Family Reaction to DO Acceptance

[amerepedestrian]

Anyone else get pretty lukewarm reactions from loved ones who aren’t familiar with the DO path and think you’ve basically been accepted to a sub-par med school? I am excited to have been accepted to NSU and am confident I would get a solid education there. I prefer a couple specific MD programs where I interviewed, so I’m waiting to hear back from them, but at the end of the day it’s about fit, not DO or MD, right?

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[Magulick81]

More like... "getting lukewarm reactions from ANYBODY who is unfamiliar with the sacrifice and dedication that it takes to get into medical school... period". At the end of the day be happy for yourself, there are many people wishing to be in your shoes and in 20 years you'll be a competent successful physician where nobody will care where your degree came from. My family pretty much just said "congrats" when i told them i was accepted... so don't take it personally.

 

[Cath Up]

Anyone else get pretty lukewarm reactions from loved ones who aren’t familiar with the DO path and think you’ve basically been accepted to a sub-par med school? I am excited to have been accepted to NSU and am confident I would get a solid education there. I prefer a couple specific MD programs where I interviewed, so I’m waiting to hear back from them, but at the end of the day it’s about fit, not DO or MD, right?

Yep have experienced lukewarm reactions from some, lots of support from others.

At the end of the day you have been accepted into the world of American medicine and that is a profound thing. You get to be a doctor. Plenty of people are stuck on the prestige train or do not understand what your DO acceptance means. While it can be hurtful to get lukewarm reactions from family, please please don't let it get to you. It reflects a dedication/commitment combined with some baseline ability that very few people are interested in truly committing to.

As far as the bolded, there are significant upsides to going MD for the majority of applicants, if accessible. It leaves more specialties open, an enables you to change your mind about specialties more in med school.

 

[mfrey28]

My parents keep referring to it as DO school. I keep reminding them that it is medical school. My brother who is a PA understands completely and is excited for me. But honestly who cares? I am thrilled with my acceptance and so is my wife. That's all that really matters

 

[harkas]

Anyone else get pretty lukewarm reactions from loved ones who aren’t familiar with the DO path and think you’ve basically been accepted to a sub-par med school? I am excited to have been accepted to NSU and am confident I would get a solid education there. I prefer a couple specific MD programs where I interviewed, so I’m waiting to hear back from them, but at the end of the day it’s about fit, not DO or MD, right?

Are you asian?

 

[0dee]

My parents were so happy that they wanted to throw a little get together party for the entire family. They never even attended one class at the college level so for me to be accepted to a medical school in the US was a moment of utter pride. Don't worry what your parents think about your future, you worked hard for this and you're gonna be a doctor.

 

[RinShanKaiHo]

My parents are foreign trained docs and they have no idea what a DO is. However they have been really excited that I get to be a doctor, and they know how hard it is to become one.

 

[aspiremd84]

I told me family I received admission to a US Medical School - and they were plenty happy with that. They're not sure what DO vs. MD means but we'll have that conversation at a later time. You're achieved a ton! Be happy!

 

[RNthenDoc]

One thing that's nice is in my hospital all the nurses I work with know about DO's being equivalent in practice (because in my state if an NP/PA puts in orders they have to be cosigned by MD/DO), so it's nice that there is 100% respect for my attempts at DO programs. (My coworkers cover shifts while I fly out to interviews etc)

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

Yeah it happens. I’ve even seen it happen with some of the private, lower tier MD schools. All during the application cycle mmh dad kept asking me why I wasn’t applying to more “medical schools” because I applied mainly DO.

If you get into the MD then go there but if you don’t then it doesn’t matter anyway and your family will realize yourba “real” doctor you are when you’re bringing in 250K+ a year minimum.

 

[Robin-jay]

People should stop caring what their parents think lol.

 

[amerepedestrian]

People should stop caring what their parents think lol.

If it were truly inconsequential, I’d probably agree! But real life is more complicated. I’m having some trouble getting help with paying the $1,250 deposit to secure the NSU spot because my family doesn’t think DOs are real doctors

 

[Shotapp]

If it were truly inconsequential, I’d probably agree! But real life is more complicated. I’m having some trouble getting help with paying the $1,250 deposit to secure the NSU spot because my family doesn’t think DOs are real doctors

Wow! That is crazy. @Goro can you speak some sense to OP's family?

 

[Robin-jay]

If it were truly inconsequential, I’d probably agree! But real life is more complicated. I’m having some trouble getting help with paying the $1,250 deposit to secure the NSU spot because my family doesn’t think DOs are real doctors

Tell them you don't think they're a real family.

 

[Goro]

If it were truly inconsequential, I’d probably agree! But real life is more complicated. I’m having some trouble getting help with paying the $1,250 deposit to secure the NSU spot because my family doesn’t think DOs are real doctors

Please get your parents accounts on SDN so they can see how, out of love and ignorance, they are trying really hard to destroy your medical career.

 

[RinShanKaiHo]

If it were truly inconsequential, I’d probably agree! But real life is more complicated. I’m having some trouble getting help with paying the $1,250 deposit to secure the NSU spot because my family doesn’t think DOs are real doctors

I'm sorry for that. My parents paid my entire undergrad tuition and they are proposing to pay for my med school tuition too. Maybe cuz I'm the only kid... I still feel really sorry for them and will take loans instead... I just feel really lucky and privileged... I have long thought the med school app being unreasonably expensive... From test prep to app fees to interview traveling... Most PhD programs either allow Skype interview or provide stipend for traveling... The whole process is just really against working class kids.

 

[de Ribas]

I'm sorry for that. My parents paid my entire undergrad tuition and they are proposing to pay for my med school tuition too. Maybe cuz I'm the only kid... I still feel really sorry for them and will take loans instead... I just feel really lucky and privileged... I have long thought the med school app being unreasonably expensive... From test prep to app fees to interview traveling... Most PhD programs either allow Skype interview or provide stipend for traveling... The whole process is just really against working class kids.

There are about 70K of MD/DO applicants. Would you think these schools would pay for everyone's travels and application expenses?

 

[Robin-jay]

I'm sorry for that. My parents paid my entire undergrad tuition and they are proposing to pay for my med school tuition too. Maybe cuz I'm the only kid... I still feel really sorry for them and will take loans instead... I just feel really lucky and privileged... I have long thought the med school app being unreasonably expensive... From test prep to app fees to interview traveling... Most PhD programs either allow Skype interview or provide stipend for traveling... The whole process is just really against working class kids.

The majority of medical school students come from fairly high socioeconomic backgrounds.

 

[amerepedestrian]

I truly appreciate you guys’ encouraging comments! It can feel quite isolating to have worked this hard and feel like many of those closest to you have no real clue of what’s at stake.

 

[Stagg737]

I truly appreciate you guys’ encouraging comments! It can feel quite isolating to have worked this hard and feel like many of those closest to you have no real clue of what’s at stake.

You could explain the alternative option to them. Aka you turn down the DO acceptance, never get into medical school, and pass up a guaranteed 200k+/yr salary for the rest of your life for a job that pays a fraction of that with less security. I've found that people concerned with the lack of "prestige" from going the DO route usually shut up about that when they're made aware of the financial upside. Those who are overly stubborn about the title usually have expectations that won't ever be met anyway or have a skewed view of how much (or how little) prestige those titles actually confer.

 

[amerepedestrian]

The majority of medical school students come from fairly high socioeconomic backgrounds.

This has brought up a really interesting discussion. If anything, I’m happy to witness it! But I think it’s hard to deny the existence of numerous socioeconomic barriers to becoming a physician—early life exposure to education and critical thinking; expensive educational institutions, test prep and application services; the freedom to not have to work during college/to focus on academics and other application-building activities; the language, mannerisms, and appearances of the upper strata of society translating into professionalism; cost of transportation to/from interviews, missed wages due to time off from work for travel, and security of admission seats—the working class and lower-middle class just have a harder time of it.

I remember everyone being baffled when I told them I got paid minimum wage ($7.25 in Texas) to work odd hours as an ED scribe and that I had to support myself with those kinds of wages. I realized many of my coworkers didn’t need the money—it was like pocket change to them while their parents supported them. We were all desperate for the experience, so the companies were able to pay us the bare minimum. We just differed in what that practical economic decision meant to us and our quality of life.

I don’t write this all out as some sort of pity party—I don’t think there’s any shame in embracing great opportunities in life and feeling grateful for one’s fortunes—but just to add to the illumination of something I think is a major issue in the field we all hope to call our own. There are probably a lot of people with potential who just aren’t able to work around all the hurdles.

 

[Robin-jay]

This has brought up a really interesting discussion. If anything, I’m happy to witness it! But I think it’s hard to deny the existence of numerous socioeconomic barriers to becoming a physician—early life exposure to education and critical thinking; expensive educational institutions, test prep and application services; the freedom to not have to work during college/to focus on academics and other application-building activities; the language, mannerisms, and appearances of the upper strata of society translating into professionalism; cost of transportation to/from interviews, missed wages due to time off from work for travel, and security of admission seats—the working class and lower-middle class just have a harder time of it.

I remember everyone being baffled when I told them I got paid minimum wage ($7.25 in Texas) to work odd hours as an ED scribe and that I had to support myself with those kinds of wages. I realized many of my coworkers didn’t need the money—it was like pocket change to them while their parents supported them. We were all desperate for the experience, so the companies were able to pay us the bare minimum. We just differed in what that practical economic decision meant to us and our quality of life.

I don’t write this all out as some sort of pity party—I don’t think there’s any shame in embracing great opportunities in life and feeling grateful for one’s fortunes—but just to add to the illumination of something I think is a major issue in the field we all hope to call our own. There are probably a lot of people with potential who just aren’t able to work around all the hurdles.

Ya, everyones path to medical school is unique.

Those with lower socioeconomic backgrounds just tend to take a bit longer. It takes time to become financially secure, and only having to support yourself is leagues ahead in easiness compared to supporting a family.

If you have a family and you aren't making big bucks (SO with kids), then I could imagine the feat to becoming a physician exponentially harder. I just support me, myself, and I.

 

[amerepedestrian]

You could explain the alternative option to them. Aka you turn down the DO acceptance, never get into medical school, and pass up a guaranteed 200k+/yr salary for the rest of your life for a job that pays a fraction of that with less security. I've found that people concerned with the lack of "prestige" from going the DO route usually shut up about that when they're made aware of the financial upside. Those who are overly stubborn about the title usually have expectations that won't ever be met anyway or have a skewed view of how much (or how little) prestige those titles actually confer.

Exactly! I think my family’s expectations for my career have been shaped by all the TV shows in which every doctor attended Harvard, Johns Hopkins, etc. They think because I am “smart” there’s no excuse for not meeting arbitrary percentile standards and being a Top Student at a Big-Name Institution. It’s quite unrealistic and ultimately a harmful mentality for anyone (but most of all pre-med and med students) to have. There’s no need to be “the best,” according to a bunch of strict criteria—some of which are valid, but some of which are primarily posturing. I just want to try my best to make a difference in the quality of life of human beings every day I go to work. I don’t think there’s anything more worthwhile than that.

Forgive the rant—yes, they definitely care about the bottom line, and hopefully that will be persuasive to them

 

[RinShanKaiHo]

There are about 70K of MD/DO applicants. Would you think these schools would pay for everyone's travels and application expenses?

I'm talking about covering the expenses for the ~700 people invited to interviews. And even then they can do Skype interview... For most non-mmi ones it really makes not too much difference but saves at least a few hundred dollars.

 

[RinShanKaiHo]

The majority of medical school students come from fairly high socioeconomic backgrounds.

So does it mean that kids from working class are less qualified to become a doctor than upper/middle class kids?

 

[RinShanKaiHo]

Exactly! I think my family’s expectations for my career have been shaped by all the TV shows in which every doctor attended Harvard, Johns Hopkins, etc. They think because I am “smart” there’s no excuse for not meeting arbitrary percentile standards and being a Top Student at a Big-Name Institution. It’s quite unrealistic and ultimately a harmful mentality for anyone (but most of all pre-med and med students) to have. There’s no need to be “the best,” according to a bunch of strict criteria—some of which are valid, but some of which are primarily posturing. I just want to try my best to make a difference in the quality of life of human beings every day I go to work. I don’t think there’s anything more worthwhile than that.

Forgive the rant—yes, they definitely care about the bottom line, and hopefully that will be persuasive to them

I guess that might really be the difference... My parents are doctors although they work abroad they know what is it like to be a doctor although they still love watching those dramas haha...

 

[RNthenDoc]

Exactly! I think my family’s expectations for my career have been shaped by all the TV shows in which every doctor attended Harvard, Johns Hopkins, etc. They think because I am “smart” there’s no excuse for not meeting arbitrary percentile standards and being a Top Student at a Big-Name Institution. It’s quite unrealistic and ultimately a harmful mentality for anyone (but most of all pre-med and med students) to have. There’s no need to be “the best,” according to a bunch of strict criteria—some of which are valid, but some of which are primarily posturing. I just want to try my best to make a difference in the quality of life of human beings every day I go to work. I don’t think there’s anything more worthwhile than that.

Forgive the rant—yes, they definitely care about the bottom line, and hopefully that will be persuasive to them

I identify with this a lot. I've gotten my ass kicked in undergrad and had to SCRAPE a decent GPA out. Had a marginal MCAT despite working my ass off, all while working in one of the more stressful medical environments at a high level of practice.

Yesterday I got my first acceptance, and I feel like everyone was just sort of like, "Well yeah, we know you'd get accepted because of how hard you work," and while that's a nice sentiment, I don't think anyone else grasps how lucky I am and how close I have come to having to reapply.

Maybe I'm just too sensitive, but I think in general the public doesn't understand what a nightmare getting into med school (especially as a non trad) can be. Or how expensive it is.

 

[umgoblue2008]

So does it mean that kids from working class are less qualified to become a doctor than upper/middle class kids?

No. High socioeconomic backgrounds means you are provided more resources and have less obstacles towards obtaining a doctoral education.

 

[RinShanKaiHo]

No. High socioeconomic backgrounds means you are provided more resources and have less obstacles towards obtaining a doctoral education.

I meant that these obstacles should not exist to this extent in the first place.

Becoming a doctor really should not be hindered by the fact that you cannot afford 1000 dollar deposits and interview traveling that can cost hundreds of dollars.

 

[umgoblue2008]

I meant that these obstacles should not exist to this extent in the first place.

Becoming a doctor really should not be hindered by the fact that you cannot afford 1000 dollar deposits and interview traveling that can cost hundreds of dollars.

A lot of things are not the way they should be. That's just the reality we live in. Because of the prestige and potential income, the competition/demand for acceptance into medical school is very high. People (especially those of high socioeconomic backgrounds) are willing to pay whatever the costs. Medical schools, then, have no incentive to provide financial assistance of any kind. Demand > Supply.

 

[rg2o3]

Honestly, my parents were extremely happy to hear of my DO acceptance. Maybe even happier than I, haha. They are aware of DO's as they have had DO's as primary care in the past. The most pushback I have received has surprisingly been from a friend who is in PA school lol

 

[rg2o3]

I meant that these obstacles should not exist to this extent in the first place.

Becoming a doctor really should not be hindered by the fact that you cannot afford 1000 dollar deposits and interview traveling that can cost hundreds of dollars.

I hear ya. I have paid $1500 of my initial deposit and am struggling to get the final $500. A lot of my travel expenses and other interview necessities sadly went on a credit card.

 

[RNthenDoc]

I hear ya. I have paid $1500 of my initial deposit and am struggling to get the final $500. A lot of my travel expenses and other interview necessities sadly went on a credit card.

I appreciate the way RVU does their deposits. First one is $250, then $750, then the rest closer to matriculation. I get the need for deposits to keep hineys in seats, but these schools have to realize that it would be foolhardy for a solid candidate to commit entirely to the first acceptance early on. There's Early Decision programs for that. If a med school is truly convinced that their institution is the best choice, they should have no fear of a candidate attending elsewhere. If they *don't* believe their school is a candidate's best choice, their job should be to improve the school, not manipulate students into attending anyway.

So far the schools I've interviewed at seemed confident in what they had to offer, and that's good.

 

[Skiiiiiing]

Anyone else get pretty lukewarm reactions from loved ones who aren’t familiar with the DO path and think you’ve basically been accepted to a sub-par med school? I am excited to have been accepted to NSU and am confident I would get a solid education there. I prefer a couple specific MD programs where I interviewed, so I’m waiting to hear back from them, but at the end of the day it’s about fit, not DO or MD, right?

As you go for high goals, you will have to learn to deal with the tug of little people. - George Patton

People generally - and family particularly - have defined "places" for you. If you step outside that in a way that can be attacked, expect to be.

 

[DO2015CA]

Honestly, my parents were extremely happy to hear of my DO acceptance. Maybe even happier than I, haha. They are aware of DO's as they have had DO's as primary care in the past. The most pushback I have received has surprisingly been from a friend who is in PA school lol

Hilarious. What does this friend say

 

[Robin-jay]

Hilarious. What does this friend say

"I'll be working for DOs"

 

[rg2o3]

Hilarious. What does this friend say

haha, nothing straight forward. Just makes subtle jabs and comparisons. So and so's friend is in DO school and says its easier than PA school. etc etc

 

[DO2015CA]

haha, nothing straight forward. Just makes subtle jabs and comparisons. So and so's friend is in DO school and says its easier than PA school. etc etc

Lol that’s laughable...

In that sense then PA school is harder than MD school seeing as DO School is just a bunch of OMM piled on top.

Just take solace in the fact that this person has no clue what they are talking about. @Goro teaches both med and PA students and has said many times that they learn less material

 

[rg2o3]

Lol that’s laughable...

In that sense then PA school is harder than MD school seeing as DO School is just a bunch of OMM piled on top.

Just take solace in the fact that this person has no clue what they are talking about. @Goro teaches both med and PA students and has said many times that they learn less material

Thats what I always assumed. My roommate is actually a PA student and he tells me all the time how they brush over most topics. The undergrad I went to has a PA program and I have heard far too many times that they believe PA school is harder because "its the same stuff in a smaller amount of time" lol

 

[DO2015CA]

Thats what I always assumed. My roommate is actually a PA student and he tells me all the time how they brush over most topics. The undergrad I went to has a PA program and I have heard far too many times that they believe PA school is harder because "its the same stuff in a smaller amount of time" lol

PA is a quick paced program no doubt but it pales in comparison. Once you start, especially with all the extra OMM, there is no way PA students would be able to handle the exact same curriculum in half the time.

 

[rg2o3]

PA is a quick paced program no doubt but it pales in comparison. Once you start, especially with all the extra OMM, there is no way PA students would be able to handle the exact same curriculum in half the time.

I agree. Not to sound pretentious because I am not better than anyone, but it seemed as if a lot of the PA students were trying to convince themselves as opposed to convince me.

 

[amerepedestrian]

I'm talking about covering the expenses for the ~700 people invited to interviews. And even then they can do Skype interview... For most non-mmi ones it really makes not too much difference but saves at least a few hundred dollars.

Totally agreed. There is still the issue of computer access, but I’m guessing most people applying to med school are able to use a reasonably new computer (that is another barrier, though). I think overall saving people the trip and doing a virtual tour and virtual group interview or something like that could even the playing field a bit.

 

[Coltuna]

My mom was very happy that I was accepted to medical school; so much so that she posted a big spiel on her facebook about it. Someone asked her "what's osteopathic?" My mom proceeded to look online and use every frustratrating buzzword known to SDN to describe it including but not limited to "holistic" and "whole body." I just let her have her moment as a proud mother though.

 

[amerepedestrian]

A lot of things are not the way they should be. That's just the reality we live in. Because of the prestige and potential income, the competition/demand for acceptance into medical school is very high. People (especially those of high socioeconomic backgrounds) are willing to pay whatever the costs. Medical schools, then, have no incentive to provide financial assistance of any kind. Demand > Supply.

It really comes down to what your values are. It sounds like you have libertarian/laissez-faire capitalist values, while others such as myself prefer to look at the very same reality and see what COULD be done about it rather than what MUST be done (or your argument: the absence of an obligation). I think private travel scholarships for med school candidates would help even the playing field even if you don’t think the program itself should be burdened with the cost. We may be losing a lot of talent, and compassionate talent at that, who (if able to become physicians would) probably have a better understanding of what their underserved patients experience on a daily basis.

 

[throw_away5122]

My family told me not to go to DO school, period. I did not listen though

 

[RinShanKaiHo]

Totally agreed. There is still the issue of computer access, but I’m guessing most people applying to med school are able to use a reasonably new computer (that is another barrier, though). I think overall saving people the trip and doing a virtual tour and virtual group interview or something like that could even the playing field a bit.

Not that crappy sort of new computers and free wifi are accessible in most public libraries... And a $400 acer laptop is really not that bad,(I personally use one!) 400 bucks investment on med school app is reasonable, compared to the thousands of dollars traveling

 

[fldoctorgirl]

My parents were ecstatic to hear that I had gotten into medical school, period. I'm their oldest child, my father got a bachelor's, and my mom raised us. To them, getting into medical school is an incredible accomplishment and they are so happy that I will have security in my future.

Every now and then, my mom will ask me if I've heard anything from an MD school regarding IIs-- not to belittle the DO degree, but because I've spoken with her openly about how I would likely take an MD acceptance over DO just because of the unfortunate biases still present.

My parents' PCP is a DO, so yeah.....they're not ignorant enough to think that DOs aren't real doctors. Maybe you need to make your parents an appointment with a DO

 

[amerepedestrian]

Not that crappy sort of new computers and free wifi are accessible in most public libraries... And a $400 acer laptop is really not that bad,(I personally use one!) 400 bucks investment on med school app is reasonable, compared to the thousands of dollars traveling

Definitely superior. I’m just saying some people can’t even afford that, and public library hours might conflict with work schedule, etc.

 

[__AVI8R__]

Edit: Thanks to @pseud0 for pointing out how dumb my original statement sounded. Seriously guys, if I say something stupid, you've gotta tell me. This is an internet forum for crying out loud. Don't be shy about it. But if it's that stupid, it's probably because I suck at writing and come across a tad dumber than i actually am.

Definitely superior. I’m just saying some people can’t even afford that, and public library hours might conflict with work schedule, etc.

McDonalds has WiFi.

Check this out: Who needs motivation?

If you're so cash-strapped that buying even the cheapest laptop on the market is not feasible, medicine probably isn't the wisest career at the moment. (My original statement lacked the bolded part). Some commenters have stated that they had difficulty affording application fees, study materials, and laptops. My contention is that it would be more prudent to first find another job to pay for these rather than taking out a loan. The notion of taking out a loan to pay for everything one cannot afford is extremely dangerous. But loans do have a place but only when the gain significantly outweighs the risk such as when one actually gets into medical school but NOT before that is guaranteed. For the 50% that get into medical school, they may someday be able to pay back that debt. But for the other 50% that don't get in, they are saddled with that debt. If you find these claims dubious, perhaps consult any number of online personal finance sites or perhaps a friend or family member that has experienced the crippling effects of debt.

Disclaimer: Take everything I say with a grain of NaCl since I'm still a humble pre-med.

 

[deleted831695]

My parents, friends, and community all knew that Michigan State's medical schools included DO and MD, so they were ecstatic.

I guess I had to explain who A.T. Still was to the parents when his name was spoken during the osteopathic oath at White Coat Ceremony.