I am currently just finishing up my first month of internship in the ICU and am really considering quitting and doing something else with my life. I have been feeling this way for quite some time now, at least since the beginning of third year. I never really found a field that I enjoyed a lot and ended up picking internal medicine more or less by default since I didn't mind it and could see myself subspecializing. But in a hurry I have realized that internal med blows and although it is a means to an end (ie specializing) I cannot put up with this s--- for much longer, let alone three more years. There is just way too much bs involved in medicine these days. It is getting to the point where I hate being at the hospital, dislike seeing patients, and trying to act as a liason or more or less secretary between the specialists and other departments blows. I really do not enjoy patient care or clinic that much either. Granted I do enjoy some of the patients, about 10-20%, most I could care less about. It is just a mess trying to take histories on a lot of these vets patients and degenerate people at the inner city hospital, many of whom are continuously harming themselves upon discharge and bidding time until their next admission. How am I or supposed to care about these people? I don't want to sound too jaded, but that is how I really feel. These train wrecks with multiple organ system problems coming in on with no clue what their medical history is----just a damn nightmare. The clinic isn't any better. All these vicodin seeking patients, people bitching about depression, back pain, shoulder pain, four hundred pounders with dm and knee pain, 'it hurts all over', 'i have a shooting pain by my ankle that lasts three seconds', it is amazing people want to put up with this. The egos in the hospital are also completely annoying, the cocky a-- surgeons who think they walk on water, the ocd internal med people who'll suck out a brick if they back into a wall since their sphincter tones are that tight, etc. Does anyone else out there feel this way? I keep hearing that 'it gets better' but am sick of hearing that sh--. Life is too short to be thirty five or forty and begin enjoying it. I just want a job where I can work 50-70 hours/week and enjoy free time instead of having to read medicine journals in the tiny amount of free time I currently enjoy. Does anyone else think those journals are boring as hell? Most articles have little if any clinical application, yet we spend hours arguing about them at journal club. Good times. Does anyone know what else I can do with a medical degree, eg consulting, policy, administration, teaching, getting an MBA or MPH? Are there any good resources out there that can help send me down the right path. Also, would it be worthwhile to continue the nightmare of internship and finish the year in order for me to pass step 3 and become a liscensed physician. Will that open up more avenues for me in business or other areas? I do enjoy business and the market, enjoy teaching, and am a very creative thinker. Any help or comments on the subject are very much appreciated. ----hanging by a thread in michigan
fed up and wishing to pursue different careers
- Thread starter knuffa
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You're right,
Life is too short to be stuck in something you won't enjoy. Toughing it out would only be beneficial if you stay in healthcare, otherwise, no sense in wasting 80 hours a week of your life away.
I tell people that there is no way I would be in medicine if I didn't feel it was my "calling". This is too much stress, demands on the family, time and health.
If you are inclined, go into business for yourself and make sure you find a career that will help you pay back those loans.
I've found that most people in the medical profession have the talents to do other things and most always have the intelligence. Good luck in whatever decision you face.
PS - The same feelings you have about the clinic, hospital, etc. cross most of our minds. I see the light at the end of the tunnel when I get to call my own shots (when the insurance company lets me
) and see who I want to see.
Life is too short to be stuck in something you won't enjoy. Toughing it out would only be beneficial if you stay in healthcare, otherwise, no sense in wasting 80 hours a week of your life away.
I tell people that there is no way I would be in medicine if I didn't feel it was my "calling". This is too much stress, demands on the family, time and health.
If you are inclined, go into business for yourself and make sure you find a career that will help you pay back those loans.
I've found that most people in the medical profession have the talents to do other things and most always have the intelligence. Good luck in whatever decision you face.
PS - The same feelings you have about the clinic, hospital, etc. cross most of our minds. I see the light at the end of the tunnel when I get to call my own shots (when the insurance company lets me
) and see who I want to see.
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knuffa said:
I think that since you have come this far, and are about 80%+ through your medical career, you should finish internship and take step 3 and get licensed, because it could certainly open up some more doors (military, corporate medicine, etc.) and I think you would look back upon your medical training with intense regret, given all that you had to go through to get to this point. Get the paper, get the letters, change your mind if you feel like it.
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i don't have any advice for you but it sounds like you are very unhappy and in need of a quick change. is there any way to take a leave of absence so that you can figure things out?
i wish you the best of luck and hope that you find your calling. keep on hanging in there
i wish you the best of luck and hope that you find your calling. keep on hanging in there
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Finish your internship. I was 100% certain that I wouldn't practice medicine following my military payback, I was that bitter during internship. Everything you've stated I felt, I think anyone who is honest will admit that. Even if you never want to practice medicine again, passing step 3 and being licensed will be beneficial in whatever you do...it certainly can't hurt. Get your license, take some time off, look for another field, in medicine or out. It is possible to get through the internship, trust me.
NDD
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Agree that finishing internship would be good, and hopefully you'll have some better/easier months than ICU. Don't stick it out for the whole medicine residency if you are this dissatisfied already. It's not worth it to do the whole 3 years of training to be qualified to do a job you hate.
Have you thought about other fields of medicine with less patient care involvement? - pathology or radiology, mabye even anesthesia (although anes. do interact with patients daily, it's a short-term involvement - they also usually do some ICU time in residency though). In path or rads, you have much less direct patient contact and patient management, but get to use all that medical knowlege you've worked so hard to learn. In all 3 of these fields, you will be able to work a schedule where you can have a nice lifestyle and some freetime. In rads and anesthesia you have to do an intern year in medicine or surg or tranistional anyway, so you wouldn't have wasted time this year at all. In path I think you just go straight to path - this is a pretty uncompetetive field and I almost wonder if you could look around and find any open PGY1 spots you might be able to get into later this year?
Have you thought about other fields of medicine with less patient care involvement? - pathology or radiology, mabye even anesthesia (although anes. do interact with patients daily, it's a short-term involvement - they also usually do some ICU time in residency though). In path or rads, you have much less direct patient contact and patient management, but get to use all that medical knowlege you've worked so hard to learn. In all 3 of these fields, you will be able to work a schedule where you can have a nice lifestyle and some freetime. In rads and anesthesia you have to do an intern year in medicine or surg or tranistional anyway, so you wouldn't have wasted time this year at all. In path I think you just go straight to path - this is a pretty uncompetetive field and I almost wonder if you could look around and find any open PGY1 spots you might be able to get into later this year?
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Definitely try to suck it up and just finish your internship. Once that's over you will have many options available to you. Other posters have mentioned that you can always just finish this year and then switch to pathology, gas, etc.
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Dear friend:
I graduated in 2002. I entered an FP residency. Much like you, I started to feel terrible about being a Doctor long before I graduated. I more or less chose FP because I didn't see a better specialty.
I became terribly depressed. I hated waking up and going to work. I actually failed two rotations because I would skip out on them. The final straw was when the FP department told me they would remediate me. I turned in my letter or resignation. Right after that, I was actually hospitalized in a psych hospital for thoughts of killing myself.
But guess what? I have been in therapy and have been treated for my depression. Now, I am back in internship, after about a year and half absence.
Next year, I plan to apply to a psych residency. Psych is my calling. I learned a lot about myself in psych. And having been a patient will allow me to be a better psychiatrist.
As far as internship goes, I like what the other guy says about finding a different internship such as in Path. My current internship is a transitional year and they are very good to the interns. We are more like extra people in the hospital. The attendings who are paid medicare have to write their own notes, so they don't really care if we preround or write on patients.
Laid back internships are out there if you luck out and find one. That is what happened to me. I stumbled upon this one. Right now, at my small community hospital, my schedule is such that I work five days a week with no nights or weekends. I am on IM and the IM doc is paid by medicare--which means he has to write notes himself in order to be paid, so he doesn't really care if I write notes or even preround. Later on down the year, I will do some week end calls (about 10 calls the whole year). Then on OB, there is q7 call for the month, but that is all!.
You may think you hate being a physician right now. I felt the same way. However, I finally found a specialty that I am going to enjoy. This, coupled with an internship that isn't focused on working the interns to death has revived passion for medicine.
In summary: I quit my internship in 2002. Now I am just started another one. Night and day difference in the two internships. If in 2002, I had this internship, I would have had no problems finishing.
good luck to you. things will work out--just have to be flexible and accept that there may be set backs. The set backs are not the end of the world. You will survive and things will work themselves out. Just realize that the end product may be different from your initial conceptionalization, but that doesn't mean the end product is a bad one.
sincerely.
I graduated in 2002. I entered an FP residency. Much like you, I started to feel terrible about being a Doctor long before I graduated. I more or less chose FP because I didn't see a better specialty.
I became terribly depressed. I hated waking up and going to work. I actually failed two rotations because I would skip out on them. The final straw was when the FP department told me they would remediate me. I turned in my letter or resignation. Right after that, I was actually hospitalized in a psych hospital for thoughts of killing myself.
But guess what? I have been in therapy and have been treated for my depression. Now, I am back in internship, after about a year and half absence.
Next year, I plan to apply to a psych residency. Psych is my calling. I learned a lot about myself in psych. And having been a patient will allow me to be a better psychiatrist.
As far as internship goes, I like what the other guy says about finding a different internship such as in Path. My current internship is a transitional year and they are very good to the interns. We are more like extra people in the hospital. The attendings who are paid medicare have to write their own notes, so they don't really care if we preround or write on patients.
Laid back internships are out there if you luck out and find one. That is what happened to me. I stumbled upon this one. Right now, at my small community hospital, my schedule is such that I work five days a week with no nights or weekends. I am on IM and the IM doc is paid by medicare--which means he has to write notes himself in order to be paid, so he doesn't really care if I write notes or even preround. Later on down the year, I will do some week end calls (about 10 calls the whole year). Then on OB, there is q7 call for the month, but that is all!.
You may think you hate being a physician right now. I felt the same way. However, I finally found a specialty that I am going to enjoy. This, coupled with an internship that isn't focused on working the interns to death has revived passion for medicine.
In summary: I quit my internship in 2002. Now I am just started another one. Night and day difference in the two internships. If in 2002, I had this internship, I would have had no problems finishing.
good luck to you. things will work out--just have to be flexible and accept that there may be set backs. The set backs are not the end of the world. You will survive and things will work themselves out. Just realize that the end product may be different from your initial conceptionalization, but that doesn't mean the end product is a bad one.
sincerely.
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knuffa,
It doesn't hurt to call a head hunter and go over other options in medicine while you are still working, eg consulting, pharma, advertising. Figure out the switch first before you quit. Maybe it's just your program and you could apply to another?
It doesn't hurt to call a head hunter and go over other options in medicine while you are still working, eg consulting, pharma, advertising. Figure out the switch first before you quit. Maybe it's just your program and you could apply to another?
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Listen my friend, during my intern year I wanted to pack it in so many times I lost count. As part of our anesthesiology residency, we do an incredibly malignant year of IM. The only month I didn't have call was doing an ED rotation. All my other rotations had call, and on general medicine it was 7 per month!
I survived, probably because I knew that it wasn't what I was going to be doing. Anesthesiology hasn't been easy, but it's another world. Most of the issues you describe we avoid, except of course in our pain clinic and ICU months, but it's still quite different. If you love the challenge and the intellectual aspects of IM but hate dealing with the usual patient management issues, gas is the way. The most important thing is to find something YOU like in medicine. Rads may be the "premier" job in medicine, but not for me. Other guys may find gas just as boring. Different strokes for different folks.
Finishing your intern year will give you many options: You can then apply to, anesthesiology, neurology, PM&R, and theoretically rads, optho and even derm, though getting one of those three will be very difficult to say the least. There are also a few 2,3,4 ER programs as well.
I survived, probably because I knew that it wasn't what I was going to be doing. Anesthesiology hasn't been easy, but it's another world. Most of the issues you describe we avoid, except of course in our pain clinic and ICU months, but it's still quite different. If you love the challenge and the intellectual aspects of IM but hate dealing with the usual patient management issues, gas is the way. The most important thing is to find something YOU like in medicine. Rads may be the "premier" job in medicine, but not for me. Other guys may find gas just as boring. Different strokes for different folks.
Finishing your intern year will give you many options: You can then apply to, anesthesiology, neurology, PM&R, and theoretically rads, optho and even derm, though getting one of those three will be very difficult to say the least. There are also a few 2,3,4 ER programs as well.
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I agree with the good Dr. Cuts the Radiology is the place to be, but I'll make a plug for Pathology as well. I did the post-sophomore fellowship in Anatomic Path and really enjoyed the year, even more now looking back on the time (I was all fired up to see patients during the fellowship year, so I paid less attention than maybe I should have, waiting for third year clinical rotations. Little did I know at the time how little I'd like clinical medicine). Since radiology is now hypercompetitive, and path is still very easy to match in, path may be a better option for the original poster. Most of the benefits apply to both fields, though obviously I'm more partial to radiology.
The military would be a potential option, too, after finishing internship. Someplace to get paid to practice medicine with your hard won license but not have to decide what specialty to go into yet. With no committment to the military, you could actually negotiate good orders before signing up, so you wouldn't get the shaft with a bad ship tour (if you went Navy, all I can speak to.) I'm not a recruiter, so that's all I'll say, cruise the Military medicine boards for more info. However, I will say that my 3 years as a Diving Medical Officer saved my career in medicine, as I did return to residency and was able to take the time to really decide what to do with my life. Just one other option to think about. Hang in there.
NDD
The military would be a potential option, too, after finishing internship. Someplace to get paid to practice medicine with your hard won license but not have to decide what specialty to go into yet. With no committment to the military, you could actually negotiate good orders before signing up, so you wouldn't get the shaft with a bad ship tour (if you went Navy, all I can speak to.) I'm not a recruiter, so that's all I'll say, cruise the Military medicine boards for more info. However, I will say that my 3 years as a Diving Medical Officer saved my career in medicine, as I did return to residency and was able to take the time to really decide what to do with my life. Just one other option to think about. Hang in there.
NDD
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How fast can you run the 40? Miami's lookin' for a new RB.
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I chose to go into law enforcement full-time. I investigate narcotics crimes with a focus on pharmaceutical diversions investigations. I am hardly a quitter. I am an innovative user of my skills, and I still practice medicine part-time. You have a lot to learn, and your name calling likely comes from youthful arrogance and insecurity.
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You say,
"I keep hearing that 'it gets better' but am sick of hearing that sh--. Life is too short to be thirty five or forty and begin enjoying it."
People say it gets so much better. Right. Another invention to make you get up for another day of working harder than most people do in a week. And you have the benefit of a limited wimpy 80 hour work week.
The only reason doctors work so hard when they're in their 30s, 40s, and on up is because: loans have to get repaid, then they have to buy big houses and new cars, and then the kids start going to college. And then they say, "Oh, did I save anything during that time? Oh no, looks like I have to work for retirement!" And yes, that goes for radiologists too - I've never heard any radiologist particularly eager to go down to that dark room to read films other than betraying an eagerness for making easy money.
BTW: Our friends who were too "stupid" to "undertand" O Chem (ie, too "smart" to "sit down for 10 hours memorizing at a time") are setting their sights on retirement by the age of 50 from the jobs where they work 3 satisfying hours a day (please, if you don't know these people, then you have to get out of the hospital sometime and meet people. And don't flame me about how your best friend was an analyst who now works retail at Gap). And for the most part we accept that we're going to be working well into our 60s.
I totally agree with you on most everything you said. We've all gotten into this mess. If you're very lucky, then you don't have overwhelming debt, have married into wealth, and can have some freedom to make some real choices. Otherwise, get that Rx pad out because you're going to need a lot of SSRIs to get through the year - because, not to doubt your skills, I doubt J&J is beating down your doors to make you a VP of drug development.
Getting an MD doesn't give you ANY skills. Amazing, isn't it, that a school can take some of the brightest and hardest working people, take their money, and give them nearly nothing but two letters? At least they're capital letters. What did you learn how to do in the past 4 years? If you were anything like me, and the (a top 10) med school students that I now have to suffer, then you can't even be relied upon to obtain a history and come up with a sensible plan - which isn't even what you want to do anyway. Most likely, if you go into industry now, you'll be bringing doctors lunch and pens.
With an MD only and no residency, you can't even get a license - well, perhaps in West Texas. Your best bet, and it hurts me to say this, is to stick it out and graduate from ANY internship (transfer is an option). If you can then stomach it, to go on in your residency translates into a higher position when you make the Great Leap out of medicine.
And see that headhunter. Pronto. Because hopefully I'm wrong.
Good luck.
Oh yeah, I tried to keep this optimistic, so I hope I didn't sugar coat things too much.
"I keep hearing that 'it gets better' but am sick of hearing that sh--. Life is too short to be thirty five or forty and begin enjoying it."
People say it gets so much better. Right. Another invention to make you get up for another day of working harder than most people do in a week. And you have the benefit of a limited wimpy 80 hour work week.
The only reason doctors work so hard when they're in their 30s, 40s, and on up is because: loans have to get repaid, then they have to buy big houses and new cars, and then the kids start going to college. And then they say, "Oh, did I save anything during that time? Oh no, looks like I have to work for retirement!" And yes, that goes for radiologists too - I've never heard any radiologist particularly eager to go down to that dark room to read films other than betraying an eagerness for making easy money.
BTW: Our friends who were too "stupid" to "undertand" O Chem (ie, too "smart" to "sit down for 10 hours memorizing at a time") are setting their sights on retirement by the age of 50 from the jobs where they work 3 satisfying hours a day (please, if you don't know these people, then you have to get out of the hospital sometime and meet people. And don't flame me about how your best friend was an analyst who now works retail at Gap). And for the most part we accept that we're going to be working well into our 60s.
I totally agree with you on most everything you said. We've all gotten into this mess. If you're very lucky, then you don't have overwhelming debt, have married into wealth, and can have some freedom to make some real choices. Otherwise, get that Rx pad out because you're going to need a lot of SSRIs to get through the year - because, not to doubt your skills, I doubt J&J is beating down your doors to make you a VP of drug development.
Getting an MD doesn't give you ANY skills. Amazing, isn't it, that a school can take some of the brightest and hardest working people, take their money, and give them nearly nothing but two letters? At least they're capital letters. What did you learn how to do in the past 4 years? If you were anything like me, and the (a top 10) med school students that I now have to suffer, then you can't even be relied upon to obtain a history and come up with a sensible plan - which isn't even what you want to do anyway. Most likely, if you go into industry now, you'll be bringing doctors lunch and pens.
With an MD only and no residency, you can't even get a license - well, perhaps in West Texas. Your best bet, and it hurts me to say this, is to stick it out and graduate from ANY internship (transfer is an option). If you can then stomach it, to go on in your residency translates into a higher position when you make the Great Leap out of medicine.
And see that headhunter. Pronto. Because hopefully I'm wrong.
Good luck.
Oh yeah, I tried to keep this optimistic, so I hope I didn't sugar coat things too much.
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neglect said:
I don't know what kind of hospital you rotated at, but many of the attendings at my program as well as myself really enjoy the practice of radiology. Maybe you are projecting your bitterness onto others.
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Ha Ha Ha.
Yeah, that must be it. You totally got me. Radiologists love looking at films over and over. And do you get it: projection? Like projecting films?
That's why it's so easy to find radiologists at night - they just love it so much they have trouble going home. And that's why it's so easy to get them to approve those studies - they just love reading films. At all times of night and day. Especially when they're busy with the total body CT scan from trauma!
"Rotated at" (you could call it "worked at" though) least 6 hospitals off the top of my head - and my impression still stands. Impression isn't really the right word though - more like what I've been directly told.
Hey - it's terrific for you! $$$ is good.
Yeah, I feel better now. Thanks for the psychoanalysis. I needed that. Projection! Ha.
Yeah, that must be it. You totally got me. Radiologists love looking at films over and over. And do you get it: projection? Like projecting films?
That's why it's so easy to find radiologists at night - they just love it so much they have trouble going home. And that's why it's so easy to get them to approve those studies - they just love reading films. At all times of night and day. Especially when they're busy with the total body CT scan from trauma!
"Rotated at" (you could call it "worked at" though) least 6 hospitals off the top of my head - and my impression still stands. Impression isn't really the right word though - more like what I've been directly told.
Hey - it's terrific for you! $$$ is good.
Yeah, I feel better now. Thanks for the psychoanalysis. I needed that. Projection! Ha.
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Hi Knuffa,
I understand exactly how you feel. I too have had very mixed feelings about being a physician. The problem is that you have not found out what you like in medicine. Starting your internship in the ICU is not a great morale booster either.
Your are early in your career. Changing specialties will not be difficult for you now. Research all of the aspects of the different specialties and I am sure that you will find one that suits you.
I don't suggest that you leave medicine. There is such a wide variety from to choose from in our profession.
I cannot imagine anyone disliking medicine more than I did/do.
I am not saying that there is complete utopia in any specialties but there are a few specialties that you will "enjoy." You have to do some leg work. Look at the life style specialties but do not stop there. Medical infomatics is growing. You could get an MBA and work for and HMO. The possibilities are endless.
In the meantime, do not let a bad attitude or depression set in.
Examine what you hate the most about what you are doing now and look for the antethesis(did I spell that right?) of that. If you hate too talk to patients path may be better suited for you.
My own story is very similar to yours.
Good luck,
CambieMD
I understand exactly how you feel. I too have had very mixed feelings about being a physician. The problem is that you have not found out what you like in medicine. Starting your internship in the ICU is not a great morale booster either.
Your are early in your career. Changing specialties will not be difficult for you now. Research all of the aspects of the different specialties and I am sure that you will find one that suits you.
I don't suggest that you leave medicine. There is such a wide variety from to choose from in our profession.
I cannot imagine anyone disliking medicine more than I did/do.
I am not saying that there is complete utopia in any specialties but there are a few specialties that you will "enjoy." You have to do some leg work. Look at the life style specialties but do not stop there. Medical infomatics is growing. You could get an MBA and work for and HMO. The possibilities are endless.
In the meantime, do not let a bad attitude or depression set in.
Examine what you hate the most about what you are doing now and look for the antethesis(did I spell that right?) of that. If you hate too talk to patients path may be better suited for you.
My own story is very similar to yours.
Good luck,
CambieMD
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I don't want to hijack your thread, but I just had a question . . .
Is IM really this bad (particularly ICU)???
I'm just thinking about the "old days", my father and several of his friends went into IM and found it mentally stimulating with lots of opportunities to form long-lasting relationships with patients, etc. I am just wondering how much/how bad things have really changed in the field? Do a majority of IM residents plan on specializing? Does anyone want to Gen IM anymore? Just seems kind of scary if there's no one around who wants to do it in the future . . .
Just curious.
Is IM really this bad (particularly ICU)???
I'm just thinking about the "old days", my father and several of his friends went into IM and found it mentally stimulating with lots of opportunities to form long-lasting relationships with patients, etc. I am just wondering how much/how bad things have really changed in the field? Do a majority of IM residents plan on specializing? Does anyone want to Gen IM anymore? Just seems kind of scary if there's no one around who wants to do it in the future . . .
Just curious.
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neglect said:
Coming from a competitive undergrad, I know tons of people making big bucks in the corporate world right now. All of them work long hours. This three hour crap per day stuff is 100% ******ed. It's true that people in medicine get screwed during our training process, no question about that. But once you finish your training process, it's an excellent job by any standards. Even if you hate medicine, just going by average hours and pay, job security, and job mobility, the field is on par with any other profession (once you finish the training process ofcourse). Sure I have a lot of friends from college making 100k now while I'm still on loans. But they're jealous of the fact that I have 200k + guaranteed one day. Meanwhile they have to keep hoping to keep getting promoted. Then there's the occasional college friend who's making a sick amount of money right now, but those guys are the exceptions, not the rule. And radiology still blows away their lifestyle anyhow.
neglect said:
I agree with you here. The bad part about medicine is the training process. After making it this far, you really should keep going!
lolneglect said:
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CambieMD said:
what exactly does the field of medical informatics entail?
what can you do with an MBA and MD at an HMO?
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Idiopathic said:
hypothetically, is a preliminary year in medicine or surgery equivalent to the first yr in a intrenal medicine, surgery OB/GYN, or psychiatry residency program, as far as satisfying the minimum 1 year of residency training requirement (plus passing Step 3) to get licensed?
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I completely agree with knuffa and neglect. Its completely disheartening to get up so early, come home so late, and be miserable. Not to mention the ****** patients who come to the hospital either not knowing why they are there or with a problem list the size of an encyclopedia. And you would think that they would at least be somewhat grateful for your help FREE OF CHARGE but instead they yell at you about the cafeteria food, the a/c in the room, or some other bull**** complaint. I can't seem to understand how everything seemed so warm and fuzzy in college when I've turned into the very person that I swore I would never be: impatient, stressed, tired, unhappy.
Not only do I have all of these complaints but I was unlucky enough to be interested in surgery. Of all fields, I had to like the most malignant one. I kept my mind mind open during every clerkship and each one was torture. Surgery was the only one I woke up excited to go to. It was also the only one where I lost ten pounds, got sick twice, lost touch with my friends and family, and was humiliated on a daily basis.
Now, I'm caught between a rock and a hard place. Should I A) go into the specialty I enjoy, have no life, be miserable, and get a bad rap for being an a**hole OR B) go into any one of the other specialties, be miserable, BORED, and have somewhat of a life. How am I supposed to know what's ultimately going to make happier? Everyone say "do what you love" but then in the same sentence they say "why would you want to SURGERY"? By no means do I expect easy street, but surgery is such an extreme. They deal with sicker patients, colleagues with attitude problems, and half the sleep of the rest of the hospital. And who is to say that I won't end up miserable anyway? I've debated other career paths but it seems like everyone has the same problems: long hours with no pay and minimal feelings of accomplishment. Sometimes I wish I could rig the lottery and just buy a place off the coast of Hawaii.
I am amazed by how many people feel the same way. Here I thought I was the only one that hated life in medicine only to find an entire group of people with the same complaints and doubts.
Not only do I have all of these complaints but I was unlucky enough to be interested in surgery. Of all fields, I had to like the most malignant one. I kept my mind mind open during every clerkship and each one was torture. Surgery was the only one I woke up excited to go to. It was also the only one where I lost ten pounds, got sick twice, lost touch with my friends and family, and was humiliated on a daily basis.
Now, I'm caught between a rock and a hard place. Should I A) go into the specialty I enjoy, have no life, be miserable, and get a bad rap for being an a**hole OR B) go into any one of the other specialties, be miserable, BORED, and have somewhat of a life. How am I supposed to know what's ultimately going to make happier? Everyone say "do what you love" but then in the same sentence they say "why would you want to SURGERY"? By no means do I expect easy street, but surgery is such an extreme. They deal with sicker patients, colleagues with attitude problems, and half the sleep of the rest of the hospital. And who is to say that I won't end up miserable anyway? I've debated other career paths but it seems like everyone has the same problems: long hours with no pay and minimal feelings of accomplishment. Sometimes I wish I could rig the lottery and just buy a place off the coast of Hawaii.
I am amazed by how many people feel the same way. Here I thought I was the only one that hated life in medicine only to find an entire group of people with the same complaints and doubts.
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Yeah, you can moonlight ERs like that.prominence said:
To the OP:
sounds pretty bad...hang in there and finish step 3 and ABIM
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neglect said:
Whatever makes you feel better about yourself is cool with me. I'm just telling you that what you state as truth is not necessarily true. Of course the extremely busy on call radiologist, who is in charge of triaging scans at night (when there is limited technologist coverage), is not gonna be as happy at that point in time. I hope you find a field which you enjoy. Good luck. Ha.
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chigirl said:I completely agree with knuffa and neglect. Its completely disheartening to get up so early, come home so late, and be miserable. Not to mention the ****** patients who come to the hospital either not knowing why they are there or with a problem list the size of an encyclopedia. And you would think that they would at least be somewhat grateful for your help FREE OF CHARGE but instead they yell at you about the cafeteria food, the a/c in the room, or some other bull**** complaint. I can't seem to understand how everything seemed so warm and fuzzy in college when I've turned into the very person that I swore I would never be: impatient, stressed, tired, unhappy.
Not only do I have all of these complaints but I was unlucky enough to be interested in surgery. Of all fields, I had to like the most malignant one. I kept my mind mind open during every clerkship and each one was torture. Surgery was the only one I woke up excited to go to. It was also the only one where I lost ten pounds, got sick twice, lost touch with my friends and family, and was humiliated on a daily basis.
Now, I'm caught between a rock and a hard place. Should I A) go into the specialty I enjoy, have no life, be miserable, and get a bad rap for being an a**hole OR B) go into any one of the other specialties, be miserable, BORED, and have somewhat of a life. How am I supposed to know what's ultimately going to make happier? Everyone say "do what you love" but then in the same sentence they say "why would you want to SURGERY"? By no means do I expect easy street, but surgery is such an extreme. They deal with sicker patients, colleagues with attitude problems, and half the sleep of the rest of the hospital. And who is to say that I won't end up miserable anyway? I've debated other career paths but it seems like everyone has the same problems: long hours with no pay and minimal feelings of accomplishment. Sometimes I wish I could rig the lottery and just buy a place off the coast of Hawaii.
I am amazed by how many people feel the same way. Here I thought I was the only one that hated life in medicine only to find an entire group of people with the same complaints and doubts.
Your story reminds me of people who used to tell me to "do what you love" with regards to specialty. In some cases, those same people were nearly lead to their destruction by blindly following that advice. I'm sure it works for some people, but someone like yourself or myself need a balance between rewarding career and a rewarding personal life.
I'm sorry you have found yourself in that position. But is there any hope for another specialty? Perhaphs one that is a little less rewarding professionally, but would be less abusive and give you more time to persue a life outside of medicine?
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Most of the thoughts I see expressed here are similar to what I 've geard from people in the various specialties in the three years I've been in residency. But the bottom line is that there are so many options as to the type of medicine you can practice.
If you want an easy life, then PM&R, path, psychiatry, or primary care FP,peds or IM are all options. Radiology too fits the bill, but of course is much more competative.
Surgical residencies even with the "80 hr rule" are still very hard. But that being said, it varies from program to program. IM can be just as varied too. Our program for example kills the interns, but then after that in years II and III, they have only 3-4 calls a month, and they are often half calls. Not a bad life.
Residency training is certainly no fun, but once you are done with any specialty, you have even more options. I'm in my final year of anesthesiology. I know that when I go out to start practicing, I don't want a super stress filled existence. So that means no academic job, no level 1 trauma center, no liver transplants, and limiting the number of heads and hearts that I do. Guess what? There are tons of jobs out there doing "bread and butter" cases, and they still pay very well.
My advice? To those already in residency, hang in there, it does get better. And to those about to enter the match this fall, when you interview at programs, try to pull a few residents aside and get a real honest view of what the working conditions are like.
If you want an easy life, then PM&R, path, psychiatry, or primary care FP,peds or IM are all options. Radiology too fits the bill, but of course is much more competative.
Surgical residencies even with the "80 hr rule" are still very hard. But that being said, it varies from program to program. IM can be just as varied too. Our program for example kills the interns, but then after that in years II and III, they have only 3-4 calls a month, and they are often half calls. Not a bad life.
Residency training is certainly no fun, but once you are done with any specialty, you have even more options. I'm in my final year of anesthesiology. I know that when I go out to start practicing, I don't want a super stress filled existence. So that means no academic job, no level 1 trauma center, no liver transplants, and limiting the number of heads and hearts that I do. Guess what? There are tons of jobs out there doing "bread and butter" cases, and they still pay very well.
My advice? To those already in residency, hang in there, it does get better. And to those about to enter the match this fall, when you interview at programs, try to pull a few residents aside and get a real honest view of what the working conditions are like.
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Almost everyone who's been through internship has gotten to the point where they believe that medicine is not for them. Your medical career does not get any harder than the beginning of internship - especially in the ICU. It only gets easier from here on out.
Right now you have almost no practical skills. You don't know anyone. If you're anything like me, you're terrified at making a mistake that could kill or harm someone. The nurses treat you like crap. Attendings watch over your every move. You stay late every night after all of the residents have gone home.
This all gets better. Soon, you will be more efficient and more confident. You will leave work earlier and have more fun. Nurses will start to respect you as they get to know you. You'll joke around with your fellow residents. You'll start teaching med students and remembering how much trouble you had when you first did X procedure or Y workup. Attendings will start to trust you and stop second-guessing your decisions. You'll get some sleep on call, knowing which pages can be ignored and which must be answered immediately. Family members will come up to you in the hallway and thank you for all the care you've provided for their mother/father/grandmother.
I know this feeling has been creeping up since third year, but it's come to a head now because you're in one of the most difficult time periods in your life.
Finish your internship so you're capable of getting a license if you wish. If you don't have at least an internship under your belt, you have no options in medicine. All of the last 4+ years will be wasted from a career point of view.
Consider other specialities. You can do anesthesia, Optho, Radiology, Dermatology, Rads Onc etc. without losing any time whatsoever. These all have better schedules and less patient contact that IM.
Consider that this may just be a phase and you may start really enjoying yourself. For me it was about the middle of my intern year that I was able to stop worrying about the technical stuff to really get into medicine.
For the short term, use an off day to do something fun. Recharge. Start counting off the days left on your ICU rotation. Contact old friends (medical and nonmedical) and bitch about your life - friends often give you an excellent sense of perspective. Get out of hospital as much as you can.
Good luck
Right now you have almost no practical skills. You don't know anyone. If you're anything like me, you're terrified at making a mistake that could kill or harm someone. The nurses treat you like crap. Attendings watch over your every move. You stay late every night after all of the residents have gone home.
This all gets better. Soon, you will be more efficient and more confident. You will leave work earlier and have more fun. Nurses will start to respect you as they get to know you. You'll joke around with your fellow residents. You'll start teaching med students and remembering how much trouble you had when you first did X procedure or Y workup. Attendings will start to trust you and stop second-guessing your decisions. You'll get some sleep on call, knowing which pages can be ignored and which must be answered immediately. Family members will come up to you in the hallway and thank you for all the care you've provided for their mother/father/grandmother.
I know this feeling has been creeping up since third year, but it's come to a head now because you're in one of the most difficult time periods in your life.
Finish your internship so you're capable of getting a license if you wish. If you don't have at least an internship under your belt, you have no options in medicine. All of the last 4+ years will be wasted from a career point of view.
Consider other specialities. You can do anesthesia, Optho, Radiology, Dermatology, Rads Onc etc. without losing any time whatsoever. These all have better schedules and less patient contact that IM.
Consider that this may just be a phase and you may start really enjoying yourself. For me it was about the middle of my intern year that I was able to stop worrying about the technical stuff to really get into medicine.
For the short term, use an off day to do something fun. Recharge. Start counting off the days left on your ICU rotation. Contact old friends (medical and nonmedical) and bitch about your life - friends often give you an excellent sense of perspective. Get out of hospital as much as you can.
Good luck
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"For the short term, use an off day to do something fun. Recharge. Start counting off the days left on your ICU rotation. Contact old friends (medical and nonmedical) and bitch about your life - friends often give you an excellent sense of perspective. Get out of hospital as much as you can".
That's totally right on the money. As hard as it seems, you need to have a life outside of medicine to keep yourself sane. Join a gym, and workout regularly (incredible stress releaser). Plan for a really good dinner at a fancy restaurant at least once every two weeks. Get together with your fellow residents one night when you're all off and go out together and commiserate. Hang in there, we've ALL been there too.
That's totally right on the money. As hard as it seems, you need to have a life outside of medicine to keep yourself sane. Join a gym, and workout regularly (incredible stress releaser). Plan for a really good dinner at a fancy restaurant at least once every two weeks. Get together with your fellow residents one night when you're all off and go out together and commiserate. Hang in there, we've ALL been there too.
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In no way do I mean to insult the OP or others who expressed their dislike for the medical profession, but I am curious how this dissatisfaction seemingly "snuck up on you" during the latter part of medical school or early residency. In order to be admitted to most medical schools, one must have a fairly significant amout of previous exposure to the medical profession. This, in addition to the clincal exposure (albiet limited at some schools) during medical school, seems like enough "warning" in regards to difficult patients, long hours, etc. Was this untrue in your cases?
That being said (or asked, as the case may be), I think that life is definitely WAY too short to do something that you hate for 10 minutes, much less 20-30 years! I say find something that makes you happy ASAP- cut your losses if necessary.
That being said (or asked, as the case may be), I think that life is definitely WAY too short to do something that you hate for 10 minutes, much less 20-30 years! I say find something that makes you happy ASAP- cut your losses if necessary.
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To be admitted to most medical schools, you need not have any previous exposure to the medical profession. You must have the prerequisite undergrad classes (with any degree major), do well on the MCAT, and pass the interview.
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you are projecting...classic projection. ya got more issues than Time magazine. did you not have the scores to go into rads and now a big bitter lemon...you are. Ha.
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I did a research project with a urology fellow that did his first year in internal medicine and hated it. Went into urology, and really enjoyed it. I don't know how common it is to switch, but I bet some physicians do it.
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I think internship sucks in medicine or surgery. I think it's probably the worst in the ICU. But ...
Hey guess what? I actually like going to work. Radiology is interesting to me. And I work really hard. I probably don't have to put up with near the same kind or quantity of bs as internal medicine docs. If I don't go into academics, I will be working harder in private practice than residency. However I will still have a decent life.
I know many financially wise doctors including radiologists who have fully funded their retirement, have put their kids through college and are able to retire at 55-60 years old if they choose. (ie never have to work another day in their entire life).
If you think people making >100K in other fields didn't work hard to get where they are at and don't still probably work pretty hard, I've got a bridge in Brooklyn I'd like to sell you.
My advice to you echos many of those who have alread posted. Finish your internship year (PGY-1) and take Step III. Then look into getting a state medical license. Also find out about switching into other specialities and other careers.
You can moonlight a desperate ED with 1 yr of training and your state license. Or you can train in another field which is more satisfying.
I think every job has it's bs but you have to find one that you can put up with and where the positives outweigh the negatives for you.
neglect said:
Hey guess what? I actually like going to work. Radiology is interesting to me. And I work really hard. I probably don't have to put up with near the same kind or quantity of bs as internal medicine docs. If I don't go into academics, I will be working harder in private practice than residency. However I will still have a decent life.
I know many financially wise doctors including radiologists who have fully funded their retirement, have put their kids through college and are able to retire at 55-60 years old if they choose. (ie never have to work another day in their entire life).
neglect said:
If you think people making >100K in other fields didn't work hard to get where they are at and don't still probably work pretty hard, I've got a bridge in Brooklyn I'd like to sell you.
My advice to you echos many of those who have alread posted. Finish your internship year (PGY-1) and take Step III. Then look into getting a state medical license. Also find out about switching into other specialities and other careers.
You can moonlight a desperate ED with 1 yr of training and your state license. Or you can train in another field which is more satisfying.
I think every job has it's bs but you have to find one that you can put up with and where the positives outweigh the negatives for you.
As a radiologist on the edge of wealth and prosperity, let me give you some REAL advice.... RUN FAR AWAY FROM IM!!
The truth is that the hospital is full of depraved souls... some calling themselves patients, others wearing white coats and calling themselves doctors. The personality pathology is amazing.
Most of us got into medicine with the idea that it is a noble profession where we can "make a difference" and "help people." Unfortunately, medicine is no longer that profession. Now, it is a perversion of its former self, run more by trial lawyers and the "suits" at the top of HMOs than any physician. Furthermore, not a lot of people out there want your "help" anyways. Sacrificing youself and your happiness for your career now is akin to selling your soul to a corporation. You want to help people, go volunteer in a 3rd world country teaching and feeding destitute children.
We no longer live in the society of yesterday, and the medical profession, although still filled with many good people, it not what it once was.
As for me reading films... I find it very interesting, as much as any JOB can be. It is probably one of the top 3 jobs in medicine. But, of course, I also do it for the love of the bling-bling. I am happy to work late and read CTs and MRIs.... for a price. Frankly, I am really good at what I do, and expect to be paid accordingly.
I am not interested in changing the world.... unless I can do it from a 911 Turbo.
If I were you, I would get out of IM.
The truth is that the hospital is full of depraved souls... some calling themselves patients, others wearing white coats and calling themselves doctors. The personality pathology is amazing.
Most of us got into medicine with the idea that it is a noble profession where we can "make a difference" and "help people." Unfortunately, medicine is no longer that profession. Now, it is a perversion of its former self, run more by trial lawyers and the "suits" at the top of HMOs than any physician. Furthermore, not a lot of people out there want your "help" anyways. Sacrificing youself and your happiness for your career now is akin to selling your soul to a corporation. You want to help people, go volunteer in a 3rd world country teaching and feeding destitute children.
We no longer live in the society of yesterday, and the medical profession, although still filled with many good people, it not what it once was.
As for me reading films... I find it very interesting, as much as any JOB can be. It is probably one of the top 3 jobs in medicine. But, of course, I also do it for the love of the bling-bling. I am happy to work late and read CTs and MRIs.... for a price. Frankly, I am really good at what I do, and expect to be paid accordingly.
I am not interested in changing the world.... unless I can do it from a 911 Turbo.
If I were you, I would get out of IM.
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Sorry, feel compelled to respond. This doesn't have anything to do with the origional post.
So I should tell you that I'm a medical subspecialty. Oh yeah, I got a 92 on step 1, so probably could have gotten into rads, but did not. I didn't really consider it because I just knew it wasn't for me: I actually thought it was kinda pointless, dictating all day, having no perceivable impact other than making the films go from unread to read, and sitting in a dark room. I'm happy some people can tolerate it, I couldn't. Didn't mean to rag on rads, but most people assume that if you don't like medicine, it means you should have done either radiology or derm. This thinking isn't right. I don't dig rashes either. Radrules' post is typical of the radiologists I've met. Perhaps you really really dig work. Cool.
Weird thing is, I actually presently enjoy about 25 to 50% of the clinical practice I do. The 50% that actually requires some thought, does not involve anything meaningless like documentation, dispo, fights with other services, cya-ing, dealing with the things I'd rather not deal with (any phone conversation). In short, I could tolerate clinical private practice. (Get really annoying flyers almost every day: could make 400,000 somewhere with "great schools").
And overall I'm happy with what I currently have. Moonlighting currently makes me about 50% of my salary - and it's minimal in terms of time and scut. Have minimal debt - now.
But I'd rather not do clinical practice for the rest of my life. I don't see it building towards anything. So I'm taking steps away from clinical practice now.
I think it's a shame, as I've perhaps written here before, that we encourage bright people to go into medicine, allow them to accumulate large debt burdens, and then assume that they'll like all of medicine. That they will, in the words of any of our deans, "find your nitche"
But medicine isn't good. There may be no nitche for you. Medicine isn't growing. It's stagnant. We have no real competition, no impetus to get better other than our pride in what we do. Everything we do comes with little to no protection from medical errors - and when they do occur we either: never know, ignore them, say sorry, get sued. (Just had a plain film showing a fx - missed - one month ago).
Yeah, I wish I didn't go into medicine. Now that I'm here however, I'm happy to make the most of it.
And I agree, people making over 100000 tend to have to work for it. Dear Vox, so sorry can't resist, but are you making that? Even with moonlighting? And how hard do you work/have you worked/will you work?
The vast majority of people, first of all, do not make that much, and second of all, do not work very hard for it. Instead, if they are smart, they've maxed out IRAs (which few medical students have even heard of as they plummet into debt), invested, bought real estate. They work a little, they have never taken a 36 hour call, they play a lot, and in 10 years their investments will more than make up for it.
Again, if you don't know these people, then get out of the hospital! Or take this as a sign that you really need to call those high school friends you lost contact with. My electrician makes more money than me - by a lot.
So I should tell you that I'm a medical subspecialty. Oh yeah, I got a 92 on step 1, so probably could have gotten into rads, but did not. I didn't really consider it because I just knew it wasn't for me: I actually thought it was kinda pointless, dictating all day, having no perceivable impact other than making the films go from unread to read, and sitting in a dark room. I'm happy some people can tolerate it, I couldn't. Didn't mean to rag on rads, but most people assume that if you don't like medicine, it means you should have done either radiology or derm. This thinking isn't right. I don't dig rashes either. Radrules' post is typical of the radiologists I've met. Perhaps you really really dig work. Cool.
Weird thing is, I actually presently enjoy about 25 to 50% of the clinical practice I do. The 50% that actually requires some thought, does not involve anything meaningless like documentation, dispo, fights with other services, cya-ing, dealing with the things I'd rather not deal with (any phone conversation). In short, I could tolerate clinical private practice. (Get really annoying flyers almost every day: could make 400,000 somewhere with "great schools").
And overall I'm happy with what I currently have. Moonlighting currently makes me about 50% of my salary - and it's minimal in terms of time and scut. Have minimal debt - now.
But I'd rather not do clinical practice for the rest of my life. I don't see it building towards anything. So I'm taking steps away from clinical practice now.
I think it's a shame, as I've perhaps written here before, that we encourage bright people to go into medicine, allow them to accumulate large debt burdens, and then assume that they'll like all of medicine. That they will, in the words of any of our deans, "find your nitche"
But medicine isn't good. There may be no nitche for you. Medicine isn't growing. It's stagnant. We have no real competition, no impetus to get better other than our pride in what we do. Everything we do comes with little to no protection from medical errors - and when they do occur we either: never know, ignore them, say sorry, get sued. (Just had a plain film showing a fx - missed - one month ago).
Yeah, I wish I didn't go into medicine. Now that I'm here however, I'm happy to make the most of it.
And I agree, people making over 100000 tend to have to work for it. Dear Vox, so sorry can't resist, but are you making that? Even with moonlighting? And how hard do you work/have you worked/will you work?
The vast majority of people, first of all, do not make that much, and second of all, do not work very hard for it. Instead, if they are smart, they've maxed out IRAs (which few medical students have even heard of as they plummet into debt), invested, bought real estate. They work a little, they have never taken a 36 hour call, they play a lot, and in 10 years their investments will more than make up for it.
Again, if you don't know these people, then get out of the hospital! Or take this as a sign that you really need to call those high school friends you lost contact with. My electrician makes more money than me - by a lot.
I am a little confused by your post, do you like medicine or not?
As for radiology, we do a lot more than sit in a dark room all day and read films. Of course, this is the prevailing notion among the ignorant out there.
You very rarely hear most clinicians say they are in the best field in medicine, but radiologists say it all the time. There is something to be said for that.
As for radiology, we do a lot more than sit in a dark room all day and read films. Of course, this is the prevailing notion among the ignorant out there.
You very rarely hear most clinicians say they are in the best field in medicine, but radiologists say it all the time. There is something to be said for that.
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RADRULES said:
Yeah, you get up for coffee and bathroom breaks.
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The only reason I would do rads "which I love" instead of medicine, is for the money....
Internists do the really important work in healthcare. The feeling of healing sick patients makes it extremely rewarding for me, and that is why I feel it is hands-down, a more exciting field.
Internists do the really important work in healthcare. The feeling of healing sick patients makes it extremely rewarding for me, and that is why I feel it is hands-down, a more exciting field.
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Newdoc2002 said:Yeah, you get up for coffee and bathroom breaks.
LOL.
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Good to see you back, RADRULES.
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It is kind of funny that some rad folks have a parallel discussion going on within this post. Enough already. We all know that radiology has a lot going for it right now. The initial poster was looking for direction and advice. The radiology guys could start another thread to sing the praises of radiology.
I still think that this guy just needs to find out what floats his/her boat.
About working as an MBA at an HMO. 9-5 no call ,no malpractice, no overhead ,no patients or their families to deal with. That is not what I would want to do but I definately can see why some MDs have crossed over.
CambieMD
P.s.
Where do you hide money from a radiologist. I am sure that you have heard that you put it in a book to keep it out of the hands of a surgeon. For psychiatrist you put it on the patient.To keep money out of the hands of an attorney by bury it in the truth. I could go on and on . The answer is you can't. They always find it.
Oh, for Ricky Williams put it in a clean drug screen.
I still think that this guy just needs to find out what floats his/her boat.
About working as an MBA at an HMO. 9-5 no call ,no malpractice, no overhead ,no patients or their families to deal with. That is not what I would want to do but I definately can see why some MDs have crossed over.
CambieMD
P.s.
Where do you hide money from a radiologist. I am sure that you have heard that you put it in a book to keep it out of the hands of a surgeon. For psychiatrist you put it on the patient.To keep money out of the hands of an attorney by bury it in the truth. I could go on and on . The answer is you can't. They always find it.
Oh, for Ricky Williams put it in a clean drug screen.
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Hey there;
I was in your situation a few years back. I was in Internal Medicine and left after my intern year. For your information there are quite a few people who leave or take extended time off from residency. Some moonlight for a few years, some work in IT/health informatics if you have the back ground, and I've even heard of one person becoming a restaurant manager. I personally wanted to hide out in Goa like Jason Bourne and shack up with Franka Potente , but lacking the finances, physique, and Matt Damon charm I had to fall back on my tech skills and work in engineering. Working in a different field gave me a different perspective on life, family, and career. As in there's something more to life than just your career. Brainstorm with someone who knows you well about what kind of work would make you happy.
First thing I would do in your situation is realise that your feelings are not unique, many many people feel angry and depressed during residency. It's not caused by you, it's a known and accepted side effect of residency training. If you need/want to talk to someone please do: some find comfort in friends/family others with trusted colleagues, some with counsellors, and some post on message boards 🙂 . I would add as a caveat that talking to senior medical people (esp attendings) about your feelings may be counter-productive. Alot just don't understand about this and will spout ACGME approved nonsense in my opinion. This is true even now and even with younger attendings.
Next: I would put my heart into taking active care of my patients. Don't just do what the attending or senior tell you. Ask why, learn as much as you can because you're learning the skills that pay the bills. Come next July 1 you're out there unsupervised relying on just your knowledge base to get you through, esp if you moonlight.
Then: I would get a book on resumes/job searching from a bookstore. Read it note the format of resumes/cover letters. Write one using your residency match stuff as a reference. If you know anyone in the industry you want to go into have them look through your resume and cover letter and mark it up (have them be brutal). After that, look for a head hunter. If you're still interested in doing something health care related search google for: 'executive search' and healthcare. That should get you some websites.
Good luck and feel free to PM me about anything.
theD.O.C.
I was in your situation a few years back. I was in Internal Medicine and left after my intern year. For your information there are quite a few people who leave or take extended time off from residency. Some moonlight for a few years, some work in IT/health informatics if you have the back ground, and I've even heard of one person becoming a restaurant manager. I personally wanted to hide out in Goa like Jason Bourne and shack up with Franka Potente
, but lacking the finances, physique, and Matt Damon charm I had to fall back on my tech skills and work in engineering. Working in a different field gave me a different perspective on life, family, and career. As in there's something more to life than just your career. Brainstorm with someone who knows you well about what kind of work would make you happy. First thing I would do in your situation is realise that your feelings are not unique, many many people feel angry and depressed during residency. It's not caused by you, it's a known and accepted side effect of residency training. If you need/want to talk to someone please do: some find comfort in friends/family others with trusted colleagues, some with counsellors, and some post on message boards 🙂 . I would add as a caveat that talking to senior medical people (esp attendings) about your feelings may be counter-productive. Alot just don't understand about this and will spout ACGME approved nonsense in my opinion. This is true even now and even with younger attendings.
Next: I would put my heart into taking active care of my patients. Don't just do what the attending or senior tell you. Ask why, learn as much as you can because you're learning the skills that pay the bills. Come next July 1 you're out there unsupervised relying on just your knowledge base to get you through, esp if you moonlight.
Then: I would get a book on resumes/job searching from a bookstore. Read it note the format of resumes/cover letters. Write one using your residency match stuff as a reference. If you know anyone in the industry you want to go into have them look through your resume and cover letter and mark it up (have them be brutal). After that, look for a head hunter. If you're still interested in doing something health care related search google for: 'executive search' and healthcare. That should get you some websites.
Good luck and feel free to PM me about anything.
theD.O.C.
- Joined
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theD.O.C. said:
Although it is certainly true that many attendings (I don't know what % as I doubt this has been polled) would react negatively to your expression of these feelings, not all (or, in my opinion, nearly all) would. Sometimes, just like perspectives given in anonymous message boards are helpful, talking with someone who is 5,10, or even 20 years out of residency and has seen the path of careers of many residents can be helpful too. In dealing with attendings, it might be worth it to sound them out a bit first with some gentle complaining. If you get "suck it up" or "it'll pass" then move on to someone else. But I assure you that not ALL attendings have forgotten and will answer that way. Sometimes attendings can identify when a resident is having trouble adapting and is unhappy, but they don't feel comfortable asking the residents about what is going on for fear of intruding or getting too personal. They may need to have the resident initiate some contact in order to be able to help.
Good luck with your choices
Regards
Oldbearprofessor
- Joined
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Hey, sounds like you need to get out. If I were you, I would finish internship and do a residency in Public Health, Preventive Med, Occupational Med...
Graduates are paid well, most don't work more than 50-70 hrs, and they don't work in clnics nor hospitals... they work for companies, consulting firms, or governmental agencies in a managerial position. It's 3 years total, but 1 year is a clinical year for which you should get credit for your IM intern year. Then 1 year of class work for your MPH, and 1 year of practicum which can be in an agency. At the same time, you get an MPH which should be the equivalent of a managerial professional degree.
Worth looking into.
Graduates are paid well, most don't work more than 50-70 hrs, and they don't work in clnics nor hospitals... they work for companies, consulting firms, or governmental agencies in a managerial position. It's 3 years total, but 1 year is a clinical year for which you should get credit for your IM intern year. Then 1 year of class work for your MPH, and 1 year of practicum which can be in an agency. At the same time, you get an MPH which should be the equivalent of a managerial professional degree.
Worth looking into.
TRANSLATION: We are scut monkeys who admit and manage the patient no one else wants to deal with. We spend our days babysitting Ortho patients with hypertension and discussing the facinating world of cholesterol lowering drugs.
Hey, someone has to do it, just glad it is not me. 😛
