1. Dismiss Notice
  2. Download free Tapatalk for iPhone or Tapatalk for Android for your phone and follow the SDN forums with push notifications.
    Dismiss Notice

ECFMG and Fellowships

Discussion in 'General International Discussion' started by psalm128, Jul 18, 2006.

  1. psalm128

    psalm128 Member
    2+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2006
    Messages:
    26
    Likes Received:
    0
    Status:
    Attending Physician
    Is it possible to do fellowships in the US without going through the US residency program?
    Do you need ECFMG certification before doing a fellowship?
    Do I need to complete Step 3 at all if I am not intending to be board certified in US?
     
  2. Note: SDN Members do not see this ad.

  3. Shah_Patel_PT

    Physician 10+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2005
    Messages:
    761
    Likes Received:
    0
    Status:
    Attending Physician
    yES...........
     
  4. psalm128

    psalm128 Member
    2+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2006
    Messages:
    26
    Likes Received:
    0
    Status:
    Attending Physician
    yes to all 3?
     
  5. PathOne

    PathOne Derminatrix
    5+ Year Member

    Joined:
    May 10, 2004
    Messages:
    833
    Likes Received:
    1
    Status:
    Attending Physician
    You cannot enter a Fellowship without having completed a ACGME-approved Residency in either the US or Canada. You might be able to secure a "Visiting Fellowship", provided you'll finance it yourself or from other external sources. You will obviously not be able to sit for US boards.

    you will not be permitted to provide ANY medical care to patients, unless you have a ECFMG Cert. So if you do not have ECFMG certificate, you will not be able to touch a patient. How big an obstacle this will be is highly dependent on which field you're interested in.

    For a description of a Visiting Fellowship (in Derm)
    http://www.mgh.harvard.edu/dermatology/programs/itp.asp
     
  6. psalm128

    psalm128 Member
    2+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2006
    Messages:
    26
    Likes Received:
    0
    Status:
    Attending Physician
    awesome! thanks a lot.
    do you know if once I get the ECFMG certificate, is it for life?
    or do I need to "use" it within a certain period of time?
     
  7. f_w

    f_w 1K Member
    5+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2005
    Messages:
    2,900
    Likes Received:
    2
    > Is it possible to do fellowships in the US without going
    > through the US residency program?

    Depends on the specialty and the fellowship. In some fields, some fellowships are not particularly competitive. At times, they will accept suitably qualified foreign trained physicians (I knew an endocrinology fellow in IM, a bunch of different fellows in radiology and some fellows in anesthesia who came directly. some did a residency after the fellowship in order to become board certified)

    > Do you need ECFMG certification before doing a fellowship?

    If you are not a US citizen, you need a valid ECFMG certificate whenever you enter the US 'to work as a physician' (this is part of US immigration law). At times, people get appointed to university faculty positions without having the ECFMG certification, if the university puts its weight behind it they can even get a restricted medical license. Technically, this is a violation of the law, but I don't think the immigration service has ever prosecuted anyone for this.

    > Do I need to complete Step 3 at all if I am not intending to
    > be board certified in US?

    You need step3 for 2 things:
    - to obtain an unrestricted medical license (after residency)
    - to obtain certain types of visas (if you are not a US citizen)

    If you intend to come here for a fellowship only, you might not need step3. However, having it shows your future employer that you have all the formal qualifications a US trained physician would have at the same point.

    > do you know if once I get the ECFMG certificate, is it for life?

    It used to be that you had to keep it alive by submitting a passing score in the TOEFL every 2 years. Now, you have to repeat step2cs every 3 years if I am not mistaken (the TOEFL was maybe $200, step2cs is 1k, really sucks).
     
  8. psalm128

    psalm128 Member
    2+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2006
    Messages:
    26
    Likes Received:
    0
    Status:
    Attending Physician
    > do you know if once I get the ECFMG certificate, is it for life?

    It used to be that you had to keep it alive by submitting a passing score in the TOEFL every 2 years. Now, you have to repeat step2cs every 3 years if I am not mistaken (the TOEFL was maybe $200, step2cs is 1k, really sucks).[/QUOTE]

    wow are you serious?? :(
    Does this apply for US graduates or only to foreign medical graduates?
     
  9. f_w

    f_w 1K Member
    5+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2005
    Messages:
    2,900
    Likes Received:
    2
    US grads don't need an ECFMG certificate.

    By the way, it becomes permanent the moment you start a residency in the US. It just expires if you haven't started yet.
     
  10. Winged Scapula

    Winged Scapula Cougariffic!
    Staff Member Administrator Physician Faculty Lifetime Donor Classifieds Approved 15+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2000
    Messages:
    38,531
    Likes Received:
    26,710
    Status:
    Attending Physician
  11. Faebinder

    Faebinder Slow Wave Smurf
    10+ Year Member

    Joined:
    May 24, 2006
    Messages:
    3,507
    Likes Received:
    10
    Status:
    Attending Physician
    Are you sure you guys aren't mixing up between CSA and Step 2 CS?

    CSA was used before for the ECFMG certificate and at the same time TOEFL was required and since TOEFL expired in two years, ECFMG certificate required updating....

    Now TOEFL is not a requirement and the Step 2 CS exam does not expire after 2 years (You still have the limit of taking Step 1, 2 and 3 within 7 years of each other or they will be invalidated.) So the certificate doesn't expire anymore. Those who need the permanent stickers are the ones who have passed the CS and TOEFL long ago and still havent gotten into residency.

    If you believe I am wrong... correct me.
     
  12. f_w

    f_w 1K Member
    5+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2005
    Messages:
    2,900
    Likes Received:
    2
    I believe you are right. The expiration of the step2cs only caught people in the transition between CSA+TOEFL and step2cs. Looks like they have done away with that idiocy.
     
  13. psalm128

    psalm128 Member
    2+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2006
    Messages:
    26
    Likes Received:
    0
    Status:
    Attending Physician
    Cool... so does that mean that once i get my ECFMG certificate... I have it for "life?" without need for renewing it every few years?
     
  14. Faebinder

    Faebinder Slow Wave Smurf
    10+ Year Member

    Joined:
    May 24, 2006
    Messages:
    3,507
    Likes Received:
    10
    Status:
    Attending Physician
    Step 1 and 2 I believe have 7 year expiration date (that's what I was told)... so after 7 years if you havent started residency (which means the certificate is not made permanent)... you are going to have to retake them and probably reapply to the ECFMG certificate... so it's not permanent permanent... it expires when step 1 (which I presume you took before step 2) expires.
     
  15. Winged Scapula

    Winged Scapula Cougariffic!
    Staff Member Administrator Physician Faculty Lifetime Donor Classifieds Approved 15+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2000
    Messages:
    38,531
    Likes Received:
    26,710
    Status:
    Attending Physician
    The 7 year rule applies to that regulation that you have to take all 3 Steps within 7 years (so once you take Step 1, you have 7 years to complete Steps 2 and 3).

    Check with ecfmg.org for information on renewing your certificate. I don't think you have to anymore.
     
  16. f_w

    f_w 1K Member
    5+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2005
    Messages:
    2,900
    Likes Received:
    2
    Also, different states have different rules on the 7 year issue. Some require step 1-3 to be within 7 years, even if you started the process before the 7 year rule came on a national level.
     
  17. rice_boy

    rice_boy Member
    2+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2006
    Messages:
    47
    Likes Received:
    0
    Status:
    Medical Student
    ok, so let's just make a unifying clarification:

    Once you pass Step 1, you have 7 years to complete Steps 2 & 3, after which you will become ECFMG certified for life.
     
  18. f_w

    f_w 1K Member
    5+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2005
    Messages:
    2,900
    Likes Received:
    2
    Actually, you become ECFMG certified after fulfilling
    - step1-2cs within a 7 year period
    - graduating a WHO listed medschool
    - paying ungodly amounts of money to finance the palacial headquarters of ECFMG on Market St.


    In order to obtain a medical license in a good number of states you also have to pass step3 within the 7 year timeframe (this requirement is independent from ECFMG). See this table for reference:
    http://www.fsmb.org/usmle_eliinitial.html
     

Share This Page