All Branch Topic (ABT) Flight surgeon training questions

[zeppelinpage4]

Hey everyone, I posted a couple years ago about flight surgeon training and got some great responses. Just to add to that, I ended up deciding I want to practice medicine and be a physician as my main career so I did not apply to OCS and do pilot training. Instead I went straight to med school. Nonetheless, I still have an interest in flight, aerospace medicine, being a general practitioner, and public health, and it seems being a flight surgeon might let me incorporate these interests to varying degrees in one career.

I just had a few additional questions.

1) I've been doing some research online and someone on another forum mentioned that HPSP graduates get priority when applying to become flight surgeons. Is this true?
I ask because I am already an MS2 and did not apply for HPSP. Would being a non-HPSP grad be a big hindrance to my applying to the flight surgeon program? And if accepted, would I be given the same opportunities as those who did HPSP once in the program?

2) Also, from reading other threads, it seems there's 6 months of training, then you spend 2 years as a GMO with your assigned unit, then you do your residency (either within the military, or as a civilian). Is this correct? I imagine this also varies between Army, Air Force, and Navy.
What happens after a flight surgeon has done their residency? Do they become civilian doctors? Or are they expected to come back to the military (serving as the specialty they did the residency in)?
Do they have to apply to military residency programs only?

3) As a continuation of the previous question, I'd also like to know roughly how many years a non-HPSP grad flight surgeon should expect to dedicate to the military before they can choose to go back into civilian medicine. A user in the last thread said it could all add up to a decade before you are able to leave the military.

4) Lastly, I know you guys get this a lot, but what are the odds of a flight surgeon being placed in a unit that flies double seat fighter jets? I ask because I have an interest in working with fighter pilots and being around fighters, and to occasionally be a passenger in them (I realize I won't be flying myself, and I'd likely be spending a very very small amount of my time in these planes) but being around that environment would be an amazing opportunity. Do flight surgeons have any choice in the billet they get?

Sorry there's so many questions. I'm considering contacting a recruiter to get more info. If there's any other good/accurate websites or threads that have more info. on the life of a flight surgeon, and flight surgeon training that would be worth reading, I'd appreciate any links. I just want to start the process of educating myself on this properly.

I realize still have a lot to learn, and I'm certainly not 100% decided if this is something I want to do (hence I didn't apply for HPSP) but I've been thinking about pursuing this for so many years now, even before med school, that I don't want to just dismiss the idea but try to learn more about it and then make a decision. Thank you.

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[WernickeDO]

A flight surgeon is a doc or PA who has completed a 6 week course on how to take care of aircrew members. Said doc could be intern trained or an cardiologist. Doing the 6 week course will accomplish you precisely zero in a civilian setting. If you are interested in taking care of pilots look into occupational medicine and trying to get on with an airline. You have to actually join the military to do any kind of military training.

 

[backrow]

A flight surgeon is a doc or PA who has completed a 6 week course on how to take care of aircrew members.

For the Navy it is a 6 month long course for Doctors only.

 

[WernickeDO]

For the Navy it is a 6 month long course for Doctors only.

Interesting. I didn't know that. Army is 6 weeks. But the point is moot because OP is not military.

 

[backrow]

Interesting. I didn't know that. Army is 6 weeks. But the point is moot because OP is not military.

You can apply for the Navy program, at least, as a civilian to come on active duty. Can't tell you what the chances of selection are though.

 

[j4pac]

Most of your questions are irrelevant at this time because you aren't military. You have to be Army, Navy, or Air Force to have a chance to be a Flight Surgeon in the military.

I am about 100%certain that the military has the only Aerospace medical residency and it is joint with occupational med residency. It's located in Pensacola FL. You have to be military to get in.

If you are civilian you could be an Aeromedical examiner after specializing in Occupational medicine.but there is no flying with that gig...only flight physicals and admin.

I love being a Flight Surgeon but you want to be boarded in another specialty. FS is great as a GMO before residency or something to give you a change of scenery for board certified docs of all specialties. Both of those scenarios are for military personnel.

If your life's mission is to fly and be a flight surgeon...join the Navy. It's the best and most fun flight training around.

 

[backrow]

Most of your questions are irrelevant at this time because you aren't military. You have to be Army, Navy, or Air Force to have a chance to be a Flight Surgeon in the military.

You can apply to the Navy program as a civilian and come on active duty, had one in my class "a few" years back. (Granted, I guess this could have changed, but I doubt it).

I am about 100%certain that the military has the only Aerospace medical residency and it is joint with occupational med residency. It's located in Pensacola FL. You have to be military to get in.

UTMB Galveston has an aerospace medicine residency that from what I know is pretty well respected.
http://pmch.utmb.edu/residency/aerospace-medicine-program

 

[Cooperd0g]

Hey everyone, I posted a couple years ago about flight surgeon training and got some great responses. Just to add to that, I ended up deciding I want to practice medicine and be a physician as my main career so I did not apply to OCS and do pilot training. Instead I went straight to med school. Nonetheless, I still have an interest in flight, aerospace medicine, being a general practitioner, and public health, and it seems being a flight surgeon might let me incorporate these interests to varying degrees in one career.

I just had a few additional questions.

1) I've been doing some research online and someone on another forum mentioned that HPSP graduates get priority when applying to become flight surgeons. Is this true?
I ask because I am already an MS2 and did not apply for HPSP. Would being a non-HPSP grad be a big hindrance to my applying to the flight surgeon program? And if accepted, would I be given the same opportunities as those who did HPSP once in the program?

HPSP grads do not get priority to become flight surgeons. They are really only competing with USUHS grads anyway. This is because most people become flight surgeons after their intern year and are already in the military. Since you say you are not HPSP then you are not going to be eligible for a military internship and also won't be eligible to apply to flight surgery during your intern year as far as I know (edit - looks like backrow says it is possible). You could, however, apply for a 2 year HPSP scholarship to finish out your last two years of medical school and then be eligible for the military match, internship and then flight surgery. You would have a three year commitment to active duty after your internship if you took a 2 year scholarship. Most of that would be covered with flight surgery training and a tour. Any remaining balance you could likely extend at your job. During that time you could decided if you want to stay in or get out.

2) Also, from reading other threads, it seems there's 6 months of training, then you spend 2 years as a GMO with your assigned unit, then you do your residency (either within the military, or as a civilian). Is this correct? I imagine this also varies between Army, Air Force, and Navy.
What happens after a flight surgeon has done their residency? Do they become civilian doctors? Or are they expected to come back to the military (serving as the specialty they did the residency in)?
Do they have to apply to military residency programs only?

Navy flight surgery course is 6 months, Army/AF are 6 weeks. Typically people will do another tour as a flight surgeon or seek specialty training. If their commitment to the military is up and they want to leave the military they can apply to the civilian match for their further training and just be a civilian. Once trained as a civilian people can always try to come back into the military if they want as a board certified doc; I have seen a few who got out and then later decided to rejoin. If they still have commitment left and/or want to be in the military they can try for their specialty of choice within the military.

3) As a continuation of the previous question, I'd also like to know roughly how many years a non-HPSP grad flight surgeon should expect to dedicate to the military before they can choose to go back into civilian medicine. A user in the last thread said it could all add up to a decade before you are able to leave the military.

The only real way for a non-HPSP grad and non-USUHS grad to become a flight surgeon is complete a civilian residency first and then enter the military as a board certified physician with a deal to become a flight surgeon. That doesn't really answer this question because per my answers above, you can't really become a military flight surgeon from civilian medical school. I suppose it is theoretically possible to complete a civilian internship, get a state license and try to sign up for the military and seek flight surgery. I have no idea how realistic that is; probably not very realistic at all. (edit - backrow said he has seen it at least once)

4) Lastly, I know you guys get this a lot, but what are the odds of a flight surgeon being placed in a unit that flies double seat fighter jets? I ask because I have an interest in working with fighter pilots and being around fighters, and to occasionally be a passenger in them (I realize I won't be flying myself, and I'd likely be spending a very very small amount of my time in these planes) but being around that environment would be an amazing opportunity. Do flight surgeons have any choice in the billet they get?

Actually not terrible, at least in the Navy. Many of the fighters have been pushed away from nice places to live because of civilian complaints about noise. Most young doctors who become flight surgeons seem to be more interested in living in a "cool" place than they are interested in what type of aircraft they will be associated. If you are willing to live in what other people may consider less than desirable places like Lemoore, CA and Fallon, NV then you would likely get your choice and have pretty good opportunity for two seat fighters. I am not familiar with how the Army and Air Force assign flight surgeon billets, but in the Navy they pretty much give each flight surgeon class a list of the billets and let the class try and work out who wants what.

Sorry there's so many questions. I'm considering contacting a recruiter to get more info. If there's any other good/accurate websites or threads that have more info. on the life of a flight surgeon, and flight surgeon training that would be worth reading, I'd appreciate any links. I just want to start the process of educating myself on this properly.

I realize still have a lot to learn, and I'm certainly not 100% decided if this is something I want to do (hence I didn't apply for HPSP) but I've been thinking about pursuing this for so many years now, even before med school, that I don't want to just dismiss the idea but try to learn more about it and then make a decision. Thank you.

I would not recommend contacting a recruiter about the life and career path of a flight surgeon. It is hard to state just how little they know about the subject. Many of them barely know the process for their signing people up for HPSP or FAP. I am not very familiar with websites you could look at other than the program websites themselves. There may be some helpful threads on this forum, but none that I have bookmarked or anything.

Here is a link to the Navy flight surgeon course info. You can click around for more info as well.
http://www.med.navy.mil/sites/nmotc/nami/Pages/CourseCatalog.aspx

I know you didn't ask directly about the aerospace medicine residency, but others brought it up. From your interests laid out in the opening paragraph you might be interested in the Navy or Army combined residency in Aerospace and Occupational medicine, but that really does require you to be in the military. Also, according to the Aerospace Medical Association there are six recognized aerospace medicine residency programs. Four are civilian with three of them in this country - Mayo Clinic, Wright State and University of Texas Medical Branch (which is associated with NASA).
Here is a link to the Navy combined Aerospace and Occupational Medicine residency.
http://www.med.navy.mil/sites/nmotc/nami/Pages/Department33AerospaceMedicineResidency.aspx

BTW I am a former Naval Aviator and plan on the aerospace medicine residency so I have a fair amount of experience, but obviously a different viewpoint than those who have actually been flight surgeons already.

 

[deuist]

1) I've been doing some research online and someone on another forum mentioned that HPSP graduates get priority when applying to become flight surgeons. Is this true?

No, that's not true. If you have a pulse you can become a flight surgeon.

2) Also, from reading other threads, it seems there's 6 months of training, then you spend 2 years as a GMO with your assigned unit, then you do your residency (either within the military, or as a civilian). Is this correct?

As mentioned above, the Air Force and Army have a six-week flight surgery course, while the Navy's is six months. As far as the timing on residency, a lot of that depends on you as well as the luck of the military match. Some folks would do residency first (in say, family medicine or emergency medicine) and then pursue flight surgery, while others will do a one-year internship, complete a tour as a flight surgeon, and then go to residency.

What happens after a flight surgeon has done their residency? Do they become civilian doctors? Or are they expected to come back to the military (serving as the specialty they did the residency in)?

You become a civilian doctor after you have finished all of your active-duty service obligation. That could be after a flight surgery tour, or you may have additional obligations.

Do they have to apply to military residency programs only?

You can apply to residency through the civilian match if the military grants a deferral.

I'd also like to know roughly how many years a non-HPSP grad flight surgeon should expect to dedicate to the military before they can choose to go back into civilian medicine.

Every physician has an eight year commitment to the military. At least two of those years are going to be spent on active duty, with the rest in the reserves. The total timing depends upon what kind of residency you go through and what kind of bonuses you take on.

what are the odds of a flight surgeon being placed in a unit that flies double seat fighter jets?

If you want to be a pilot so much, the Air Force does have a pilot-physician program whereby certain flight surgeons can go through pilot training and become dual rated as pilots and doctors.

Do flight surgeons have any choice in the billet they get?

You get to rank potential locations and then will be sent to one of them.

I'm considering contacting a recruiter to get more info.

That's definitely the last place that you should look. Recruiters know little to nothing about what doctors in the military do and will fill their knowledge gaps by outright lying to you. Use this website for any questions that you may have.