FMG applying for a residency

[zade]

---

Members don't see this ad.

Hi! I'm on my 4th and last year of med school in the Philippines and I was thinking about doing my residency elsewhere. How does a FMG apply for residency in Australia? I honestly don't have a clue. I'm thinking of taking up plastic surgery so is it hard to accepted for a surgical residency? Also, how many years does it take? Any info would be greatly appreciated... 🙂

 

[pitman]

It'd be extremely difficult to get into surgery here for you.

First, you'd have to land an internship. This is done at the state level (for example, for Queensland see: http://www.health.qld.gov.au/medical/osdocsinfo.asp), but non-Australians from non-Australian med schools are at the bottom of the preferences list, which means much lower odds of getting in, and if you do, then prob no real choice of where you go (South Australia is prob the most FMG-friendly for internship, but that might just be for GPs, not sure).

After internship, you become a House Officer for one+ years, before applying and passing exams to enter the Royal Australian College of Surgeons. Note that surgery is one of the more competitive fields here (there's a shortage of them, but not a lot of training spots), and the exams are apparently a beoch. Once in the RACS, you become a registrar and work specifically towards becoming a general surgeon. In all, general surgery is about 7 years post grad, not sure about how much additional for sub-specialties.

If you can get Australian permanent residency, then it'd be easier for you to get an internship in most states. Or you might want to look into whether you can do internship somewhere else and come here as a house officer.

 

[pitman]

The site above no longer has the page on internship priority, but there are 7 or 8 categories (first being Oz residents graduating from Qld schools), with non-Australian FMGs last.

 

[landa29x]

Hi! I'm on my 4th and last year of med school in the Philippines and I was thinking about doing my residency elsewhere. How does a FMG apply for residency in Australia? I honestly don't have a clue. I'm thinking of taking up plastic surgery so is it hard to accepted for a surgical residency? Also, how many years does it take? Any info would be greatly appreciated... 🙂

i was thinking of australia too, but if non-australians are at the bottom of the list.. it's faster to finish nursing first.. 🙂 🙂 that's what everyone else is doing 🙂 i'm a foreigner in the phils.. is it true consultants only makes about US$1000 here?? 😕

 

[FlindersGrad]

I'm not sure what you mean by consultants only making $1000 US. Pay in Australia is generally very good. Especially in the early years when you compare it to the US.

Trying to do Plastics as a foreign graduate would be very hard, but not impossible. As before, you need to first get an internship (SA or Tasmania would be your best bet). Normally you can apply for general surgery training right after internship, but you will need to get PR status first. The college will not accept you without it. Then you do 2 years as basic surgical trainee and study to pass your primary exam. Once the exam is passed you can apply to surgical specialties. This can be the hard part.
If it's really what you want....give it a try.

 

[DrL]

I'm not sure what you mean by consultants only making $1000 US. Pay in Australia is generally very good. Especially in the early years when you compare it to the US.

FlindersGrad-
Would you happen to know an approximate figure for how much residents in Australia make? I know in the US standard is about $US45k/yr, just wondering how Australia compares, especially since residencies in Australia are supposed to be a lot longer than the US.
Thanks

 

[FlindersGrad]

I can only give you any idea based on when I was an intern. I'm sure the information is available somewhere on the net as well. There is a booklet sent out every year (to medical students) regarding internships, participating hospitals, and wages. You might be able to find it.
Wages in Australia (for interns and residents) are generally established by individual states. Thus it varies quite a bit. SA and Tasmania are probably the lowest.
I did my internship in SA. You are awarded a base salary and then paid for all overtime. The base salary is based on a 37 or 39 hour week, but very few people would work that little. So the rest of your hours are paid as "overtime". I normally worked about 60 hours per week.
I think my base salary was about $42 or $43K per year. But with the extra pay you will earn $55-$60K per year. There are some hospitals in Perth where interns claim to make upwards of $75K per year (they must work a lot of hours). Pay as a consultant (esp. if you work in private practice) can be very good.
I hope this helps.
Oh I nearly forgot. As a resident there are various classifications or grades, and your pay will increase accordingly. I have some friends who are in the higher grades, and whilst I don't know for sure I would think they make maybe $80-$90K all up. Also you can work at other hospitals in A&E or ICU to make lots more money if you need.

 

[JoeNamaMD]

Coming to Australia from a non-commonwealth medical school will be next to impossible. Most foreign graduates here come from the UK, New Zealand, and South Africa. If you can take the USMLE and perform well, the USA would be a better choice for foreign medical graduates.

 

[FlindersGrad]

While I agree that it is difficult, it is far from impossible. It really depends on where in Australia you want to live, and how well you speak English. There are a lot of graduates from India, Russia, and other countries working all throughout Australia. But, as before, they tend to be in underserved states like SA and the NT. It would probably be difficult for you to go to NSW, Vic, or Queensland.
You have to pass an AMC exam and an OSCE, and would would have to start all over as an intern.

 

[DrL]

I can only give you any idea based on when I was an intern. I'm sure the information is available somewhere on the net as well. There is a booklet sent out every year (to medical students) regarding internships, participating hospitals, and wages. You might be able to find it.
Wages in Australia (for interns and residents) are generally established by individual states. Thus it varies quite a bit. SA and Tasmania are probably the lowest.
I did my internship in SA. You are awarded a base salary and then paid for all overtime. The base salary is based on a 37 or 39 hour week, but very few people would work that little. So the rest of your hours are paid as "overtime". I normally worked about 60 hours per week.
I think my base salary was about $42 or $43K per year. But with the extra pay you will earn $55-$60K per year. There are some hospitals in Perth where interns claim to make upwards of $75K per year (they must work a lot of hours). Pay as a consultant (esp. if you work in private practice) can be very good.
I hope this helps.
Oh I nearly forgot. As a resident there are various classifications or grades, and your pay will increase accordingly. I have some friends who are in the higher grades, and whilst I don't know for sure I would think they make maybe $80-$90K all up. Also you can work at other hospitals in A&E or ICU to make lots more money if you need.

Thanks a lot FlindersGrad. 60 hours a week sounds nice for residency, I am guessing that's why they're longer in Australia though.

Btw, you work in the US now, correct? If so, and if you don't mind me asking, how difficult was it to secure a residency coming from an Australian school, which field are you currently in , and was this your field of choice?

Thanks a lot, your feedback is much appreciated

 

[FlindersGrad]

In Australia I was doing basic surgical training...would have gone on to do ortho. In the US I am doing anesthesiology. I chose to do anesthesia over surgery mainly for lifestyle issue. Also, I did 3 months of anesthesia in Australia before leaving and I really enjoyed it.
It wasn't very difficult to get into a residency here, but then again I had really good USMLE scores. The main difficulty for me was that the whole process was very expensive (applying, traveling, accomodation, etc).
It really depends on what you want to do. If you want internal med, peds, psych, or path I think it's pretty easy. Anesthesia and surgery are becoming very competitive (ie. upwards of 100 applicates for every one spot in some places). Derm, Optho, and Rads are very, very difficult for a non-US to secure.
The most important thing for a non-US student to get recognized though is USMLE scores. You must do well.

 

[canucker]

In Australia I was doing basic surgical training...would have gone on to do ortho. In the US I am doing anesthesiology. I chose to do anesthesia over surgery mainly for lifestyle issue. Also, I did 3 months of anesthesia in Australia before leaving and I really enjoyed it.
It wasn't very difficult to get into a residency here, but then again I had really good USMLE scores. The main difficulty for me was that the whole process was very expensive (applying, traveling, accomodation, etc).
It really depends on what you want to do. If you want internal med, peds, psych, or path I think it's pretty easy. Anesthesia and surgery are becoming very competitive (ie. upwards of 100 applicates for every one spot in some places). Derm, Optho, and Rads are very, very difficult for a non-US to secure.
The most important thing for a non-US student to get recognized though is USMLE scores. You must do well.

Hi FlindersGrad,

I'd like to hear your opinion on how well you felt prepared for the USMLE's coming out of the PBL curriculum. Other SDN'ers (like Dr. Cox) have posted in regards to this but I'd like to hear your thoughts on the matter.
Also, were there any Canadians in your graduating class? If so, do you know if they were able to secure a Canadian residency?
Finally, in regards to PBL: do you know if there's any difference between how PBL is run in Australian schools vs. how PBL is run in Canadian/American schools? I realize that this is a difficult question to answer as you most likely have no basis of comparison. But reading past posts, on SDN and especially ValueMD, that claimed there was a significant difference have caused me a bit of confusion as I'd always assumed they were run in the same manner. The particular posts in question didn't come from the most reliable sources but regardless I'd still like to hear your opinion on this matter (if you have one). Thanks.

Cheers, canucker

 

[FlindersGrad]

Hi FlindersGrad,

I'd like to hear your opinion on how well you felt prepared for the USMLE's coming out of the PBL curriculum. Other SDN'ers (like Dr. Cox) have posted in regards to this but I'd like to hear your thoughts on the matter.
Also, were there any Canadians in your graduating class? If so, do you know if they were able to secure a Canadian residency?
Finally, in regards to PBL: do you know if there's any difference between how PBL is run in Australian schools vs. how PBL is run in Canadian/American schools? I realize that this is a difficult question to answer as you most likely have no basis of comparison. But reading past posts, on SDN and especially ValueMD, that claimed there was a significant difference have caused me a bit of confusion as I'd always assumed they were run in the same manner. The particular posts in question didn't come from the most reliable sources but regardless I'd still like to hear your opinion on this matter (if you have one). Thanks.

Cheers, canucker

I'm glad to hear Kim (Dr Cox)is helping people out too. I went to med school at Flinders with her!
I felt I was very prepared for the USMLE (esp step 2). The PBL process can be tough, but in the end you actually learn and retain the information as opposed to craming and regurgitating it for exams. And you build on your knowledge base throughout the whole four years. Most all exams in Australian schools (Like Flinders) are essay and short answer, so again you really have to KNOW the material. I did really well on all step exams, and I credit my great education. Kim was a few years ahead of me, and the program was very new. It evolved quickly and continues to do so. Her experience was probably different from mine. All of my friends from Flinders who took the USMLE did well, and I don't know anyone who has failed.

There were a few Canucks in the class (very close friends in fact). As I understand it is very difficult to get back into Canada, but things may be changing. You have to pass a series of exams (like USMLE), but the positions for foreign-trained doctors are limited. I know of 2 who made it back to Canada (internal med and GP), but most took the USMLE and secured spots in the US.

It's hard for me to compare the various PBL structures. However, Flinders studied (and purchased) the PBL curriculum from McMasters Uni in Canada, so I imagine it would be close. Flinders has also played around with the structure a lot to optimize the experience. In the end I think it works really well, but it takes time to get used to this style of learning.

I think PBL is good, but if you're the type of person who likes to learn on your own then it's probably not for you. It takes a lot of team work to meet your weekly goals, and there are very few lectures. But again, I think you actually learn the material better.

I hope this helps. Feel free to ask away!

 

[mendel34]

Dear All,
I am an FMG and currently a 2nd year psychiatry resident in US.
Is it possible to go to Australia or New Zealand?
I would have to start from the scratch?
know a resident came from Australia and just did one year and become an attending since US accepted what he did in Australia?
Is it posible vice versa?
GL to you all

 

[MPS]

Dear All,
I am an FMG and currently a 2nd year psychiatry resident in US.
Is it possible to go to Australia or New Zealand?
I would have to start from the scratch?
know a resident came from Australia and just did one year and become an attending since US accepted what he did in Australia?
Is it posible vice versa?
GL to you all

I should think that they would bite your hand off - both countries are short of psychiastrists. I suggest you contact the relevant college direct (http://www.ranzcp.org/) - it may prove easiest to finish your residency in the US first; this will also keep your options open.

 

[Purifyer]

Dear All,
I am an FMG and currently a 2nd year psychiatry resident in US.
Is it possible to go to Australia or New Zealand?
I would have to start from the scratch?
know a resident came from Australia and just did one year and become an attending since US accepted what he did in Australia?
Is it posible vice versa?
GL to you all

I knew a couple of US psychiatrists a couple of years back during my psych rotation. They didn't have to repeat any training and came over straight away as consultants. Only catch was they [at the time at least] couldn't get full medical registraton... they were on temp registrations that were renewed every year