DOs and AMA/AOA/ACGME General Surgery Residencies

[Plinko]

This issue may have been discussed elsewhere on this forum, but I could not find it after doing a search. If it has, I would appreciate a link to it. With that said, I would like a little input about the problems DO students encounter in obtaining a surgical residency (vascular, CTS, and general). I have asked many people at my school (TCOM) and very few seem to be informed. We are such a primary care oriented school, so finding information about the ins and outs of getting a surgery slot is hard to come by.

I am half way through my third year and I have surgery as my last rotation (in May and June). Additionally, I have what we at TCOM call a "max" in surgery, which means I can choose to arrange my rotation location on my own wherever I want. I would really like to know more about what I should be doing in preparation for filling out applications come next Fall. A little bit of background: COMLEX 1 score was just average (pretty much right atop the bell curve); class rank the same; performed pretty well on clinical rotations thus far. I have not taken USMLE Step 1 yet because I was unsure as to whether or not it was needed. I plan on taking USMLE Step 2. Based on match results from my school (TCOM keeps tabs on students' class rank, COMLEX scores, etc. and where students go for residency, and then makes them available to current students), I am confident I can obtain an AOA general surgery residency. However, I am completely in the dark about whether or not I should try for ACGME or AMA surgical residencies, take the USMLE Step 1, etc. Lastly, while I hear consistently that surgery is a very competitive field to get into, I also hear that many surgical sites go unfilled. I am unable to resolve this apparent contradiction.

Any input would be greatly appreciated.

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[DO_Surgeon]

This issue may have been discussed elsewhere on this forum, but I could not find it after doing a search. If it has, I would appreciate a link to it. With that said, I would like a little input about the problems DO students encounter in obtaining a surgical residency (vascular, CTS, and general). I have asked many people at my school (TCOM) and very few seem to be informed. We are such a primary care oriented school, so finding information about the ins and outs of getting a surgery slot is hard to come by.

I am half way through my third year and I have surgery as my last rotation (in May and June). Additionally, I have what we at TCOM call a "max" in surgery, which means I can choose to arrange my rotation location on my own wherever I want. I would really like to know more about what I should be doing in preparation for filling out applications come next Fall. A little bit of background: COMLEX 1 score was just average (pretty much right atop the bell curve); class rank the same; performed pretty well on clinical rotations thus far. I have not taken USMLE Step 1 yet because I was unsure as to whether or not it was needed. I plan on taking USMLE Step 2. Based on match results from my school (TCOM keeps tabs on students' class rank, COMLEX scores, etc. and where students go for residency, and then makes them available to current students), I am confident I can obtain an AOA general surgery residency. However, I am completely in the dark about whether or not I should try for ACGME or AMA surgical residencies, take the USMLE Step 1, etc. Lastly, while I hear consistently that surgery is a very competitive field to get into, I also hear that many surgical sites go unfilled. I am unable to resolve this apparent contradiction.

Any input would be greatly appreciated.

I went through a similar situation last year. I too only took the COMLEX and did not take the USMLE and was trying to decide if I had a shot in the ACGME world. General Surgery from what I can gather was not all that competitive a few years back but that has changed for what ever reason. Yes many spots go unfilled each year but these are not categorical positions, there is a difference between categorical and preliminary positions, with categorical positions pretty much lock you into a PGY2 spot and preliminary means you wait and see if one opens up the following year. I decided not to go back and retake the USMLE step 1 and try to find the best AOA programs I could. I rotated at Grandview in Dayton and Doctors in Columbus and think both programs are pretty solid. At Doctors as a resident you spend 1/2 of you time at Doctors and 1/2 at Grant which is a level 1 center. Also you do a few rotations at Ohio State in Hepatobiliary and transplant. I think many of the programs in Michigan are pretty good as well. If you want to do an ACGME residency I would say it is a MUST to take the USMLE step 1 and score well so PDs are comparing apples to apples, being a DO you are already behind the curve a bit when trying to get into the MD surgery world. That statement is not true for all specialties, but it seems to still exist when it comes to surgery. With that being said, if you are interested in vascular or CT, which I am, I think the opportunity is there to obtain an ACGME fellowship since neither of those fields are all that competitive at the moment, but who knows what medicine will be like in 5-10 years. The problem you may run into, which I am tyring to find the answer, is will you be able to sit for the boards in Vascular or whatever after completing an AOA GS residency and an ACGME fellowship. I guess my feeling is if you want to be a competent general surgeon or enter one of the "less competitive" subspecialties then an AOA residency shouldnt be much of a problem. And if you want plastics....Do an ACGME residency and pray alot!

 

[Plinko]

Thanks for the info DO Surgeon. Please post what you find out definitively about the ACGME fellowship. Good luck.