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failed organic chem I, organic chem II a good idea?

Discussion in 'Pre-Medical - MD' started by reese07, Dec 6, 2008.

  1. reese07

    10+ Year Member

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    Im about to fail organic chemistry I and i am complementing whether i should go ahead and take organic II next semester. How well do you need to know organic I to be able to pass organic II? Will just knowing the basics of organic I be enough?
     
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  3. psy

    psy Lazy Bum Extraordinaire
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    what do you mean by "fail"? Please be more specific.
     
  4. muggle911

    muggle911 Non-magical member
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    simple answer - absolutely not. That is why it is a 2 part course - orgo 2 builds on orgo 1.
    -if you're failing, I doubt you have the basics of orgo 1 mastered.
    -no, you don't need to know everthing from orgo 1, but if you couldn't grasp a majority of the info, you won't have much success in orgo 2.

    -I would try to find a tutor, and retake orgo 1.
     
  5. StIGMA

    StIGMA Doctor Professor
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    Ask your professor!

    At my Uni, the first 3/4 of orgo1 was entirely conceptual and very basic reaction mechanisms. On the other hand, orgo2 is entirely reaction mechanisms, which you only need basic conceptual knowledge to comprehend. The decision is yours, but ask for your professors input on how other students typically perform in your situation at your school.
     
  6. MedicalSonata

    MedicalSonata Friendly Pre-Med, PM me!
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    I too will most likely fail Orgo I..

    Thing is..you still have to take Orgo I. I just don't know when and where I'm going to be able to!??

    Is a CC possible? What about online from an accredited school (UC Berkeley extension)
     
  7. fusionx22

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    I don't know if this the best thing to do (although it makes sense), but if you're about to fail, I think you should withdraw and take it again later. However, you should ask someone who has done that and has gone through the application process for their input. Good luck.
     
    #6 fusionx22, Dec 7, 2008
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2008
  8. Twiigg

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    Well if you're legitimately failing organic chemistry I, you'll have to retake it anyway before medical school. So why not just retake it in the normal order? Or perhaps concurrently?
     
  9. psy

    psy Lazy Bum Extraordinaire
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    Taking two ochems at the same time is just asking for stress. Try to clear some time for Ochem 1 retake like have easier classes during that semester/quarter. Do all problems in the book for the assigned reading chapters every day. Doing the problems will help you succeed.
     
  10. ILikeFood

    ILikeFood NSU Class of 2013
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    Why are you failing? Are you failing because you've been a lazy bastard? Then I don't suggest taking Ochem 2. I'd retake Ochem 1 and work a lot harder.

    Are you failing because the Ochem 1 conceptual stuff is beyond you, despite your work ethic? Then don't worry about Ochem 2, because Ochem 2 is about doing lots of problems, and rewriting mechanisms over and over and over again until you remember them by heart. It's reaction chemistry. It's memorization.


    This works. OP if you have the time, I'd take it slow. I'd retake Ochem 1 and take Ochem 2 the following semester. If you don't have the time, and you haven't been a lazy bastard, then take both concurrently. But make sure other parts of your schedule are lighter.
     
  11. ILikeFood

    ILikeFood NSU Class of 2013
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    Have you even taken it yet?

    Btw OP I suggest Ochem as a 2nd Language. It's a great book.
     
    #10 ILikeFood, Dec 7, 2008
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2008
  12. Isoprop

    Isoprop Fascinating, tell me more
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    figure out why you failed ochem 1 before doing anything else
     
  13. DarkHorizon

    Physician 10+ Year Member

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    How can you possibly take Ochem II after without passing Ochem I? Isn't Ochem I a requirement for OchemII? I attended multiple schools and that was the case everywhere.
     
  14. WannaBePreMed

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    That's exactly what I was thinking. If your getting a C or B then go on to Ochem 2. If you're failing then you can't move ahead, you don't have a high enough prerequisite grade, they won't let you.
     
  15. Chemdude

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    You only need a basic understanding of Organic I to go on to Organic II. There was a lot of stuff we did in Organic I that was never(rarely) brought up in Organic II. Like the stupid conformations and the chair/half-chair stuff. Organic II for me was more straightforward. So if you have a "C", go ahead an take Organic II.
     
  16. NoMoreAMCAS

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    WTF? you can take Organic II at your school without passing Organic I?
     
  17. link2swim06

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    Do you know how name molecules, draw mechanism arrow correctly? These are skills you must know before you go to O-chem II. What are you going to do on your o-chem 2 test when it says 1,3-dibromopentane reacts with XYZ and you have no idea what the hell 1,3-dibromopentane is and even if you knew the reaction you will not be able to do it becuase you don't know what the molecule is. Or if you try to understand a mechanism from the text book when it looks like a football play diagram to you.

    Take o-chem I first, remember the crowd you are competing with in the second o-chem are significantly smarter than those in the first o-chem.
     
  18. njbmd

    njbmd Guest
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    If you are truly "failing" the first semester of Organic Chemistry, then you are setting yourself up to fail the second semester of Organic. Failing Organic Chem I means that you DON'T know the "basics" of Organic Chemistry. What's your ultimate goal? If it is to become a pharmacist, then you need a pretty fair grounding in Organic Chemistry which you won't have.

    If your goal is medical school, you may be able to overcome one grade of F but two or an F combined with anything other than a B+ or higher is going to take some significant "damage control" in order not to tank your GPA and in order for you to have a significant knowledge base in order to do well on the Medical College Admissions Test (MCAT).

    As some folks have suggested, drop the course if you can and take something else until you can figure out why you are failing this course. If you can't drop, then get the best grade that you can and don't take Organic Chem II until you figure out your problems. A good start would be to speak with your professor and get some objective and honest appraisal of why you are doing poorly.

    If you are a troll, then you get what you earn. The people above have given you good advice. You may want to read it a couple of times and get your problems solved.
     
  19. Chemist0157

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    The OP needs to tell us whether he can actually TAKE Organic II because at my school (and those of others apparently), Organic I is required to move on. I found Organic II easier personally; it's just applying knowledge from Organic I. The professors I've talked to say that usually people go from a C -> B or B -> A between those two semesters.
     
  20. justdoit31

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    I concur with previous posters- at my school you need a C or better in Organic 1 to go to Organic 2...

    I also felt Organic 1 was much more difficult because I was lost in 1 and with a different prof for 2 I went from C--> A :)
     
  21. JeanLuc

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    If you're going to have below a C, then retake it. Actually a W would be better than a D or fail, but I guess its too late for that. If you've had an early burnout and thats why you're failing my advice is to take it easy over the break and then enter the second term with a fresh mind. Organic II is about equally difficult as Organic I. Just don't despair. I think retaking Organic I along with an advanced Bio class would be beneficial - demonstrate that you can handle the load and that the past semester was a "flop"/accident.
     
  22. spyderracing32

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    Are you allowed to go on to Orgo II without having passed Orgo I at your school? Either way, it's certainly a bad idea to take II after failing I.
     
  23. WestHaven626

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    if you failed OCHEM, then you need to take OCHEM again. dont get caught up with the time. ochem II builds on ochem I...push the class towards the summer for ochem II, it doesnt matter when you apply as long as they are processing your application concurrently with your ochem II which you will take in the summer.
     
  24. juardine

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    Retake organic chem I but when you study, study with an MCAT review book. I prefer Princeton Review because its slightly more detailed compared to other MCAT books. I must say, I started to understand organic chemistry a thousand times better once I started studying for the MCAT.
     
  25. rctriplefresh5

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    from what i hear orgo 2 builds on a lot of the knowledge that should have been mastered in orgo 1. my recommendation is to retake orgo 1. if you are applying to a DO school ,they will replace the F with your new grade so your gpa will be much cleaner, however if you are applying to a MD, they will just average the grades together. however if you get an A in the retake, youre new grade will be a C which is decent compared to an f.
     
  26. neskalee

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    I was under the impression that most med schools don't accept AP, online or distance learning credit. I've only really looked at schools in my state (California) but pretty much every UC says no to online courses.
     
  27. Seraph 84

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    I don't see how you could fail organic I and be able to proceed to organic II.
    It wouldn't be wise, and I'm sure your school's chem department wouldn't allow it.

    Retake organic I.
     
  28. CapnCrunch

    CapnCrunch You've been Crunchitized!

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    Yes yes yes... Retake organic 1 before 2. As far as I know, our registration system (online) tells us what the prereqs are, but it is not required. Basically, they tell you what the norm is, but I've taken classes "out of order" before. (I've taken a level two elective class before finishing the 4 level one classes required)
     
  29. anonymousername

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    [additional generic comment regarding how you must understand and pass organic chemistry 1 before enrolling and succeeding in organic chemistry 2]
     
  30. artx2008

    artx2008 MS0

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    If you want to fail the second part as well, then it is a good idea!
     

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