we have already gone through the process once, we may be able to help ourselves and others who are doing it for the first time. any advice, inspiration, or chit-chat might be interesting too.

i hope that this does not brake any rules or anything, but i think a big part of this medium is to put out info that can comfort and help people.

with that said . . . i also think that it is a good idea to reveal ones profile, at least as much as one is comfortable with, so that other people have an idea of whom is applying where and how they are doing in the whole process. i think that it is intersting to know, perhaps, where one stands in a certain crowd. if this helps out anyone, great, if not, well . . .

btw i applied to 13 schools last year, got an interview at mcp and univ of wash wwami program. got rejected from mcp and was the 9th alternate for u of w.

this year i am applying to 19 schools, even st georges in granada, i am applying to a lot more practical schools with respect to my gpa and mcats, which are 3.51 and a 32.
i have little research experience, but i have volunteered over a year in an er in seattle (harborview, for all who have been there), and i have spent an academic school year in ecuador, so i speak a little more than a little spanish, and i ran for a couple of years on the x-country and track teams at udub. i also have a double degree in zoology and psychology, and i am a caucasian male for those intersted in that.

hope this is useful and take care 😀•

 

[jdub]

hey ai,
i think that all of those experiences you have had are great. when you are a physician, i imagine that they will help keep you grounded, knowing that there is a lot more out there than meets the eye. . .

also i think that reapplying shows a lot of determination and desire, i am really suprised that you did not have much luck the second year around, have you been updating your letters of rec and re-writing your personal essay? your numbers and experience seem really strong, the kind of stuff that i personally think are really important, because it is not a given that the smartest people make the best doctors . . .

i wish you the best 😀

 

[gmendese]

I'm just contributing my part to this thread:

I am on my second year of applications and am still on two wait lists. I am ready to begin my application for 2002 soon, which will make it my third consecutive year applying. Last year I was wait-listed, too, but it never worked out.

I graduated with a 3.82 from the Univ. of Mass. and majored in Microbiology. My MCAT, however, was a different story. I took Kaplan, and throughout the course, my scores improved DRAMATICALLY. On the last two tests, I scored a 42 and 43 respectively. They even offered me a job to teach there, which I eventually accepted. I'm not kidding either. I have no need to joke about this. Well, I am a wicked (see my Boston accent coming out?) stressball and couldn't get it together on the MCAT. I read WAY to quickly and couldn't absorb a thing. I scored a 7 on verbal, which is what my advisors and me think is keeping me out, considering that I stated on my application that I was an MCAT teacher - it looks a little suspicious when you get a 7 and say you're a teacher, you know? Even though my boss at Kaplan sent me a letter of recommendation, it didn't matter much. Well, that's my spiel. I know it must be the MCAT that's keeping me out because when I interview I do fine - I've gotten wait listed at both (yes, only 2) schools I've gone to for interviews. THe problem is, I'm not getting invited to too many of them.

If I don't get in this year, I'm going to take the AUgust MCAT (which I've already signed up for) and hopefully tear it to shreds!

 

[kutastha]

This is my third time applying. My first was as a senior at UCSD. I took the MCAT in August of 94 and at the beginning of the test, the needle from my insulin pump fell out. So I had to take the whole test holding the damn needle in my belly. 🙄 I got a 29R: 7V, 11P, 10B. With a 3.23 GPA as a chem/biochem major, this got me nowhere. I applied to 25 schools and got four secondaries, no interviews.

My second time applying was during my year getting an MS in Chem. I retook the MCAT in August of 1996 and was able to pick up my score to a 34S (9V, 14P, 11B). My grad GPA was a 3.6, and I TAed, worked in a lab and did some volunteer work. I applied to 20 schools, got 8 secondaries, no interviews.

Now, after that, I pretty much resigned myself to the fact that being a physican may not be for me. I applied to USC for a PhD in molecular biology. The graduate school for USC is at the medical school, so it was always picking at the back of my mind that I could try again after getting my PhD. Now it's that time. I've chalked up many personal experiences with student government, working in a cancer hospital, a fellowship, publications, volunteering et al. I took the MCAT this past April and got an 11V, 12P, 13B and an R on the writing. I'm applying to 25 schools and am keeping my fingers crossed that this will be the time. We shall see.

Andrew

 

[imtiaz]

Wow, your story is pretty similar to mine. Although I had much lower stats! I applied for the first time last year with a 2.67 and a 31M. I'm not shooting for top 10 or anything so my MCAT is fine. I just need to up my GPA. I too am enrolling in a masters program in Chemistry this year. While it won't be on my AMCAS, I hope that schools will accept transcripts of my graduate coursework later on in the year as they are reviewing my file. I have lots of volunteer experiences, etc. I applied to 25 schools, 8 secondaries, no interviews. I'm applyng again for 2002, let's see what happens. Good luck to you though, I truly hope you get in this time.

Originally posted by ajr:
•This is my third time applying. My first was as a senior at UCSD. I took the MCAT in August of 94 and at the beginning of the test, the needle from my insulin pump fell out. So I had to take the whole test holding the damn needle in my belly. 🙄 I got a 29R: 7V, 11P, 10B. With a 3.23 GPA as a chem/biochem major, this got me nowhere. I applied to 25 schools and got four secondaries, no interviews.

My second time applying was during my year getting an MS in Chem. I retook the MCAT in August of 1996 and was able to pick up my score to a 34S (9V, 14P, 11B). My grad GPA was a 3.6, and I TAed, worked in a lab and did some volunteer work. I applied to 20 schools, got 8 secondaries, no interviews.

Now, after that, I pretty much resigned myself to the fact that being a physican may not be for me. I applied to USC for a PhD in molecular biology. The graduate school for USC is at the medical school, so it was always picking at the back of my mind that I could try again after getting my PhD. Now it's that time. I've chalked up many personal experiences with student government, working in a cancer hospital, a fellowship, publications, volunteering et al. I took the MCAT this past April and got an 11V, 12P, 13B and an R on the writing. I'm applying to 25 schools and am keeping my fingers crossed that this will be the time. We shall see.

Andrew•

 

[kd]

OK guys, there is hope! I had to apply three times myself before I finally got in. Like many of you, I had good stats - MCAT in the mid-30's, undergrad GPA 3.6 (3.3 science), graduate GPA 4.0.
My suggestion is to try to find out what might have gone wrong with your application- contact your pre-med advisor and the schools that rejected you and ask for advice on what they thought your weaknesses were and how you might improve. Get all the feedback you can, from as many people as you can.
If you've been offered interviews, that's a good sign: that means the school considers your stats to be competitive- you just didn't quite make the final cut. Find out what your weaknesses are and go fix them.
In my case, one of my weaknesses was a relatively low science GPA (3.3) due mainly to one horrific semester earlier in undergrad. Since that was 8 years previously and my grades since then were stellar, I thought the med schools would look past that. But when I asked, one school told me my science GPA was too low. Apparently, with thousands of highly qualified applicants, a lot of schools will weed you out based on stats alone. So when I applied the third time, I wrote a letter addressing what happened that semester and sent it in with each secondary. In addition, I took extra upper-level science classes and aced them to show I could do the work.
Another weakness, identified by an admissions rep at another school, was insufficient clinical experience. So I quit my job and took a full-time position volunteering as a nursing assistant at a senior clinic. It was a major financial hardship, but it was 1) great fun, 2) very rewarding and 3) helped to demonstrate my ongoing commitment to medicine. Best of all, working with patients is what gave me the motivation to keep trying- there is no better cure for rejection than having patients tell you that they know you'll make a great doctor!
I met with my pre-med advisor, who reviewed my file and reassured me that there were no red flags in my letters of recommendation. Still, I obtained a couple of new letters, as well as an additional reference from the physician I had worked for.
Finally, I got lots of people to critique my personal statement and revised it to make it more effective.
The third time, I had my choice of schools - I got 4 interviews, 3 acceptances (Rochester, Albany, and East Tennessee State) and 1 waitlist (Dartmouth.) I'll be starting at East Tennessee in a few days. I'm glad I didn't give up!

mongoose- If you're interested in ETSU, I know they look favorably upon reapplicants. One of the M1's I met at my interview got in on the 3rd try as well. Call or email Mike Stephens in the Admissions Office- he's a really nice guy and will be glad to review your file for you.
Realize that admissions to ETSU is actually more competitive than you might think because of the small class size (60 versus 160 for Memphis) and the primary care mission. The school is especially interested in admitting applicants with a demonstrated interest in primary care medicine. If you're more interested in attending "some higher level school"- this may have come across as arrogance in your interviews- maybe ditto for Meharry? I apologize if I'm off-base and I certainly don't mean to offend- just trying to help.

Hope this helps - good luck and don't give up!

 

[kris]

I had to apply twice because my premed advisors told me I was in a prime position to apply from my graduate program. I'm still bitter about the bad advising.

AI, you CAN get admission advice from some med schools. The school at which I'm matriculating (UNMC) even offered me a 'post-rejection review'. I flew out and met with someone from the admissions committee, and she told me exactly what was wrong with my app and what I needed to do to get in. She noted in my file that I attended such a meeting, which she said strengthened my app in itself.

Other schools are also receptive to offering such advice over the phone, but not all.

best wishes,
--kris

 

[Amy B]

AJR,

I don't understand how you could have been turned down with such a good stats record. Were you ever given a reason as to why any of those schools didn't accept you?

 

[kd]

ai- I started off by sending a letter to each of the schools that rejected me. One of them (Pitt) didn't reply at all, so I called them up and was told that, as a rule, they don't provide feedback to applicants. The other schools all replied, either by letter or phone.
I think sending a letter initially is less intrusive and they can then route the letter to whomever in their office is responsible for talking to applicants. However, if you've already re-applied this year, I probably wouldn't do it now. Check with a pre-med advisor or someone in the know- not sure how that would be perceived.

 

[kutastha]

Originally posted by Amy Beth:
•AJR,

I don't understand how you could have been turned down with such a good stats record. Were you ever given a reason as to why any of those schools didn't accept you?•

I was never given an explicit reason from the med schools. All I would get from them is the 'too many qualified applicants, not enough spaces'. Many people have looked at my application and said it was decent enough to get an interview. I'm most fascinated as to why I didn't even get that.

There's only two reasons I could think of that this happened. The first is that one of my recommendation letters may have not been too hot. The second is that in my personal essay I mentioned I was diabetic. I never thought anything of it until an undergrad that worked in my lab said her mother once worked in an admissions office at USC. She said that adcoms may look at the disease as a 'life-shortening illness' and that I would only be able to contribute a relatively short amount of time to the medical field. I knew this was BS, but the adcoms wouldn't. I've had five long years to think about it, and that's about all I could come up with.

Andrew

 

[mongoose]

kd -- thanks for the insight. actually, ETSU is one of my first couple of choices as I want to do primary care. That is addressed in my personal statement and practice vision. So, I am desperately hoping good things will happen for me. I will definitely contact the guy in admissions. Again thanks for the advice. BTW although I would love to get into a "great" school for other reasons (a high school teacher that said I would never amount to anything...would just love to call her up and tell her I made it into med school) I consider any med school more than adequate.

 

[Ai]

kris,

What was the situation with your graduate program?

 

[gmendese]

Ai,
Thanks so much for your encouragement and your advice. I'm going to take you up on that - on MCAT day (if I need to retake it), I'll do just what you suggested. I hope it helps!

Gary

 

[kris]

Originally posted by Ai:
•kris,

What was the situation with your graduate program?•

It wasn't clear that I would be finished.

 

[Ai]

kris,

I asked because I am currently in a graduate program as well. It is a 4 year masters program for Oriental medicine. I have never planned on getting a degree, I just wanted some background in Eastern medicine. I am only in my first year of the program. I planned it so that I would get a solid foundation (2 years) and then start Western med school.

Do you think this hurt you because they thought you were dropping out in the middle of your program?

 

[ckent]

Originally posted by Ai:
•kris,

I asked because I am currently in a graduate program as well. It is a 4 year masters program for Oriental medicine. I have never planned on getting a degree, I just wanted some background in Eastern medicine. I am only in my first year of the program. I planned it so that I would get a solid foundation (2 years) and then start Western med school.

Do you think this hurt you because they thought you were dropping out in the middle of your program?•

If it is a US masters program, then yes, I believe that this will hurt your chances for admission if you were still enrolled in the program at the time of applying. It may even hurt your chances just dropping out early right before you apply, I'm not sure about that though. Most medical schools don't "poach". Poach is a term used to describe picking students for their class that are currently enrolled in or in the middle of another graduate program. It is considered poor ettiquette to poach.

 

[Ai]

CKent,

Thanks for the quick response. I can't believe I didn't think of this before now. It was never my intention to complete the graduate program, in fact, my original interest was in the Oriental body therapist program but the admissions counselor suggested I enroll in the masters program because I could take any class I wanted and I would be eligible for financial aid. I am still enrolled and have already applied.

Do you have any suggestions as to how I might rememdy this situation?

 

[ckent]

Originally posted by Ai:
•CKent,

Thanks for the quick response. I can't believe I didn't think of this before now. It was never my intention to complete the graduate program, in fact, my original interest was in the Oriental body therapist program but the admissions counselor suggested I enroll in the masters program because I could take any class I wanted and I would be eligible for financial aid. I am still enrolled and have already applied.

Do you have any suggestions as to how I might rememdy this situation?•

Why don't find out if med schools care if you have already dropped out of the program by the time that you apply. If you are applying this year, then starting your program this year might present a problem. I can't remember the specifics about what I read about poaching, I either read about it somewhere or I might have heard an adcom talk about poaching, whatever my source, I got the information over a year ago and was not really paying attention at the time as it did not apply to me. I think that the first step would be to confirm what I've told you about poaching in terms of a master program, because med schools might look differently upon a masters program versus another doctorate program. I think that I do remember reading something about med schools not wanting to poach from masters programs too, I don't really remember. You might try e-mailin your pre-med advisor and double checking by calling or e-mailing a med school adcom (you can always call anonymously or make up a name) to figure out what you need to do. Try to confirm information from multiple sources though, because pre-med advisors don't know everything and can sometimes give out very poor advice. You can also start a new thread on poaching and see if anybody else knows anything about it but always remember to take "advice" you get here with a grain of salt, you never know who your source is or how knowledgeable they are on the subject.

 

[Ai]

CKent,

Thanks for your help, I'll look into it 🙂

 

[emdeetwobee]

Now I'm a bit nervous. I have a good GPA from a state school and a good MCAT score, but I have done nothing medically related except volunteering. I did apply to a wide range of schools. Are there any more who had good stats but were ultimately not accepted in medical school?

 

[USeF]

Originally posted by Ai:
•I had wanted to live abroad for a long time and decided to put med school off for a year... I'm 26, was a dance major undergrad and, as I said above, spent a year teaching English in Japan. •

Ai, thank you for applying again to medical school. As a 20 yr old, I would be very happy to have someone as non-traditional as you for a classmate 🙂

My 'final frontier' of places to travel is the far east. A program to teach in one of these countries is exactly what I' thinking about doing during a deffered year if I get accepted this first round. Please e-mail me at [email protected] so you can further explain your experience and possibly offer suggestions/advice about teaching abroad.

 

[kris]

Originally posted by Ai:
•kris,

I asked because I am currently in a graduate program as well. It is a 4 year masters program for Oriental medicine. I have never planned on getting a degree, I just wanted some background in Eastern medicine. I am only in my first year of the program. I planned it so that I would get a solid foundation (2 years) and then start Western med school.

Do you think this hurt you because they thought you were dropping out in the middle of your program?•

I was nearing the end of a PhD program. I'm not sure if they thought I was going to drop out, but I do know that I didn't make it clear enough to them that I would finish, despite putting a grad date on my AMCAS. Honestly, I was ambivalent about finishing. In addition, I was in the humanities, and my science courses were long in the past. Despite my MCAT scores, they also wanted more recent science courses. As far as that goes, I think they made the right decision, and I said as much when they asked me about it. (I'm still bitter about my pre-med advising 🙂 )

I did, however, get told in person and in writing that being currently enrolled in the grad program was a big issue. For you, not having an appropriate intended graduation date is a very big concern.

I think one poster's idea of getting a letter from your advisor explaining why you were encouraged to go the route you did would be helpful. Definitely contact the schools and investigate the options mentioned, including the "drop out" option backed by a letter.

I sincerely wish you the best of luck,
--kris

 

[tucker]

I totally agree with what has been mentioned previously- definitely contact schools which rejected you & try to set up an appointment to speak with their admissions director. I did this- and was totally surprised to hear the reason for my rejection from one school! Without that information, I would have reapplied without having added what they were looking for (non-health care related volunteering)! They told me that applicants frequently reapply having improved things that were already fine. I was lucky enough to be able to get in to a school on my first try with only a decent MCAT and GPA. It is one of my state schools, and I just really made sure they knew how much I wanted to go there- kept calling, writing, updating, etc. Anything I could think of, really!!