Duke decision, part 2

[omores]

I'll begin anew, since the old thread seems not to be functioning. Poor Lilycat was cut off in mid-sentence, just as she was on the verge of revealing something potentially life-changing. WHAT must I "realiz", O lilycat, WHAT?

Christiangirl, I've been thinking about your predicament. Since the admissions office isn't being very accomodating, what I'd suggest is this: try to get in touch with someone on the committee itself, for example the person whose name appears on your "alternate" letter. Explain your situation. Maybe she will be able to give you some idea of how much chance you have of making it off the waitlist. She wouldn't need to reveal your actual rank, but she could certainly tell you APPROXIMATELY how good your chances are.

You could also ask her about how Duke feels about people who decline acceptances in one admissions cycle and apply again in the next one. She might tell you that Duke sees that as indicative of skewed priorities, in which case you'd know not to risk it. Or she might tell you that Duke sees it as evidence of integrity and an unwillingness to settle, which would mean they'd be extra receptive if you applied again next year. Or she might just be really vague. But I think it would help you to talk to someone who is actually involved with making those decisions.

Bon chance.

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[Crafty]

omores --

Very good suggestion (I'm taking the liberty of using your same advice). The only thing is that our "alternate list" letters were signed by Dr. Armstrong, the Director of Admissions. So contacting her would most likely yield the same results as calling the admissions office. I have considered contacting one of my interviewers and seeking his opinion, but I know most interviewers are pretty removed from the process after their evaluations are submitted. Just another thought.

 

[omores]

Hmmmm. I'm not sure that contacting Dr. Armstrong would yield the same results. When you call the admissions office, you generally reach an administrative assistant. Sometimes these people are great -- I reached one at another school who pulled my file, read it over, and offered me advice about something else to include.

But many of the people you reach are very non-committal, unwilling to give you anything but the most basic information. When that happens, it can be really helpful to consult with someone who actually sits on the committee. Have you read Imtiaz' posts under the "Rejections" thread? He was relentless. He demanded to speak with committee members, and he got some good information -- more than he would have if had had just talked to the office staff.

This is not to imply that office staff are ignorant of the process, merely that they're often cagey when it comes to giving solid information.

About talking to one of your interviewers -- sure, if you established a good rapport with that person, go ahead. My interviewer actually told me that if I had any trouble with Duke, to contact him and he'd see what he could find out for me. So that might well be a good route.

Hope you get through to them.

[This message has been edited by omores (edited March 21, 2001).]

 

[scully]

Crafty and Christiangirl, I am joining you in Duke alternate list limbo. I, too, have been unable to find out anything worthwhile. Omores, you have given really good advice, and I know everyone appreciates it.

My own big Duke decision is whether to ruin my last summer with Calc 2, which is only required by Duke. Actually, I don't mind so much, but it seems worthless, and I would really like to spend a little time packing and relocating. Does anyone know if you can get out of this requirement, or substitute something for it (like PhD-level stats?) Or, worse, does anyone know if the summer before matriculation is too late to complete your pre-recs?

I would appreciate any insights. Everyone on these Duke threads is very kind and helpful, and I appreciate this resource. I am a bit frightened to call and ask these questions of the admissions director (since the secretary won't tell me!) because I don't want to call attention to my deficiencies!

My best to all...

 

[lilycat]

Alas, alack. My brilliant words of wisdom are forever lost to the masses.

However, omores, since I no longer remember what I wanted you to realize, it must not have been that earth-shattering.

I totally agree with the information given so far -- let's face it, the people in the front office might have very little idea about the inner workings of the waitlist. I would strongly consider emailing -- email Dr. Armstrong, or email one of your interviewers if you feel that you "clicked" with them. I did this at another school, and while the only definitive thing he could tell me was "No one really understands how the process works except for a couple of people on the inside" he seemed encouraging and positive, and at the very least, I don't think it hurt to let him know how serious I was about the school. Good luck you guys.

omores, if I have a flash of brilliance and have some great insight on the meaning of life, you will be the first to know.

 

[Christiangirl]

Hi Omnores. I did write Dr. Armstrong an e-mail two days ago explaining the situation. No response.

 

[lilycat]

Hey Christiangirl -- what about your interviewers -- did you really hit it off with either of them? If so, I would definitely consider writing one of them.

 

[omores]

Christiangirl: Duke's a bit odd about e-mail, I noticed. Some questions are answered in minutes, others seem to fall into cyberlimbo.

Scully: yes, I'd be worried about calling attention to my "defects" as well -- as if lack of Calc 2 can be considered a defect. I've noticed no significant improvement in my character after having taken it. I can just picture the scenario: "Who's next up on the waitlist? Oh, it's Scully. Well she (yes?) looks like a fine addition to our incoming class. Her name seems to ring a bell, though...oh yes, she was the one who hadn't taken Calc 2 yet. Well scratch her off the list. Who's next?"

Perhaps what you need to do is direct a hypothetical and anonymous query to Ms. Armstrong regarding ditching or substituting something else for the Calc 2 requirement. PhD-level stats sounds pretty impressive to me. If your e-mail account doesn't specify your name, you could do it that way (although Christiangirl doesn't seem to have had much luck). Or you could phone her and talk to her or leave a voice mail without giving your name. I couldn't find her phone number on the Duke website (their search engines weren't working properly), but I do have it at home. Let me know if you want it.

Bon chance.

 

[scully]

Hi omores!

Thanks for the offer of Armstrong's number, but that is okay, I think I will take my chances. Besides, I don't think an anonymous phone message would work -- I doubt she would call me back if I didn't give my name.

She doesn't even call back people who do leave their names!

The scenario you described is *exactly* what I am afraid of! I know it sounds silly, but with all of the other excellent (and I am sure more qualified) waitlistees, it would be an easy way for them to cut down the list.

Ah well, I will still hope. Thank you for your continued support and encouragement to all of us who hope to join you in the fall.

[This message has been edited by scully (edited March 23, 2001).]

 

[jimi]

This is sort of in line with Scully's question. Does anyone know if Duke accepts AP credits for the calculus requirement??? I took the Calculus BC exam in high school. I didn't even think about it until I read Scully's post. Now I'm starting to wonder.

 

[caffeinegirl]

From the Duke website
Admission to the School of Medicine requires a minimum of ninety hours of approved college credit including one year of college English or a university writing course, one year of inorganic chemistry, one year of organic chemistry, one year of physics, one year of biology and/or zoology, and one year of calculus. An introductory course in biochemistry during the senior year would be helpful. All science requirements must be completed not more than seven years prior to entrance.


I think that "approved college credit" includes AP credit that has been awarded college credit.
I'm in the same boat as you jimi, and I'm not planning on taking calc anytime soon

PS: Hey jimi! See you at second look this week!!!

[This message has been edited by caffeinegirl (edited March 24, 2001).]

 

[jimi]

Caffeinegirl,

Thanx for the clarification! Cool, we'll meet in less than a week! I'm flying out there Thursday but I couldn't get a cheap flight to come back until early Monday morning, so I'll have a lot of time to check out the place. Are you considering Duke over UCSF?

 

[caffeinegirl]

Hiya jimi
You're really have a ton of time to check things out! I'll be leaving on Sunday afternoon. I'm not sure what to do about the whole Duke v. UCSF dilemma. It might just come down to financial aid...! But I really want to check both out before making the decision. And, Duke's second look weekend is too good to miss!
see you soon!

 

[omores]

Scully: Anonymous voice mail messages. You know, I've gotten several of those in my life, and it's true, they don't work.

Jimi: you'll be there too? Yay! Care to exchange names ahead of time? E-mail me at [email protected]. See you Thursday!

 

[Christiangirl]

Hey scully and crafty!! Just figured I would share this info with you.... After May 15th, Duke will tell you if you are in the top half or bottom half of the waitlist, but they will never tell how many people are on the list.

I wish all of you success!! Keep us posted. I think that I am going to withdraw soon simply because I need to find a job soon for the next year and no one is going to hire me in this limbo game.

 

[Crafty]

Hey Christiangirl --
Thanks for the update! Next week I'm going to revisit the two in-state schools where I was accepted, decide on one of those, and then I guess wait to hear from Duke. I don't really want to make housing arrangements just yet (on the off chance that Duke works out), but I don't know how long I can wait.
Best of luck to you.

 

[Christiangirl]

Hey Crafty. What state are you in?

Yes, the mysteriousness of the waitlist irritates me. It seems heartless and cruel. I don't understand why one can not be told of their place. It is ridiculous.

 

[scully]

Thanks Christiangirl! That will help a bit to know which half we are on. I am going to have to relocate, too, and waiting until June or July just is not feasible. I have to choose a school now too, and boy is it tough! Holding on to hope at Duke kept me from even thinking about my other choices. But I am not complaining, at least there are some good choices (but Duke sure would have been nice!

) Wouldn't it be something if after all of this we all got in off the waitlist? Then we could look back on this and laugh about how sad and anxious we were. Hope it happens!

[This message has been edited by scully (edited March 28, 2001).]

 

[Hallie]

Christiangirl, I hope that I misread your previous post, but did you say you were thinking about withdrawing from the waitlists? I really, really hope that you do not do that!!!! I think that you have at least a 50/50 chance of getting in, and it would be a huge shame to waste that opportunity. Please do not drop it, even if you have to delay finding a job for next year. You could always do something fun for the summer (or waitress or something) and then find a job starting in September. Please don't drop the waitlists so early!!!! (If that was not what you meant, I apologize for this post.)

[This message has been edited by Hallie (edited March 28, 2001).]

 

[Christiangirl]

Hey Hallie!! I owe you an e-mail!! I will get around to it!!

No, you did not misread my post. The thing is that if I don't get off the waitlist I will have to take the MCAT and reapply this year. Which means that I need to be settled and have an address by the beginning of the summer.... Last year, it was hard to find a research position in my area and I fear if I don't get one soon all of them will be taken by new graduates. The schools are just irritating me, because I seriously don't understand why there is so much mystery. I am not asking for a guarantee, just a guess or at least an idea of where I stand. I mean, people need to make plans... Then, they say the earliest movement is June 1st. I just think it is ridiculous. I mean, they say you can't change your rank, so why not tell what it is?

Thank you for being my cheerleader Hallie!! I appreciate all of your help. I honestly believe this will all work out. Maybe not this year, but definitely next.

I'll mull it over tonight some more. This insomnia is just driving me crazy and largely it is because of this med school thing...

[This message has been edited by Christiangirl (edited March 28, 2001).]

 

[Crafty]

Christiangirl -- FYI, I'm in Texas finishing up my undergraduate degree in May. My two in-state med school choices are really good, so I'm in an enviable position. But, like Scully, I was trying not to decide between the two until I heard from Duke because they are my definite #1 choice. But since I got waitlisted at Duke, I'm going to have to choose one of the two schools and put down a deposit by May 15th.

Luckily for me, I'll probably just be mooching off my parents for this summer, so I won't have to find a place to live in the near future. But I would like to find a roommate for next year, and if I go ahead and make plans with somebody here in-state, I don't want to bail on them if I do indeed get the long-awaited call/letter from Duke. I agree with everyone else's sentiments -- why not just let us know approximately where we stand, and then let us make an educated decision? Just another reason this long process is so fun!!

 

[Christiangirl]

Hey Crafty. So which two are you choosing from? Sorry to be so nosy.

If I reapply next year, I am definitely applying to Baylor. I have heard nothing but good things about it.

 

[Crafty]

Christiangirl --

I am deciding between UT-Southwestern and Baylor. I'm leaning towards Baylor because I really like their curriculum and the Medical Center, but I'm going to revisit both Houston and Dallas on a normal school day to get a better feel for the atmosphere of the schools. FYI -- Baylor accepts the most out-of-state students of all the Texas schools. They are a private school that receives some state-funding, so they are mandated to accept 70% of their class from Texas. (Lucky me!) That is compared to 90% Texas residents at the other Texas schools. Hopefully you get into Duke this year, but if you do decide to reapply next year, I would encourage you to check out Baylor -- it's a pretty amazing place.

 

[jimi]

Dear Christiangirl,

I was reading your posts, and I just can't help but reply! Are you sure about the other school you've been accepted to????!!

I mean, have you visited it? Are you positively sure that you won't do well there? I just think throwing away an acceptance is a HUGE decision. Deep down I think you'll get into Duke, but still, PLEASE don't give up your other acceptance! Maybe I'm the only one who feels like this, but I really think med school is what you make of it! You can be happy anywhere BECAUSE you'll be studying medicine. Please please don't give up on that school. AND DEFINITELY STAY ON THE WAITLIST!!! You have worked too hard to get to this point. Take as much advantage of it as possible!!!

 

[Christiangirl]

Hey jimi... I have not completely decided to withdraw from my one acceptance, but it is definitely a possibility. Yes throwing away an acceptance is definitely a HUGE thing, but I have to do what is best. God knows, I don't want to go through this process again, but I feel within my heart that God will lead me in the next couple of months to make the right decision.

I have visited there and I just didn't get a good vibe. I am not sure that I won't do well there, but if I go there with the feelings that I have I doubt that I will shine. The school doesn't have a second look weekend, so I won't be able to see my potential future classmates or anything.

I think med school can be what you make of it , but there are definitely "better fits" for some people. I am not saying that Duke is my perfect fit. As I stated above, there are a lot of schools that I think fit me very well that I would apply to this time around.

I would love to stay on the waitlists, but unfortunately I have to pay rent, student loans, etc. and can't afford to be without a job and not be in med school next year.

I hope you all enjoy Duke's second look weekend. Unfortunately, it is supposed to rain down here all day Thursday, Friday, and Sunday.

So, if you haven't left for Durham, bring your umbrella!!

 

[sheils]

hi.
i'm waitlisted at duke as well. i called today and an admissions office secretary told me that no correspondance is mailed to us unless we get in. so, whoever it was that said that we will find out in may whether we are on the top or bottom half of the ranked list seems to be WRONG. hey, if you hear back from armstrong, will you tell us if it was helpful?

thanks!
-s




[This message has been edited by sheils (edited April 10, 2001).]

 

[Rza]

Actually I called the admissions office the other day and specifically asked if we could possibly find out about being in the top half of the list or bottom half. The answer was, "No, we don't give out that information."

 

[Christiangirl]

I called two weeks ago and she said that after May 15th, she would tell. Maybe a different secretary... A friend of mine who is a Duke MS1 said that last year when she was on the list they told her whether she was "more likely or less likely" to get off. So, I guess it just depends on the mood of the person. Also, I never said they send you that information only that they told me if you call after that date, they will give it. Best wishes.

 

[sheils]

sorry there was someone that posted on another discussion that said that duke mailed out letters on the 15th.... i was referring to them, not you!
s

 

[lloyd braun]

This is an interesting issue with ethical and public health implications. On the one hand, we want to protect society as much as possible from violent and dangerous people. On the other hand, a patient's right to confidentiality must be upheld most of the time and violated only in serious circumstances.

I actually think I would be in favor of having a national database for people who have been so seriously mentally ill to have been civilly committed. However, I think there should be some way to be removed from the list after a certain period of time, once a person has shown with reasonable evidence that their mental illness is under control through means of medication compliance, no hospitalizations, etc. In other words, I think it is acceptable to temporarily suspend such civil liberties as gun ownership in order to protect the general public. Of course, I am not naive, and I do not think that such a database would totally prevent seriously mentally ill people from obtaining guns, but I do think it would make it more difficult, which should translate into improved public safety.

Some posters have suggested that the FBI could not be trusted to use this information solely for the purpose of preventing people from obtaining guns. How else might they use it?

 

[Lests55]

Wow, a pre 9/11 thread.

 

[pagemmapants]

Holy Lazarus-thread, Batman.

 

[byong_soo]

kinda late reply there.... almost after.... 6 years? lol